Not Music-Sheepskins

Subject: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 05:54 PM

I appreciate I am leaving myself wide open to derision and very crude jokes, but I really do need help on this one.
Next week, I will be given 2 jacob sheepskins. Fresh. I want to cure them, the sheepskins, the sheep will be in the freezer, past saving. I have read some stuff on the subject.
Where in the UK can I buy the equipment and chemicals I need? Has anyone ever done this? and were the results good?
Thanking you in anticipation., Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: MMario
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 05:57 PM

I have had good results with just salt and alum - though it did take forever to soften the skin once cured and dried....

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Amergin
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 06:12 PM

Nothing like a good sheepskin to get me aroused.....My girlfriend gets me hot just by wearing her jammies that have pictures of sheep all over them....

Amergin

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: DougR
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 07:08 PM

Hmmm, Amergin, you ever consider becoming a shephard? You could be in "hog" heaven, so to speak. Just you, acres of green grass, and a whole herd of sexy sheep all to yourself! **BG**

DougR

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 31 Oct 00 - 07:31 PM

Been there, done this, many times.

LUCKY YOU!!! It is considered quite a gift, among sheep people, to give a pelt, and in a way, even more so when given in this state of rawness-- at least here. It says that you are part of the family, for these are usually family gifts unless you have bought the sheep for meat. Giving it to you raw says that you are one of the people-- that you will know what to do and not be grossed out. It says that you are a person who knows how the world is. It's like when our neighbor and landlord, whose father Hardiman had buried that year, dropped a freshly killed and gutted deer on the lawn and drove off. It says, "You are one of us."

Be sure the slaughterer knows you want these pelts (proper term) with the heads removed. If you don't specify, you can get a surprise. When pelts go to commercial tanners, the faces are left on and sometimes, for small lambs, the whole head. You don't want this looking up at you. (Or maybe you do!) However, if they remove the heads, they may not cut the pelt attractively. Be sure they know these are for decorative purposes. Commercial pelts, which the tanner usually sells as a cost-recovery item in bulk, are turned into paint roller covers and looks are not an issue, so the slaughterers usually just slash and toss.

If you want to cure it well enough to send to a tanner, which I STRONGLY recommend, you spread them out wool side down, and see if all the fat and flesh are off. If not, scrape. Don't make or enlarge any holes.

Then you take them to a nice airy place where they won't freeze but will be cool. Upper part of a barn works well, or in an empty stall if it's dry and stays that way. In your house is OK too if you have space in an attic. The smell is much less than you might expect. Don't pick a rat-laden area; but a few mice are OK because the salt will discourage them. I used my storage closet in the apartment building's laundry room once.

Get a whole lot of salt. In the USA, that would be kosher pickling salt. Maybe 3 pounds per pelt. It varies. Get too much, not too little, although you can always go back for more. (Not kosher for any reason except that's how pickling salt comes here.) This is coarser and cheaper than table salt but not nearly as coarse as rock salt, you know, road salt. If you just can't find this, table salt will work fine, non-iodized if possible. I suppose you could splurge on sea salt. Whatever.

You sprinkle the salt liberally all over the flesh side, wool side still down, and work it in with your hands a bit. Wear rubber gloves or it will hurt your hands. After this is done, sprinkle on an even layer all over and leave it. It will draw the juices up into the salt and make it wet. Add more. Check every day and add more to the wet spots till it stays dry, and by now it should have a sparkly crust. Leave it that way for as long as it takes for it all to dry. You will know it is dry because it will be stiff and much lighter in weight than it was fresh, even with all the salt which may be an inch thick by now, or more. This will take weeks, not days.

To send it to the tanner-- and I recommend driving if possible to see what the tanner is all about, and to be sure you wiull get your OWN pelts back again-- shake off the crust and brush off the remaining salt lightly. If shipping in a box, pack it loosely enough that any remaining moisture has some air. Don't fold it either, it may crack and then get caught in the tanning machinery.

If it has any holes, tell the tanner so they handle it well. Some will not take pelts with any holes or rips. Also discuss with them about trimming the pelt if necessary. Some of the wool is awfully coarse and you may want it off-- when sheep are shorn, this is called "skirting" the pelt, to remove the coarse and dirty underbelly part of the fleece. Same with your pelt. Also you may like the short, fine fuzz around the armpits and leg pits, or you may want to cut around these. You will have to decide how "finished" you want the thing to look. It's fine to trim once tanned, also, but if there are pieces hanging off here or there, trim.

