Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 02:55 PM

--- Ah: the bletherings and forbiddings are all part of the plan: it's all a wind-up exercise. If and when the Democrats can be accused, however falsely, of inciting or (better) initiating violence, bingo! one Caesar-ready state of emergency.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 02:56 PM

Jesse Watters's viewers won't care too much how many children she has. It won't register.

"Self-proclaimed," "poet," "Colorado" [a blue state]," "pronouns in her bio" paint her as a far-left, possibly LGBTQ, weirdo. "Lost her life" not "was killed." Meaning: "sad, but she should have behaved herself." (Weirdos don't often do so.)

The diction is prejudicial: charged language, argument from verbal connotation. Perhaps Fox's broader coverage was fairer (I haven't been listening). Contrast the effect of "a 37-year-old mom from Colorado, whose ex-husband told Fox [as he did CNN] that she'd never taken part in a political protest."

We all use "pronouns." But Fox means a very special kind of pronoun. Otherwise, why even mention?

The Vice-President has very emphatically said that she "lost her life because she tried to ram somebody with a car." Videos from various angles make this statement doubtful at best.

However, because DHS and the President have already called the incident an "act of domestic terrorism," charges almost certainly will never be brought.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 03:14 PM

The VP now says the agent has "absolute immunity" from prosecution because he was "engaging in federal law enforcement action."

So that's that.

Interesting argument.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 03:27 PM

Vance on X:

"Do you think this officer was wrong in defending his life against a deranged leftist who tried to run him over?”

Of course not! (If that's what happened....)

All Democrats are now called "leftists," which in my day was pretty much restricted to socialists and communists.

And not just "leftists": "deranged leftists." This has become a usual phrase. I can't recall even Khrushchev at the height of the Cuban Missile Crisis being described as a "deranged" leftist.

And, of course, we don't know if Renee Good was even a Democrat.

(Dems, by the way, who, Stephen Miller warns, "lend aid and comfort to domestic terrorists" like Renee Good.)

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 03:42 PM

> "absolute immunity"

I saw that, and thought they didn't know how to spell "impunity". Like Führer, like stormtrooper.

.... Herself is attempting to detox from the news by watching PBS America, which as usual (and fittingly) is full of Third-Reich documentaries. It occurred to me that, *when* this nonsense in the USSA ends, there should be some equivalent to the Nuremberg trials .... then that the future equivalent to such documentaries covering this era will be narrated in Mandarin.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 03:42 PM

The only ‘deranged’ ones are the fat, ugly, orange baboon and those he surrounds himself with. Even in the gun-crazy US, fleeing from law officers does not carry a summary death-sentence. Why couldn’t that ICE guy have moved aside and let Renée Good’s car pass him by? Why was it necessary to carry out a summary execution?

The US is fucked, completely, absolutely, and utterly.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 03:46 PM

Hm: Nothing will "lend aid and comfort to domestic terrorists" like giving them absolute impunity.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 03:48 PM

--- oops: I inadvertently used a pronoun.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 04:05 PM

> "deranged leftist"

I refer you to Accusation in a Mirror, an expression which it turns out has a long history. It more neatly encapsulates my idea that sinners always accuse others of the sins which they (the accusers) are most familiar with, from the inside, because they're their own.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 04:07 PM

US DOJ Policy on Use of Lethal Force

SpecifIcally, Section A, Points 1 and 2 refer. Seems perfectly clear that the ICE officer is guilty of breaking the rules set out in the Policy.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Donuel
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 05:31 PM

Fighting a big brother Orwellian dictator is not easy.
However they do depend on our despair as their most effective cheap weapon. Do not despair. More people are believing their eyes and ears.

Yes, the Federal Kash PATEL FBI has taken over the Twin City killing investigation, so Governor Walsh and the mayor may not interfere, but they will interfere with the truth. If I know those local officials, the federal Trump propaganda will be opposed.

The governor has called out the National Guard. Will the National Guard end up fighting ICE????????? That would be a trip.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 06:09 PM

Turns out that Good was actually a "37-year-old mother of three."

The back seat of her SUV was filled with stuffed toys for her kids.

Sounds a lot more normal, doesn't it?

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 06:11 PM

Karoline Leavitt: [The incident] "occurred as a result of a larger, sinister left-wing movement that has spread across our country" [and put federal immigration agents] "under organized attack."

MAGA supporters marched peacefully on the Capitol yesterday in honor of Ashli Babbitt, the career USAF veteran killed by a police officer while violently smashing into the Speaker's Lobby of the House of Representatives in the forefront of a mob, despite urgent warnings at gunpoint.

The President has described Ms. Babbitt a great patriot.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 06:23 PM

Her ex-husband has also described her as a "devout Christian."

Possibly different from a "MAGA Christian."

