BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing

Subject: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Hollowfox
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 07:41 PM

I've been going nuts with this for months now. I have an accumulation of cats, all neutered or spayed. A couple of them apparently felt insecure about their standing in the feline heirarchy and started marking stuff. I've tried a variety of deodorizing products and procedures (Feliway, vinegar, etc.) and nothing's worked. I'm tired of making a religion of sniffing everything, closing doors that haven't been closed in years, and spending all my off time scrubbing the bottom twelve inches of every room in my house. Any suggestions? Transferring all the cats to permanent outside duty isn't an option, especially the way this winter's been going.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: katlaughing
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 07:59 PM

Putting up a simple wooden frame with chickenwire outside of our office window seemed to help, so they could get out some. We still use one even though we are down to two cats for the first time in my life.:-)We call it the "chicken coop" but it's really an unglorified cat run.

There are also some herbal calming products which have helped with the ones who are nervous. I think you can get them at the bigger pet stores, but also at Drs. Foster and Smith online.

We had to be religious about not leaving clothing on the floors and closing doors, as you say, and trying to give them each the attanetion they seemed to need.

Good luck and how about one of those reduction candles?"-)

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Hollowfox
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 08:00 PM

I should add that I've added another large catbox, and I clean all three of them frequently. I've also replaced two carpets.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 08:32 PM

Is the individual culprit identifiable?

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Gurney
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 08:56 PM

It's probably a male if it is spraying the walls. They are also likely to spray electrical equipment such as wall-sockets and television sets, and how they know that it is live electricity is beyond me! How they survive it is even more surprising.
Are you sure it is the internal heirarchy that is the problem, and not a new aggresive male in the garden?
We 'compromised' by leaving the bedroom window open so that he could 'defend' his territory.

Now we enjoy vocal confrontations an the wee hours.

A lead pill is the only answer I have, which meets with stern opposition in certain quarters.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 09:28 PM

Just post a "NO STRESSPISSING" sign.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: katlaughing
Date: 10 Feb 09 - 11:37 PM

It seems ridiculous, but rule of thumb is one box per cat plus one extra. I never had that many, but we did have five at one point for eight cats.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Gurney
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 04:40 AM

Yes Kat, we have three for two cats (one of each) AND leave the window open.
The male uses two and the female uses the other. Seems to work. Mostly. Two in the loo and one in the lounge, overnight.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 05:02 AM

Contrary to popular belief, neutered males can and do spray, especially if an un-neutered male has been in and marked. Whole Queens can also spray, although not so copiously so don't immediately blame the Toms.

Citrus scents are better as cats mostly don't like them. Using an odourous product though can have repercussions as the cat comes along looking for its' calling card, sniffs, finds another scent overlying it, and so lets fly again to reinforce the point that this is their bit. I've found the 'Febreze' spring fresh quite effective as a deterrant.

Putting a bowl of food at a spraying point will sometimes help as no sensible kitty will pee on its own dinner. Note I said sensible. There are a couple. Not many, I grant you, but there are one or two sensible kitties out there. Not in my house though.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: bald headed step child
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 05:14 AM

Maybe if you got a banjo with a catskin head and started playing it around them, they might get the message. ;)

BHSC

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 09:52 AM

What do you mean by 'an accumulation of cats'? How many do you have?

A cat in the wild lives a solitary existence, unless it's a mother with kittens. Maybe your house simply has more cats in it than the cats can stand.

Or maybe one of them has a kidney or urinary tract problem. That can also lead to spraying. Trouble is, checking that out at the vet's runs into serious money.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Hollowfox
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 11:09 AM

Here's a few more details. I currently have seven cats in a ten room house. The problem probably started about a year ago last September when three kittens got droppped off. The number was then nine, but two have since died. I think the nub of the problem began when Tao, the lowest cat on the social ladder, got bullied away from the food dish and retreated to the upstairs area (sort of a cross between Emily Dickenson and Mrs. Rochester). That's where the cat boxes are. she has a helluva warcry, and I think she was giving grief to any box use. By now, every room has been pissed in, and every cat has given it a try, at least once. I've added a box downstairs, put food and water upstairs for her (although everybody snacks on it), and I think that they've just fallen into a bad habit.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: GUEST,Doc John
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 11:15 AM

I have a bagpipes chanter: as soon as I start to (try to) play, all cats walk out!
Doc John

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Alice
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 11:18 AM

My family had an old neutered male Siamese who started spraying all around the house, and the older he got, the worse he was. You can't really stop them once they start doing that. I think my parents had 3 cats in the house at that time. It sounds like you should find a home for the old cat where he can be the only pet in the house, but he may still keep spraying anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Abdul The Bul Bul
Date: 12 Feb 09 - 03:06 AM

Hey Bee D, s'been 2 days now and at the shaving mirror this morning I still find myself laughing at your "NO STRESSPISSING!!!

Al

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Gurney
Date: 12 Feb 09 - 04:18 AM

Abdul, are you sure it was just the joke you were laughing at in your mirror? 8-]

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Abdul The Bul Bul
Date: 12 Feb 09 - 04:23 AM

I'll have to reflect on that Gurney.
Got bloody 'no stresspissing' in my head again now!

Al

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: GUEST,MAG at work
Date: 12 Feb 09 - 11:23 AM

I use odormute, the best enzyme cleaner I have found.

I also rotate turns outdorrs so my now 5 are not all inside at the same time.

I too had to get religious about not leaving laundry in a pile on the floor.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Becca72
Date: 12 Feb 09 - 12:15 PM

I don't have an answer other than more boxes for 7 cats or moving the existing boxes, but I also wanted to point out after reading these posts that "spraying" and "urinating" are not the same thing...