Oh I forgot to tell you about the anuses!! (It's been awhile!!) They may have these still attached (just the hole, from being pulled off instead of cut off the carcass). Or they may have been cut around. If not cut, you cut, so they don't catch in the tanning. Just make a nice line. You will find that the dry pelt cuts very easily, almost too easily. Cut as little as possible.

You can have it tanned regular or waterproof. Waterproof is if you will want to be able to wash it. If not, plan on taking it to the leather cleaners. You will probably NOT want to wash it yourself anyway, but waterproof is nice because things WILL happen to it, and you will also want to be able to take it outside and sit on the ground on it.

If the wool is very long it is more likely to mat in the tanning process. If it had been shorn at some point in the last year, this should be no problem. It's the lifers who mat the worst. Another reason to know your tanner, so they know it is important to you that they minimize this.

The person I got mine from explained all this to me and helped me the first time. Hopefully the person you get yours from will too. It's easy but sounds complicated. It is well worth the cost to pay a tanner for the quality you will get. And they last forever.

PM me with any questions when you have it "in hand" if you like! Have fun! Enjoy them! I know you'll do 'em proud!

~Susan

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 03:42 AM

Thank you so much, Praise, I am very clear now about the first stage, and I can do that. Unfortunately, I don't think that we have tanners locally, though I will check, so, MMario, what do I do with the Alum, and where do I get it?
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 07:59 AM

Ll,

Ask your local sheep people who tans for them? Ask the slaughterhouse who buys pelts from them?

Here, there are associations for sheep people, for referrals.

What kind of sheep are these pelts going to be from? Breed type and color? Long or short wool?

Got me jealous!

~S~

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: SINSULL
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 08:52 AM

The first parody of "Martha" magazine included a section on slaughtering, skinning and tanning sheep. She of course had multiple uses for every part and complete instructions on making sheepskin condoms. I'll see if I still have a copy. Praise, I never thought of you as the "Martha Stewart" type. You never cease to amaze.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 11:46 AM

They are Jacobs sheep, Praise, multicoloured and longhaired. Does the long wool make a difference?
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: sian, west wales
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 11:59 AM

Bron, you might try talking to the people at St. Fagans (OK - Welsh Museum of Folk Life to be correct). They might know of some small scale artisan types ...

sian

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: MMario
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 12:04 PM

In your part of the world, I believe you would get alum at the "chemists" - I'd go to a drug store...*grin* it is a common, inexpensive chemical.

These directions are for a cleaned fresh skin, or if you have previously salted it according to Praise's very explicit instructions above , then brush off the salt and soak in cool water until soft before you begin this stage

SALT AND ALUM TANNAGE

This is an old, widely used method for fur skin tanning. When properly carried out, it produces skins with stretch and flexibility. It often happens, however, that alum-tanned skins come out stiff and hard and must be worked repeatedly and sometimes retanned.

1. Prepare a salt-alum tanning solution:

Dissolve 1 lb ammonia alum or potash alum in 1 gal water. Dissolve 4 oz washing soda (crystallized sodium carbonate) and 8 oz salt in 1/2 gal water. Pour the soda-salt solution very slowly into the alum solution while stirring vigorously.

2. Immerse the skin in the tanning solution for 2-5 days, depending upon its thickness.

OR

Apply the liquor as a paste. Because alum affects some furs, it may be best to apply the tanning liquor as a paste to the flesh side only.

Mix the tanning liquor with sufficient flour to make a thin paste, adding the flour in small quantities with a little water and mixing thoroughly to avoid lumps.

Spread the skin so it lies smoothly and tack down, flesh side up. Using a brush or scraper knife, coat the skin with paste about 1/8" thick. Let stand until the next day.

The next day, scrape off most of the paste and apply another coating. Apply two or three coatings at daily intervals. Only thick skins should need as many as three treatments. Leave the last coating on for 3-4 days.

Scrape off the paste.

