BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 01:21 PM

Sad, but true eh SharonA

Well put Don...

guest... one day I'm moving back to Canada... no more of this America-lite for me...

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 01:11 PM

Following an explosion in a Scrabble tile factory, there are people who could walk through the debris and find something to be offended at.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 01:06 PM

You ain't too bright yourself, Clinton--otherwise you'd live somewhere other than Michigan--

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: SharonA
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 12:57 PM

You're kidding... Somebody out there actually wants to change the title of Tolkien's "The Two Towers" for the movie, even though that's been the title of the book since 1954???... Omigod, you're not kidding. I just checked Google, and here it is: http://www.petitiononline.com/twotower/

Unbelievable. The petition actually says "The title is clearly meant to refer to the attacks on the World Trade Center". What idiot wrote that??? Hah, probably the same idiot who named it the "Rename 'The Two Towers' to Something Less Offensive Petition Petition", which of course means that anyone signing it has to agree that "I have read the Rename 'The Two Towers' to Something Less Offensive Petition Petition Petition".

Well, at least there's a notice that says "This petition has been suspended temporarily due to a lack of maintenance by the petition author." Either he lost interest, or he walked into a tree and knocked himself out.

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 12:36 PM

Ya Dave... there's a small internet petition... most of the sigs on it are voting AGAINST the petition...

Once again I'll quote George Carlin...

"Think about how dumb the average person is... now what you have to realise is that HALF the people are dumber than that!"

And people wonder why I have no love for the human race....

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 12:32 PM

Anyone heard the rumour about some parties wanting to change the name of the second Lord of the Rings films for similar reasons?

I checked snopes but could not find anything.

Only out of interest.

Cheers

Dave the Gnome

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: catspaw49
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 10:06 AM

But which one is Knievel?

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: GUEST,The Bottom Line
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 09:40 AM

For those who Can't See The Forest For The Trees

...The ambulance workers did eventually get their $130 back, but they had to jump through hoops for what should have been freely and promptly tendered.

Starbucks isn't heartless -- it did provide free coffee to rescue workers, gave $1 million to the September 11th Fund (a national relief endeavor to help victims of the tragedy), and collects further contributions for the fund from its customers and friends.

(Other companies have made similar contributions, including $10 million each from Microsoft and Lilly Endowment, $5 million from IBM, and $4 million from UPS.) It's thus not an unfeeling company [Starbucks], merely one that fell down badly on problem resolution.

True: It shouldn't have happened, but look at the other side of the picture...

Woe to those who call Evil Good and Good Evil!

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: SharonA
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 09:14 AM

Kevin (McGrath): I don't think so. I attended several song circles (small ones, mind you) in the back room of a Starbucks in Wayne, PA before the manager shut it down because some nimrods had brought in an electronic bass and drums one night, and had made too much noise!

However, there may be a policy against allowing live-music performances in the main seating area; I don't know for sure.

Artbrooks: Thanks for giving your impression of the poster! I'm glad to hear that any similarities between it and the images of 9/11 were not so blatant as to give even the appearance of being intentional. I guess people are going to be sensitive to this sort of thing for a long, long while, and I can't say I blame them, but I agree with Clinton that when people give in to that sensitivity to the point of seeing images of 9/11 in ordinary things, then the terrorists have achieved at least one of their goals.

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 05:54 AM

Am I right in understanding that Starbucks has a company policy against allowing people to make live music or sing in their coffee bars?

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 02:08 AM

Good to know I'm not alone here spaw!

;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Metchosin
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 01:57 AM

Well I can't comment on the ad, but as far as coffee goes and as PT Barnum once said, no one ever went broke underestimating the taste of the American public. Or the world for that matter.

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: catspaw49
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 01:44 AM

Thanks Jeri....I checked Snopes but missed it for some reason.....Must have had a Clinton Hammond attack....

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Mark Cohen
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 01:19 AM

All you Seattle (and ex-Seattle) 'Catters, remember when....? Did anyone ever think that little company would turn into the McDonald's of coffee? Well, maybe the Tommy Hilfiger of coffee. Well...anyway, you get the idea. Thanks for the link to Snopes, Jeri, I was about to check the site. I agree with Barbara 100% on this one.

Aloha,
Mark

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 01:18 AM

I can't believe I said "Sep 9th", TWICE...

*sigh*

It's not easy being this addled...

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Metchosin
Date: 18 Jun 02 - 12:24 AM

misophist, I would agree, I hate the taste of over-roasted burnt beans.

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: GUEST,DW at work
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 11:55 PM

Yes, the water thing is true, I was there.

Basically anything that gets Starbucks a few less customers is good in my book. Ever see the Simpsons episode where the entire mall is nothing but Starbucks except one store, but that's about to close too to become a Starbucks? That's how DC is getting. I understand London England is getting that way too. How much coffee can the western world drink?

DW

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Jeri
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 11:09 PM

Spaw, apparently the thing with the water DID happen. Click

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: artbrooks
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 10:19 PM

Spaw, actually its a Chevie Blazer and Lands End!

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: mack/misophist
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 09:43 PM

Starbucks is NOT politically correct. They're doing their best to ruin coffee, for god's sake.

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: catspaw49
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 09:40 PM

Artbrooks, I KNEW IT!!!! I KNEW IT!!!

You're a closet yuppie aren't you? Go ahead...Admit it......You have a Lincoln Navigator and wear clothes from LL Bean........Am I right?......I knew it!!!

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 07:22 PM

Without seeing the poster it's impossible to hazard a guess as to whether scrapping the poster is a ridiculous but of PR, or putting it out was a sick effort to cash in somehow on September 11th. Or maybe both.

