BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime

Subject: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime.
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 03:47 PM

Last night I watched a deeply disturbing program on Channel 4 (UK TV)
concerning the activities of the "Endtime " believers, who apparently believe that the end of the world is imminent.

Nothing new about that, I hear you say, these lunatics have always been around, and it is true, there have been more false alarms concerning the end of the world than you could shake a stick at.

The disturbing thing about this particular set of lunatics is that they allegedly have a powerful lobby within the White House, that GWB is apparently a believer, and that the peace process in the Middle East will be sacrificed in order to bring about the end of the world (which they believe is prophesied in the Book of Revelations ).

I don't want to make this a long didactic post.

Until last night, I had never heard of "Endtime"

Google it, make your own assessment, many of you in the US must have encountered these fanatics.

Are they really as influential and dangerous as the UK program alleged, or are they simply a lunatic fringe whom we can safely ignore ?

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now ? or Endtime ?
From: artbrooks
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 04:05 PM

Never heard of them. There are a lot of kooks out there.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now ? or Endtime?
From: Ebbie
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 04:25 PM

In the US 'endtime' is a long established belief among certain religious groups. Been ever thus- and I don't think it's getting fewer adherents.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now ? or Endtime?
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 04:26 PM

This is not the first time this has come up on Mudcat.

People just don't want to believe it because it is a 'conspiracy theory'.

If you want to see how rank it gets, check out the 'controlled demolition' thread. As to Bush and the Fundies, what's new? YES the arseholes are welcoming and bringing about the so-called 'endtimes'.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: bobad
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 05:00 PM

Hopefully for some.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: wysiwyg
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 05:01 PM

It's based on a particular (and IMO flawed) interpretation of "Revelation."

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 05:03 PM

Old John took a bit too much acid methinks.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 05:16 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now ? or Endtime?
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 04:26 PM

This is not the first time this has come up on Mudcat.

Well, GUEST, trust me, I did an exhaustive search to ascertain whether this had been covered on Mudcat and got no hits (searching for "Endtime" )

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 05:20 PM

It wasn't phrased that way. It was also part of a few other threads. Mostly to do with Bush and the Fundies.

Also, I wasn't suggesting this thread shouldn't be here. It's a good topic.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: sian, west wales
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 05:33 PM

I saw the programme too. Excellent production, frightening issues. I have a lot of respect for the presenter and thought it was a very well thought-out documentary.

And apparently it might not have been "St" John who wrote Revelations. But that's the least of our worries.

It would be great to think that it might be shown in the USA, but I somehow doubt it. Maybe a Canadian channel would buy it ... ?

sian

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Ron Davies
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 06:08 PM

The question is whether GWB is an opportunist without scruples--or totally bonkers.

I take comfort in the belief that he's just an unprincipled worm. And he plays up the connection to the radical Right--including the Endtimes lunatic fringe--for the votes. And they, like everybody else, will find they've been betrayed.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Rapparee
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 08:35 PM

Try searching the Forum for "Rapture" or "The Rapture."

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: frogprince
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 08:47 PM

In my experience, the usual idiom is "The end times"; as Rapaire said, a lot of the discussion here would be under "Rapture", which is the key event of the whole cockeyed scenario.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 08:58 PM

I had a hernia that threatened to do that. Hurt like hell.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Sep 06 - 11:55 PM

Bush is no Christian. That is a fabrication. The official story is that he was personally saved by Billy Graham (world's most famous 'preacher') during a walk on a beach. Pure Bushit. Bush is a Luciferian. (Just do a search for...forget it, I'll do it for you):

http://educate-yourself.org/cn/skolnickoverthrowamericanrepub47part10feb04.shtml

Five seconds it took me to come up with this one, which I've read before. It's accurate. The Bushes are monsters. We in Texas have been plagued with them ever since George H.W. drove down from Kennebunkport and leased a P.O. box in Houston so he could run for office here. The Bushes may have plans to stop your clock, but it has nothing to do with serving Jesus.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: M.Ted
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 03:09 AM

Tom DeLay was their main point man in Washington, and he is no more. Even still, their are lots of other congressmen who welcome these folks by the bus-load. A lot of us were thinking that this was the reason behind the Iraqi Invasion--and it still looks more like we are headed for the final conflict than I am comfortable with--

A lot of these fundamentalists have been enthusiastically investing in Israel, traveling there, and encouraging Israel to more and more agressive actions--The Israelis have not yet figured out that these friendly folk actually expect them to be anihilated, and the sooner the better.