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 06:28 PM

One more comment. The President of the United States on his special website explains what happened:


“The woman screaming [after the shooting] was, obviously, a professional agitator, and the woman driving the car was very disorderly, obstructing and resisting, who then violently, willfully, and viciously ran over the ICE Officer, who seems to have shot her in self defense. Based on the attached clip, it is hard to believe he is alive, but is now recovering in the hospital. We need to stand by and protect our Law Enforcement Officers from this Radical Left Movement of Violence and Hate!”

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 06:35 PM

I swear this is the last one.

From the New York Times yesterday:

"Asked in a wide-ranging interview with The New York Times if there were any limits on his global powers, Mr. Trump said: 'Yeah, there is one thing. My own morality. My own mind. It’s the only thing that can stop me....'

“'I don’t need international law'.”

That pretty much lays his cards on the table.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Helen
Date: 08 Jan 26 - 06:38 PM

Well, the video I saw on the ABC (Oz) News site shows no-one being run over or impacted by the vehicle which was being driven slowly in an attempt to make a U-turn, and no obvious cause for the ICE guy to fire point plank into the victim's head, at least three times.

I just watched the two most recently aired (in Oz) episodes of The Late Show with Stephen Colbert. A lot of pointed observations were made and one brief comment was that Trump threatened to take action against Iran if any peaceful protesters were injured or killed.

Pot? Kettle? Black? One story for others and another for himself.

Journalist and author Chris Hayes was interviewed and he had some very specific and thought-provoking comments. Well worth watching.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: r.padgett
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 02:37 AM

Really sorry to see on tv the shooting through the front windscreen of a an ordinary woman going about daily chores

tv shows a partial U turn and an ICE armed soldier run up to the side of her car she tried to complete her journey home and not clear from the tv but ANOTHER soldier it seems shot through the front wind screen

The question is was this part of ICE's brief? Was there evidence that she was an illegal

Minnesota rulers were rightly incensed and yet another instance of misrule

Ray

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Helen
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 04:45 AM

Sorry: typo. Point blank. (I had the "p" upside down - vertical mirror image. Darn this dyslexia! I usually check my typing before hitting the submit button.)

Also, two people have been injured after being shot by US Border Agents in Portland, OR.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 05:44 AM

ICE ambushed Ms. Good by first blocking her with a minivan, causing her to seek an exit. Last year, I called ICE a new Gestapo. It is living up to Gestapo standards. She was guilty of blowing a whistle to warn neighbors of ICE activity. This all took place 7 blocks away from where George Floyd was murdered by police.

Identical to Germany's first detention camp, Dachau, and every subsequent concentration camp, they allowed no mayor or judicial visits. This is identical for US ICE detention centers.

A normalization of martial law tactics will increase up to the next Presidential election coup when the main event will occur.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 08:02 AM

Here is Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal speaking to the House Committee about the Minneapolis murder, and shedding light on the barefaced lies of Noem and the fat, orange baboon. Good on you, Congresswoman!

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 08:40 AM

I suspect that brave people like her will be 'dissappeared' when the turnip bans elections because America is in a state of war. :-(

I genuinely fear for what will happen to you guys who oppose him on the front line over ther but believe that you will win in the end. It will be a battle though.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: r.padgett
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 09:44 AM

God help USA, sorry to say I did warn people over many years not to elect him

Vigilance by those in power and action to prevent War on all sides is now overdue

Ray

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 10:02 AM

More from Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal on the bare-faced lies being touted by the shameless, shameful President, the Vice-president, and Kristi Noem.

How could anyone vote for these POS?

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 10:43 AM

I promise this will be the last one. One good man’s view. Very well worth watching…

Robert Arnold, Little Rock, Arkansas on the murder by an ICE Agent of Renée Nicole Good

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 10:43 AM

Vance says the only people lying about the ICE shooting are the lunatic fringe on the left. He says the agent who defended himself has absolute immunity. That is not true unless you include a Presidential pardon. It is time to call this ICE action an execution.

This is what MAGA has desired from the President's racist white power authority. Never mind that the victim was a white Christian; she has been pronounced to be a domestic terrorist by the administration. It would be desirable for authoritarian rule to normalize mass murder and executions for obvious control reasons. It's time to nip this in the bud.

Minnesota has already had the assassination of two State Democratic Senators by a MAGA nut dressed and masked as an ICE agent at the victim's home. This year, there have been 2 shootings there, of which one was by ICE.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 11:32 AM

Time to call out the ICE dress code:

* all black;
* masked;
* armed;

.... now which side in a classic Western does that remind you of?

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 11:49 AM

Let's not get carried away.

We know it was a "killing." We don't know that it was either (pre-meditated) "murder" or an "execution."

