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Who is packing heat this Xmas?
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Red Eye Date: 01 Jan 02 - 04:39 AM Says Big Mick with the last word. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Big Mick Date: 31 Dec 01 - 11:30 AM LOL, GUEST. I had that coming, nicely done. You are right. I really am not after kat on this, she is just the one who responded. What I have been after in this endless thread is to get folks to talk, and quit throwing strident bs back and forth. kat is being honest on what she is posting, and frankly I find her to be less prone to the "slogans and statistics" stuff than most. But as I say, she responded. Jerry, quite frankly, also seems open to the talk it out kind of discussion that I think this very difficult subject requires. I guess I am guilty of taking this further, but I feel so strongly that (in the USA) we need to get to the point of bridging the divides between reasonable people. Both Jerry and Kat seem to reasonable, even though our opinions on the subject are different. I guess it is time to let this one go. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: GUEST,in the mudcat observatory tower Date: 31 Dec 01 - 10:02 AM hey big mick, at 6:40 last evening you accused kat and jerry the boy wonder of having to get in the last word in this thread. since then you've posted three more times to this thread. you sir, are the king of having to have the last word. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Blackcatter Date: 31 Dec 01 - 01:59 AM Yall are going for the record for the longest thread, right? |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: katlaughing Date: 31 Dec 01 - 12:46 AM Well, me mon, I don't know what else to say. I don't think debating tactics is going to get us anywhere. I could as easily say it seems as though you are badgering and holding some to a different standard, but where would that get us? There is nothing hidden in what I say or do, as anyone who knows me can tell you. I call them like I see them. I went to the website which those two GUESTs cited, www.keepandbearams.com, and the gist of it seems pretty strident and paranoid to me. I am allowed to have my own opinion, last I knew.:-) Conversely, I didn't see anything paranoid about the article I copied and pasted nor at the newspaper I got it from. kat |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Big Mick Date: 30 Dec 01 - 10:08 PM Yep, Kat, that is what I was referring to. It wasn't a paranoid posting as best as I could see. If I recall correctly, it was simply the posting of a situation where a woman displayed uncommon good sense in how she handled herself when confronted by a tough situation. And the person who posted it asked a very good question, which was ignored. If it had been paranoid crap from the pro gun side, I would have been all over it as well. You have stated any number of times that you were raised with guns, know how to shoot them, used to carry, etc. I understand that. But what I am after is straight talk on this issue, and that is why I asked you what the difference was between the tactic you used and the tactic the other person used. I don't think you answered that question except to say that you thought it was from someone you ID as paranoid. Even if that is true, what is the difference in the tactic? Because context is important, I ask this within the context of trying to get folks to talk straight on the issue. And yes, dearie, I know we must agree to disagree, but I am trying to find out on which point. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: kendall Date: 30 Dec 01 - 10:07 PM Keep guns out of the hands of children? No arguement here. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: katlaughing Date: 30 Dec 01 - 09:45 PM Mick, are you talking about the posting I made after the postings by the GUESTs from Colorado Springs? If so, I posted that because it seemed obvious their postings were from the well-known faction there which is paranoid by all accounts which I've read from various sources or seen reported. And, I am not talking about teh Brady bunch or any other org. from the left, I am talking about news sources and my own research when working on trying to get a bias crimes law here in Wyoming. The story I posted was from a well-respected newspaper and I don't believe it displayed any paranoia on my part of the writer's. I simply was using it for an example and wanted to honestly know what some of you thought about, as I indicated to Kendall. Remember, please, I was raised with guns, target-shooting and knowing how to use one for protection. I still have my dad's old .22 single shot. Do I feel a need to have a gun? No. Do I believe we have a gun problem in this country? Yes. Do I have any answers? No, BUT I do think we need to do something to keep guns out of the hands of children and that includes boys like the ones in the story I posted. If that makes me paranoid, well then I guess I qualify for a room at the NYCFTTS.:-) Once again, agreeing to disagree. Thanks, kat |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Big Mick Date: 30 Dec 01 - 09:07 PM Message received, kat, but the question remains. What is the difference between what you did when you called someone paranoid for the story of the woman who protected herself and what you did in the story you posted? I am not picking on you here, I just want to know. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: katlaughing Date: 30 Dec 01 - 08:55 PM Thanks, Kendall, that's all I wanted was a reply from a perspective such as yours. Agreeing to disagree, here. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: kendall Date: 30 Dec 01 - 08:42 PM Kat, my friend, to answer your question, more guns in that case WOULD have led to a blood bath. That is not what this is all about. This whole thing started by someone who is afraid of guns, even in the hands of qualified people who SOMETIMES carry, (LEGALLY.) I say again, logic will never outweigh fear. As far as I'm concerned, this thread has gone far enough. No minds have been changed, and it has become an exercise in futility. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Big Mick Date: 30 Dec 01 - 08:32 PM OK, Jerry, fair enough. But once again I would ask what is the point in the context of this discussion? Training and good intention is sometimes not enough when it comes to combating terrorism. Shall we stop? Training and good intention is sometimes not enough in granting a drivers license, shall we stop? Training and good intention is sometimes not good enough, shall we abolish flying? The knee jerk response to these rhetorical questions is that I am being ridiculous, but I am not in the context of the observation you made. I return to the predicate that this debate should be built on. And that is that guns, legal and illegal, are part of the fabric of this collection of States. I make the distinction regarding States with the intent of showing why comparison of us to countries like England, Scotland, Wales, or any other, isn't a valid comparison. The closest to a valid comparison would be Canada, and even that great country doesn't have the diversity of tradtions that exist in the United States. Even if one could ban weapons, the only thing that could be banned would be legal weapons. In far too many jurisdictions, the police are already outgunned by illegal weapons. While you would have some minor adjustment in overall death rate due to accident, you would have a rise in deaths due to violent crime. That is shown to be the case in every jurisdiction where guns are banned or severely restricted. Criminals would not stop their violent ways. Another way to demonstrate the point would be to ask this question. What is to be gained by taking guns out of the hands of lawful, trained and responsible gun owners like myself? There is nothing to be gained, and it certainly won't stop the horrific events that usually spawn this debate. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: GUEST Date: 30 Dec 01 - 07:47 PM WHY are adults using children's restrooms in a public school? |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Jerry Dingleman: The Boy Wonder(inactve) Date: 30 Dec 01 - 07:12 PM Mick, The point was made that guns are perfectly safe when entrusted to them with the proper training, like cops, for example. Real life examples demonstrate that that is not always the case. I'm sure that the proportion of cops who pull a stupid blunder like that is very small and I'm certainly not advocating disarming cops. The point that I'm making is that training and good intentions are not necessarily enough. If I hadn't seen the news report this morning, I wouldn't have brought it up. I did see it though, and it is relevant to the discussion. Jerry |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Big Mick Date: 30 Dec 01 - 06:40 PM Jaysus, kat and boy wonder. Does the term demagogic come to mind? Don't you understand that for every one of your stories I can produce stories of people who have saved themselves and/or others by using a firearm? You folks just can't get by on intelligent discussion, you have to keep throwing this stuff out. It is easily refuted by using your same tactic. In fact, kat, my friend, you called someone a paranoid for posting just such a story earlier in this thread. What do we call you now for doing the same thing? Come on, guys, if its that important to have the last word, then just say you disagree and forget posting this stuff. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Jerry Dingleman: The Boy Wonder(inactve) Date: 30 Dec 01 - 06:20 PM I found a link on the CBC News site about the story I saw this morning about the cop leaving his gun in a school bathroom. Jerry |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: katlaughing Date: 30 Dec 01 - 11:51 AM The following is from Indian Country Today from a search on the words "wounded knee." I would like to know how gun advocates think more guns in this case would have been helpful. The way I see it, if the Indian girls had had guns with them, there could have been a bloodbath "shoot-out" with many wounded and/or killed. I am not saying the girls shouldn't have been equally equiped; I am saying the boys shouldn't have had a shotgun in the first place. This story comes from one of the most racist places in our nation, when it comes to Native Americans. IMO, gun ownership is not going to solve any of the problems inherent in the region. Nothing hypothetical about this one, folks:
Shooting incident creating ripples across the plains
Posted: December 06, 2001 - 7:00AM EST EAGLE BUTTE, S.D.— The Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe joined a growing list of tribal councils which have passed resolutions or voiced support in connection with a firearm incident directed against members of the Crow Creek girls basketball team in early November. Councilmen briefly discussed the incident during a special session late last month saying they wanted to express their support of the Crow Creek officials and students. During a recent regional BIA-tribal meeting in Bismarck, N.D., attended by representatives of all tribal councils in the three-state region, the issue was on the agenda with councilmen expressing outrage over the shooting incident. Crow Creek Tribal Chairman Roxanne Sazue and tribal school officials have made every effort to assist authorities in bringing a pair of unidentified Hand County teens to justice. "All of Indian country is watching this case and a lot of non-Indian folks are looking at it as well. All the chairmen were there. All the BIA superintendents were there,'' Sisseton-Wahpeton Sioux Tribe Vice Chairman Jake Thompson said. "People are angry. We're all waiting to see what's going to happen. They have to be sent a message.'' The girls, traveling home from the ballgame, weren't physically hurt in the Nov. 1 incident in which a semiautomatic 12-gauge shotgun was fired at a pickup truck, but the event frightened them. Two young white males from Miller were charged in juvenile court, but Hand County States Attorney James Jones has said he will try to get the case moved to adult court. The action of one girl tossing an ice cream drink at a car in retaliation after the a pair of white teen-age boys shouted obscenities, racial slurs and made crude hand gestures toward the girls, set off a three-car chase with one car passing the pickup carrying the girls. The driver of the car hit the brakes and the passenger pulled out a shotgun firing as many four times, the girls and their parents said. Some tribal leaders and Indian groups say the teen-agers should be prosecuted for more serious crimes and that there were delays in the arrests and prosecution. Further upsetting tribal members is the failure of the South Dakota High School Activities Association to investigate claims fans were shouting racial slurs at Crow Creek players during a district competition. Some have speculated the actions may have been the prelude for the events that happened to the 20-year-old driver with five Crow Creek student passengers. The Lady Chieftains girls basketball team played a game against Wessington Springs in Miller hours before the shooting. Tribes have written letters to the U.S. Attorney's Office calling for an investigation into the incident. On Nov. 20, five days after the regional tribal-BIA meeting, the Sisseton-Wahpeton Tribal Council issued a letter to U.S. Attorney Michelle Tapken, expressing outrage and asking for federal intervention: "In response to the described incident, we request that the District of South Dakota United States Attorney's Office initiate an investigation and determine whether there has been a violation of the laws enacted by Congress that provides criminal and civil remedies to victims of bias-motivated crimes." Thompson said all the tribes have children attending Crow Creek High School, which operates as a boarding school. "That's why it's so important to us." The Oglala Sioux Tribe decided it needs more information about the shooting before deciding upon a course of action and is conducting its own investigation. At least one of the tribe's enrolled members was in the pickup that night. Tom Iron, vice chairman of the Standing Rock Sioux Tribe, said a different approach beyond the courts might be in order and suggested bringing a federal mediation team to the area to work with tribal and non-tribal people in the area. He said the shotgun incident was reminiscent of racial tensions that followed the occupation of Wounded Knee in the 1970s. "We live in a society where there's so much tension." The Standing Rock Sioux Tribe and the city of Mobridge went through increased racial tension following the death of Robert Many Horses, who died in 1999 after being stuffed into a garbage can by four white youths following a night of drinking. After Many Horses' death, the Department of Justice sent two community relations specialists to the area to mediate problems between tribal members and the town. "They did an excellent job. We had a lot of racial issues. We stood up and worked together. That could work here," he said. The 16- and 17-year-old boys will appear in court in Miller Dec. 3. Each faces six counts of aggravated assault, a class three felony, in connection with the incident. Jones said the charges carry a maximum penalty of 15 years in prison and a $15,000 fine for each count if they are prosecuted as adults and convicted.