Google "End Times", or "End of Times" and you will do better, "Endtime" is not used by anyone, except your documentary producers.

For an Islamic perspective, (they are waiting for Al Mahdi)--Google "Hayun Yahya" who reminds us "The Last Hour will not come before there come forth thirty Dajjals (imposters), each presenting himself as an apostle of God. (Sunan Abu Dawud)" So we've got some time, depending, anyway, on who you want to count.

My consolation is that these folks are dull witted bunglers, who screw up everything that they try-- if they actually try to bring about the Armageddon, we can rest easy--if they come up with a peace plan, then you should worry--

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Paul Burke
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 04:34 AM

Let's get this above the line- a song challenge, write an apocalypso!

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: pdq
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 10:46 AM

Come Mr. tally man
Tally me imposters
Forth thirty Dajjals
Gotta go home.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Wesley S
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 12:35 PM

"Don't they know it's the end of the world,
It ended when you said goodbye"

Thanks - now I have that Skeeter Davis song running around in my head.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 12:57 PM

The scenario including the rapture was an invention of an English Protestant in the 1890's.

It included illustrations!

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 01:14 PM

Just to help you recall all the words . . . .

Skeeter Davis

Why does the sun go on shining?
Why does the sea rush to shore?
Don't they know it's the end of the world,
'Cause you don't love me any more?

Why do the birds go on singing?
Why do the stars glow above?
Don't they know it's the end of the world.
It ended when I lost your love.

I wake up in the morning and I wonder,
Why everything's the same as it was.
I can't understand. No, I can't understand,
How life goes on the way it does.

Why does my heart go on beating?
Why do these eyes of mine cry?
Don't they know it's the end of the world.
It ended when you said goodbye.

Why does my heart go on beating?
Why do these eyes of mine cry?
Don't they know it's the end of the world.
It ended when you said goodbye.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 01:17 PM

Kingdom Coming : The Rise of Christian Nationalism, by Michelle Goldberg. Very highly recommended, even if it is a bit scary.

There are certain things that you can't simply write off as a "conspiracy theory."

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 01:19 PM

'There are certain things that you can't simply write off as a "conspiracy theory."'

Wanna bet? This is Mudcat.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 01:26 PM

Heck, the End Times/Apocalypse/Rapture has occured already. Pick one:

ca. 2800 BC         
634 BC         
389 BC         
1st Century         
ca. 70         
2nd Century         
247         
380         
Late 4th Century         
500         
Apr 6, 793         
800
806         
848         
Mar 25, 970         
992         
995         
1000         
1033         
1184         
Sep 23, 1186         
1260         
1284         
1290         
1306         
1335         
1367         
1370         
1378         
Feb 14, 1420         
ca. 1504         

Feb 1, 1524         
Feb 20, 1524         
1525         
1528         
May 27, 1528         
1532         
1533         
Oct 19, 1533         
Apr 5, 1534         
1537         
1544         
Jul 22, 1556         
Apr 28, 1583         
1584         
1588         
1600         
1603         
1623         
Feb 1, 1624         
1648         
1654         
1656         
1657         
1658         
1660         
1673         
1688         
1689         
1694         
Fall 1694         
1697         
1700         

That's only as far as 1700 CE. You'd think it would be enough, but it wasn't....

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 03:22 PM

Why, there's no END to it!

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: bobad
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 04:05 PM

You can hear the lovely Skeeter singing it here.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: bobad
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 04:09 PM

Oops - that didn't work, you'll have to access it from here

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Becca72
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 04:19 PM

Guest 11:55 - Just to defend Kennebunkport (me being a Mainer) GHWB is actually from Milton Mass....

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 04:25 PM

"People just don't want to believe it because it is a 'conspiracy theory'.

If you want to see how rank it gets, check out the 'controlled demolition' thread"


People ONLY want to believe it because it is a conspiracy theory.

If you want to see how rank it gets, check out the "controlled demolition" thread.

When the time comes, it comes.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 05:36 PM

Awesome.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 05:42 PM

One question: When was the half-time show?

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 05:58 PM

Haven't you heard of "The Middle Ages"? So, if that was the middle someone must know when the end is going to be, right?

