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BS: Let's talk about the US election
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Dave the Gnome Date: 23 Nov 24 - 05:30 AM Who are these usual suspects, Don? Accusing people of something and then dehumanising them by giving them derogatory names seems very Trumpian to me. The usual subjects do not... Immigrants are not... Jews do not... Don't have a go at fascist tactics then use them yourself. If you want to accuse anyone of anything individualise them and provide some reference |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Helen Date: 22 Nov 24 - 01:06 PM Here is a link to a YouTube video of the (Oz) ABC TV show Planet America in the episode a couple of days ago where they discuss Gaetz's nomination for AG. I'll have to listen to it all to find the exact moment when the "stalking horse" comment was made. I've listened up to the 7 minute mark so far, at the conclusion of their interesting comments about Gaetz. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Helen Date: 22 Nov 24 - 12:52 PM In my opinion, if there was ever going to be election interference, it would never be by the Democrats. The Trumpian Republicans could/would have interfered to help their own cause in both elections if they had a chance of getting away with it. It would be poetic justice if it could be proven that Trump and his minions, including his Russian friends, had rigged this election. Bondi's name was not mentioned in the initial list of possible AG's so either he had her in mind all along and was playing a sneaky game, using Gaetz as bait, or she came into his view later and he dropped his previous list and focused on her. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Stilly River Sage Date: 22 Nov 24 - 11:40 AM It sounds like Gaetz may have been the stalking horse - he was a really smelly candidate whose stink was so much worse than Bondi's. Trump didn't have her in the first cabinet because they had a financial history (not looking it up this morning - but whatever was a problem before is barely a blip this time around.) The count is continuing and Trump's margin was very small and his take under 50%, but he'll still shout "mandate!" from the top of the White House. And still looking closely at those swing state counts to see if there was mischief. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Donuel Date: 22 Nov 24 - 10:15 AM Newsmax is to the extreme right of Fox News. TDS is their story as well as the no climate change 'good' news. Elon's X suppresses URL links outside of X. Thats why Blue Sky (another version of twitter without Elon's interference) is attracting people who actually want conversation and not another echo chamber. It seems the usual suspects don't look at media outside their own comfort zone. The seed of this modern US religio fascism goes back 55 years ago to the John Birch Society. Getting the big picture involves going to some VERY unsavory places. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: gillymor Date: 22 Nov 24 - 09:49 AM I think Gaetz was exactly the kind of toady Trump wanted at DOJ. A true believer who would undertake all manner of unethical and possibly criminal actions against the nation that he's envisioned (including quashing all the federal investigations against him) without question. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 22 Nov 24 - 09:33 AM Gaetz methinks wasn't a stalking horse. His was a sacrificial appointment (he may or may not have been instructed to fall on his sword at the appropriate moment), to distract from the previous appointments' unsuitability for their respective posts. As I said above: "Push The Parent". |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Donuel Date: 22 Nov 24 - 05:56 AM Bondi. She was Donald's defense lawyer. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Helen Date: 21 Nov 24 - 06:24 PM Hmm! They mentioned someone else but the name escapes me. I can look it up. Maybe Mike Lee? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: robomatic Date: 21 Nov 24 - 06:17 PM So WHO could he be a stalking horse for . . . Kanye West? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Helen Date: 21 Nov 24 - 03:52 PM Well, robomatic, one of our balanced political commentators on Oz TV's Planet America said that Gaetz could have been proposed as a "stalking horse" so that the next person nominated gets in with less fuss and less scrutiny. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: robomatic Date: 21 Nov 24 - 03:34 PM Gaetz has pulled out of contention for AG. Now it's time to worry about the next submission. I learned long ago that whenever you feel relieved that some sob has left the stage, there's room for worse. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: robomatic Date: 21 Nov 24 - 02:38 PM Yesterday a news article on National Public Radio more than suggested two significant undersea data cables were deliberately cut, the apparent culprit being a Chinese vessel. Here is the Newsweek version but it is in several European online pubs. Curious to me why it would be so obvious, but we already know we live in strange times. Suggests to me another book for the New Era Club. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Helen Date: 21 Nov 24 - 02:34 PM The funny part about Gaetz as well is that he resigned from his role as a Congressman in Florida just before Trumpty-Dumpty announced that he was putting Gaetz forward as the AG nominee. Damn & double-damn, Mr Gaetz! LOL |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: gillymor Date: 21 Nov 24 - 01:32 PM There's a long litany of sleaze on Gaetz, without his connections and influential father he'd be doing time right now so he does seem like a logical pick for a Trump administration AG as having sexual predation on your resume appears to be a plus. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Stilly River Sage Date: 21 Nov 24 - 01:32 PM Democrats consider themselves the adults in the room, not falling for conspiracy theories and say the elections are sound. Then articles like this one come along: Cyber-Security Experts Warn Election Was Hacked 'Musk is guilty as fuck' Cyber-security experts across America are raising the alarm of wide-scale election fraud securing Trump’s victory — and the data is compelling. Follow the link for the rest of the article. The part that makes this seem most creepy and yet most plausible is the lottery that Musk ran - the description of the information needed to enter that he could then manipulate. In that instance. (I'm not there yet as far as what happened, but the swing states need more examination for this as one of many reasons.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Helen Date: 21 Nov 24 - 01:19 PM Here's something to cheer about: Donald Trump's choice for US attorney-general, Matt Gaetz, withdraws, from consideration "Donald Trump's controversial pick for US attorney-general, Matt Gaetz, says he has decided to withdraw his name from consideration. "The US Congress's House Ethics Committee had been considering releasing a report into allegations Mr Gaetz had engaged in sexual misconduct. Mr Gaetz denies the allegations, which include that he had sex with a 17-year-old girl." |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Stilly River Sage Date: 21 Nov 24 - 11:04 AM Big Al, YOU keep bringing it up. I just described the numbers game that gets played here. Dick, stop sending PMs. We know what happened, but the difference in votes is about 0.05% that would have turned the election. If half of one percent of all of those voters were in those swing states, Harris would have won even without the popular vote (it's how Trump won the first time). It's a screwed up system based upon colonial Southern landowners in slave-holding states. It means Harris connected with a lot of people, she wasn't out of touch, but they didn't figure out how to get past the outright lies told by the Trump campaign to working people who didn't know that their news sources are like FOX as Trump parrots or like 'influencers' on disconnected social media. And don't doubt that Russia influenced a lot of those disconnected folks. The party chairs in each state will sum up the results in their states and the party will choose a new leader and maybe in two years the Democratic opposition will break through that news/sound barrier. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: gillymor Date: 21 Nov 24 - 08:13 AM We're definitely transitioning into an Idiocracy. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Big Al Whittle Date: 21 Nov 24 - 06:56 AM God is not going to sort this mess out. America has to do it for itself. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Backwoodsman Date: 21 Nov 24 - 06:47 AM ”Oklahoma will be purchasing Trump bibles for their students” If that’s true, then they clearly don’t ‘get’ irony in Oklahoma. It’s obviously lost on them that Trump is the personification of The Seven Deadly Sins - envy, gluttony, avarice, lust, pride, sloth, and wrath. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Donuel Date: 21 Nov 24 - 06:40 AM Speaking of education, McMahon of Worldwide Wrestling is the new Department of Education director. Oklahoma will be purchasing Trump bibles for their students. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Big Al Whittle Date: 21 Nov 24 - 05:21 AM flippin' heck! Look! You've got to face facts. Many , too many people have voted for this Trump plonker. Something has gone wrong with your educational system. Something has gone wrong. Perhaps several things. We feel sorry for you, but its only you that can sort this out. We have our own problems. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Nigel Parsons Date: 21 Nov 24 - 05:04 AM SRS: This year, Harris lost to Trump by only 780,000 votes in the swing states, compared to 3.2 million nationally under current vote counts. So it would have taken the VP flipping just under one million votes into those areas to be the president-elect today. To overturn a margin of 780,000 votes doesn't need one million 'flips'. It's less than half that figure. Each vote 'flipped' would reduce Trump's votes by 1, and increase Harris's by 1. so 390,001 'flips' would do the trick. (adjust to allow for weird voting systems) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Helen Date: 20 Nov 24 - 06:10 PM I find it a bit odd that Dr Oz is so whacky as a potential politician. When I was teaching at adult education colleges I had different classes at different times and places and I happened to be able to watch his daytime show for about a year. I usually found him and the topics covered fairly sensible and factually accurate, as far as I could tell. He was able to relate to the mostly female studio audience and guests on the show without negative biases - again, as far as I could see. I was very surprised to learn of his political aspirations. Life is full of surprises, in this day and age. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Stilly River Sage Date: 20 Nov 24 - 05:45 PM Big Al, it is only a win if the electoral college says so - and if that particular batch of voters had gone to Kamala even if she didn't have the popular vote he would have lost. Also he didn't have 50% of the vote (as the numbers continue to be firmed up) so his claim of a "mandate" is nonsense. He's going to fuss about that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Donuel Date: 20 Nov 24 - 05:33 PM SAD MESS? Dr. Phil is probably suffering from clinical depression over the cabinet appointment of Dr Snake Oil OZ. After all, Oz had more daytime Emmys than Phil. Telecommuting is to be banned. Zoom meetings have been SOP since the pandemic. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Big Al Whittle Date: 20 Nov 24 - 01:18 PM 780 thousand is a fair majority. He won. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Stilly River Sage Date: 20 Nov 24 - 12:56 PM Democrats weren't defeated overwhelmingly. The numbers are coming in - it's the electoral college count that matters (still, for now anyway, if we can't get rid of it.) Trump’s win has been described as resounding. It was closer than you think The vice president improved on Biden’s margins in some swing states, but Trump swept them all Despite the popular vote, Harris could have won the 2024 — or at least made it significantly closer — if she had just maintained Biden’s figures in a few key states such as Pennsylvania and Michigan. It's that win the popular vote but lose the election thing - the electoral college put Trump in the last time. It would have been ironic if it had put Harris in this time. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Nigel Parsons Date: 20 Nov 24 - 11:04 AM Sandman: Nigel, since when has Trump been an arbiter of what is morally right. That is something I never claimed. In school many decades ago, we were taught 'comprehension' which meant reading something, and understanding its meaning. It did not include shading what you read depending upon your own pre-conceptions! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Backwoodsman Date: 20 Nov 24 - 08:37 AM There’s no need to SHOUT. Shouting is for rude, aggressive people, and does you no credit whatsoever. If you feel the need to emphasise a point, try underlining, emboldening, Or italicising the words. And you appear not to understand Nigel’s point and mine - that Biden is, in every respect, the POTUS until Trump’s inauguration on 20th January, and it is both his right and responsibility carry out his Presidential duties until that date, making whatever decisions he feels right and necessary. Did you read the list Nigel linked to, of Presidential actions taken by Trump during his interregnum period? If not, you should, it might open your eyes a little. I recommend that you educate yourself by reading this piece from The Economic Times. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: The Sandman Date: 20 Nov 24 - 07:51 AM you appear NOT to understand my point, about what is morally right and representing voters not corporations,the voters rejected the DEMOCRATS AND THEIR POLICIES, Nothing difficult to understand there |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Backwoodsman Date: 20 Nov 24 - 02:45 AM Nigel is absolutely right - although the election was in November, the Term of Office begins on 6th January. Until then, Biden is the POTUS, just as Trump continued to be the POTUS from the election on 3rd November 2019 until Biden’s Term began on 20th January, 2020. Nothing difficult to understand there. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: The Sandman Date: 20 Nov 24 - 02:30 AM Nigel, since when has Trump been an arbiter of what is morally right. The democrats were defeated overwhelmingly, the voters rejected them and their policies, in my opinion that means they no longer have a mandate to make important decisions, the same would apply if trump had been in power and lost the election. A sad reflection of the morality of USA Politicians, Biden was funded billions by armament manufacturers so he had to do their bidding , never mind the voters who no longer gave him a mandate,so much for democracy |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Thompson Date: 20 Nov 24 - 12:58 AM Just saw a photo of the lads on the plane eating McD's. Does this mean that RHK has been chosen to be the boy that everyone bullies and laughs at? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Thompson Date: 19 Nov 24 - 11:30 PM What a sad mess. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Stilly River Sage Date: 19 Nov 24 - 11:16 PM Trump's new best buddy Musk is in cahoots with Putin. How can we tell? An undersea communications cable between Lithuania and Sweden has been damaged in the Baltic Sea, public broadcaster LRT reported on Nov. 18. Andrius Šemeškevicius, the chief technology officer of Lithuanian telecommunications company Telia, stated the cable was cut on Nov. 17, around 10 a.m. It's handy that Musk has a starlink satellite service he can sell to those folks whose cables are damaged. Does Trump care? Probably not. Does he know what Musk is up to? Who can say. But letting Musk tamper with the US Government operations doesn't bode well for anyone except Musk. If photos could post here I'd put up an image of the fox guarding the hen house. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Stilly River Sage Date: 19 Nov 24 - 07:44 PM The TV doctor Mehmet Oz appears to be headed to the cabinet. No surprise there - anyone who Trump has seen on TV is a candidate for his insider group. He's pushed as much or more crackpot stuff as Kennedy. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: keberoxu Date: 19 Nov 24 - 04:44 PM Thompson, what Donuel may have hinted at regarding labor unions concerns the National Labor Relations Board, or NLRB. This entity was affected by the first Trump administration, apparently not in a good way for union workers. Then there is the presence of Elon Musk, who is ... not pro-union. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Donuel Date: 19 Nov 24 - 02:17 PM Trump actually said that the wages of US workers are “too high”. He insulted the nation’s workers by insisting their pay is too high because from Trump’s billionaire, pro-business viewpoint, that makes it too hard for US companies to compete. Trump said that workers’ pay was too high even though corporate profits and the stock market were booming at the time. Trump suggested that automakers in the midwest move some operations to the south so that they could reduce their workers’ wages – the last thing that workers want. “You can go to different parts of the United States.” Trump said that after the auto industry in the midwest “loses a couple of plants – all of sudden you’ll make good deals [to lower workers’ wages] in your own area”. Trump praised the idea of firing workers who are on strike, even though that is illegal under federal law. In a conversation with his billionaire campaign supporter Elon Musk, Trump applauded the idea of corporations telling their striking workers: “You’re all gone.” “You’re the greatest cutter,” Trump told Musk. “I look at what you do. You walk in and say: ‘You want to quit?’ I won’t mention the name of the company, but they go on strike and you say: ‘That’s OK. You’re all gone.’” Trump tried to portray himself as a regular worker by donning an apron for a photo op at a McDonald’s in Pennsylvania, but the fact is, Trump has never been a worker and has always been an owner. As an owner, he has always had management’s interest at heart, particularly when it comes to workers. If Trump really wanted to be a worker, rather than an owner, he certainly could have been. Trump, who always wanted to be a billionaire and be in glitzy headlines, insults workers’ intelligence when says he always wanted to be a McDonald’s worker. “I’ve always wanted to work at McDonald’s, but I never did.” Trump insulted the nation’s factory workers by saying their jobs are such a cinch that children can do them. By saying that, he showed he has very little understanding of blue-collar jobs and how hard, exhausting and sometimes dangerous they are. In a recent speech to the Economic Club of Chicago, Trump talked about auto assembly plant jobs as if they’re as simple as a child assembling Lego. “They [workers] don’t build cars. They take’em out of a box, and they assemble’em. We could have our child do it.” Trump said he hates overtime pay. In a speech last month in Pennsylvania, he revealed how stingy he is toward workers by saying he tried to minimize what he paid his workers by always making sure he avoided paying time-and-a-half overtime pay. “I hated to give overtime. I hated it. I shouldn’t say this, but I’d get other people in. I wouldn’t pay. I hated it.” To win support from workers, Trump, after driving past several closed factories and steel mills in Ohio, made a marvelous promise. He sounded like the pied piper when he told thousands of workers in Youngstown that all of Ohio’s lost factory jobs would be coming back with him as president. Trump even told Ohio workers not to move, promising them that the jobs would come back. But the truth is that hardly any of