BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!

Subject: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: dianavan
Date: 17 Sep 04 - 11:44 PM

I just read about something that I have long suspected. Applying deodorant to freshly shaved underarms may cause breast cancer.

This is not a joke.

d

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Teresa
Date: 17 Sep 04 - 11:47 PM

Or don't use deodorant? ;)

But in all seriousness, where did you read this?

T

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 12:00 AM

I remember reading something about this a while back. Here's what I found, in a search on google, fwiw:

According to a Jan., 2004 Journal of Applied Toxicology editorial:

    The findings of parabens in tumour samples are additional results in line with the general hypothesis that there may be a link between oestrogenic compounds commonly used in underarm cosmetics and other consumer products and breast cancer. The results alone, however, do not suggest that these chemicals caused the tumours in these patients. Darbre et al.'s findings invite several questions: how did the parabens get into the breast, are they persistent and could they do harm? The answers require further research.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: CarolC
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 12:16 AM

What about deodorant crystals?

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Peg
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 12:31 AM

I think it's the aluminum compounds in anti-perspirants which are more of a concern (because they block pores and are absorbed intothe body (aluminum doesn't naturally occur in the human body).

Main reason not to apply deodorant after shaving is it will cause irritation...

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Teresa
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 12:38 AM

So from Kat's posting, it would seem to me that there is a correlation, but not a direct cause ... all manner of chemicals that contain estrogen could be the culprit, and perhaps deodorants are one example.

I try to steer clear of commercial cosmetics and cleaners. It's getting easier to buy such things--Dr. Bronner's soap, etc.

T

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 12:43 AM

Yes, further research is required but who will fund it? Certainly not the cosmetic industry.

d

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 01:13 AM

Here are a couple of other interesting sites about it. This one shows the scientific community cannot agree on this, or the need for more study: click;

and, this one is a copy of an "urban myth" email which has been going around a lot (snopes also had this on their site): clickety

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Teresa
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 01:28 AM

Thanks, Kat.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 02:34 AM

I read an article about this in a local mag called Common Ground. Apparently the research was done by a doctor whose mother and wife had both been diagnosed with breast cancer.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 04:20 AM

I have never believed in anti perspirants, as blocking your pores up is wrong. After all they recommend that opening and cleansing the pores on other parts of your body is a good idea, can't both be right.
I have recently had to stop using deodorants, as I've become allergic to them, or possibly to the alchohol they contain, same goes for cologne. I have discovered a preparation in Boots called Trust which is an ointment type long term deodorant, 5 days between applications, it is expensive, but it works.
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: artbrooks
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 08:31 AM

I believe this is the article Dianavan is refering to.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 10:16 AM

I haven't used any kind of deodorant in probably 30 years. It's a useless product as far as I'm concerned. Stopping up pores sounds like a bad idea (anti-persperant) but deodorant (masking odor) is equally unhelpful. Either product is a source of one more annoying smell in the world of perfumed products. Bathing daily is sufficient to take care of cleanliness, and if it's hot enough out for me to be sweating, the rest of me is going to be moist also, not just my underarms. It seems especially silly to use something like this in a hot climate.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 12:41 PM

thanks artbrooks - I didn't know it was on the net.

I remember when I first became aware of harmful food additives in the 60's. When I told my mother she said, "Don't be silly, the government wouldn't allow it if it was bad for us."

I think this is probably a similar situation. A few years down the road, scientific research will confirm our suspicions. Until then, I will be very cautious and urge others to do the same. It is, after all, only a few generations that have been duped into believing its all a part of good hygiene.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 12:53 PM

Same here, SRS, plus they all made me itch anyway!

Thanks for the link, artbrooks.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: CarolC
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 01:59 PM

I recommend deodorant crystals to anyone who can't or doesn't want to use deodorants. It's some kind of mineral that is formed in to a rock-like thing. You wet it and rub it on. I've been using them for years. They have no scent of their own, and they completely prevent any kind of underarm odor on me for a minimum of two days (very good for music festivals that don't have good shower facilities). Plus, they last a long time. You only have to buy them once every year or two.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: MBSLynne
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 02:01 PM

I use Pit Rok, which is the crystal stuff...no nasty aluminium thingies. And it's a deodorant because it gets rid of the bacteria which cause BO, not an anti-perspirant. I agree, stopping you sweating altogether can't be a good thing.

Love Lynne

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Teresa
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 02:17 PM

Where can you get them? I am having no luck at all with "natural" deodorants. Vitamin Shoppe? Health food store?

