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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: keberoxu Date: 30 Aug 17 - 02:16 PM Miss you Senoufou. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: leeneia Date: 30 Aug 17 - 11:51 AM I'm uncomfortable with huggy-kissy stuff too. When somebody wants to hold my hand, I smile and murmur, "I've been coughing." It works every time. I like singing Kumbaya, partly because it's beautiful, and partly because of the harmonies that my friends improvise. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Richard Bridge Date: 29 Aug 17 - 06:54 PM Senofou - Miss Piggy knew what was right. Bliar, a noov of the worst sort, simply presented a vulgar, vulgar distorted mirror of the Scottish tradition. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Anne Lister Date: 29 Aug 17 - 06:46 PM I have used Kumbaya in a voice workshop as it's a song that's easy to remember and add words to (which, in the context of the voice workshop, made a lot of sense). However I was stung to the quick (and reduced to helpless laughter at the same time) by a Mail on Sunday reporter who had attended the venue at which my voice workshop took place (amongst other sessions) and wrote, if I remember correctly, "Grown men wept as Anne strummed along to Kumbaya". Each individual part of that sentence might have been true (some men did shed some tears as part of the whole experience, I did have my guitar with me although my playing style isn't really strumming and we did sing Kumbaya) but put together in a sentence it didn't represent anything I recognised at all. Ah, the Daily Mail and the Mail on Sunday - what a waste of newsprint! |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Joe Offer Date: 29 Aug 17 - 04:12 PM I read in the paper, Al, there are robbers, with flashlights that shine in the dark. If I had that doggie in the window, he'd scare them away with one bark. I moved away from Wisconsin in 1970, and I've spent most of my life in California since then. But I'm still a Midwestern Boy at heart, and I never got used to that shallow California huggy-kissy, handy-holdy kinda stuff. Still, I get warm, fuzzy feelings remembering campfires that we closed with Kumbaya and holding hands, especially when in the company of very sincere young women with beautiful, long hair. I learned "Kumbaya" and "Today" for the same reason - the beautiful, sincere, long-haired young women. Alas, those days are over. But I still know the songs. (and I know "Doggie in the Window," too) -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Phil Cooper Date: 29 Aug 17 - 08:56 AM I'm not that fond of Kumbaya, but understand why some people like it. I do object, when I'm sitting in an audience, when we are coerced into standing up and holding hands, or other "forced" comraderie. It's not just done with Kumbaya. I was at a house concert where the performers asked everyone to stand up and hold hands on Kate Wolf's Give yourself to Love. I like that song, I understand why the performers felt they wanted to do it, but I still only went along because I didn't want to try to explain why I would rather have stayed seated. The Revels performances where the cast tries to get the audience to join hands and circle around the theater also bothers me. I was at a holiday singalong last December where, when they did that and someone asked me to join (politely, I would add) I just said arthritic knees and they moved on. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Big Al Whittle Date: 29 Aug 17 - 03:35 AM i was just thinking how nice it would be if all the people on this thread could hold hands. we could sing How much is that doggy in the window? if you like. I can play that one and know all the words. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Elmore Date: 28 Aug 17 - 01:45 PM Tony Saletan deserves the credit for resurrecting this classic. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: GUEST,Patricia Averill Date: 27 Aug 17 - 09:20 AM Last December I went into Amazon and YouTube to find versions of "Kumbaya" and "Come by Here" and was surprised at how many existed - literally hundreds. The Kumbaya Moment may have given "Kumbaya" a bad name, but it hasn't affected its international popularity. I started a new website to describe some of these new variants. My plan is to alternate posts between the two and compare how each treats a common theme. So far I've discussed some religious uses of the songs, and how live performances differ from recordings. I'm now discussing some of the versions most widely imitated in recent years, like those of Lightnin' Hopkins and Kurt Carr. The address is easy to remember: http://www.kumbayacomebyhere.com/ |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: The Sandman Date: 21 Mar 17 - 02:17 PM Holding hands is great, its good in a circle, a good way of promoting a one feeling. i remember a festival that was run by maggie starkey. stanford arms. this was 30 years ago, everybody was going to join me in singing a song with joined hands Sadly Ian Woods refused to sing and hold hands. Ian was a pleasant guy, but I never understood what was his problem with being part of a circle holding hands. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Senoufou Date: 21 Mar 17 - 01:55 PM I don't think many Brits of my generation would feel at all happy 'holding hands' with folk on either side while singing. I remember the poor Queen singing Auld Lang Syne with Tony Blair (!!) at her side at the Millennium. She wouldn't cross her arms to hold his hand, and just extended a paw rather reluctantly, looking terribly ill-at-ease. I always think the tune is such a dragging thing. It needs to be sung by true Africans, with 'open voices' and a lot of harmonies. Zulus for example, or Ladysmith Black Mambazo. But not earnest hippies swaying around and looking 'moved'. Yuk! (I sang it as a Brownie in the early fifties, and hated the blooming thing even then!) |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Jeri Date: 21 Mar 17 - 12:33 PM 10-year-old thread, but... I was in one of those Girl Scout camps, but we just sat on our logs in a circle around the campfire and sang it. The hand-holding isn't that much different from putting arms around each other and singing "Seamen's Hymn" at the close of a session. Singing and group bonding. I'm not a gamer. I think I'd paint when the world ended. It works on the right parts of my brain, and encourages good neurotransmitters. I wouldn't be with other people, because I'm not around humans about 99.5% of the time anyway. Or I'd grab my towel, go to a bar, and wait for Ford Prefect. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Jack Campin Date: 21 Mar 17 - 11:21 AM Holding hands and singing Kumbaya in a social science research paper... what people will do at the end of the world |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: olddude Date: 01 Sep 10 - 11:21 AM What Joe said, remember my girls when they were at scout camp. It was very cute .. anyone after the age of 11 ... it is kinda creepy .. LOL |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Suffet Date: 01 Sep 10 - 11:12 AM They have it all wrong! You are supposed to hold hands and sing We Shall Overcome, not Kumbaya. This photo proves it. --- Steve |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: GUEST Date: 31 Aug 10 - 07:32 PM I don't remember holding hands when this was sung at Methodist youth events and church camp worship services... we were too busy doing the ASL (American Sign Language) version as we sang (when singing it slow) or punctuating the song with handclaps (when singing a syncopated faster version I came to prefer). The faster variant--which uses a different tune altogether--had words something like these: "Somebody's praying, Lord, Kumbaya (clap-clap) Somebody's praying, Lord, Kumbaya (clap-clap) Somebody's praying, Lord, Kumbaya (clap-clap) Rain, Storm, Fire, Wind, Kumbaya Chorus: Kumbayah, kumbayah (clap-clap) Kumbayah, kumbayah (clap-clap) Kumbayah, kumbayah (clap-clap) Rain, Storm, Fire, Wind, Kumbaya" The chorus had some great harmonies--different parts for male & female voices. We threw ourselves into singing them with all the unrestrained, marginally innocent enthusiasm of, well, teenagers at a Methodist church camp. Cynicism is easy and cheap. Innocent joy in the newly-discovered thrill of informal part-singing is harder to come by...here. --Cuilionn, who misses those innocent summers of song |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: GUEST,Peter Gozinya Date: 31 Aug 10 - 06:48 PM Yea, I was forced to hold hands around a campfire and sing that crap at least 4 times a summer, over 5 years in a row. It's not a good song, very basic, catchy at best. Thats why malnurished, stoned hippies, who don't know how to sing or play guitar, force it upon the young; strumming and swaying away, looking and sounding like morons all the while. I really really hate that song, Kumbayuck! MY LORD! |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: GUEST,jimmiejazz Date: 31 Mar 08 - 09:22 AM Now I know why I had no idea of the meaning of Kumbaya in the context of political discussions. I hated the 60s and I particularly hated folk music and still do. And yes, I'm an aging cynic. Not that there's anything wrong in that, of course. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Peter Kasin Date: 02 Feb 07 - 12:39 AM We sang Kumbaya at a summer camp I went to in the early 1960s in northern California, Hidden Villa, which was run by a Quaker couple, josephine and Frank Duveneck. They were aremarkable people, who began this racially integrated camp in the 1940s. This is where I first heard Kumbaya, and it was sung just before breakfast when all the campers were at their tables in the dining hall. Another one sung at that time was "Peace I ask of thee, o river," which along with Kumbaya, had a calming effect on the campers, for just a bit, before we went back to being our knucklehead selves. I don't remember crossing arms and holding hands on Kumbaya, but it was possible that we did that. Chanteyranger |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Azizi Date: 01 Feb 07 - 10:16 PM "Going back to the 60's: we would ling [sing?] the most inappropriate words to this song, and I don't hthink I need to tell you what they were!" moongoddess,I really hate the fact that I can never get the punchline of jokes or witty comments. Now you got me tryin to guess what those