Diddly Dee

Subject: Diddly Dee
From: woodsie
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 09:51 PM

There are people on the local music scene in SE London,, who believe think that a good session involves a small clique of long faced squeeze box & fiddle players playing the same monotonous diddly dee throughout the night, oblivious to anybody else. I wthought that a folk session was a friendly get together of people from varied backgrounds who enjoy music at all levels.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: woodsie
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 09:53 PM

Blimey I've just translated it into French!

Il y a les gens sur la scène locale de musique dans Se Londres, qui croient pensent qu'une bonne session fait participer une petite clique de longs joueurs faits face de boîte et de violon de compression jouant le même diddly dee monotone tout au long de la nuit, inconscient à quiconque autrement. Wthought I qu'une session folklorique était une réunion amicale des personnes des milieux divers qui apprécient la musique à tous les niveaux.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: michaelr
Date: 17 Jan 06 - 10:00 PM

You're talking about ITM. Them's fightin' words!

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 12:07 AM

Not necessarily Irish, though it's true that modern Irish-style sessions sometimes have less variation than other kinds, and can get a bit dull for those not in a position to join in. On the whole, I'd guess that "woodsie" might prefer a singaround of some sort. I expect that SE London has those, too; but I moved North long ago and can't advise.

What would you have preferred? If, for instance, you're a singer/guitarist, there will be limited opportunities for solo performance in an instrumental session.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: Paul Burke
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 04:31 AM

If you don't like the session, don't go to it. It's as simple as that. I personally don't like whinging blues sessions, and I don't go to them. Not very fond of music hall stuff, so I avoid that. Don't like hopping about, so no dances either.

A good session is inclusive, in that it's open to other people who come along. But don't expect an Irish session to be accommodating to a Bavarian oompah fanatic who brings his tuba along and expects everyone to join him playing Yodelayeehee for the rest of the evening. (they might well be happy with one set, though). Just as I wouldn't expect to be particularly welcome if I decided to play mediaeval bagpipes in a shanty session.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: greg stephens
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 05:19 AM

All depends who set up the session, and for what purpose. You can't generalise.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 05:32 AM

And don't expect an ' Irish ' session to welcome singers either.

Where I play in Yorkshire, most sessions are mixed, ie. anything goes,

ANYONE can join in.

eric

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 08:21 AM

Translating programs are worse than spellcheckers - garbage in garbage out. Or even good stuff in, garbage out.

Squeeze box and fiddle does not equal boite et violon de compresssion (I'm trying to imagine a squeeze violin) !

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 08:22 AM

Now, a 'banjo de compression' ...

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 08:50 AM

I think you may find that you have started off with

"Squeeze box" and "fiddle"

and that
boite et violon de compresssion

ends up as

Squeeze (box and fiddle)


:-)

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: GUEST, Topsie
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 04:15 PM

and what about those 'longs joueurs'?
Maybe if you translated it back again they'd turn into LPs.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: GUEST,sorefingers
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 07:07 PM

Without a Flute/Pipes amd/or whistle I think they are doing you a favor by being unfriendly.

For a great giggle go learn a couple of jigs/reels etc on the TW and then go back, you will be surprised and delighted to learn crowds like that far far more than a buch of whiney scratchy fiddles and honking accordions. BTW Neither of these are really traditional.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: woodsie
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 09:14 PM

... Back into English from French:

There are people on the local scene of music in London, who believe think that a good session made take part small clicks long faced players of box and violin of compression playing same the diddly dee monotonous throughout the night, unconscious with whoever differently. thought I that a folk session was a friendly meeting of the people of the various mediums which appreciate the music on all the levels.

Couldn't have put it better myself.

BTW

In my original post I said nothing about Irish music. In fact the session that inspired this post frowns upon Irish music and doesn't allow it.

Any Irish sessions that I have been to are jovial, friendly and welcoming. Irish music is certainly not monotonous.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: woodsie
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 09:19 PM

From French to German to Italian then back to English:

There is people on the local scene of music in it London, that they believe think that a good reunion lasci in order to participate one small cracking of long the made players side of the case and of violino of jam, that the same diddly DTE plays monotone during the night, unconsciously in all, otherwise. thought I, that it was one folkloristische that comes to contact of a friendly reunion of the persons of the different circles, that they have estimated music to all the levels.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 10:42 PM

It was natural for Michael to assume that you were talking about Irish-style sessions, that being what people usually mean when they use that ignorant and patronising "diddly dee" cliché.