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Jerry Dingleman: The Boy Wonder(inactve) Date: 30 Dec 01 - 09:43 AM I just saw a story on the CBC sattelite news channel that a policeman in Quebec City went to speak to children at a grade school in October. After speaking to one class, he went to the bathroom and then went on to the next class. A few minutes later, a seven year old boy finds the policeman's gun in the toilet stall. Luckily, the kid was smart enough to rush and get a teacher. Some other kid finding the gun might have precipitated a tragedy. The cop was described as a veteran officer with a spotless record. I guess that just goes to show that even those with the proper training can royally screw up. Jerry |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: wysiwyg Date: 29 Dec 01 - 09:23 PM Leprechaun, really, if you ever get near our area, you just gotta come over. If only to help us wipe the pee off the floor, cuz it ran outta my pants, down my leg.... really, we are in stitches here!!!! Thank you so much for bringing a light touch to this!! ~Susan |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: leprechaun Date: 29 Dec 01 - 07:37 PM For those of us who have to pack heat, it can be a pain in the ass. You want to maintain some consistency, so it's not a good idea to switch your carrying method. When my buns get really sore, I'd like to switch to a shoulder holster, but I haven't found one that adequately conceals my duty weapon. Maybe when my torso gets broader...(My firearms instructor told me to drink more beer) It also limits your wardrobe. You have to wear something that conceals the damn thing, so either you have a coat on, or you don't tuck your shirt in. I have a collection of hawaiian shirts, but that only works in the summer. There are ways to tell if somebody's packin'. They have to adjust their clothes in a particular way when they stand up or sit down, or move about. They also tend to caress the thing occasionally, to make sure it's still there, that they didn't accidentally leave it at grandma's or drop it at the Grade three Christmas pageant. Oops, I mean, winter festival. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: kendall Date: 29 Dec 01 - 04:17 PM To those who want to live in fantasy land, ponder this hard cold fact. What is, is. We must deal with things as they are, not as we would like them to be.And, the fact is, this world is getting more and more dangerous. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: JedMarum Date: 29 Dec 01 - 03:17 PM There's nothing wrong with the logic at all. I know that I have the right to protect myself from illegal attacks against me - I know that that right extends to the lawful use of firearms. As Kendall says, there is no reason for me to allow any advantage to the people who would do me harm. I don't advocate looking for ways to deter crime. I don't encourage vigilante-ism or anything. I advocate the lawful use of firearms. I don't own a firearm - but only because I don't have a use for one, don't travel in enviroments where I amy need one (very often) and haven't had the time or money to be a hobbyist - so I never bought one. I learned to use them (a bit) as a kid, and probably would have owned them had I continued living in the environment where I grew up (rural; hunting and shooting sports were common). Trey is OK now, by the way. And the thug who injured healed OK too. The two attackers will be free of any punishment, criminal record or rehabilation efforts soon, as well (at 18 years their juvenile record is expunged). That's a damn shame; attempted murder is attempted murder no matter how old your were when you attempt it.
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: harpgirl Date: 29 Dec 01 - 09:27 AM ...there's something wrong with that logic, Jed. Everyone who wants to carry a gun to deter crime against them can already do that and it hasn't stopped very many criminals at all. All the Junior G men in the world would need capes to fly in order to stop all the crime they think they can deter...but I am very sorry about Trey |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: kendall Date: 29 Dec 01 - 09:19 AM All we want to do is to level the playing field! Why the hell should the scum bags have the advantage? |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: JedMarum Date: 29 Dec 01 - 02:23 AM LOL - Kendall! I am sure you're correct about the second ammendment's origins. I just learned today that my daughter-in-law's younger brother (Trey) was attacked on his way home from work (walking on a busy Houston street late at night) by two thugs intent on hurting him - the attackers were 15 & 16 years old and one was armed with a knife. Trey was punched, kicked and cut pretty badly, but managed to get the knife away from one of the guys and stabbed him with it. The other guy took off. Trey and the thug were take to the hospital, the second 'bad guy' was caught eventually - and the thugs were processed through the juvenile system. They will graduate to firearms for their next crimes - and now they know that some people will fight back, they'll pull the trigger first next time. These are not misguided boys who just need a lucky break to rise above their lives of crime. These will be killers soon (if they aren't already) and if I run into them in the street, I know I would need to have a firearm if I had any hope of surviving the encounter. 