inappropriate words could have been way back in the {19}60s and if those words have changed nowadays. [Seriously...kinda] |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: moongoddess Date: 01 Feb 07 - 09:49 PM Going back to what CoolBeans first posted - I asked my husband what he thought the phrase meant and he was in agreement with CoolBeans, but with a slightly different twist. He said that when a Democrat makes a suggestion that a Republican thinks is stupid or silly, like "let's end the war in Iraq" or "let's get a good healthcare program here in the USA", the Republican answer is "yea, and lets join hands and sing Kumbaya". I think Kumbaya is one of the most beautiful songs I've ever heard, and it is made more beautiful when a large group is singing it, whether they are holding hands or not. Going back to the 60's: we would ling the most inappropriate words to this song, and I don't hthink I need to tell you what they were! |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Snuffy Date: 01 Feb 07 - 09:05 AM Arms crossed, holding hands in a circle? People were doing that to Auld Lang Syne long before Kumbaya was ever thought of. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Azizi Date: 31 Jan 07 - 09:25 PM Thanks for your compliment, ClaireBear. I'm glad you got my joke and that you weren't turned off by my questions and speculations. Best wishes, Azizi |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: moongoddess Date: 31 Jan 07 - 09:00 PM Yes! I remember Gibson singing that Kumbaya thing at Newport in 64. He introduced Joan Baez and sang with her and wow, what a time that was. If anyone ever asked (or asks) me to join hands and sing Kumbaya , I'd tell them to go away, I need my hands to play my guitar. Besides, I hate touchy-feely folk music. I'll leave that to Dr. Phil. And John Denver. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: ClaireBear Date: 31 Jan 07 - 11:09 AM Azizi, I knew it was a joke (and a funny one, too!) -- but I've read enough of your postings to know that, joking aside, you would probably like to know more about the circumstances. I am awed by your scholarship almost every day that I visit here! Nice to get a chance to say so. Yes, I'm sure you're right that the congregation's behavior was influenced by the presence of guests and quite possibly by the race of those guests (being Lutherans, they all may well have been white guests; certainly my friend's appearance clearly reflects her Swedish ancestry). It had not occurred to me that the hosts might have deliberately chosen Kumbaya to honor their guests because of its American origins, but of course that is entirely possible. I'll see what more I can find out about the circumstances, but much depends on my friend's powers of observation and I'm not sure of those. Claire |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Uncle_DaveO Date: 31 Jan 07 - 10:38 AM I'm in the middle of reading Dave Van Ronk's memoir, The Mayor of MacDougal Street, and I can't forbear to quote his anecdote that fits in this thread. (Timing is everything! I just left off reading the book last night, at this very incident!) He's been talking about the folk scene some time I think in the late 50s, although he doesn't really date it. I'll pick up in the previous paragraph: Besides that, he (Bob Gibson) was a good musician, and I sometimes think that he and Paxton were my favorite melodists in the folk songwriter field, Paxton for his incredible simplicity and Gibson for his ability to come up with unusual modulations and chord progressions. I also found that I really liked some of those people personally. Gibson, like Cynthia Gooding, was very polished onstage, but offstage they were both wonderfully cynical and funny. I remember years later seeing Bob at Newport with a group of people singing "Kumbaya," and it was turning into one of those really tacky group-gropes, with everybody joining hands and taking turns leading verses--"Someone's crying, Lord, Kumbaya," "Someone's dying, Lord, Kumbaya,"--and it gets arund to Gibson's turn, and he sings, "Someone's kidding, Lord . . ." Dave Oesterreich |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 31 Jan 07 - 09:41 AM An awful lot of musical snobbery around... |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Alba Date: 31 Jan 07 - 08:57 AM Ouch.....I just got my fingers smacked I think, naughty Alba Well it would seem that while there are Folks like yourself Dave out there playing and liking this Song I am sure that 'Kumbaya' will survive. As I said in my previous post: "Hey if folks like to sing it and it makes them feel good..great" Jude (who's opinion of this Song remains the same regardless of who is performing it) |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: GUEST,Shimrod Date: 31 Jan 07 - 08:32 AM No! Oh, no,no,no!! Nooooooo!!!! Please, no, oh please don't make me sing it!!!! Nooooooo!!!!!!! |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: DaveA Date: 31 Jan 07 - 08:06 AM OK enough!! Maybe too many of the current generation of folkies have heard too many crap versions of classic songs like Kumbaya & Streets of London to ever want to hear them again. But don't condemn the songs to oblivion & let the younger generation