Thought for the Day (August 13)

Subject: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Peter T.
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 09:18 AM

News items, August 12:

Scientists have discovered new evidence for early life on earth in Archean rock in Australia. The presence of lipid steranes (forms of fatty acid) indicates that some form of cellular life was present on the earth 2.7 billion years ago, almost a billion years earlier than previous calculations.
--Nature.

The state of Kansas Board of Education has dropped the requirement to teach evolution in its school system. Teachers will no longer be required to give evolution equal time with "creationist" explanations of the development of life on earth.
--New York Times.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Neil Lowe
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 10:02 AM

What do the Creationists have to kick about? Why could God not have created life using the tool of evolution?

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 10:05 AM

....please don't get me started on this one.....

Spaw

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 10:26 AM

Me, too!!!!!! Doya 'spose they all will claim immaculate conception, now, nothing scientific about it, right??*big cynical grin*

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Jasper
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:29 AM

One step forward...two steps back...

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Aram
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:34 AM

I wonder if any of you kind folks can help me. I'm trying to get lyrics for popular Mexican folks songs like La Cucaracha, Cielito Lindo, Chiapanecas, etc. I've spent a lot of time searching lyric sites and have turned up very little. Any of you out there have any suggestions? I would greatly appreciate any help you can offer.

Thanks,

Aram

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:38 AM

Wait'll they confirm that some form of life existed on Mars (or even the moon!) The fundamentalists better get their spins ready for THAT one. Perhaps they'll hire Dick Morris or Barry Sheck.
Personally, if there's any kind of afterlife, I hope it contains a weekly debating club. Sign me up for the one with God and Darwin hashing it out.
Rick

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: MMario
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:45 AM

I think in the long run I'm with 'Spaw on this one. Don't get me started. However, postulating a Creator - to my mind evolution fits right in. Oddly enough, did anyone see the article that claimed the Galaxy has revolved just slightly under 7 times since it came into existance?

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Wolfgang
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:45 AM

Aram, start your own thread with a specific title, and before that make a forum search and you might find things like this.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Bert
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 12:02 PM

For the REAL TRUE story you must read "Are We There Yet? a Frank and Ernest History of the world" by Bob Thaves

blue clicky thingy

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 12:28 PM

Didn't we go through all this years ago in the Scopes Trial? I believe in God. I also believe that the 7 days of Creation story was a non-literal parable that enabled the human mind to grasp something that is nearly unfathomable- the great stretch of time since the Big Bang, and the miraculous evolution of the human mind.

Of course, Kansas City seems to be staking it's claim to be a leader in the Devolution of the Human Mind.

LEJ

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: annamill
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 12:47 PM

...don't get me started either...

Hey Bert, who's Frank and Ernest? And what are there qualifications?

If you wake tomorrow and have a hankerin', come one over.. Hankerin' is an American expression. It means ifyawantta.

I feel good. da-da, da-da, da-da, dah. James Brown

Love, annap

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Allan C.
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 01:07 PM

Personally, I am a staunch defender of the concept of spontaneous generation ;-)

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Margo
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 01:07 PM

It seems to be the way to start a post in this thread, so I'll follow suit so as not to be different; DON'T GET ME STARTED, BUT

Ok. Now, I'm with you, LEJ. I believe in God, and I also believe that the "six days" may have been other than days as we know them....

I believe in miricles and things happening that we cannot explain. Immaculate conception falls into that catagory. I've had one thing in particular happen to me in real life that was so spooky but real, and I truly believe that there is a spiritual realm that is connected with the human race, evolved or created.

Hoo boy, I said more than I meant to. I guess you did get me started.......

Margs

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Bert
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 01:22 PM

Frank and Ernest are cartoon characters. here

If I can get away from the Company Picnic a little early and I'm not too tired I'll try to make it. But I can't promise.

Bert.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From:
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 01:48 PM

Do you guys remember the Eric Idle song from the meaning of life?

Just remember that your're standing On a planet that's evolving, And revolving at 900 (?) miles and hour; That's orbiting at roughly 13,000 (?) miles a day, The sun that is the source of all our power. The sun, and you and me, and all the stars that we can see Are moving at a million miles a day, In an outer spiral arm at fourteen thousand light years wide, Of the galaxy that we call the Milky Way!

Kinda puts it all in perspective. Try not to stress out too much about it. I personally have no problems believing in a loving Creator, who also happens to use the process of evolution to shape us into His/Her image. In fact, I will confess to needing to believe it. Like the Good Book says, In the beginning was the Word... and the Word was God. From the Greek, "logos," meaning word, and also meaning "law" and "logic". I always felt that God/Goddess was big enough to withstand my puny doubts. This little bit of legislation, will not change the Truth. Like the Man says, "the truth will out."

'T'ain't no big thing

Beau

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 02:07 PM

Well said, Beau.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Aram
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 03:33 PM

Wolfgang - Thanks very much for the link...sorry about blundering in here and blurting out my request..but I appreciate the help.

BTW, It is a proven scientific fact that God created evolution.