those factory jobs came back. Indeed, General Motors closed its giant assembly plant in nearby Lordstown not long after Trump gave his Youngstown speech. “Those jobs have left Ohio. They’re all coming back. They’re all coming back. “Don’t move. Don’t sell your house.” Shawn Fain, the president of the United Auto Workers (UAW), is one of the country’s most successful and respected union leaders. Fain led a major strike last fall that won 25% raises from GM, Ford and Stellantis/Chrysler and the restoration of cost-of-living adjustments, plus 68% raises for new workers. Despite Fain’s huge successes, Trump said at the Republican convention that Fain should be “fired immediately”. Why in the world was a presidential candidate saying that such a respected, inspiring union leader should be fired? That’s improper interference in union affairs, and what Trump was calling for would seriously hurt the UAW’s huge momentum and successes. “The leader of the United Auto Workers should be fired immediately.” Trump lied to the country’s workers and insulted their intelligence when he said he always paid contractors and workers on time and what they’re supposed to be paid. Before he became president, he was notorious for paying construction contractors and workers late and for refusing to pay them the amount he had promised to pay; sometimes he would pay tens of thousands of dollars less than he was contracted to pay. Hundreds of contractors and workers had sued Trump after he failed to pay them or after he insisted on paying them far less than what the contract called for. “We pay everybody what they’re supposed to be paid, and we pay everybody on time.” Trump actually told union members that they shouldn’t pay their union dues. By saying this, Trump was essentially seeking to sabotage the country’s labor unions. If workers refuse to pay their union dues, that would greatly weaken unions and their ability to fight for higher wages, better benefits, improved working conditions. Profit-maximizing corporations would love it if workers stopped paying their union dues and that undermined unions’ ability to battle for better things for workers. “I’m telling you, you shouldn’t pay those dues.” Steven Greenhouse is a journalist and author, focusing on labour and the workplace https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/oct/23/trump-anti-worker-union-statements You linked to AFGE but actually copy/pasted from the Guardian. In future use a small amount of the article and post the link with the article. ---mudelf |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Nigel Parsons Date: 19 Nov 24 - 07:20 AM Biden is still President until January. Do you think all presidential work should have a 2 month hiatus? To see what Trump did after losing (although not according to him) the presidential election in 2020 there is a list Here Post election actions start with item 135 in the list. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: The Sandman Date: 19 Nov 24 - 02:55 AM I am intrigued, The democrats have lost the election, but Biden has just pushed through an aggressive foreign policy with RUSSIA,after his party has been voted out, how Democratic is that, to put the rest of the world at risk of a world war. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Thompson Date: 19 Nov 24 - 02:46 AM Labour unions? What's this? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Donuel Date: 18 Nov 24 - 02:42 PM A page out of the 3rd Reich is about banning labor unions. The President-elect has begun the process by stabbing the heart of organized labor in the US. If she wants to Stilly could explain the process or you could Google it yourself. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Stilly River Sage Date: 18 Nov 24 - 12:22 PM Perhaps I should have qualified it as one that we over here agree with. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 18 Nov 24 - 10:41 AM > What goes around *Urgh*: in this context, that made me think of a lavatory being flushed .... > comes around .... now it's running backwards. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Thompson Date: 18 Nov 24 - 09:04 AM And cacastocracy is rule by James II of England. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: The Sandman Date: 18 Nov 24 - 08:49 AM For those who are abroad in particular, getting a good left and right view of things is sometimes a challenge, quote stilly river sage No, it is not a challenge, it is easier than you think |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Stilly River Sage Date: 17 Nov 24 - 06:23 PM Listen to the podcast I linked to, Don. They discuss that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Let's talk about the US election From: Donuel Date: 17 Nov 24 - 05:19 PM Kakistocracy comes from ancient Greece. They must have encountered this problem a time or two to have a word for it. During election week the top Google search was 'did Biden drop out?' Stilly, Kamala's turnout among women was low, and even lower among men. I believe she did not do as well as Hillary. shrug |