"Charged language" is never helpful to a rational discussion.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 03:40 PM

Charged language is the weapon of Donald J Trump, and it has worked.
I use the word 'execution' appropriately, as a judge, jury, and executioner, in the role of a policeman. It happens far too often.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 03:44 PM

When a weapons-grade stupid leader is told that something is free, as in free money from tariffs, free luxury 747, or free oil, they ignore the actual costs involved. Often, the real costs are astronomical.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 04:21 PM

"It works."

That seems to suggest that rational discussion doesn't work, or doesn't work well enough.

And that may be right. But if so, then what?

The ever-increasing venom have now.

Let's cool it down.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 04:28 PM

When someone shoots a woman in the face 3 times at point blank range and then an ICE agent is heard yelling "fucking bitch" I believe my eyes and ears..
Two seconds before dying, Ms. Good says to her killer, "dude, I'm not mad at you".

Subject: RE: to the tune thats entertainment.
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Jan 26 - 04:50 PM

A clown with his pants all on fire
Or the act that's a nightmare of death
Or the scene where the villain is mean
That's execution!

The lights on the lady's car
Or the cop with the gun by his side
Or the ICE where they give it there all
That's execution!

The plot can be hot, simply full of trauma
Or a guy killed by tariffs who used to be a farmer
It could be Oedipus Rex
Where a chap kills his father and causes lots of bother

The clerk who is thrown out of work
By the boss who is thrown for a loss
By the skirt who is doing him dirt
The world is a stage; the stage is a world of entertainment!

It might be a fight like you see on the screen
A king getting slain for the love of a queen
Some great Shakespearean scene
Where police and a gal meet, and then she ends in mincemeat

The guy who was waving the flag
That began with making hate of the fags
Hip hooray! The American way
The world is a stage; the stage is a world of execution!

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: r.padgett
Date: 10 Jan 26 - 02:14 AM

Time will tell so long as no one pushes the button first

US is in a mess looking towards a police state and world domination to acquire by force ALL the mineral deposits possible

This is NOT how it is supposed to work and FREE countries need to express that thought

Bullies bread bullies and rattling the cages of the other super powers is not a good idea

Ray

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: r.padgett
Date: 10 Jan 26 - 02:40 AM

I an getting worried by the stubborn warmonger elected by US who feels that US must come first in every move ~ he has never learnt that his path can only ever have one out come ~ where's the Anderson shelter ~ o that isn't much good now is it

Wake up to this maniac

Ray

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Donuel
Date: 10 Jan 26 - 08:13 AM

Depending upon what maniac you ask
its as though it is a fact that

Trump is a transforming god
like Zeus with morals of a dog

Or the second coming who must die
so we can eat pie in the sky

It should best end in cremation
so relic hunters won't face damnation

All that will eventually be left
are Trading cards subject to theft.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Jan 26 - 12:00 PM

Going to a march today, making the sign now (something on both sides - don't waste that real estate!)

Here is a long post (I haven't tracked it all of the way back to the first post, the credit from a journalist friend says "from a person on a 'Veterans Against Trump FB page'":

There seems to be a lot of Keyboard attorneys online today. So, as an actual attorney, I'd like to cite actual law. The ICE officer in MN violated both protocol and case law. 1) officers are not allowed to fire into a moving vehicle 2) lethal force is not allowed to prevent someone from fleeing 3) case law is clear, an officer cannot intentionally place himself in front of a vehicle and then allege self defense At best, this officer acted with a reckless disregard for public safety and is guilty of negligent homicide. Federal agents do not have blanket immunity from state laws or criminal prosecution. They can be prosecuted by state authorities for violating state laws if their actions were unauthorized, unlawful, or unreasonable, even if they were on duty.

The concept governing this is called Supremacy Clause immunity. Federal agents are generally immune from state prosecution only if their actions were:

Authorized under federal law; and "Necessary and proper" to fulfill their federal duties.
If a federal agent is charged in state court, they can petition to have their case "removed" to federal court. In federal court, the judge would then determine whether the agent's actions met the "necessary and proper" standard. If the court finds the agent was acting within the reasonable confines of their duties, the state charges will be dismissed. If not, the state prosecution can proceed in federal court, applying state substantive law. It is unlikely any judge would find his behavior necessary and reasonable. The mere fact that no other officer present unholstered their weapon and appear shocked he fired towards them reinforces that fact.

Estate of Starks v. Enyart, 5 F.3d 230 (7th Cir. 1993)
Seventh Circuit – foundational caseFacts:
Officer stepped in front of a slowly moving vehicle and then shot the driver, claiming fear for his life.

Holding (paraphrased):
“An officer may not unreasonably create a physically threatening situation and then use deadly force to escape it.”
Adams v. Speers, 473 F.3d 989 (9th Cir. 2007) Ninth Circuit
Facts:
Officer jumped in front of a vehicle during a stop and then fired.

