BS: Woman shoots herself to get help

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: beeliner
Date: 18 Jun 10 - 09:30 AM

1. At least he didn't have to wait for the damn smokes to kill him!

2. Now, in Illinois...It's total stress and fighting ALL THE TIME!

1. Art, I'm not sure you "got it". He asked his wife to "run over" (cross the street) to get the Camels, and when she refused, he "ran over" himself.

2. Well, I live in Illinois too, and I think you're misplacing the blame. Most doctors will tell you, if they are honest, that's it's not the government but rather the insurance companies that are the problem. They charge excessive premiums and then, in cases of catastrophic illnesses or injuries, put all of their resources behind refusing to pay, leaving their clients destitute. That is outrageous! In nearly every other developed country in the world, health care is a right and taken for granted.

In Germany, where I live part of each year, I was recently hospitalized for three days with blood pressure issues. The medical care there is second to none, arguably the best in Europe.

The bottom line, semi-private room, meals, medications, all of the various tests and procedures, doctors' fees, etc. - everything - wanna guess how much? Less than $1500 US dollars. Anybody know what that would have cost here?

The US medical system needs to be SCRAPPED and replaced with something that works. So I agree with you except that, as I said, you are putting the blame on the wrong side of the fence.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Ebbie
Date: 17 Jun 10 - 09:47 PM

Danged if I'm not still reading this as BS: Woman Shoots Herself in the Hip

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Art Thieme
Date: 17 Jun 10 - 05:01 PM

At least he didn't have to wait for the damn smokes to kill him!

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: beeliner
Date: 17 Jun 10 - 03:37 AM

A similar story, which alledgedly occurred a few years ago, involved a man who ran over himself.

The gentleman was a heavy cigarette smoker, a habit of which his wife disapproved.

One day they were in the car together and he noticed that he was out of smokes.

Spotting a convenient store on the opposite side of the street, he drove to the curb and asked his wife to run over and get him a pack of Camels.

She replied, "Screw you!"

So he ran over himself.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Art Thieme
Date: 16 Jun 10 - 06:49 PM

In other threads I've told of our situation here. Suffice it to say in order to have health insurance for my wife under Medicaid, I must make sure I am poor enough -- all the time -- to get it.

Now, in Illinois, even though we follow all their fucking rules, their ineptitude and bureaucracy has me totally depressed--and without the coverage she needs. It's total stress and fighting ALL THE TIME!

And Obama wants to put everyone on Medicaid!???

Give me a break!
Art

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: gnu
Date: 15 Jun 10 - 07:22 PM

Sorry, bobad... my comments are just frustration at losing sleep for eleven and a half months worrying about what would happen to my mother if my problem was serious. She's 83 and near blind. So. my worries and lack of sleep may have tainted my take on things. And, I am getting to be a crabby old fart much to soon. It was a poor attempt at a joke.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: bobad
Date: 15 Jun 10 - 06:48 PM

Without having read the study I couldn't comment on that gnu, but from my experience in having worked on health related studies, I have to presume that that variable would have been controlled for, As for your advice to not get sick, unfortunately we don't have that choice.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: gnu
Date: 15 Jun 10 - 05:58 PM

bobad...

Well, it could have been that a lot of not-for-profit patients died at home because they coundn't get access to health care.

Either way, don't get sick.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: bobad
Date: 15 Jun 10 - 05:30 PM

gnu, do you know that in Canada doctors have the option to opt out of medicare and run a private, for profit practice? In Quebec in 2005 there were 90 doctors doing this. There are also private imaging clinics and private hip and knee replacement clinics.

Private does not always equate with quality though as attested to by this from http://www.canadians.org/about/Maude_Barlow/Too_Close_for_Comfort/index.html

A "meta-analysis" of all the studies comparing mortality rates between not-for-profit and private for-profit hospitals in the United States was undertaken by McMaster University, and the results werepublished in the May 2002 edition of the Canadian Medical Association Journal. The massive study found that death rates in for-profit hospitals were significantly higher than in not-for-profit hospitals, even though patients who used for-profit hospitals were more wealthy and able to afford a healthier lifestyle. The researchers found that for-profit hospitals cut corners in order to achieve a profit margin for investors and to pay the excessively high salaries of their administrators.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: gnu
Date: 15 Jun 10 - 03:06 PM

bobad... good one.

But, not only is Amos correct on the issue of rights, NObody has free health care. SOMEbody has to pay for it.

