 sj |
||
|
||
BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4
|
|
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Fred Date: 24 Sep 25 - 03:36 AM I don't often post here, but I feel you guys are knocking on the wrong door when you blame Reform's popularity on the BBC. Is it that, or is it that the voters who want illegal immigration stopped tried the Tories who failed to tackle it, tried Labour which led to record levels and Farage is saying what they want to hear? I don't know. I've long given up on politics. Try Labour, mess up try Tories and it's like the Ariston TV ad if you remember that. All you get is different faces pushing the same old hand-cart which is long overdue a major service :) -F |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Dave the Gnome Date: 24 Sep 25 - 03:06 AM Just reading that the government has managed to recover £500m lost to benefit fraud using an AI tool. Good for them. They now just need another one to stop the billions being lost to the tax avoidance schemes put in place to make the rich even richer... |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 23 Sep 25 - 01:52 PM I agree if they were truly impartial they would give him less time., but if you include what i said earlier about Starmers attack on Farage, and reforms increased membership on that day, you get a truer picture.There is no gettying away from the effct Starmers attack on Farage had, Harold Wilson would never have made that mistake |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Backwoodsman Date: 23 Sep 25 - 01:10 PM The BBC are Deform’s biggest cheer-leaders. Look at how much time they spend on reporting Deform business (with 4 MPs) compared to the Greens (also with 4 MPs) and the Lib-Dems (with 72 MPs). |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 23 Sep 25 - 01:05 PM and also the faux pas made by Starmer, Reform membership, increased dramatically when Starmer made a personal attack on Farage in parliament |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Dave the Gnome Date: 23 Sep 25 - 12:30 PM Heard a question posed a BBC political pundit yesterday. Along the lines of "Why are reform gaining so much popularity?" It is not too often that I can be seen shouting at the TV but the words were something like "Because you bunch of fucking wank-puffins keep pushing the shite that deform are spewing out on the rest of us!" |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 22 Sep 25 - 01:32 PM Found in the Letters column in this week's New
.... by way of balance. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 22 Sep 25 - 09:48 AM https://news.sky.com/story/duchess-of-york-dropped-as-patron-of-childrens-hospice-julias-house-over-epstein-email-13436100?utm_s |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 22 Sep 25 - 09:47 AM https://news.sky.com/story/duchess-of-york-dropped-as-patron-of-childrens-hospice-julias-house-over-epstein-email-13436100?utm_source=firefox-newtab-en-gb |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Backwoodsman Date: 22 Sep 25 - 06:12 AM This being, first and foremost, a music forum, here’s one for the hard-of-heart, “Let ‘em drown” brigade… “Are We Human?” |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Backwoodsman Date: 21 Sep 25 - 12:12 PM ”We all know that there are no easy answers as to how to deal with the crossings across the channel. But people should never forget that the RNLI is manned by volunteers. The crews at Dover have been called out an increasing number of times. If you have not already seen it, i would recommend this episode of Saving Lives At Sea. Saving Lives at Sea Series 10: 1. Emergency in the Channel It does include upsetting scenes.” That’s very true, RD, and one of the points I was making in my previous post is that, unlike vessels of the RN, the Lifeboat crews aren’t ordered to carry out service, they do so because they want to, because they regard it as their duty as decent human beings. And I regard the earlier statement, ”Why does it only seem to be the British who say "Well, although they put themselves in harm's way, it is our responsibility to rescue them."?” as a shabby, shameful example of victim-blaming. Absolutely heartless and disgraceful. I’ve already seen the episode of ‘Saving Lives at Sea’ you linked to, but I watched it again from your link. Those who, from the comfort of their living rooms, question the rescues carried out by, not only the RNLI, but other vessels too (including the French), really should be honest and examine their own heartless, callous attitudes. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Rain Dog Date: 21 Sep 25 - 10:44 AM "But the RNLI should not be sending boats to meet boats which have been escorted by the French authorities to mid-channel.” You forgot to complete that sentence. “…escorted by the French authorities to mid-channel, then abandoned in their leaky, unreliable craft” The question should be why do the French abandon them in the middle of the Channel. We all know that there are no easy answers as to how to deal with the crossings across the channel. But people should never forget that the RNLI is manned by volunteers. The crews at Dover have been called out an increasing number of times. If you have not already seen it, i would recommend this episode of Saving Lives At Sea. Saving Lives at Sea Series 10: 1. Emergency in the Channel It does include upsetting scenes. It does also show otber vessels responding to the emergency. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 21 Sep 25 - 07:11 AM the split between Corbyn and Sultana is disappointing, how frequently the left gets divided, which suits the establishment, is one of them working for the establishment deliberately causing division |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Backwoodsman Date: 20 Sep 25 - 02:04 PM ”But the RNLI should not be sending boats to meet boats which have been escorted by the French authorities to mid-channel.” You forgot to complete that sentence. “…escorted by the French authorities to mid-channel, then abandoned in their leaky, unreliable craft”. Unlike the Royal Navy, The RNLI is a privately-run, independent charity, funded by voluntary public subscriptions and donations operating, under Royal Charter, according the the provisions of Article 3 of that Charter. Nowhere in those articles is there any limitation on the rescue activities of the RNLI dependent on the cause of the peril in which those rescued find themselves - all that is necessary is for the lives of human beings to be at risk at sea. Read the Charter and educate yourself. Having spent a great deal of time at sea in large sailing vessels, and having witnessed at first hand the power of the sea and the frailty of human life at sea, I know that it’s a particularly cruel, callous sort of person who would condone abandoning a group of people effectively adrift and at risk in a small boat at sea, no matter what their origins or motivations. And no matter the colour of their skins. Fortunately, there are still some of us who hold themselves to far higher standards of decency and humanity. Take care, Nigel, your true colours are showing, and they’re not pretty, not pretty at all… |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 20 Sep 25 - 10:36 AM "The UK should not use its armed forces to break International Maritime Law, period." True! But the RNLI should not be sending boats to meet boats which have been escorted by the French authorities to mid-channel. Not meeting them does not put them in peril. The smugglers did that by arranging the boats. The French police were complicit in allowing them to leave French shores. Any boats escorting them to the mid-point are also complicit. Why does it only seem to be the British who say "Well, although they put themselves in harm's way, it is our responsibility to rescue them."? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Backwoodsman Date: 20 Sep 25 - 07:26 AM The UK should not use its armed forces to break International Maritime Law, period. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 20 Sep 25 - 03:41 AM Trump poses as anti establishment, but he is really not too bright, all this nonsense about using the military to stop boat people, the navy does not have enough ships, Trump talks off the top of his head without consulting facts |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 20 Sep 25 - 03:31 AM 2 Establishment poodles, |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Dave the Gnome Date: 20 Sep 25 - 02:40 AM Not a fan of royalty but I thought that Charlie's speech at the turnip's visit was pretty good. Went right over turnip's head of course. The look on Charlie's face during some of his guest's verbal diorhea was a picture too:-) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Dave the Gnome Date: 14 Sep 25 - 06:23 AM So, the rally organised by ex-con and known thug, Tommy Ten Names, resulted in dozens of arrests and many police being injured. What a surprise. The turnips ex-pet muskrat turned up on video telling the protestors that they must 'fight back or die'. I hope that, if he ever sets foot on British soil, he is arrested for inciting violence Rain Man - "Best mate? Please reveal your sources" The fact that you knew who I meant means the the hyperbole did it's job ;-) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 13 Sep 25 - 03:49 PM The Hatter's hat "10/6 in this style" would hardly equate to 52.5p. UK inflation since 1865 has been about 16,000%. The hat would now be £84.00 (rough approximation) But thank you for the reminder. I should re-read "Alice's Adventure in Wonderland" |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Doug Chadwick Date: 13 Sep 25 - 02:54 PM OK, I can see where you got your references from but what the connection is, between the first comment and the response, escapes me. I wouldn't bother trying to explain it further, if I were you. Let's just accept I'm too thick to understand. DC |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 13 Sep 25 - 02:23 PM Doug: see Alice in Wonderland. The hat in question features on the front cover of the dust jacket of our household copy .... which appears to have been put Somewhere Safe. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 13 Sep 25 - 04:29 AM is it time for Starmer to resign?I think he should be replaced |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Doug Chadwick Date: 12 Sep 25 - 07:25 PM MaJoC the Filk, I understand your the comment on reshuffles on general: About 14 months. *Just* long enough to be seen to have "held" the post, just short enough not to have been able to do more than get up to speed, attend some lunches and be moved on. CHANGE PLACES! ... but what is the reponse, fully earned or otherwise, supposed to mean: Does make about as much sense as the UK leading the world in Horological Dairy products even if "It was the best butter." I wouldn't give you 53p for the heads even it included the hat. Could you explain please? DC |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Rain Dog Date: 12 Sep 25 - 01:57 PM "Yet we are still welcoming Epsteins best mate with open arms later this month. The hypocrisy is stunning." Best mate? Please reveal your sources. I imagine that a lot of people would like to know them. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 12 Sep 25 - 12:21 PM Minor aside: In comments following on from the reshuffle which was triggered (prematurely) by Angela Rayner's problems, something I agree with about reshuffles in general:
... which fully earned the response:
Evaluation of "52½p" in old money is left as an exercise. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 12 Sep 25 - 11:36 AM I agree |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Dave the Gnome Date: 12 Sep 25 - 06:01 AM Yet we are still welcoming Epsteins best mate with open arms later this month. The hypocrisy is stunning. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 12 Sep 25 - 03:23 AM MANDELSON has been sacked, and rightly so |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 11 Sep 25 - 11:28 AM News or old news? U.K. fires its ambassador to Washington over emails to Jeffrey Epstein LONDON — Days before President Trump arrives in the United Kingdom for a state visit, the U.K. has fired its ambassador to Washington over links to convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein. In 2008, before becoming ambassador to the United States, Peter Mandelson — a former Cabinet minister and European Union trade commissioner from the center-left Labour Party — wrote Epstein an email saying, "I think the world of you and I feel hopeless and furious about what has happened." There's a bit more to the article at the link. It says the emails were from private email addresses and leaked by The Sun - a yellowish UK journal, correct? How did they get them? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Dave the Gnome Date: 11 Sep 25 - 11:21 AM As this current government has shown, trying to get the richest to pay more than a reasonable percentage just gets them to move themselves, their money, and their businesses elsewhere. Which makes the country poorer. Has it Nigel? I cannot find any reference to anyone moving their money or business out of the country for any other reason than Brexit in recent times. If there has been a mass exudus because of Labour's taxation policies I have not spotted it in the news. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 11 Sep 25 - 02:47 AM The quote is about a Communist society. SPB is talking about our present capitalist society, stop muddying the waters with irrelevance. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 11 Sep 25 - 02:36 AM HERE is the quote in context In a higher phase of communist society, after the enslaving subordination of the individual to the division of labor, and therewith also the antithesis between mental and physical labor, has vanished; after labor has become not only a means of life but life's prime want; after the productive forces have also increased with the all-around development of the individual, and all the springs of co-operative wealth flow more abundantly—only then can the narrow horizon of bourgeois right be crossed in its entirety and society inscribe on its banners: |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 11 Sep 25 - 02:00 AM "As this current government has shown, trying to get the richest to pay more than a reasonable percentage just gets them to move themselves, their money, and their businesses elsewhere. Which makes the country poorer." that is your opinion, it is not a proven fact "from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs," your QUOTE, has nothing to donw ith Taxation, also it is quoted out of context |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 10 Sep 25 - 04:10 PM SPB: Taxation? I thought that was about communism: The full slogan, "from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs," was popularized by Karl Marx in his 1875 work, Critique of the Gotha Programme. As this current government has shown, trying to get the richest to pay more than a reasonable percentage just gets them to move themselves, their money, and their businesses elsewhere. Which makes the country poorer. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 10 Sep 25 - 12:44 PM Spot on, SPB. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 10 Sep 25 - 10:30 AM Taxation is about each person contributing to society according to their means and receiving according to their needs. Imagine two people who have failed to pay the same amount of tax: one through a genuine error or omission, and the other by deliberately exploiting a loophole to avoid their liability. In this scenario, has only the person who did not exploit the loophole failed to contribute their fair share? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 09 Sep 25 - 03:45 PM Ihave found out ,Starmer goes up in my estimation FFS how important is parliamentary protocol |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 09 Sep 25 - 02:25 PM what exactly went on between Starmer and Fartage |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 07 Sep 25 - 09:40 PM SPB: If you worked for HMRC then you should be able to discern between the spirit (and purpose) and the letter of the law, and why we have taxes. Yes, I can discern between the two. Breaking the 'spirit' of the law is not, necessarily, illegal. Breaking the legal definitions of the law is. I hope that you understand the distinction. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 07 Sep 25 - 05:31 PM If you worked for HMRC then you should be able to discern between the spirit (and purpose) and the letter of the law, and why we have taxes. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 07 Sep 25 - 05:02 PM The wealthy CAN buy their way out of anything look at Prince Andrew. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Backwoodsman Date: 07 Sep 25 - 04:01 PM A Tory and a tax-man! No possibility of redemption - straight to Hell! ;-) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 07 Sep 25 - 02:47 PM Well, there's dihonesty and there's dishonesty. On one hand there's getting your taxes wrong and paying the price later, and on the other hand there is spending a fortune on tax lawyers to find ways of legally reducing tax liabilities depriving public services. I know which is the greater wrong in my book, especially where the most wealthy have the means to buy their way out of taxation. (My bold/italics) And no, I'm not rich, and I used to work for HMRC, so I know a lot about it. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 07 Sep 25 - 02:30 PM Well, there's dihonesty and there's dishonesty. On one hand there's getting your taxes wrong and paying the price later, and on the other hand there is spending a fortune on tax lawyers to find ways of legally reducing tax liabilities depriving public services. I know which is the greater wrong in my book, especially where the most wealthy have the means to buy their way out of taxation. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 07 Sep 25 - 02:11 PM Still no comment about the examples of ‘forgetfulness’ from your mob, Nigel? I repeat, ‘glasshouses’ and ‘stones’. What a strange set of double-standards you Tories seem to live by. I was discussing current news. Both major parties (and most of the minors) have similar histories. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Backwoodsman Date: 06 Sep 25 - 11:25 PM That’s my point. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: The Sandman Date: 06 Sep 25 - 05:22 PM surely it is irrelevant what party they belong to, all politicians, who behave in a financially dishonest manner should resign. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 4 From: Backwoodsman Date: 06 Sep 25 - 04:40 PM Still no comment about the examples of ‘forgetfulness’ from your mob, Nigel? I repeat, ‘glasshouses’ and ‘stones’. What a strange set of double-standards you Tories seem to live by. |