Holding:
An officer cannot provoke a confrontation and then rely on the danger they created to justify deadly force.
Key language:
The court emphasized that reasonableness includes the officer’s own tactical decisions leading up to the shooting.
Thompson v. Hubbard, 257 F.3d 896 (8th Cir. 2001)
Eighth Circuit
Key point:
The court rejected summary judgment for officers where evidence showed the officer moved into the vehicle’s path, creating the perceived threat.
Abraham v. Raso, 183 F.3d 279 (3d Cir. 1999)
Third Circuit
Facts:
Off-duty officer shot a fleeing driver.

Holding:
The court stressed that pre-seizure conduct matters and that officers cannot rely solely on the “split second” framing if their own actions escalated the situation.
Kirby v. Duva, 530 F.3d 475 (6th Cir. 2008)

Holding:
*Deadly force may be unconstitutional where:
*The officer fired into a moving vehicle
*The officer could have stepped aside
*The threat was self-created
The Sixth Circuit explicitly rejected the idea that a moving car automatically justifies gunfire.
Adams v. Speers, 473 F.3d 989 (9th Cir. 2007)

Holding:
An officer may not intentionally place himself in danger and then use deadly force to neutralize the danger he created — including firing into a vehicle.
The Ninth Circuit emphasized tactical disengagement as the constitutional expectation.
Training & Policy Alignment (Courts Care About This)
Many courts note that modern police training instructs:
*Do not fire into moving vehicles
*Do not use deadly force to stop a fleeing car
*Disengage and contain instead
Courts treat violations of training as evidence of unreasonableness, even if not dispositive.

I've tried to give it line breaks so it is readable, but may have broken his paragraphs of related content in the cases described.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Helen
Date: 10 Jan 26 - 12:47 PM

Thanks heaps, SRS. Those informed comments from an attorney show a ray of hope for the prospect of a possibly successful state case against the ICE officer.

The comments are very useful about previous cases where an officer stepped in front of a vehicle and claimed to have used lethal force because their own life was threatened.

A ray of hope.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 10 Jan 26 - 01:22 PM

SRS, in my post of 08 Jan 26 - 04:07 PM I linked to the DOJ Policy on Use of Lethal Force, which confirms the above. Here it is again, for those who missed it…

DOJ Policy on Use of Lethal Force

It’s perfectly clear from your piece and my link that the ICE officer broke all the rules, and must therefore be guilty of at least ‘Unlawful Killing’ (or whatever the equivalent US offence is), or probably Manslaughter, possibly even Murder.

Why on earth does anyone ignore the evidence of their own eyes and believe the Fat, Ugly, Orange Baboon and his fellow liars?

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Helen
Date: 10 Jan 26 - 02:15 PM

Look on the bright side, BWM. The Police Officer who murdered George Floyd just up the road from Ms Good's murder was convicted and is still serving his sentence. It took a while for the case to be finalised but the right decision was made.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 10 Jan 26 - 04:04 PM

Good reality-based summary:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/3-unanswered-questions-day-fatal-234725271.html

The social-media comments are "interesting" in a variety of ways.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Helen
Date: 10 Jan 26 - 04:22 PM

I just read an ABC (Oz) News article by an analytical journalist who says that the Venezuelan oil is not likely to be as lucrative as expected, so probably not worth the whole invasion exercise.

Has Trump landed a dud with his Venezuelan oil play?

By chief business correspondent Ian Verrender

My summary: The price of oil has plummeted, oil is less likely to be needed to the same extent as now when renewable power becomes more available and less oil based fuel is used for vehicles, and the oil from Venezuela needs a lot more processing than oil from most other areas so its price is usually lower to account for the extra processing costs.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: r.padgett
Date: 11 Jan 26 - 03:26 AM

It seems the major Oil companies that were invited to invest in Venezuela declined the invitation

Yep keep it up

Ray

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Donuel
Date: 11 Jan 26 - 07:21 AM

One presidential pardon makes the laws governing police moot.

When Donald is told of FREE money from tariffs, free luxury 747 or FREE oil he only sees the word FREE and not the costs.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 11 Jan 26 - 08:57 AM

Of *course* he's after the Venezuelan oil. It's just like him: heavy crude.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Donuel
Date: 11 Jan 26 - 10:11 AM

Two MAGA Congressmen are arguing that obstruction of police allows summary execution.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 11 Jan 26 - 12:02 PM

They are 600% WRONG (see what I did there?). But the MAGATs will fall for the lie of course.

Subject: RE: Convicted felon US Prez 47/Don't Say His Name
From: Lighter
Date: 11 Jan 26 - 05:22 PM

Law officers in the United States can shoot someone only to save life, prevent serious bodily injury, or stop a fleeing, armed, violent individual who is likely to kill or injure someone if he escapes.

All members of Congress presumbably know this.