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: GUEST,PeterC
Date: 12 Feb 09 - 06:46 PM

I was about to make the same post as Becca about the difference between spraying and unrinating.

My old neutered tom started spraying when we moved house. Once he started there was no way to stop it. He had to be re-homed in the end.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 12 Feb 09 - 07:15 PM

And I thought I had problems with two cats and two boxes. Alas, when one cat died recently, I think I was left with the one that occasionally pisses on things.

I think you have too many cats for an indoor collection, and you have reached the point of critical mass where you will never get them to stop peeing around the house because you won't be able to keep up with them or completely remove the smell that they're marking on top of.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: katlaughing
Date: 12 Feb 09 - 07:26 PM

Foster and SMith have some good training aids which might help: HERE.

Also, if you think you know which one is really bad or you think the frightened one might benefit from being enclosed, you could try one of THESE, though they are expensive. We did try one for a bully cat, but he went berserk in it and actually pulled the bars away from the rim and stuff himself through. I think a scaredy-cat might do okay, though, esp, with a blanket draped over part of it to make it dark and cosy.

If ya wanna go nuts, check out THESE ENCLOSURES!.

Poke around on their site; they've got good articles about such problems, too.

Good luck!

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 13 Feb 09 - 10:35 AM

'the upstairs area...That's where the cat boxes are.'

Ah so! That's one problem. You need to have a box downstairs and one in the basement, if any. If all the boxes are upstairs, an aggressive cat can keep others from them by guarding the stairs.

Blocking access to the litter box is an established form of bullying among cats.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Alice
Date: 13 Feb 09 - 11:05 AM

It doesn't sound like a litter box problem (urinating) as much as a spraying problem. As pointed out upthread, spraying and marking territory is a different problem than just urinating.

I think you have too many cats for the size of the house. It would probably be more humane for them to not have to be so crowded in territory. Have you considered finding new homes for a few of them? I think that would be the best solution for the welfare of the cats.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Becca72
Date: 14 Feb 09 - 11:06 AM

Hollowfox wrote: "I think the nub of the problem began when Tao, the lowest cat on the social ladder, got bullied away from the food dish and retreated to the upstairs area (sort of a cross between Emily Dickenson and Mrs. Rochester). That's where the cat boxes are. she has a helluva warcry, and I think she was giving grief to any box use."

Sounds like a litter box problem to me...

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Hollowfox
Date: 16 Feb 09 - 05:44 PM

Good news! More boxes and persistance with cleaning seem to have won the day. I plan on trying the various compounds as well, but the tide seems to be turning.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: JennieG
Date: 16 Feb 09 - 06:36 PM

That's good to hear! So you won't be so stressed yourself that you will need to resort to stresspissing.

Cheers
JennieG

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: GUEST,LTS pretending to do housework
Date: 17 Feb 09 - 11:36 AM

So what can I do with a cat that has just got old and ornery and refuses to go out of the cat flap when the weather is anything other than blinding sunshine and 30 in the shade? It's not even as if she's immobile... she pees not 5' from the cat flap, which she's perfectly capable of getting through. No-one is waiting on the other side for her, and there are no other cats blocking her passage - she rules this house. She's also continent.. she controls when she goes and she chooses to go in the hallway.

Manitas has suggested various means from a cork to euthanasia... I told him I'd do the same to him when he gets old and incontinent.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Alice
Date: 17 Feb 09 - 11:41 AM

That's great, Hollowfox.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: katlaughing
Date: 17 Feb 09 - 12:07 PM

good news, Hollowfox!

Liz, what things have changed recently that she might literally be pissed (USA meaning) about? Maybe try putting a catbox where she pees OR put her food there? If you can catch her while she's doing it, pick her up like her mother would, by the nape of the neck, and scold her, putting her in the catbox? You could also get some of those incontinence pads and out one down where she goes; at least it would make clean-up easy.

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 17 Feb 09 - 05:28 PM

She varies her target areas from the hall floor to the back of the sofa, occasionally the living room carpet (which at least has the merit of being easy to clean up with the carpet washer) or, and this is the most obnoxious, the kitchen floor within a paws reach of her food and the cat flap. There have been a couple of changes but she's been peeing unsociably for ages before I moved the bookcases.

She does it most in bad weather, she doesn't like going out into the rain, and when it was snowy, we literally had to post her out through the flap.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: katlaughing
Date: 17 Feb 09 - 07:31 PM

In that case, the next thing to do would be take her to the vet to make sure there isn't anything going wrong with kidneys, etc. Sometimes being obnoxious is the only way they have to tell us something is wrong, unless we finally get smart and learn meowspeak.:-)

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: JennieG
Date: 18 Feb 09 - 07:03 PM

Yep....what Kat just said.....we had a similar problem with a lovely grey cat many years ago, and it turned out that she had a hormone problem. A little medication, she was as right as rain, and the problem stopped.

Cheers
JennieG

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: robomatic
Date: 18 Feb 09 - 09:02 PM

I was gonna ask if YOU had tried, y'know, letting 'em know who's boss by the only way they understand. It worked on "Never Cry Wolf" but most of that was outdoors.

Actually I'm ashamed I brought up the whole idea. . .

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: GUEST,LTS pretending to work
Date: 19 Feb 09 - 08:32 AM

I threatened her with it yesterday. I told her I'd pee in her bed if she did it again. So far, nothing...

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Help! Feline Stresspissing
From: Hollowfox
Date: 19 Feb 09 - 07:11 PM

Friends on another forum suggested 1) scrubbing the affected area with Listerine to get the smell out and 2) checking with a professional janitorial supply company to see if they're willing to sell whatever they use. I hope this helps.