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BS: Government Controlled Media?
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 21 Jan 03 - 04:30 AM Kevin, doesn't a terrorist act have to be deliberate? I have seen the video of the Vincennes bridge when they fired the missile. They were very unproffessional, shouting and panicking, but they feared they were being attacked. Incompetents not terrorists. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Little Hawk Date: 20 Jan 03 - 05:12 PM It's part of the big game to keep "conservatives" and "liberals" sniping away at each other, Doug, when actually they (we) have far more in common in terms of basic moral beliefs and human decency than most of us think. You find this out fairly soon if you sit down and calmly talk about moral values with people on "the other side" of the liberal-conservative divide. You may not agree on every detail, but you will agree on the basics of right and wrong. Thus you have a situation where both left-wing and right-wing people (ordinary people, I mean) are generally under the false impression that the other guys are "controlling the mainstream media". It's the old divide and conquer tactics. That's the main present purpose of the political party system as well, I believe. It keeps people fighting with each other instead of focusing on the very small and wealthy elite who run the game from the top down. In the same way, millions of Christians and Muslims are being set against each other by people who ultimately couldn't care less about either Jesus or Mohammed. They find people's tendency to divide up and take sides tremendously helpful to their agenda. - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: DougR Date: 20 Jan 03 - 04:33 PM Garg, I respectfully disagree with you. I really don't think the government has the media under its control. Perhaps if you and others who think so could post some examples. I just don't see it that way at all. I do think the liberals have the mainstream media under their control though. DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Hrothgar Date: 19 Jan 03 - 04:48 AM How many extra viewers do TV channels pick up if they have a war? Especially if they have a front row seat. Sells more papers, too. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: harpgirl Date: 18 Jan 03 - 08:48 AM I'm happy to question authority, garg. Oh gosh, that means rich, white christian males, doesn't it??????? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 17 Jan 03 - 10:45 PM The govt has had the "media" in their pocket and in the socket of control since 1974.
Vietnam taught the media-moguls of the USA that perception was all, and deception the call....we won't know the truth until the owl gives three hoots.
Sincerely,
Question ALL authority, Max, Joe, BBS, and IP/AP |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 17 Jan 03 - 09:13 PM Just for the record: 290 people were killed on 3rd July 1988 when the USS Vincennes shot down Iran Air Flight 655. I think most people around the world saw that as act of terrorism. There is a fairly convincing case that the Lockerbie atrocity in December 1988, in which 270 were killed, was a reprisal by Iran, and nothing to do with the Libyans at all. (The fact that something is a reprisal to an atrocity of course doesn't in any way stop it being criminal, whether it's carried out by Iran or Israel or Palestinians or anyone else.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: leprechaun Date: 17 Jan 03 - 08:52 PM Well Doug, have they convinced you that your government is Evil incarnate? I guess you and I must be pretty stupid if we can't see that everything (apparently every God-damned thing) our government does is all part of a well-conceived plot to exterminate the weak, oppress the poor, and ravage the environment. I can only hope that in this police state they'll need some experienced folks like me to interpret all that data they're collecting so they can figure out whose door to kick in in the middle of the night. That way, at least I'll have a job. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: GUEST Date: 17 Jan 03 - 08:29 PM Little Hawk is right in essence but wrong in detail. Read the history for yourselves. It's worth the effort. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: CarolC Date: 17 Jan 03 - 07:03 PM Sort of like different ends of the same possum, eh LH? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Little Hawk Date: 17 Jan 03 - 06:35 PM The media are controlled by...their commmercial sponsors. The government is controlled by exactly that same group of people. You don't get a chance to vote for them, just for their chosen mouthpieces. It's a self-perpetuating system, kind of like the British monarchy was back in 1775, only it's far more subtle and less visible...in the human sense. But it is visible and audible 24 hours a day if you have the eyes to see it and the ears to hear, parading itself before you in a constant barrage of advertising, sensationalistic "news", and vapid "entertainment". Gotta keep the serfs happy... Thus did Imperial Rome befuddle and distract the comman masses, whilst catering to the whims of egomaniacs, pedophiles and madmen...from Nero and Caligula on down. - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: NicoleC Date: 17 Jan 03 - 05:23 PM Hence the word "inadvertently," Doug. I am not accusing you (in this case) of having said that, but it does raise the issue. And we have certainly seen the accusation of unpatriotism or being a traitor flying around a lot in the past couple of years in the US for anyone who dissents! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: DougR Date: 17 Jan 03 - 05:03 PM My friends (at least I think you are): I have reviewed my posts on this thread and unless I missed one, there were only two. In neither of them did I say what Nicole says that I did. If, Nicole, you were referring to the post to Bobert asking that he post at least one positive thought he has about his country, then I I think it is a far stetch from what you claim. And I assure you, I was not whining when I asked him to do it. I just wanted to see if he could. So that's so terrible? I think your last post was very positive and enjoyed reading it, even if I do take issue with your opening sentence. DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: katlaughing Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:51 PM Excellent, Nicole, one of the best commentaries I've read, lately. Thanks. Mets, I did hear that about Prince Charles. I think it was on NPR. I found this dated Dec. Prince Charles has dropped plans to visit the United States because the White House, apparently unhappy with his views on Iraq, signalled he would not be welcome, The Mail on Sunday reported. In a front-page report, it said "senior figures in the Bush Administration" had indicated it would be "very unhelpful" for the trip to proceed due to the prince's reported concern that a war would lead to a dangerous rift between the West and the Muslim world. He had been "politely informed that his views ... might not go down well".
sorry about the wrong date |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: CarolC Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:43 PM Remember, DougR, running away when things aren't the way one thinks they should be is the easy way out. It's the coward's way. I have certainly thought about it from time to time. And every time I do, I think to myself, I was born here. If anyone has a responsibility to stay here and try to help make things better, I do. Change for the better never happens when people blindly accept the status quo. If you think things are peachy the way they are, you certainly have the right to accept them that way. But for those who think things are not the way they should be, or even the way our founding fathers wanted them to be, it is our responsibility as good citizens to try to do something about it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: gnu Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:33 PM NicoleC... you go girl. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Bobert Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:30 PM Ditto, Nicole. Well said. Well said. Your not so secret admirer, Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Bobert Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:26 PM Well, danged, leprechaun... (sniff, sniff) Iz feelin' real bad about the turtle now and well, just got off the phone with a surgeon who says that he'll remove the tattoo for 25 bucks a letter and well, heck, that's only, ahhhh. How much is that? A couple a bucks? So Mr. Turtle is going to get that done next week and then in the spring, I'm gonna put him back in the middle of the road where I found him. I'd do it now but I don't want his poor little feet to freeze. Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: gnu Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:25 PM As far as Bush not wanting Bonnie Prince Charlie to visit, he'd better watch his P's & Q's. I dare say that Chuck has a bit more insight concerning Middle-East politics than Bush ever will. Having said that, I'm sure Mummy has spoken to Chic and I doubt if he will throw any more off-hand remarks out. Kids, eh ? Whaddya gonna do ? As far as the friendly fire incident, I just hope that the law suit just filed doesn't get interpreted by our American brothers as "blame" or retribution. At first, I was truly ashamed. However, I now understand that the lawsuit will attempt to ensure the widows and families are looked after financially... it's not a punishment sort of thing. I believe we all just want to know what happened so that it can be prevented in the future. However, again, please forgive my repitition, the lawsuit is to help the families via financial compensation. As far as punishment for the pilots, I don't believe anyone wants any punishment for these two men. Whatever happens, my thoughts and prayers go out to those who suffered loss and to the two pilots who must be carrying a very heavy burden. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: NicoleC Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:24 PM Doug has inadvertently brought up the usual whining about how those who dare criticize America must hate it. Last night I was reminded about how important it is to do just that. The staunchest supporters of America can usually be found in the immigrant population. Last night, I was talking to a man who was an Italian, born in Croatia. During WWII, his mother and siblings hid in a hut in the forest from the German soldiers, who had killed their family dog who protected their home and vineyards and were seizing likely young men for the army. He was a boy of 13, and getting "old enough" to fight, so they fled. For 6 months, they lived in the forest and listened to the German and American artillery. When the Americans won out, an Army officer found them in the woods and later returned with food and blankets. Right then, he decided he wanted to go to America, to find out what kind of people would be strong enough to defeat the Germans but still cared enough to give the weak food. It took him 12 years to get a visa. He never intended to stay for more than 4 or 5 years, but he's still here. This is not a man from an oppressive country, or even a poor one; he was fairly well off in Italy. As he talked about how he KNEW that the government would never harm immigrants or take their rights away, and how America *couldn't* have an oppressive government like Mussolini, at first I wondered how he could be so blind to the reality of America. In WWII we took away the rights of Japanese immigrants, and we're doing that now to Middle Eastern immigrants. But I was reminded that the vision of America in his head -- one defined by an Army officer who brought children canned chicken in a war zone -- is exactly the same vision that most Americans believe in, and the one we want so badly to be true. Even when, from time to time, it isn't. It's the America we take for granted sometimes. It's also the America we MUST protect, because we deserve it, our children deserve it, and those immigrants who believe in that dream deserve it. So when I hear statements like, "I think you hate America because you complain," I can't help wonder, "Do you think?" Do you think America would exist if it weren't for those who stood up and said, no more repressive government? Would America be the country it is today -- both the shining perfect one in our heads and the flawed one that it is in reality -- if not for those who stood up and said, this is wrong, let's fix it. A person's relationship with God will NOT be dictated by our goverment. A person's worth is not determined by their birth or the color of their skin. A person has a right to vote and own property even if they aren't white and male. Would America be the country that so many wish to live in, if not for those times we fought and bled to help those weaker than ourselves? Those who complain and fuss and act for change are the ones who define America, even if you disagree with those changes. Because the struggle to be a better country is what defines America, not a ficticious perfection that we don't -- and probably never will -- achieve. When America acts like the oppressor, we must be fully American -- complaining, arguing, disagreeing Americans. Or we'll lose the chance. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: leprechaun Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:10 PM Well I am shocked to learn that Bobert keeps animals in slavery. How do you know that turtle has any opinion one way or another about Iraq? And how is that tattoo going to affect its health in the years to come? Who would have suspected that Bobert would practice Speciesism? After the revolution, people won't be able to exploit animals like that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: DougR Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:08 PM petr: if you are referring to the Canadian soldiers that were killed accidentially by a U. S. warplane, it most certainly did hit the papers in the U. S. Bobert: Love it! I'm not going to move from my TV tomorrow! I don't think you should let a little chilly weather keep you from mooning anybody though! Have at it, you'll have a international audience! DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: CarolC Date: 17 Jan 03 - 04:07 PM Metchosin, I don't think I heard anything about Prince Charles wanting to come over here. I asked JtS if he had heard anything about it, and he said no. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: GUEST,petr Date: 17 Jan 03 - 03:57 PM although not exclusively govt controlled one has to read a wide cross section to get fair representation of facts. half the news on cnn are commercials in disguise (suggestions for Christmas shopping etc). You can still get the facts, eg. Newyorker, (the coverage of the Gulf war was severely restricted, as was Panama etc. -) and its skewed anyway, the newsmedia always referred to Lockerbie as the worst terrorist incident prior to 9/11 even though more people died in the AirIndia bombing in 1985 (but they dont count since theyre not Americans) the 'friendly fire' killing of 4 canadian soldiers last april didnt even make the US news at the time, but the 'moron' comment did. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Bobert Date: 17 Jan 03 - 03:40 PM Well, danged, Kat. Wish it weren't so cold so if I saw one of them camera's I could moon 'em. Butt, ahhh, but too cold fir that... Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: katlaughing Date: 17 Jan 03 - 02:36 PM Watch for those 14 Big Brother cameras, Bobert! They are only going to turn them during the march! Whatever happened to the laws against monopolies? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Metchosin Date: 17 Jan 03 - 02:33 PM just curious, but has anything ever been reported in the US regarding the derailment by the US government, of Prince Charles' planned visit there? CBC in Canada reported a few weeks ago, Charles was advised by US officials, that his visit would not be welcome, due to a comment by the Prince that, the US position regarding Iraq, could lead to the destabilization of the whole Middle East.....(duh).....I've not seen any further comment regarding this. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Bobert Date: 17 Jan 03 - 02:06 PM Well, Dougie. I like you. Does that count? And I like my wife and son. And my dog. And my three cats. I like my pet turtle 'cause he had a tattoo put on his back that reads, "Don't Attack Iraq". But he's not allowed to go to the march tomorrow because well, when turtles get real cold, the go to sleep for a few months and that wouldn't be good since I have a treadmill in his cage which is hooked up to a generator and runs the front porch light and well, you know that it gets real dark where I live, especially at night and so.... Yeah, you be sure to have yer TV on tomorrow and maybe you'll see me and my son, Ben, down there. I'll be wearing a black western style hat with an "Impeach Bush" button on it. You won't have no trouble finding me and if I see the camera I'll hold up my "Whose God Do You Hear, Mr. Bush?" sign real high and flip it around to the other side that reads, "Wish You Were Here, Dougie" Peace, bro... Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: DougR Date: 17 Jan 03 - 01:16 PM Misophist: Yeah, let's hang 'em both, eh? Bobert: I think you need a hobby. Is there anything in the USofA that you like? I'd sure like to hear something positive coming off your word processor for a change. By the way, you should have listened to the Diane Reames show this morning on NPR. The protest in D. C. got a huge boost, and one caller to the show urged everybody to oppose anything Bush has anything to do with, and to be certain not to vote for him in 2004. You would have loved it! DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: mack/misophist Date: 17 Jan 03 - 11:59 AM Colin Powell looked like one of the good guys until I learned that his son was a big shot in the FCC. Poison fruit doesn't grow on a wholesome tree. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Bobert Date: 16 Jan 03 - 06:03 PM Yup, ttr. That's exactly what can and will happen if the last five regs are dropped. Yeah, I know it stinks now but compared to what it can be, this aroma is like calogne, brother... Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Thomas the Rhymer Date: 16 Jan 03 - 05:43 PM Bobert, old boy... What do we have now? A fully opperational competitive media systemitically creating the much needed checks and ballences that our democratic system stays healthy with... and thrives on? Or are you 'implying' that it could actually get worse ...than the debautchery we have now? I remember a day when 'investigative reporting' meant more than recanting 'google hits' on Bush's dog... ttr |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Bobert Date: 16 Jan 03 - 05:16 PM Good point, Carol. And right now I'd say thre government has the upper hand. Either way, we don't need to consolidate all of our media into 4 major corporations. But good point... Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: CarolC Date: 16 Jan 03 - 05:09 PM Government controlled media, or media controlled government, Bobert? Hmmmm... |
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Subject: BS: Government Controlled Media? From: Bobert Date: 16 Jan 03 - 01:57 PM Well, is it any wonder that the *Big Four8 are trying to bully the Federal Communictations Commission (FCC) into droping the remaining regulations on media ownership? Yep, ABC, NBC, CBS and Fox (alias's for Rupert Murdock, AOL/Time Warner, Viacom, G.E and Disney) have been pushing the FCC to allow them unfettered access to pretty much the entire Amercan Media. Hmmmmm? If they pull this off, then the American people have taken another step closer to Sate controlled media that we righteously look down apon in nations such as Iraq, the former USSR, North Korea and China. What, if these folks get this you don't think they'll *walk* the comapny line? Yeah right... They have allready started *walking* the company line as they have "dummed down" their news reporting since 9/11, much to the pleasure of the Bush Administration. Today, at Columbia University is the first of two public hearings. The next one will occur in Richmond, Va. in Feburary. In the interim, emails to your Congessmen is in order. This is not a slam dunk for Bush and a little ruckus may stop this cancer on our media. Mnay of the Congressmen who voted with the *Big Four* during the Clinton Administraion admit to not even know what they were voting for. It would be a shame if we gave away the "competitive spirit" of American enterprise on this important issue that effects everyone because our Copngressmen didn't understand the isssues. www.democraticmedia.org Keep in mind what Jefferson said about a well informed population importance to democracy. Bobert |