If you want a real discussion, say what you mean; tell us what you play yourself, and why you think yourself superior to these unnamed people you took a dislike to. If you just want to arse about with online translation routines, then you are several years too late to be amusing.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: woodsie
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 10:55 PM

Miserable prat - you are probably one of the arseholes I'm talking about so get off the thread!

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 11:11 PM

You can dish it out, then, but can't take it?

I expect you can do better than that if you really try.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: woodsie
Date: 18 Jan 06 - 11:55 PM

OK Braindead what exactly can I "dish out"? You Say that I consider myself "superior" - where did I say that?

You use the terms "arse" "ignorant" "patronising"

Get a life sadfuck!

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: michaelr
Date: 19 Jan 06 - 01:56 AM

Easy there, woodsie. If you weren't talking about ITM, then I misunderstood your original post. Mea culpa, or as they say around here, my bad.

Running it through translation software does nothing to clarify your meaning, though; in fact, it does just the opposite. And there is no need to go off on Malcolm. What kind of music is being played in this session?

Cheers,
Michael

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: Paul Burke
Date: 19 Jan 06 - 04:25 AM

It doesn't matter what sort of music it is, woodsie, the principle is the same. Sessions are set up by people to do whatever they set up the session for. That can include being a closed clique, if that's their idea of a good time. There ARE real reasons why some people want to restrict to certain genres and styles- it's even a bit surprising there's not more of it, given the pressures to adopt a commercialised, standardised, style that fits the marketing model. But that's an argument for another thread.

If that session isn't what you want, find another session that's a bit nearer the mark.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 19 Jan 06 - 05:41 AM

Woodsie.
Unfortunately it is a fact of life that a heck of a lot of sessions are an enclosed clique. There are a number of reasons/explanations why this occurs.
Frequently it is because one or two dominating individuals just will not shut up and give anyone else a chance. They leap in with the next tune they want to play before anybody has chance to draw breath at the end of the previous set of tunes. They are not interested in listening to anything which an outsider might play, because it is not on their mental "playlist". In general I do not refer to these people as "Musicians" because to be a musician you need to listen and adjust your playing to what other musicians are doing. These people are instrument players (technicians if you like) who just play the notes, often a quickly as they physically can (plus missing out notes to make it even faster) to exclude anybody they see as "not fast enough to keep up" and therefore "inferior musicians" in their eyes. Essentially they are just selfish and are not interested in anybody except themself or their specific bunch of cronies.

In some cases a session "belongs to" an individual - it is "his/her" session, they started it and they set the agenda. They are there to play Irish/English/Obscure Catalonian stuff they nicked from the repertoire of some band you or I have never heard of....
Sometimes the leader is simply so carried away with their own repertoire that it will never occur to them that other people might have a different musical interest. You are not going to change this sort of session so a general rule might be "If it suits you , you join in. If it doesn't, you go elsewhere."

Often the session is dominated by "whoever plays the loudest" as they will start a new tune even after you have already started to play one, and just drown you out until you give up in disgust. I recall one occasion when I started playing Grandfather's Clock (Key G) in a session. A specific melodeon player joined in (In the key of D) and did not even notice that she was completely out of tune with what I was playing. Some people are just completely insensitive to anything except their own personal universe.

Sometimes the session is specifically set up with a musical agenda. For instance, every now and then Banjo Ray organises an Old-time American music session in Doncaster. I go along to that because I don't often get the chance to play Old-time with other players. On these sessions I don't want to play French tunes or Archaic English Dances, which I would be happy to do in a different location.

In most cases you will be included if you join in with what is already being played, but not if you try to change the agenda.

Some session leaders are open to new ideas, and if you get the chance to chat with any of the people attending, you may find that the session is not as exclusive as it might seem. Sometimes sessions get stuck in a rut, and are just waiting for one of the players to throw in something a bit different. You will not know unless you try.
In other cases it would be seen a someone "muscling in" and might be resented. If you have a chat (at the bar perhaps) with some of the players, you might find the situation is not as it appears to you.

Quack!
Geoff the Duck.

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 19 Jan 06 - 05:55 AM

Hear Hear Geoff!

Subject: RE: Diddly Dee
From: Leadfingers
Date: 19 Jan 06 - 10:46 AM

Woodsie - Your response to Malcolms comment about 'translations' might have something to do with the way you were received at the session you complain about ! If you have the same attitude at sessions , its hardly surprising you weren't welcomed with open arms !