BS: What is the derivation of 'broad'?

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 04 Feb 01 - 06:50 AM

I always thought it was, like Fiolar said, from broadwife. Didn't know about the 'slave' definition. I had heard that a broadwife was a man's mistress in another town. Maybe the meaning of the word changed, or maye I just heard wrong? :) Either way, I always thought 'broad' was an insult for this reason.

---Lepus Rex

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 03 Feb 01 - 11:45 PM

Bert - Right. Unconfined. Reminds me of those words in the old trad song: "Oh hard is the fortune of all womankind, they're always controlled, they're always confined, controlled by her parents until she's a wife, a slave to her husband the rest of her life"

That was the fate of many women in traditional societies (providing they married the wrong guy...and they may not have had much choice in the matter...).

Fortunately it happens a lot less nowadays than it used to.

Let the Goddess be unconfined and the community will always benefit. That's a little Pagan wish for today. :-)

- LH

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Deckman
Date: 03 Feb 01 - 05:35 PM

Here's a time capsule for everyone ... in 1954, when I was a junior in high school, the senior class president was suspended for using the term "BROAD" in a comedy sketch on stage. How far we've come! Bob Nelson, Seattle area, Wa. USA

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: GUEST,Wendy
Date: 03 Feb 01 - 03:25 AM

That sentence in 1b is supposed to be, "He's right as a guinea".

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: GUEST,Wendy
Date: 03 Feb 01 - 03:15 AM

From the Random House Historical Dictionary of American Slang (For each definition I've copied out, I've included the earliest citation.):

1.a. Gambling - a playing card, especially in three card monte. *1781 G. Parker, View of Society 2: Black-legs, who live by the broads* and the turf... *cant for cards.

b. a ticket of admission, transportation, etc. 1912 Field, Watch Yourself [referring to 1880's]: 'Fix the olly! I gave him broads to the show! He's right as guinea! Fix him! Have this cheap Green County bilk pinched! I'll land him in the quay!' All of this... meant that the owner wanted the winner of the capital prize arrested and thrown into jail.

2.a. a sexually promiscuous woman; a prostitute; slut. [Especially common in early use, and probably the original sense, now subsumed by (b)]. 1914 Jackson & Hellyer, Vocab. Crim. Slang: Broad, Noun Current among genteel grafters chiefly. A female confederate; a female companion, a woman of loose morals. Broad is derived from the far-fetched metaphore of "meal-ticket", signifying a female provider for a pimp, from the fanciful correspondence of a meal ticket to a railroad or other ticket.

b. a woman--often used contemptuously. 1911 Hampton's Mag. (Sept.): Pretty soon what was technically known as a "broad"--"broad" being the latest New Yorkese--hove into sight.

So, this dictionary thinks the general "woman" sense, comes from the "slut" sense. And the "Vocab. Crim. Slang" thinks that meaning is derived from the "ticket" sense. And I speculate (rather wildly) that the "ticket" meaning derives from the "card" sense.

Wendy

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Amergin
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 01:50 PM

Not a word I use much unless I'm driving...

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Bert
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 01:48 PM

LH, don't forget the "Unconfined"

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: nutty
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 01:45 PM

In my case I reckon it's BROAD MINDED , BROAD SHOULDERS and BROAD BACKSIDE which to my mind are necessary attributes of any woman

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 01:29 PM

Okay, that's what I figured too...broad in the beam...

As for liberal and tolerant women, they are a blessing indeed!

Good answers, folks.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Ebbie
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 12:44 PM

Sexual Slang: There may also be some suggestion of 'bawd' since it is close in sound to 'broad.'

For another spin on it--

A Feminist Dictionary, 1985, "...a woman who is liberal, tolerant, unconfined and not limited or narrow in scope."

Ebbie

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Allan C.
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 12:24 PM

JohnB, I have dated some of those Norfolk broads and they are, indeed, shallow and...and...

Oh, I see.

Nevermind.

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: GUEST,JohnB
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 12:19 PM

What about the Norfolk Broads. They are extensive shallow lake and river system in East Anglia. JohnB

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: mousethief
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 12:14 PM

No, Mrs. Duck, you're just super.

Alex

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 12:13 PM

Good question...

;-)

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 12:09 PM

Well I guess that makes me a superbroad!!

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Allan C.
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 10:12 AM

"...and she's broad where a broad should be broad" - "Nothin' Like A Dame", South Pacific

Women are constructed with a broader pelvic girdle than men, as a general rule. I think the expression was a natural extension of that observation.

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Fiolar
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 09:54 AM

The term is mainly American in origin. The Oxford Dictionary of Slang gives an obsolete word "broadwife" meaning an female slave searated from her husband as in "abroad" and "wife."

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Gary T
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 09:16 AM

No light on the origin, but Mae West said something like "a broad is a broad because she's broad where a broad should be broad."

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 08:45 AM

Webster's Dictionary has it as woman or prostitute with no derivation. Partidge's Dictionary of Slang and unconventional English has it as woman, especially one readily available, traces it from US to Canada c1925(!) and suggests it comes from "broad beamed", noting that in Australia "broad" could mean "bottom".
I had thought it might have derived from Broadway and the denizens thereof, so once again: Truth :1 Roger :0
RtS

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: MMario
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 08:27 AM

That's what I always assumed (thou' we know where that leads!)

as in B.A.M. for a Lady Marine - standing for "Broad *ssed Marine" - a term which I used exactly once in my aunt's hearing - she was one of the first women to be a marine.

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: DougR
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 12:15 AM

Yep, Jed, I agree. I suspect it referred to the "beam." DougR

Subject: RE: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: JedMarum
Date: 02 Feb 01 - 12:13 AM

A ship, it can be said, like a woman is broad in the beam. An apparent advantage to both, and could be seen as an appreciative comment. I always presumed this comparison to be the origin of the term.

Subject: BS - What is the derivation of 'broad'?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 Feb 01 - 11:52 PM

The word "broad" came up in a thread title (the thread was intended to be humorous). Now, I am wondering...where did this word originate (when it means a woman, that is...) when, and how? When did it first come into usage? Does anyone know?

I associate it with old gangster movies and such. It's definitely low class. But why "broad"? What's the connection?

Just wondering...

- LH