3. Rinse the hide clean in a gallon of water containing about 1 oz borax. Rinse again in clear water. Put the skin on a smooth board and use a dull edge to press out most of the water.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 12:05 PM

Bron, the long hair will matter if it is long when you receive it. If it is long and soft, it will mat in commecial tanning unless you find a specialist who knows how to handle it. So it may be worth the hard work of tanning it yourself to keep it from matting, and I am not sure you would salt-dry it first in that case.

Sounds like quite a gift. What do the people giving it suggest?

SINSULL, no Martha Stewart here, and not the Biblical one either. Just an old putterer. Although I did raise hens that lay those green eggs Martha's birds lay. But I did mine before she made hers famous.

Besides, would Martha point out that the anuses make lovely holes by which to hang the finished pelt? Hmm. Maybe she would. But I'd call them a**holes, and I don't think she would. (I was just being polite cuz I don't know Bron too well yet.)

~S~

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: MMario
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 12:15 PM

oops! forgot this stage;

OILING AND FINISHING

Let the wet, tanned leather dry somewhat. While it is still quite damp, apply a coating of suitable fat liquor oil (such as neatsfoot oil). The amount of oil required will vary depending upon the natural oiliness of the skin. For instance, a raccoon skin, which is naturally very oily, will require proportionately less oil than a deer hide.

1. Make the fat liquor oil by mixing 3 1/2 oz of neatsfoot oil with 3 1/2 oz of warm water; add 1 oz household ammonia. This fat liquor solution is for a 10-pound deer hide. Adjust the proportions for smaller hides.

2. Place the hide on a flat surface hair side down. Apply part of the fat liquor solution to a portion of the hide and spread it evenly with a paint brush or your hand. Continue until one-half the solution has been applied to the hide. Allow the hide to stand for 30 minutes, then apply the remainder of the oil in the same way.

3. Cover the hide with a sheet of plastic and let stand overnight. If several skins are fat-liquored at one time, they may be piled flesh side to flesh side.

4. The next day, drape the skin, hair side out, over a pole or sawhorse and allow the hair to dry. Use an electric fan to speed the drying.

5. Nail the skin, flesh side up, to a plywood board, stretching the skin slightly. Space the nails (no. 6 finish) every 5 or 6" around the circumference and about 1/2" from the edge. Dry the flesh side at room temperature.

6. When the skin is nearly dry but still slightly damp, work the skin in all directions, stretching it from corner to corner and working the flesh side over a stake or a wooden edge, such as the back of a chair or piece of board clamped in a vise.

Success in producing a soft skin lies in repeated working, which must be done while the skin is drying out, not after it is dry. This process may be repeated several times if necessary; simply dampen the hide evenly and work it again while it dries.

7. After the skin has been softened and dried, give it a hasty bath in white or unleaded gasoline, especially if the skin is too greasy. This bath also helps to deodorize some skins, such as skunk.

CAUTION: Gasoline is extremely flammable and should be used outdoors away from fire or flame.

8. To clean and brighten the fur, tumble it repeatedly in dry, warm sawdust - preferably hardwood sawdust. Bran or cornmeal may also be used. Clean the particles out of the fur by gently shaking, beating, combing, and brushing the fur.*

*I have a brother in law who does this literally - covers the pelt with cornmeal, puts it in the clothes dryer on "tumble" (air only, no heat) and runs it through a couple of cycles

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 07:39 PM

Thanks a lot, folks, I've got a good idea of what i'm doing now, and I'll let you know how I get on.
Praise, I used to be in social work, and before that in residential care. I know all about anuses in their infinite variety!!
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 07:47 PM

I would not use sawdust, bran, or cornmeal on wool. Really. It will work down to the base and stick there and make for itchiness.

Bron, if you try MMario's route I hope you'll have help! And I hope you are a big strong girl!

(MMArio, why does she not send us two tickets to come over?? Two wild and-a crrrazy guys!)

Oh-- Bron! May all your anuses be hung on walls! *G*

Let us know what you do!! I feel like a strange kind of godmother to your little lammies!!