'Packing Heat' as the thread title suggests is a reasonable thing to do for many of us. Thank God it is one of our options. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: kendall Date: 28 Dec 01 - 09:19 AM Listen to Mick. It is not the guns we should fear, it is the criminals! We must get at the reason these apes do what they do. If it were just the guns, then law abiding citizens like Mick and me would be robbing and killing.We have the means, but we lack the reason to mis use the gun. (It's all Englands fault anyway. the second amendment was an overreaction to the way the redcoats acted here before the revolution) |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: wysiwyg Date: 28 Dec 01 - 09:09 AM I am guilty of a little bating on this to see where folks would go... Mick, I am sorry to learn that you did that. Adding and inviting upset and then expecting people to think MORE clearly is.... unrealistic, at best! I would have hoped that you would ALWAYS write from your heart, here, open-handed-- with nothing up your sleeve. ~Susan |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Coyote Breath Date: 28 Dec 01 - 03:20 AM Gosh Bert, when I start making sense...we're in Big Trouble (that is in Texas, I believe, just down the road from Cut and Shoot) CB |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Big Mick Date: 28 Dec 01 - 01:21 AM I don't much disagree with them on a philosophical level, Jed. If those were the options, I would be right there with you. Imagine the havoc The Beef Brothers could wreak...........LOL. But my time in the political system of this country tells me that that is not where it will head. The slope is pretty much a certainty, but by folks like us being a part of the discussion, we can make sure that there are two sides of the hill that slope. I am not saying that we shouldn't have strident views. What I am saying is that, IMO, we have to understand the dynamic of the political system and remain a voice in it. If we have the views that you express, but are not willing to temper them with reality of what it is we face, we end up in a "Charge of the Light Brigade". Remember when the NRA wasn't a strident "slippery slope" organization? They were respected and no one would consider them a fringe organization. But when they started taking "cop Killer bullet" types of positions, they lost it. These days, on the hill, they are only perceived well by the radical Senators on the pro-gun side. And their credibility with the voting public is lessening. Correspondingly their ability to successfully lobby on behalf of legitimate gun owners is lessened. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: JedMarum Date: 28 Dec 01 - 12:57 AM I don't smoke, but I'll fight for your right to do so. I don't own a firearm - but I sure as hell will the day they are outlawed! If we think Alcohol Prohibition created a huge class of lawbreakers, ie normal Americans perfectly willing to break and even laugh off the law - wait 'til firearms are outlawed. I promise you it would be the start of the second US Civil War. I don't really fear that prohibition - I fear the slope opening that leads to it. I am afraid that pressure to regulate and legislate 'safety' or ownership requirements are disingenuous. There is no doubt in my mind that a government that wishes to oppress its population must first render it defensless. So a government like that of the USA, who face a population unwilling to give up their firearms must first apply the tourniquet of registration and regulation before it twists the tourniquet tighter and tighter. I think it's worth the fight; keep that damn tourniquet off my arm! I just don't want to see one more personal freedom slip away. I don't know if it will happen, in my lifetime ... I hope it never happens ... and I don;t want to see it start. Anyway - Mick, I don't suppose my comments were much for the 'bridging' notion you suggest - but at least I've stated where my side of the river is! |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Big Mick Date: 28 Dec 01 - 12:31 AM Interesting stuff, eh Rick & Spaw? As I told my two friends about a week ago, I am guilty of a little bating on this to see where folks would go. I also indicated that I would respond to Guest Paul's link to a very well thought out and researched article. If you haven't read it, go back to his post and do so. I guess I wanted to see if anyone could get past the emotional and strident tit for tat responses that always come about in any discussion on this topic. A few did. Most didn't. And, IMHO, that is why this debate is never ending. Let me explain my real views. First off, I really do own a number of guns of various types, including a handgun. I am exceedingly responsible with them, very well trained, AND my politics really are to the left of center. In fact, in most areas I am far to the left of center. BUT I do not include gun ownership in this. My real issue is stridency in views on this, or any other topic. But let us stay with guns. In over a quarter century of political activism, there is one lesson that I am taught over and over again. No solution is possible, in a modestly democratic society, when the only voices are from the two ends of the spectrum. Reasonable solutions come when reasonable people allow the circle of their respective experiences to overlap. In other words, we cannot get reasonable solutions until the opposing sides try to wear each others