reject them unheard because people have tired of them. For me, there will always be an appreciative smile when I hear Joan Baez singing Kumbaya or Ralph McTell singing Streets of London. And bluntly, if you can't equal the performance or the writing, you really lack credibility when you take cheap shots as certain people have Just my opinion Dave |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Alba Date: 31 Jan 07 - 05:16 AM Yip Dianavan. Maybe Plastic tiewraps are used on the hands and duct tape around the ankles in some cases...that's what it would take to get me to singalonga Kumbaya. I seem to (these days) picture a scene from the film 'Airplane' whenever I see this song mentioned. A scene envolving a Nun singing with Guitar. Hey if folks like to sing it and it makes them feel good..great. It just doesn't do it for me however. Another gem from my Girl Guide Campfire days was a song called Ging Gang Gooly, yes you read this correctly:) ...and it goes like this: Ging Gang Gooly Ging Gang Gooly Gooly Gooly Gooly Watcha Ging Gang Goo Ging Gang Goo. Ging gang Gooly Gooly Gooly Gooly Watcha Ging Gang Goo Ging Gang Goo. Haila! Haila Shaila.. Haila Shaila.. Haila whooo Haila! Haila Shaila.. Haila Shaila.. Haila whooo Shallywally Shallywally Shallywally Shallywally. Umpa Umpa Umpa Umpa......... For me there is little else to be said...*giggle* Happy When's Day, Jude Clairebear, when you find out more about where in Africa your Friend visited it would be great to hear about it.. Hope all is well:) |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: dianavan Date: 31 Jan 07 - 04:22 AM I think they make you hold hands so you can't run. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: dianavan Date: 31 Jan 07 - 04:21 AM I have the same response to hearing Kumbayah as I do to hearing Stairway to Heaven. Let me outa here. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: GUEST,Nancy King at work Date: 30 Jan 07 - 08:47 PM I don't think I've heard it sung for at least 32 years. I can remember singing it then because it makes a great lullabye, and I sang it to both my kids. When the new grandkid comes along, I'll probably find occasion to sing it again... Nancy |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Gulliver Date: 30 Jan 07 - 08:41 PM I was just starting Secondary School (run by the Christian Brothers, in Dublin, Ireland) when I first heard this song from a group of "trendy" young priests with guitars who carried out a week-long mission at our school. The previous mission we had had was from the Redemptorists (I think that's what they were called), who's main (or rather, only) theme was hellfire, damnation, all sinners and non-Catholics burning forever in Hell, etc. It was all sweetness and light for the week that the young priests were there, then it was back to the corporal punishment and deviant sexual practices of the Christian Brothers. The song brings back unhappy memories. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 30 Jan 07 - 07:57 PM There's not necessarily anything wrong with the SONGS, I'm just heartily sick of them. Scoville's comment there sums it up. People get tired of songs, but that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with the songs. I think the first time I heard it and sang it would have been at a Pete Seeger concert. We sang it pretty well too. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Azizi Date: 30 Jan 07 - 07:41 PM Actually, ClaireBear, I was trying to make a joke. But it would be interesting to know how the folks in that African church sang Kumbayah..for instance in what tempo, were percussive features such as foot stomping and handclapping added, was there instrumentation, or was it sung plaintively, or was it sung in a spirit of unity "with arms crossed and bodies swaying"... I'm assuming that these church members didn't sing Kumbayah around a camp fire, unless it was at a church camp [??]. ** I'm also wondering if the church members usually sung Kumbayah or if they sung it on that occassion because they knew ahead of time or because they noticed that they had White guests. Most people act different around guests, don't you think? I'm wondering how small this congregation was and if they if they have White people in their congregation and/or have had experience with White visitors before. I wonder if the choir or congregation or both {which was it, by the way?} sang Kumbayah because it was an English song that they knew and maybe they thought it would please their guests to sing it. And I wonder how those folks really "get down" {or, since this is church we're talking about-get their spirits up} when there are no guests around. I'm just trying to be real here. I'm not trying to make race an issue, but race is more often a factor in experiences than some folks would admit that it is. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Charley Noble Date: 30 Jan 07 - 07:26 PM One happy memory I have of this song was when I taught it to a group of South African refugee students who were attending the school I was teaching at in Addis Ababa, Ethiopia, in 1966. As part of an annual school program we did "Kumbaya," "The Hammer Song," and some South African liberation songs. It's the one tape I've lost that I have the most regrets about. But it was a wonderful presentation. Good songs like this one will be rediscovered after they have aged an appropriate period of time. I don't think this one is endangered. Cheerily, Charley Noble |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: ClaireBear Date: 30 Jan 07 - 07:16 PM Hmmm...did they hold hands? And was there a campfire, while we're asking...good questions! I'll ask, and get back to you on what country, community and sect it was too when I can -- I realize I didn't provide much information, but this actually jest happened within the last few weeks and my info is sparse thus far. My friend was SO disappointed! I think that was the only song they sang, too. (Too bad it wasn't me there; I actually kind of like Kumbayah, but then I'm perverse.) |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Azizi Date: 30 Jan 07 - 07:08 PM Yes, but did they hold hands while singing it? :o) |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: ClaireBear Date: 30 Jan 07 - 06:23 PM I have a friend who went to Africa recently on a church (ELC Lutheran) trip. She'd never been to Africa and was really looking forward to hearing some actual African music at the church service she attended while there. Three guesses what was sung... |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Azizi Date: 30 Jan 07 - 05:51 PM FYI, I just submitted a post to add the song "Come By Here, My Lord" {Kumbayah} to the African American Spirituals Permathread. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Joybell Date: 30 Jan 07 - 03:43 PM I've held hands with fellow protesters on occaision - (while singing other songs) but what I really dislike is being TOLD to hold hands by a performer on a stage. -- That is unless we are dancing a circle dance. Cheers, Joy |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: The Sandman Date: 30 Jan 07 - 03:28 PM yes very good while holding hands ,but not while one is exercising ones bowels. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Anne Lister Date: 30 Jan 07 - 03:27 PM Now, I've used "Kumbayah" in voice workshops in the past, simply because it's easy to remember or learn, and at the stage in the voice workshop where I use it I do have people holding hands - or paws - or anything they've got. In fact, I even had a mention in the Mail on Sunday (note for American Mudcatters - NOT a sympathetic newspaper) with the immortal words "Grown men wept as Anne strummed along to Kumbaya on her guitar". Which I didn't. But they might have done. And I might do it all again, so there. Anne |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: lilly Date: 30 Jan 07 - 03:23 PM remember it from the girl guides,ah, happy memories! |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Joe Offer Date: 30 Jan 07 - 12:55 PM I don't think it's a bad song. It's a song that was sung to death with the silly, cloying sincerity of stereotypical 60's folk. So, it became a symbol of the stereotype. But there's a lot of silliness in each of us, and maybe it's not a bad thing if we ALL sing with cloying sincerity every once in a while. Much better than constant cynicism, I think. -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: GUEST,neovo Date: 30 Jan 07 - 11:18 AM my recollection is of this song having actions eg holding hands palms together as if at prayer when singing "someone's singing Lord" and so on. Can't hold hands when you're doing the actions! |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: Tinker Date: 30 Jan 07 - 11:11 AM Azzi, the camp I attended in the mid-sixties had been doing "closing songs" (quiet, meditative, get the kids ready too sleep) with arms crossed and holding hands for much of the history of the camp. It was founded in 1918. By the mid sixties the camp was integrated and well versed in protest songs. It is where at 12 in 1968 I learnt We Shall Over Come, and United Nations and Crayon Box those songs were not sung arms crossed. Green Trees/Peace and Taps were a more likely combination. There are ties between the Civil Rights and Camp communities. Camp Wo-Chi-Ca (Workers Children's Camp) was started in 1933, as the first interracial camp in America. It existed until 1951. Paul Robeson was on its board of trustees and was a frequent visitor and honored guest. The site now holds a joint Episcopal/Lutheran Camp and Retreat Center. You can see his camp theatre space half way down this page Paul Robeson Recreational Hall My own guess is that there are countless ties between the two traditions that would be difficult to separate. |
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Subject: RE: Holding hands and singing 'Kumbaya' From: GUEST,leeneia Date: 30 Jan 07 - 09:52 AM "Google has 89,000 citations of the phrase." That's probably because Google is finding every page with "holding hands," or "singing" on them. Many of those pages won't have anything about Kumbaya on them. Kumbaya has a lovely melody, and it feels good to sing it. All this sneering originated with rock and pop marketers because they feel threatened by such songs. Mudcatters, go ahead and sing it if you like it. You don't have to take orders from those people. |
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