~Susan

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: SINSULL
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 09:20 PM

Gives a whole new meaning to "I'll nail your ass to the wall!" Sorry, folks. I couldn't help it.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: CamiSu
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 11:09 PM

Llanfair

I raise sheep and send all my pelts to be tanned. My tanners instructions are just a bit different than Susan's. When the sheep is skinned try to have them fist the skin off rather than using a knife. Also if you are worried about scraping, do less rather than more. The tanner is going to do a final scrape anyway, and s/he will know how to not take too much. After salting, let dry about 3 days, preferably at a bit of an angle so the moisture runs off. After that remove the (quite damp) salt and resalt. After about a week it will be dry and you can shake the salt off. One thing Susan didn't mention is the tail, which my butcher always leaves on. Tanners prefer they be removed. As far as long wool goes, many tanners now paint the solutions onto the skins so the wool doesn't end up being soaked, but either way they usually don't have too much trouble with long wool. My tanner charges me an extra $5 for long wool and I've sent him pelts with 14" wool on them. He grumbles but does a beautiful job. I reccommend the washable tan as you can then clean these babies yourself. (If the wool is too long to consider putting them in the washing machine, you can stomp on them in the tub, but you rarely need to wash them anyway.) If you can't find anyone over there to do this let me know as I use a guy in Maine and DON'T reccommend the guy in Bucks County PA. Don't let them hang arpound too lond as they will attract beetles which will eat holes in the pelt. Think two or three times about doing it yourself as the biggest problem (besides the mess) is wool slippage, and they don't look qquite so nice when the wool falls off...

Have fun and enjoy them. They will last about forever.

PS Jessica has a few of mine in St. Andrews that I sent over for her to sell at a Beltane Fest. I think she uses them for furniture instead.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: catspaw49
Date: 01 Nov 00 - 11:19 PM

Had to say it huh Sins?

Everytime I read this thread title I keep thinking its about people WITHOUT a music degree.........Which would be most of us around here. We ought to start a thread on "Most Worthless Sheepskins (Degrees)".......I know several of us have them in Philosophy.....me, Bill D., Max......and I think a case could be made for us to be the contest winners, especially Bill and I.

Spaw

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 12:08 AM

CamiSu-- you have a jewel of a tanner. What breed do you raise?

Funny you mention the tails. Hardi and I were doing a late run to WalMart and I was telling him about this thread, and about the anuses-- and I said, of course, then there are the tails... so I came to have a word about those!

I'd sure love to see your setup. Pictures??

~Susan

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: DougR
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 02:05 AM

Don't be too sure, Spaw, my degree is in Physcial Education.

DougR

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Amergin
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 04:55 AM

Now that's a thought, DougR....never thought of trying that one....but maybe in the meantime I might see if Praise still has that anatomically correct inflatable ewe......

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 05:04 AM

I KNEW!!, I KNEW this would happen, "grin".
Any mention of sheep in this forum, and men start putting their wellies on!!!!
Honestly!!!!!
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Amergin
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 05:10 AM

At least it gives you ladies a chance to rest once in a while....

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Naemanson
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 08:06 AM

My history degree has an infinite variety of uses. I can use it as a placemat for the table, it's useful for calling a moose (roll it into a cone and grunt through it), I can fold it into a (small) hat, etc.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 02:42 PM

Amergin,

Hi!!! I missed ewe!

Let's write a song next week, huh???

~S~

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Gypsy
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 10:21 PM

There is a book (which line always makes my husband panic, looking at the overstuffed bookshelves reaching the ceiling) Tan Your Hide, by Rodale press. I've used it, and many of the difffering tanning recipes. For any leather you might possibly want to wash, ever, use Gluraltehyde (sp?) it's the one that leaves the suede a rather yellowish colour. Last place I found it was in Canada, but has been a while. I really don't recommend alum on large hides, cuz it leaves them really hard to work into softness. Or maybe i'm a wuss. Freeze the things until you decide whether to do it yourself, or hire a tanner. A whole sheepskin is a very ambitious first project. Before tackling that, find some rabbit skins. (at the local butcher) and try that. You can generally get them for free. It is a good way to practice.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Gypsy
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 10:36 PM

Oh yeah, (never post once, if you can do it twice, i always say) if you really and truly want to practice, start with plain leather. It is much easier to work than fur, cuz you can break the fibres on BOTH side over your stake. With fur, you can only do the one side, and takes much more muscle.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: CamiSu
Date: 02 Nov 00 - 11:24 PM

Susan,

I have a flock of cross breeds, Clun ForestxKarakulx Romney. I am adding Churro in this year. I get two 'types' right now, VERY black long curly wool which goes to a silver overcoat, and more brown, thick, no long overcoat. And in the spring a bunch of black lambs! If you come up to Vermont you're welcome to come for a stay. My tanner is Moosehead in Greenville, Maine. The couple that had it for several years found a good guy to sell it to, and I've been really happy with the work. The guy in PA trashed a bunch of pelts I sent him and then had the gall to tell me they all lost their wool because the sheep 'were slaughtered while they were shedding!'