Aram

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: K~~
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 04:35 PM

Ussher-Lightfoot Calculations state that the world was created 4004 BC...in October...at 10am. These guys are worth looking up:) Tangentially - Did you all read about the scientists in Japan who are trying to get a share of the tissue from a frozen mastadon from Mongolia so that they can clone it? Isn't there a reason for extinction usually? That's what they told us in paleo 101.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Bert
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 05:09 PM

K'tildas, those Ussher-Lightfoot guys are wrong, I know I was there. We had a sing the night before and slept on the couch.

As for the Mastodons, they might make good burgers.

Bert.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Ballygally Whistler
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 05:33 PM

What is Mudcat about..... Music, evolution or Mars...

Yes we've evolved..Now Can We play & talk some music !!!!

Colin Ballygally

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 08:58 PM

Ahh Colin, it's been months since I've heard those words. I guess the "Cat" is back to normal again. Now how about a song about the evolution of music on Mars! Whoopie!
Rick

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:17 PM

Y'know Whistler, I just gotta tell you. I love that picture of your Mother.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Susan A-R
Date: 13 Aug 99 - 11:26 PM

Their Brains Were Small and they Died seems appropriate here. Where's mark Gram when you need him??

Susan A-R

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: emily rain
Date: 14 Aug 99 - 12:57 PM

i had a fundamentalist (affectionately known as "fundie") friend who claimed that god used the tool of evolution to develop all the animals on earth... but that humans were created in the image of god, as-is.

now there's a girl who could rationalize her way out of a paper bag!

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: CarlZen
Date: 14 Aug 99 - 01:07 PM

It seems like we are protecting the rights of the ill-educated to continue in their ignorance. Not only that, but to prevent others from learning. What happened to "the truth shall set you free"? Maybe that's the problem - the truth will set them free and they are afraid of the truth.

A wonderful octteganarian retired pastor once said to me that there are too many in the religious world who taske the idea that the word of God is only found in the Bible. If these people really believed that a god created their universe, then all of the mysteries regarding this creation which unveil themselves through scientific discovery is also the Word of God.

The real shame is that ignorant people (in this case the Kansas City School Board) are making policy which affects everyone else.

Any 'Catters from KC? What's it like there?

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Allan C.
Date: 14 Aug 99 - 01:08 PM

"...evolution Mama, don't you make a monkey out of me..."

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Allan C.
Date: 14 Aug 99 - 01:08 PM

"...Evolution Mama, don't you make a monkey out of me..."

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Bill D
Date: 14 Aug 99 - 01:27 PM

form todays Washington Post thoughts on Kansas & evolution

*sigh*..I grew up in Kansas from 3rd grade through college..but I was in Wichita, where there was some semblance of modern thought beyond the 17th century...I'm afraid that in the rural/western parts, you can still find attitudes that you associate with the deep south or other bastions of Bible-thumping....I am afraid that in some areas of discussion, there are those who simply decide what they would LIKE to be true, then defend that position to the death with threats, intimidation, bad logic, outright nonsense and political management.

It is not about what you 'choose' to believe personally, that is allowed in this free society, it is about allowing education to do it's job without making some vocal minorities the censors of what the public is allowed to learn and teach. Remember what they did to Copernicus in the name of 'truth'...and Giordano Bruno, who embraced Copernicus and went even further, was burned at the stake!

Remember, in order to have "Freedom of Religion" for all, it is also necessary to have "freedom FROM religion" for those who desire it..

to K---..and your point is? There are all SORTS of 'reasons for extinction', but watch what senses you imbue the word 'reason' with..(Bishop Usher is, indeed 'worth looking up'....just to see how silly a fellow can be about how calculations should be done!)

(What, ME? Opinionated? naawwwww)

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: K~~
Date: 14 Aug 99 - 11:37 PM

I thought that was my point, Bill D. But if James Ussher can find the answers he wants by counting up all the begats in the Bible, I'm sure some one else can find their answers by reading in, under, between, around, and through the text of Bill of Rights, the Bible, or the instructions on a packet of Bisquick.

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: campfire
Date: 15 Aug 99 - 02:28 AM

Hey, I once had a guy tell me that God put dinosaur bones in the Earth TO TEST OUR FAITH!!!!

campfire

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Roger in Baltimore
Date: 15 Aug 99 - 08:48 AM

If we are willing to throw logic out the window, we can read anything we wish into the Bible. Just saw "Bowfinger" with Eddie Murphy who plays a paranoid African-American movie star. He has just read a script and says "There's devious messages in here. I counted all the k's and found 1,368 of them. That means KKK is in here 456 times!"

The message is always in the mind of the beholder (discombobulated paraphrase, but I hope you get the message).

So, the Governor of Kansas sees this as a time to get rid of the state Board of Education. I would be just as wary, or maybe even more wary, to have professional educators running the schools on their own.

Roger in Baltimore

Subject: RE: Thought for the Day (August 13)
From: Bill D
Date: 15 Aug 99 - 10:56 AM

durn right, Roger...there is plenty of room for excesses & abuses on either side...and plenty of history of it, too! I have opinions that I'd like to win others over to, but NOT by legislating their views away...'eternal vigilance' and all that..