moccasins. Folks like myself, law abiding citizens who own guns, see them as a part of our heritage, and ownership as a generations old legacy passed on from generation to generation. The right to shoot is a rite of passage from childhood to adulthood. The learning to handle these weapons is much like learning to drive a car. It comes with age, signifies acceptance as an adult, and demonstrates that one has shown the maturity and intelligence to handle these weapons. The hunting and shooting stirs up memories of good times and happy hours spent with Da, Uncles, cousins and friends. For other folks, the guns stir up different feelings. It is a parent sitting in their living room, the one place they should feel more secure than any other place, and seeing a hole appear in the wall, or a window shatter. It conjures up the cold fear that they feel when they hear the report and in a panic scramble to check if their kids are alive or the victim of a drive by shooting. All the feelings that I have never occur to this person. That is the chasm that must be bridged, yet one would ask how is this possible. And I believe the answer is found in trying to get these two disparate groups, along with the others that have other views to talk to one another. Without the strident crap thrown in. If the parent who fears for the safety of themselves and their families could come to understand that it isn't my guns that they have to fear, it is the criminals, that would be a beginning. If folks like myself could understand the horror by folks having to worry for the basic safety of their families, that would foster understanding. But this won't happen when all that folks do is sit back and spout strident crap about 2nd amendment rights or how their is no legitimate use for guns. Neither statement is correct. Guest Paul's article was extremely well written and full of accurate data. What is the problem with it then you might ask? Simple. It's basic predicate is that it makes the arguement that we would be better off without any guns, as if that was possible. It is not. Like it or not, guns are part of the fabric of this country. Whether we are talking legitimately owned guns, or guns used in the commission of crime, or guns used in shooting accidents..........the simple fact is that in the USA, guns have been a part of our heritage (good and bad) since its inception. And the numbers, where you can trust them, show that there is not support for the most strident positions on either side of the question. So what am I saying? Just this. Spouting second amendment rhetoric is silly and polarizing. No court has ever upheld that position nor will they. Mouthing off about completely banning any legitimate gun ownership is a waste of time. There are too many people, like myself, that will not give up our guns because they are an important part of our lives. And because of these splits, in a democracy, it is highly unlikely that either of these positions will ever be achieved. But this much is certain. There will be change in this society on this issue. The key for the parties is to be a part of the discussion. Those who cling to these tired old arguements on both sides of the issue will not be a part of the discussion. And that would be a shame. One of the most interesting things to me is that as long as folks cling to these strident positions, they often end up voting for politicians who on most every other issue vote against the best interests of the same folks. That is why it is imperative that folks get to reasoned discussion without blown out of proportion stats like the Brady's use. I have met both of these folks in my travels. While they may be Republicans, they can hardly be classified as the darlings of the Republican party. Their views have made them outcasts with much of their own party. Enough rambling. All the best, Mick |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Bert Date: 27 Dec 01 - 11:30 PM You make a lot of sense CB. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: leprechaun Date: 27 Dec 01 - 11:19 PM Will they confiscate "Dave's Insanity Sauce" in Canada? Dave's Insanity Sauce is much hotter than Tabasco sauce. It's even hotter than "Smack My Ass and Call Me Sally" sauce. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: gnu Date: 27 Dec 01 - 07:57 PM On that sad note, I think we all can declare this a draw.... pun intended. Merry Ho Ho. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: CarolC Date: 27 Dec 01 - 07:50 PM I'll probably not be getting one either. Ah well... |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: gnu Date: 27 Dec 01 - 07:44 PM No. Ending this neverending thread ! |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: CarolC Date: 27 Dec 01 - 07:34 PM Ending the year with a bang, are you gnu? Sounds like fun to me... |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: gnu Date: 27 Dec 01 - 07:22 PM BANG ! |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Coyote Breath Date: 27 Dec 01 - 05:00 PM Hey! I find it odd that the "left" wants guns banned and the "right" doesn't. It would seem to me that people who have a great deal to fear from an encroaching government would not want to rid themselves of their means to protect their freedoms and those who wish to encroach on people's freedoms would not want the citizenry to remain armed. OOOH! hey, maybe I got it all wrong. Maybe it is the "left" that wants to curtail our