Amergin, I don't know what you're talking about. I do at LEAST half the chores with the sheep and all the lambing...

Cami Su

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 03 Nov 00 - 05:11 AM

CamiSu, Clun is only a few miles from here, and the sheep are lovely. One of my fantasies is to have a couple of acres locally to keep sheep and a couple of goats. Cluns are high on my wish list.
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 04:06 AM

So we'll have something to snuggle into next year then eh?

Good luck, and I hope your neighbours are complacent about pongs....

LTS

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: CamiSu
Date: 04 Nov 00 - 08:35 PM

Llanfair,

Yes, Cluns are quite lovely. and very efficient meatwise if that is your bent. However, I do love my crosses, tall and leggy and SUCH LONG WOOL! I will try to get photos...

CamiSu

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 08 Nov 00 - 03:37 PM

The fleeces arrived today, four of them, and they are quite small and manageable. I'm washing the blood and gunge off them, and salting them tomorrow. No heads, thank goodness, nicely done, in fact. I'm washing two in the bath, and two on a delicate cycle of the washing machine.
The ones in the bath show an uncanny resemblance, when glimpsed out of the corner of the eye, to a Dulux dog.
Cheers, Bron.
PS. It says in the books I've read that, if I make a mess of it, they compost beautifully!!!

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 08 Nov 00 - 03:50 PM

Good luck!

~S~

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Nov 00 - 07:25 PM

Arrrggghhh - first it was two sheepskins and now four. Make it three and you have got a music link. Particularly if the three sheepskins are quite jolly looking....

Find a Morris dancer if you don't get it....

Dave the dancing Gnoame

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: rangeroger
Date: 09 Nov 00 - 12:11 AM

Spaw,

my degree in Psychology enabled me to become a park ranger and then a lift operator at a ski resort. Now I've parlayed it into being an apprentice electrician.

rr

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: CamiSu
Date: 09 Nov 00 - 08:23 PM

Llanfair, I've never washed before salting...but I would think you want to have the wool as dry as possible before you salt or you could rot it. If you have an old bedframe you don't care about you might put them on it, though take care you don't put rustmarks on the wool. So are you going to do this yourself?

CamiSu

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: CamiSu
Date: 09 Nov 00 - 08:27 PM

PS 'Spaw, the letters after my name are N.D.G.A. (No degree, good anyway)

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Gypsy
Date: 09 Nov 00 - 11:30 PM

Shedding sheep? Now i've heard ALL the specious excuses!

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 10 Nov 00 - 03:50 AM

Yes, I'm doing this myself. I had to rinse them because the blood was driving the dogs crazy. I spun them in the machine before I dealt with them.
I have to go away for a few days, so I needed to get them salted asap. They are outdoors, but under cover and tilted so that they drain.
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 30 Jan 01 - 11:53 AM

They are nearly finished. I scraped off the salt and the fat, and ran each one through the washing machine as it was cleaned. The first one, a Jacob's, I dried too quickly, the rest are now drying slowly with a coat of neatsfoot oil compound on the skin.
When the wool is brushed out, they look wonderful, and the stiffness is ideal for rugs.
When I made enquiries about local tanners, I found that the beautiful Anglesey sheepskins on sale in the Celtic shop in Welshpool, (£40) are sent to Spain to be tanned, because of our laws about pouring nasty substances down the drain.
I shall continue to use the same method as this time, I think.
Thanks for all the advice, folks.
Cheers, Bron.
PS, anyone want a sheepskin rug later in the year? Reasonable prices.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Jan 01 - 12:45 PM

You know, I actually had been wondering what was happening with this!! LOL!

I'm really concerned about the washing machine part, so I'd suggest you take these slow till you see how they hold up with the treatment you're using. But if this process works, you could be turning out quite a few of these. How about donating one to the Auction?

