Chords in Folk?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 12:58 PM

...that's another weard thing that happens, Sedayne - no "kidology", I can be in a mess room and make the slightest constructive criticism of modern England (e.g., a Swede/Italian should NOT be managing England) and all hell breaks loose; but if a born-and-bred like yourself says how much they'd like to give up on England for old-rival Aus., no-one bats an eye...maybe Stigweard can enlighten us with his choice words.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 12:47 PM

Visit? No fucking way, Cobber. I'd head for the Northern Territories, make my home in sunny Darwin and never give chilly old England a second thought. Actually, my favourite Rolf Harris song is Northern Territorian, which largely concerns the effects of Cyclone Tracy in 1974...

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Stu
Date: 15 May 08 - 12:31 PM

Fuck

ing

hell

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 12:14 PM

They're due for another Republic? referendum, too, Sedayne...and why not just plan on a VIST to Australia.

123 of 230: FONDLY AND VIVIDLY/AN OLYMPICS-SPARKED MEMORY SONG - AUT. 2000

From way up high in Sydney Tower,
You can see it all:
East there's coastline, west there's ranges -
Blue Mountains standing tall;
There's national parks and gardens,
Sailboards on Botany Bay;
And, out among the people,
You'll soon get that term "G'day."

Yes, I remember Sydney -
Fondly and vividly:
The eucalypts and wattles;
The sun, the sand, the sea.
Yeah, I still picture Sydney -
Fondly and vividly.

And, way up high in Sydney Tower,
You can see it all:
Southern Beaches, Northern Beaches,
A skyline standing tall;
There's the Opera House and Harbour Bridge -
Ferries sail from bay to bay;
And, around Darling Harbour,
You can party the night away.

Yes...

And, way up high in Sydney Tower,
You can see it all:
Olympic grounds toward the west,
The Rocks, too, is worth a call;
Plus Aboriginal culture -
The foremost of a lot to say.
So, if you VISIT Sydney,
I'm sure you'll enjoy your stay.

Yes...

From walkaboutsverse.741.com

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 11:47 AM

Hopefully, on this as in other things, sense will prevail... otherwise I'll be expatriating myself to Australia!

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 11:44 AM

As a North-Shields born Irish-Northumbrian-Scottish-Jew, I am, and forever will be, British. You think things are bad in England now - just see how much worse should ever Scotland gain independence! We can kiss goodbye to a future labour government for a start; no bad thing in itself of course, but do we really want a Conservative state without any viable opposition? But maybe this is the sort of projected discord people get off on, by way of dividing, and conquering, and belittling, and diminishing, trading on historic / geographical divisions instead of thinking how ultimately none of that matters in the 21st century multi-cultural UK.

Hopefully, on this as in other things, sense will prevail.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 11:32 AM

"The English nation AND the United Nations," Joe - and I've enjoyed listening to quite a lot of Irish, Scottish and Welsh folk-music.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 15 May 08 - 11:09 AM

Sorry guest was me - too right, get rid of the scots, the welsh, irish, oh and cornish whilst you're at it. They can take their dirty accompanied music with them too.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 11:07 AM

Use "British folk music" while you can, Guest - a Scottish referendum is pending. I, myself, believe in the English nation and the United Nations - with eco-travel and fair-trade between them.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:58 AM

Yes, it definitely would be going pop or classical. Anyway some changes are needed at the big festivals:

They should gather together all the obviously foreign singers / groups and they should perform in a smaller tent, giving room in the main arenas etc for proper British folk music.

Then any of the British folk music with chords / foreign instruments should also be moved to these smaller venues, where there should be less facilities. Eventually we should pack all of them in trains and get them away from the festivals and 'forget' about them.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:57 AM

Bless him, I don't think he gets out much...

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:55 AM

Seriously, then - if you changed practiSe to practiCe, why wouldn't you leave licenCe alone?! What kind of licence is that?!

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:52 AM

"Introducing chords into our beloved top line melody singing and playing" (Joe) - doing so would be going pop or classical or, from early music, creating an art song.

You really haven't got a clue, have you, WAV? But I applaud you for keeping this thread buoyant for over 300 posts out of whatever perverse motives you might have in so doing.