The business of doctoring movies to remove the Two Towers is crazy and rather sick. Is the idea to pretend that they never existed, airbrush them out of history?

Maybe in disaster comic book films, like Spiderman, where the superhero saves everybody, that makes sense; there wasn't any superhero to do that on September 11th. But, as I understand it, the airbrush wielders have been busily removing any record of the existence of the Two Towers from all kinds of films and TV programmes which just happened to include them as an indication that they were set in New York, the way they might include the Empire State Building or the Statue of Liberty. or Tower Bridge in London

If that is true, it seems rather disgusting to me. I think I'd feel it as an insult if I was a New Yorker or maybe even more so if I'd lost somebody in the disaster.

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Blues=Life
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 07:17 PM

I hate the very notion of "Politically Correct", because no one can satisfy me with the answer to "According to whom?" The phrase reminds me of the classic test of a person's intelligence...s/he is judged by how well their opinion agrees with mine! Arrgh!

Screw it, I'm going to go play some more

Blues.

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: artbrooks
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 07:03 PM

I've seen the poster, and anybody who thinks that it looks like the WTC, intentionally or not, needs to see his/her medical care provider for either new glasses or a medication adjustment, as appropriate. Starbucks (which, by the way, serves the only decent coffee within walking distance of my house) is a leader in a very competitive market and is HIGHLY UNLIKELY to do anything to annoy customers/potential customers, at least not on purpose.

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: mousethief
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 06:51 PM

Where can I go to see wet-blouse caving in?

Alex

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: catspaw49
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 06:47 PM

Yeah I agree, but the question is....Is it true?

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 06:31 PM

Catspaw, the entire world heard that story

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: catspaw49
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 06:29 PM

I heard that story too Ron and don't know whether it's true or not. I personally don't care a damn about Starbucks myself and see the joints as little Yuppie Collection Devices.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Ron Olesko
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 05:38 PM

Wasn't it a Starbucks in the neighborhood of the WTC that was charging rescue workers for water on 9/11? They took a lot of abuse for that so I'm sure they were being ultra-sensitive when they pulled these posters.

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 05:31 PM

I'm gonna be glad when I'm dead and I don't have to hear ANYTHING else about Sept 9th, 2001...

It lands solidly in my Old News file...

Especially when it comes to absolutely idiotic stuff like this... or the original Spiderman movie preview being recalled, because he caught a helicopter full of bank robbers in a big web between the 2 towers...

IT was the BEST preview that movie could have possibly had... even after Sept 9th...

It COULD have become a CELEBRATION of perseverance...

Instead, all this wet-blouse, PC, caving in is just one more way that the terrorists won the day, and keep winning day after day...

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 05:14 PM

I remember after Daddy was killed really hating all the Father's Day stuff on TV... but hey, that was me, not everybody. Not politically incorrect. Starbucks, however, I gather is walmarty in getting rid of Mom&Pop coffeehouses, which is PI in my book but this ad... when was it designed? If after 9/11 then likely it was sparked by that, however unconsciously, but chances are it was in the works long before that... and I think it would take someone close to the disaster, like I was then, to mind. Have the anti-Irish come in to object to it being green and orange? For crying out loud!

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: Gareth
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 04:43 PM

Question ? Is Starbucks correct politically or otherwise.

Gareth

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: GUEST,Paul
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 04:40 PM

It's ridiculous.

A picture of a baby might well upset a woman who's just had a miscarrage. A picture of a happy family might upset peopl who have just had a divorce, etc, etc

To suggest that two glasses and a dragonfly 'represent' 9/11 is totally absurd.

Paul

Subject: RE: BS: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: catspaw49
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 04:31 PM

I think we get a hard-on way too easily anymore...............

Spaw

Subject: Starbucks 'Collapse' ad: PC or not PC?
From: SharonA
Date: 17 Jun 02 - 04:21 PM

Has anyone seen the Starbucks poster referred to in the following new story? (I have not.) If you have, what do you think – did the ad's designers intend to make an insensitive reference to the World Trade Center collapse, or are people reading things into the ad (the way some people see skeletons in the ice cubes of liquor ads)? A lot of corporations have been criticized for appearing to capitalize on the terrorist attacks of 9/11 – usually with references to nationalism and patriotism in an attempt to associate these with the products' "strengths" – but I can't imagine that any ad agency would do something this crude on purpose and expect to make any sales! Here's the article:

Starbucks Dumping Posters: Image reminded some customers of collapse of World Trade Center
06/16/2002
By IEVA M. AUGSTUMS / The Dallas Morning News

Starbucks has ordered its 4,310 stores to remove a promotional poster that reminded some customers of the World Trade Center disaster. The posters depicted two summer tea drinks – one green and one orange – standing side by side, with a dragonfly hovering to the left and the headline "Collapse into Cool" overhead.

The Seattle-based coffeehouse chain pulled the posters June 7 after hearing that a New York customer had complained the signs were "insensitive" in light of Sept. 11, company officials said.

By that time, a guest on the ABC late-night show "Politically Incorrect" had piled on, saying the dragonfly and two drinks were reminiscent of a plane and the twin towers and criticizing the use of the word "collapse." Others on the show said the charge was ludicrous.

Starbucks officials, saying the posters were not an intentional allusion to the events of Sept. 11, apologized to customers. "We deeply regret if this ad was in any way misinterpreted to be insensitive or offensive, as this was never our intent," spokeswoman Lara Wyss said.

The poster, promoting Tazo Citrus and Tazoberry beverages, was designed to create a "magical place" using bright colors and whimsical elements such as palm trees and dragonflies, Ms. Wyss said.