freedom and the "right" that wants to protect it. Man, it sure can get confusing sometimes. I belong to the NRA and I voted for Bill Clinton and supported him through both terms. How's THAT for dichotomy? I believe that we not only have a right to bear arms but we have a duty to at least consider that we might NEED to use those arms in order to remove an unwanted government. As looney as that sounds, the people do indeed have the right to remove the governement, by force if necessary. Of course the government has the obligation to blow us away should we exercise our right to overthrow it. Dang I wish that Joe Offer had deleted THIS thread. Well I gotta go, hafta go out to the Militia firing range, seems someone got a Exocet for Christmas and we're gonna do some missle drill. Kill the thread, please! CB |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: CarolC Date: 27 Dec 01 - 02:24 PM You know, Rick, I almost never do this, but I'm going to do it for you right now... LOL!!! (Especially the Charleton Heston bit.) |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: GUEST,rounder Date: 27 Dec 01 - 02:21 PM 'Handguns are for peace officers and not civilians'... Last time I checked, police officers ARE civilians... If we lose our 2nd ammendement rights piece by piece (starting with handguns) we'll find that folk music is the least of our problems. In places where the folk were not alowed to own guns, the tyrants - the kind we like to sing about overcoming - take over and genicide prevails. Or as Mason Williams may have put it,,,"How bout them Corman Rouge ain't they Sweet? stackin dead bodies out in the street. How could they kill most every one? cuz they's the only ones had a gun! Politicaly correct folk singers need to concider the correctness of self reliance, of which self defense is a part. You are responsible for your self protection. the Police are responsible to society. Just try and file suit against the police for not protecting you if you get mugged and see what you get - a good subject for a folk song. Peace at any cost... Rounder |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: wysiwyg Date: 27 Dec 01 - 02:17 PM A LITTLE SURVEY OF MUDCATTER POLITICAL ORIENTATIONS. ~S~ |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Rick Fielding Date: 27 Dec 01 - 02:06 PM Carol, what you didn't know was that all us Canadians DO pack heat. Tabasco Sauce is the weapon of choice. If we are confronted with a violent felon armed with a hot dog (or back bacon on a bun) we unscrew the lid and let him have it right between the buns. These are just the "law and order" Canajuns mind you...the liberal Commie Pinko Castro luvin' ones NEVER pack a higher calibre hot sauce than HP. We've also found that instead of expensive alarm systems, a simple framed photo of Charleton Heston's cold dead hands, placed strategically in the window, sends the bad guys a runnin'. Cheers Rick |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: kendall Date: 27 Dec 01 - 01:44 PM Do you have to be a right wing fanatic to own a gun? I hope not, it would be a real problem for me! |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: JedMarum Date: 27 Dec 01 - 10:16 AM I haven't seen any right wing fanatics here, Jerry. I am sure you're safe here, and your opinions welcome - even if some of us don;t agree with them all. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: Jerry Dingleman: The Boy Wonder(inactve) Date: 27 Dec 01 - 07:29 AM I quote Norton1's response to me: "I think what Jed was stating is that your assumption of 33,000 children killed each year by a handgun is ludicrous. And it is ludicrous." This is a total distortion of what I said. I said that an average of 36,000 AMERICANS, "many of them kinds," are killed each year by gun violence. I did not say that 33,000 of those were children. Perhaps you should actually read what people say before commenting. BTW, this thread is telling me that this is a group that I'm not sure I want to be a part of. I came here out of an interest in folk music, not to be among right wing fanatics. Keep well and please keep your guns away from your children. Jerry |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: CarolC Date: 27 Dec 01 - 06:01 AM I pack two canisters of pepper spray at all times. Except when I'm traveling in Canada. Love carrying the pepper spray. And it's concealed, too, so I guess that makes it a concealed weapon. Interestingly, though, I felt safer when I was in Canada without any pepper spray (confiscated at the border) than I do in the US with my pepper spray. A lot safer, in fact. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: catspaw49 Date: 27 Dec 01 - 04:38 AM I don't think so. The heat you feel is from the Flaming Assholes that just posted from "Keep and Bear Arms" that just posted. Can you say "dickheads?" Spaw |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: leprechaun Date: 27 Dec 01 - 04:17 AM Does pepper spray count as heat in this survey? It's really hot. |
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Subject: RE: Who is packing heat this Xmas? From: katlaughing Date: 27 Dec 01 - 01:17 AM My gawd, the paranoia right wing of Colorado Springs fame has hit the Mudcat! Quick, get all of the banjos, bazukis, bodhrans, fiddles, tiples, geetars, pipes, accordions, etc. and circle the wagons! Tune up, tune up and get ready to play! |
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