Perhaps you like to move this onto another level and share with us some of the deeper methodology by which you operate in the world - or do I credit wrongly by assuming there must be some method in this madness when, in fact, it is its own sorry end?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:37 AM

One hope this won't upset you too much, WAV - but it can be either exclamation point OR exclamation mark. How recalcitrant can you get?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:37 AM

Britain has changed the spelling of English words?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:34 AM

"Introducing chords into our beloved top line melody singing and playing" (Joe) - doing so would be going pop or classical or, from early music, creating an art song.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:21 AM

Sedayne, we cross posted. But we apparently know more 'English' than our 'expert'.


Expert, n, drip under pressure...

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:19 AM

Seriously, Foolestroupe, I do have a Webster's from my uni days, and it gives only practice and license - you better stop whatever you are doing and check youself now.
And to Joe, frankly, I don't know - has any nation other than the USA changed the spelling of English words?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:16 AM

It is NOT LO, but IO...

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:07 AM

Sorry, but 'practice' & practise' are BOTH English (UK) words - WITH DIFFERENT MEANINGS! AS ARE 'licence' & 'license'! You obviously did not use your dictionary as much/well as you THOUGHT you did!

WAV, You've got your bowels crossed!

I was going to mention 'throat singing' and a natural Folk music system that DID include harmonies with a solo performer, but... WAV obviously must stand for Wanking About eVerything...

:-)

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:04 AM

What was Alliteration's fine for?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 10:00 AM

No, I didn't know "lo"...and it took me quite a while to find what "LOL" was - but that doesn't apply here...and I thought is was exclamation MARKS! (Alliteration's fine.)

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 15 May 08 - 09:58 AM

What is it you hate so much about this variation? Does it signal the end of the world as we know it? Would you have a different opinion of it wasn't specifcally American English?

- A different culture, a different variation on the language? I thought you would like that, afterall its an American thing not an English thing.

Next thing you know they will be introducing chords into our beloved top line melody singing and playing.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 09:53 AM

Day follows night out the Gnostic thinking that DARKNESS is the passive / default principle of the universe. LIGHT is active; hard-won, needing constant vigilance. Without LIGHT there is DARKNESS, without DARKNESS these is NOTHING! The same applies to COLD, DEATH & EVIL; in respect to which WARMTH, LIFE & GOOD are active, hard-won, needing constant vigilance etc.

Anyway, it's far from farcical (if you'll forgive the alliteration) - and in any case practise is a verb & practice is a noun - see HERE.

Why? Because it just is, and gladly so, and you can't regulate these things anyway so why bother trying?

Noting your fondness for exclamation points, did you know this most reviled piece punctuation was originally shorthand for the Latin Io?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 09:30 AM

...I thought you'd say "day follows night", (Sedayne)...but equally farcical is what I mentioned above: "practiSe (English spelling)/practiCe (American spelling); licenCe (English spelling)/licenSe (American spelling)! Why?!

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 09:22 AM

300!

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 09:22 AM

And just for the hell of it...

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 09:20 AM

WAV - I think you've lost the plot here somewhat. You can't regulate culture nor any aspect of it. And BTW - not sure now it is in Australia, but here in Britain, day follows night!

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 09:11 AM

Yes, that's it Sedayne - I do love the world being multicultural but stand by what I said above; some UN laws/regulations/standards, for another example, do and should apply to all nationals.
Night follows day in England, e.g. - anyone agree with me?!

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 15 May 08 - 09:01 AM

I think you'll find that it was due to Webster trying to approach English on it's own terms, rejecting the French conventions favoured at the time.
English spelling was hardly monolithic for most of it's history and most of the American variations were also used in Britain.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 15 May 08 - 08:59 AM

Have a look a this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_English and note that it is only since 1755 that there has been anything like standardised English spelling. Changes occur constantly - I know several people, for example, who still put the largely anachronistic hyphen in to-day.

One would have thought, WAV, that your love of a multi-cultural world could accommodate a few spelling differences which in all probability evolved quite naturally, the way that language tends to.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 15 May 08 - 08:48 AM

Why not? Whatis the problem with regional variation?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST
Date: 15 May 08 - 08:45 AM

For the same reason it was changed from the Old French Coulour, I suppose....