T

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Peg
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 02:42 PM

www.Lush.com sells deodorants called Krysztal...they work great but can cause irritation if applied directly, or if the armpits are not completely dry dfrom bathing first....
I find using a brush to brush it on works great.
These come in several varieties, one has tea tree oil called T'eo. I use Oxeo Cube--smells great, works fine.
Very inexpensive and long lasting and biodegradable and no plastic packaging!

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: CarolC
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 02:46 PM

I get mine at whatever local natural food store I have near me.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 02:46 PM

Ouch! I'd think tea tree oil in your pits would burn!

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Teresa
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 02:50 PM

Thanks, CarolC and Ted.

Guest, I think the tea tree oil is in very small doses.   I use a shampoo with it, and it hasn't hurt my brain at all. ;)

T

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Teresa
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 02:54 PM

Hmm, Peg; not Ted. Maybe it did affect my brain after all. Hmm, shall have to rethink that. ;);)

T

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Teresa
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 03:01 PM

True, Martin. Actually, I think toilet paper is mainly used in North America, and I'd much rather use a bidet; much more sanitary.

But that's another topic ... dare I say "thread creep?" ;);)

T

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: CarolC
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 03:34 PM

What country are you in, Teresa?

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 04:17 PM

How did I know that Martin would eventually show up? He's so predictable.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Once Famous
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 04:33 PM

Well, my first post was apparently pulled by one of the priests or nuns.

As I was saying............................

A Chicken Little mentality, dianavan?

I hope we are not on a crowded bus together.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 04:44 PM

I'm sorry, but I'm still dubious about this. My grandmother died of breast cancer and I don't believe she ever used such things as anti-persperants or deodorants, being a poor country girl. I reckon genetic predisposition holds a lot more water than chemical additives.

The increased occurance of breast cancer in both men and women has a lot more to do with improved screening and better awareness. It also has a lot to do with better healthcare - people are living longer than they used to and not dying of the same diseases that they did as little as 100 years ago.

I will agree that the world is far too perfumed and chemically adulterated in general, but there are alternatives, as already mentioned,
Lush have some wonderful products, outlets all over the world and I think may even do a postal service.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 05:02 PM

Liz - I think you are probably right about a genetic predisposition but I still hope women will seriously consider the alternatives. Not all breast cancer has a genetic link.

d

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 07:02 PM

Oops--guest asking about the tea tree oil was me. My Firefox browser doesn't have a cookie, apparently.

There are many products in the world that are here for good reasons. Cleaning products and cleanliness habits have changed over the years, rendering some products obsolete or at least not necessary at such strengths as originally developed. As we realise that the reasons and strengths aren't so good any more, leaving them behind is a prudent thing to do. I try to use detergent without perfume, I look for mild scented soaps and shampoos, and the gel that we use for hair styling is odorless, if possible. Otherwise you have quite a cocktail of smells not only around you to effect others, but to effect your own body.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Teresa
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 07:06 PM

CarolC, I'm in the u.S.

T

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 07:30 PM

What we know about cancer is, that we don't know what causes cancer...

I suspect in the end, we'll discover that life causes death, 100% of the time...

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: pdq
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 07:54 PM

Teresa,

You are quite correct saying that you are "in the US". Las Vegas is within the US but not always considered "part " of it!

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: CarolC
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 08:30 PM

I think you shouldn't have any problem finding deodorant crystals then, Teresa. I have no idea how easy they are to find in other countries, but I can even get them in Columbus, Georgia.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Teresa
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 09:10 PM

And so I thought, CarolC. ... I had seen them here and there, but never got them, as I wasn't sure how well they'd work. I'll give them a try. ...

T

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 04 - 11:59 PM

I highly recommend the unscented variety of StonyBrook shampoo.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Kaleea
Date: 19 Sep 04 - 12:03 AM

The only references I have seen in medical journals which suggest not using the antiperspirants is on the subject of alzheimers disease. Evidently quite a bit of aluminum has been found in the brains of those suffering the disease--which can only be discovered in the process of he autopsy. As I understand it, this is one of the only ways of absolutely diagnosing the disease. Having worked with alzheimer's patients & their families, I know it is NOT a kind way to go.

Subject: RE: BS: Warning: Don't shave your underarms!
From: Gurney
Date: 19 Sep 04 - 02:55 AM

On the subject of aluminium: The story used to be (in the long gone by) that it was aluminium pots and pans that were the cause of the intake. Those days there was no anti-perspirants, well, not for most of our lot, anyway. Maybe for rich folks.
As far as I can remember, it is anti-perspirant that contains aluminium, not deodorant. Of course most products combine both, but not all do.
And then there is the Teflon coating on the frypan......