The problem, I THINK (?) Yanks with "private" health care have is they believe that there will be an increase in taxes and the level of service will drop. And other arguements ensue, of course.

Case in point. Kendall (USA) had ready access to amazing (IMO) private health care for his throat. Over the past dozen years, I had reasonable access for the same condition (Canada.. and it varies by province)). My throat was taken care of. But, last June, something was wrong again. On July 13, my GP sent a referral for an ENT. I saw the ENT on June 1. She saw no cancer with the scope and diagnosed a breathing problem within my nose causing severe snoring, which, combined with my loss of 1.6 of my parotid glands (saliva), was aggravating the past surgeries.

Ultrasound... minimum 6 months on an "urgent basis". Eye doc... 12 months on an "elective basis" (loss of night vision, floaters, sensitivity to sunlight). Physiotherapy... 4 months "urgent" if you are self employed and can't get Workman's Compensation from the government. But, if you are bleeding, the emergency department will see you RFN, depending on how much blood is on the floor... and it's free.

Oh, yeah... presciption drugs are not free here. I pay private health care $1600 a year for an 80% co-pay. It covers some dental too. Single, no kids.

So, I can understand in a way the fear some Yanks with private health care feel. They see their hard work and their health care access and quality being placed in jeopardy with "universal health care", along with increased taxes.

I am NOT saying the level of service for present US private health care WILL be degraded, but if the politicians have to make a choice between Gramma's hernia and sending a rover to Mars or bullets to Iraq, I expect Gramma's shittin her drawers.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Jun 10 - 12:50 PM

That's what he said...but that's not what was done.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: maple_leaf_boy
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 05:55 PM

Wasn't Obama trying to get Universal Health Care passed in the U.S.?
They should do it.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 05:40 PM

Well, Amos, I think that in most civilised countries it is held that there is such a right - it is a right of which the USA is in flagrant breach.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: mousethief
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 01:00 PM

It's kind of fitting in a country where there appears to be more concern about the right to own guns than the right to universal health care.

I hadn't thought about the irony of that! Good catch.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 11:54 AM

Jeez!, Good thing she doesn't have to wait for the bureaucrats, to approve her.

It is just an illustration, of what I said before..about WE the people have become victimized by the unbridled effects, of a corrupted, broken system!...Thanks to our elected 'representatives' who have allowed this condition of the Corporations, medical industry, and politics, to turn ordinary people into victims. First they were victims of the corruption...now even themselves!....But we love that way, don't we???..You can tell, just by the positions stated on here, most of the time!

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Amos
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 11:27 AM

THere is no "right" to universal health care bobad. Human decency certainly militates toward bringing it about but it is only going to happen with a lot of social engineering and political give and take.

I believe it is a good idea, that it will actually (probably) contribute to increased productivity and a certain national pride and probably even improve the economy once the sand is worked out of the gears.

But it is no wise an inherent right.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 11:09 AM

That's the "add insult to injury" part of this ongoing story.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 09:12 AM

If there were a god, I could see the aptness of the description "goddamned".

I note from the report that the desperate woman may be charged with firearms offences too.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Greg F.
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 09:06 AM

Yeah the good old U.S. of A.- best goddamn country in the world, bar none.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Leadfingers
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 06:25 AM

The N H S has its faults , but in UK you are not going to be made bankrupt by just getting sick !

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: bobad
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 06:16 AM

It's kind of fitting in a country where there appears to be more concern about the right to own guns than the right to universal health care.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 04:31 AM

Such a shame that a leading country like America are unable to look after the health of their people, without having to have them resort to such things.

Another situation of those with and those without.

Shame on you people over there.

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: mousethief
Date: 14 Jun 10 - 03:06 AM

Ya gotta love the American health system. Most coverage, as a percent of population, of any country in the industrialized world.

Oops, sorry. Did I say "most"?

Subject: RE: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: gnu
Date: 13 Jun 10 - 07:00 PM

Oh my!

Subject: BS: Woman shoots herself to get help
From: olddude
Date: 13 Jun 10 - 06:20 PM

A 41 year old lady shoots herself in the shoulder because she could not get a needed surgery on it because of no health insurance ..

shoots herself in the shoulder

ya know, I have been myself in that kind of pain that you will do anything to make it stop ... Thankfully I got the surgeries I needed. how sad it is in this country that people have to suffer because there is no health insurance .