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 08:38 AM

So why change it from colour to color, Volgadon?!

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 15 May 08 - 08:35 AM

Powers-that-be? WHAT??? Have there been any new spelling conventions in the past 30 years? I do think you have a phantom fear, as well as intolerance. Who cares if it is colour or color?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 08:20 AM

But have the powers-that-be in the USA decided that enough is enough, or are there plans to make it "enuf"? Are you starting to see what I mean - it is silly/recalcitrant.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 15 May 08 - 08:15 AM

Whats wrong with that? Crossed-cultures is whats wrong.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 15 May 08 - 08:02 AM

Israel, not Isreal. Both American and British spellings are perfectly acceptable, what's wrong with that?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 07:57 AM

But is there a school in the USA, Ted, that agrees with me - i.e., accents are fine but English should only be spelt the one English way, French the one French way, Spanish the one Spanish way, etc?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: M.Ted
Date: 15 May 08 - 07:41 AM

If Americans want to use English spellings, they go up to Canada--I think there are bus tours in the Fall, and the fares are reasonable--

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 07:15 AM

Which spelling of English words is used/preferred in Isreal, Volgadon? And, in the USA, M. Ted, are you allowed to use English spelling if you wish to?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 06:41 AM

I said "bogues are a good thing" (above). And I said "English - to use Italian - is now the world's lingua franca" (above).

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: M.Ted
Date: 15 May 08 - 06:36 AM

As an American, the American spellings seem like the right ones to me--be that as it may, my point about Lingua Franca stands--

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 15 May 08 - 06:25 AM

Diversity, as long as it's the English way.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Joe
Date: 15 May 08 - 06:14 AM

Is now the world's lingua franca,
    Where, it seems, it once was Latin;

This kind of suggests the opposite?

With regard to American spelling - I thought you celebrated diversity?

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 15 May 08 - 06:06 AM

In the above poem, I didn't say "lingua franca" was Latin, M. Ted. Let me put it another way: practiSe (English spelling)/practiCe (American spelling); licenCe (English spelling)/licenSe (American spelling)!...it's fine/good for different nationals to pronounce English with different accents, but why not just stick with the one English way of spelling it, and the one Spanish way of spelling Spanish, etc.? (At uni., in Aus., we had the choice of either English or American spelling in our essays - I've decided that's silly, and even recalcitrant.) I'm NOT saying I'm the world's greatest speller - far from it - but, when I look up a word, I always choose the English spelling of the English word!

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,The Mole catcher's unplugged Apprentice
Date: 14 May 08 - 06:38 PM

" is what remained popular, in England, e.g., for centuries"

and you have historical evidence for such a statement?
Persnally I doubt it (that you have any evidence)

"That's not tradition so much as personal bias. "

It certainly is... :-D

Charlotte R

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: M.Ted
Date: 14 May 08 - 06:21 PM

WAV-I bring this up with slight bit of trepidation, but the fact is that "Lingua Franca" was not Latin, nor was it even a full blown language--it has been described as the original "pidgin", and seems to have consisted of words borrowed chiefly from the Romance languages, mostly Italian or possibly Catalan/Provencal/Occitan, with a simple grammar that was apparently drawn from Arabic.

The term "lingua franca" is a metaphorical usage, and is used to describe languages that to function in as an overarching language--but for the most part, these are full scale languages capable of expressing the full range of human experience-

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 14 May 08 - 05:25 PM

...on the contrary, off the top of my head, M., I've sung "Tommy's Gone to Hilo" (E.trad.) and had the pace of the 2nd and 4th lines changed by the group/chorus - yes, most of whom would have attended a lot more folk-clubs than me; it didn't bother me as it was a folk club not a jazz club. And this traditional way of singing verses with, mostly, just the tune (in a manner quite different from what is now called "Pop") is what remained popular, in England, e.g., for centuries; and I like it.

Subject: RE: Chords in Folk?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 14 May 08 - 05:25 PM

That's not tradition so much as personal bias.