Who nearly slew Johnny?

Subject: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 May 02 - 08:13 PM

I was just printing off a set of words of "Johnny I hardly knew ye" for a friend, using the Digital Tradition. And it occurred to me that I always sing it as "the army nearly slew ye", and the DT has it "the enemy". So I checked on what a couple of books have it, and they were "enemy" too.

So where did I get "army"? I don't mean, "which is the authentic version?", because I don't believe in that stuff, when it comes down to it.

But where did I get it from? Did I maybe make the change myself? Or does anyone else sing it that way?

Either way, to my mind "army" fits better with the song, and ties in with the idea that the real enemy is the army itself, which tears young men away and destroys them. And the slight change it makes in the rhythm between "enemy" and "army" feels better to me into the bargain.

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: Amergin
Date: 03 May 02 - 08:23 PM

well..i always heard that Johnny was in Ceylon....which if my meagre memory serves right was Sri Lanka....

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: michaelr
Date: 03 May 02 - 08:49 PM

Boy, McGrath, you'd better not voice that sentiment "the real enemy is the army itself, which tears young men away and destroys them", in the current Universal Military Conscription thread. I said something there which much the same point, and got clobbered!

Of course I agree with you; sorry I can't help with your song query.

Cheers,
Michael

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: Amos
Date: 03 May 02 - 09:05 PM

Kevin:

I have always known it as "the enemy nearly slew you"; perhaps you have projected your own thoughts into the song? Folksongs are great breeding grounds for Freudian and Jungian slips! :>)

A

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 03 May 02 - 10:37 PM

I looked around because, as you say, "army" seems to fit with the last verse of some versions and with the intent of the song as a whole. Found over a dozen quickly, all "enemy" including the one in "An Anthology of Irish Verse," compiled by Padraic Colum.

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 May 02 - 07:29 AM

Whether or not it's actually true that "the real enemy is the army itself, which tears young men away and destroys them", this is what the song as a whole is saying. And in the context of the song the army concerned is the foreign British Army recruiting in an occupied country.

Does anyone have anything on the history of the song anyway?

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: catspaw49
Date: 04 May 02 - 01:32 PM

Perhaps Johnny was the victim of a Seattle Slew...........Gawd knows he slew a lot of others.

Okay, sorry, but it's Derby weekend and it had to be said. If you don't know, Seattle Slew was one of the greatest American race horses in history, the ultimate "blue collar" horse. Bought for a paltry $17,500, he earned his owners over 1.2 million in just three years and was valued at 12 million dollars. When put to stud at age 5, he amazingly turned out to be a superlative stud siring a literal "slew" of winners.   He was the only horse to enter the Triple Crown unbeaten and then to go ahead and win the Triple Crown. Slew is and will always be remembered for having more heart and courage than any other horse, giving 110% even in his few defeats later on.

Ol' Slew is still alive and kicking. In 2001, at age 27, he still put 90% of his mares in foal!!! This was after the first of two neck surgeries. The second, just completed successfully, left him weak but still so "interested" that he had to be moved to another stable because he was too close to the stud barn and wouldn't rest!

Spaw

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 04 May 02 - 02:09 PM

A rather different version is sung by the Cumberland Trio, with a spoken interlude about the 1847 Rebellion, saying "Ireland's mothers wrote the song in protest." Listen here: Johnny
I am not familiar with this group, or where they come from.

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 04 May 02 - 02:29 PM

This song led me to the story of the 65000 black Confederate troops, 13000 approx. who "saw the elephant" (engaged in battle). The song "Johnny..." is included among the southern songs on midi on this site, which, because of its content, I will post as a new thread later.
On Black Confederates

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: catspaw49
Date: 08 May 02 - 04:17 AM

The "Black Horse," as he was sometimes called......Seattle Slew

Spaw

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: Deckman
Date: 08 May 02 - 01:42 PM

I feel that this song is one of those that transcends the time and locale that spawned it. I also feel that it is quite important to maintain the traditional rythmn and meter of the song. I link this song back to it's traditional Irish roots. To me, it is "enemy." Don Firth, in about his final posting on the "Tales of Walt Robertson" thread, speaks of this song. I, as well as Don, learned this song from Walt. Don writes, and quite eloquantly, about the meter and rythmn. CHEERS, Bob(deckman)Nelson

Subject: RE: Who nearly slew Johnny?
From: Deckman
Date: 08 May 02 - 03:28 PM

I am curious about something. I just checked out the web site regarding the Confederate Blacks. I read that the term "saw the elephant" was used in reference to battle. I have read about about the term many times in American history, but I NEVER have heard it used in this context. Am I nuts, ot have I missed something. I would appreciate any comments. CHEERS, Bob