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 06:41 PM

Well, GUEST, I'm pretty sure that in Russia in 1917 while the Red Army was gathering around the Winter Palace, or when the little German paperhanger with the postage-stamp mustache and his buddies gathered in the beer gardens in the early Thirties and made plans, there were other people sitting around superciliously and smugly saying, "Oh, that's just another of those idiotic conspiracy theories."

There are, indeed, some idiotic conspiracy theories out there. But sometimes there are real conspiracies. If you pay attention, you can usually tell the difference. Try reading the book I recommended and see what you think.

I've talked with some of these "Christian Nationalists" and listened to what they've had to say, and they're pretty damned frank about what they plan to do. So in a sense, it's not exactly what you could call a big secret. Ms. Goldberg knows what she's talking about.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 07:58 PM

I don't doubt that, what with all the help they have in the White House.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 08:16 PM

When you consider that fascism consists of a unity of major corporations with the power of government (Benito Mussolini's definition, and he oughta know) in combination with the number of "born again" Christian Nationalists in the White House and making up most of the president's cabinet, we seem to have a fair potential for a pretty icky future unless we get off our butts and do something about it.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Sep 06 - 09:33 PM

Kennebunkport is where the Bushes flush their toilets. That makes them yours.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Sep 06 - 03:17 PM

"I've talked with some of these "Christian Nationalists" and listened to what they've had to say, and they're pretty damned frank about what they plan to do. So in a sense, it's not exactly what you could call a big secret. Ms. Goldberg knows what she's talking about."

I am he you seem to be lecturing. FYI, I have noted many times on this forum that the term New World Order has been around for about one hundred years. That there is in fact a conspiracy is beyond reasonable doubt. That Bush is on the fringes of it is also beyond doubt. (He is too stupid to be 'in charge' of anything, IMO.)

So, what's the organization that Paul Wolfowitz is heading now?

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Don Firth
Date: 19 Sep 06 - 03:35 PM

Well, not really lecturing anybody, GUEST. Just making observations for anyone who might wish to consider them.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Sep 06 - 03:44 PM

Same as everyone else here. Keep at it, Don.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Becca72
Date: 19 Sep 06 - 04:59 PM

Sorry, Guest 9:33 but since he headed to Texas shortly after graduating from Yale and merely has a summer/retirement home in Maine, he's YOUR problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Wesley S
Date: 19 Sep 06 - 05:20 PM

No Becca - that makes him a Yankee Carpetbagger.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 20 Sep 06 - 09:00 AM

So if the new world order has been around since just before the first world war, is it new any more?

And if the middle ages were the half time interval, when did we start counting. Any particular prophets birthday? The first modern humans? The   formation of the planet. I can live with that last one....

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Sep 06 - 09:29 AM

Well, that's just it. Nobody told us what the starting point was.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST,Mrr
Date: 20 Sep 06 - 12:31 PM

Non Sequitur cartoon - The World Has Ended. You're In Denial.

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Sep 06 - 03:23 PM

So much for "World without end".

Subject: RE: BS: Apocalypse Now , Endtime
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Sep 06 - 02:41 AM

Becca92...Bush won't be Texas' problem much longer. His "ranch" at Crawford is just storefront dressing with a few hay bales thrown around for atmosphere. He'll be going back to Maine once his term as seat-warmer is over. None too soon. Hopefully we'll be the ones to incarcerate him though, when the truth about 9-11 breaks over Joe 6-pack. I hope bush is at the ranch on that day. Now THAT would make up for Waco.

The Bushes moved into Texas in the 50's. They helped the Nazi looters of Europe relocate to South America, and that loot had to be put to good use, so it was channeled into the oil business, a lot of which is centered around Midland. That's why people think the Bushes are from Texas. They'd jet down here from Maine to meet with the representatives from the Nazi war criminals in South America, and they'd put those gold fillings from European Jews into new oil enterprises. What a bunch of pussycats...such nice people to have running our govt. So anyway, a Bush was bundled off to Texas and a Bush was sent to Florida, because those are key drug-trafficking states, too. Now the Bushes control the two primary points of entry for their cocaine from South America. They just got the poppies growing in Afghanistan again, too, so life is good for them. Except for that Sept 11 thing. GW's going to take the fall for that, and like I say, I hope the arrest warrant is issued when he's in Crawford. I'd gladly be cannon fodder in that episode. I hope the good folks of Maine are like-minded.