You know, some kind of marketing hook how it improves the musicianship to sit on them while playing...

Gee, some people sell CDs when they go a-gigging, this could be... wow!

~S~

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: MMario
Date: 30 Jan 01 - 01:27 PM

Did you just salt and oil? or what?

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 30 Jan 01 - 05:08 PM

Yup, salt and neatsfoot compound. And they are fine, honest!!!!!
I wonder what a "neat" is, and why it only has oil in it's foot?
WYSIWYG, are you worried about the skin or the washing machine? I use it to dye stuff, wash anything that I can get in there, and clean up my trainers. It's accustomed to hard work!!!!
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Jan 01 - 06:56 PM

Bron, I'm worried about the skin, and wool "slippage" which means wool fluffing off over time because the foillicles have gotten, I dunno, yanked too hard or too wet and rotted... Something in my memory is tugging at me that these are not supposed to get so wet.

And neatsfoot without tanning? Won't it rot? I know neatsfoot on tanned leather will let it rot eventually...

I'm worrying over your lovely sheepskins because what you did sounds so different from what I have been assured must be done. May be fine. But... well, may not!

~Susan (AKA Praise, I had a name change)

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 31 Jan 01 - 03:47 AM

Susan, I understand what you are saying. I did lose a few tufts on the edge where there wasn't enough salt, and it was wet for the 3 months, and I've learned from that.
The neatsfoot oil compound states on the can that is is a preservative, and should be applied regularly.
Most of the books I have read say that they can be machine washed. I think it is long-term wetness that causes slippage, but I'll keep checking them.
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 31 Jan 01 - 10:54 AM

I have heard of machine-washing wool, when a shorn fleece is cleaned... or washing hides tanned so as to be safe to wash... but I have never heard of washing before tanning. So that's why I am wondering.

Maybe I am just having trouble believing it can be that easy!

I do hope they turn out well-- I don't mean to be a party pooper.

~Susan

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: MMario
Date: 31 Jan 01 - 10:59 AM

washing a hide prior to tanning might slow down the salting process - as that is essentially to draw moisture out of the hide. but it can certainly be done.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 31 Jan 01 - 11:41 AM

MMario, I think it's obvious that we just want to go OVER there. You get the tickets, OK?

~S~

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: GUEST,LynnT
Date: 31 Jan 01 - 11:44 AM

I learned how to tan furs from a buckskinner (18th-cent historical reenactor) in Indiana a few years back, and practised on a variety of roadkill, from Bambi to raccoons to an unclaimed and collarless Golden Retriever. Here's the mix I use:

1 gal distilled water to 1 pound non-iodized salt to 4 oz battery acid.

This makes an odorless buffered acid solution safe to dabble in with your bare hands, but strong enough to cure hides in about 3 weeks. Works between 40 degrees (F) and about 85 degrees.

Mix the salt and water in a large non-metallic tub or drum. (I usually made four gallons at a time, because that would accommodate the 16-oz containers that battery acid comes in at my local auto-parts store. Keep the empty water bottles and refill them with tap water to use as weights tokeep your furs underwater.) Slowly pour in the acid, stirring constantly -- again, with something nonmetallic like a big stick. It's exothermic at this stage. When cool, add the skins; pull them out at intervals to scrape.

When cured, rinse and spread to dry; I rub lanolin or neatsfoot oil mix in to supple them when completely dry.

By the way, a "neat" is a generic term for cattle, so this is oil extracted from the hooves and lower legs of cows.

Hope this helps/isn't too late...

Lynn

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: wysiwyg
Date: 31 Jan 01 - 11:51 AM

Can you use Coca Cola instead of battery acid? I hear that can be sued for almost anything!

Funny, neatsfeet. I been around them critters, and they's feet ain't that neat!

~S~

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 31 Jan 01 - 12:00 PM

Lynne, I'm still thinking about the battery acid method, but my major concern is how to dispose of it afterwards.
I can't bury it in a hole in the wilderness, 'cos there's not a lot of wilderness in Wales, and it would get into the rivers. As I said before, it can't go down the drains, either.
Susan and MMario, I'll get the kettle on ready for your arrival!!!!
Cheers, Bron.

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: mousethief
Date: 31 Jan 01 - 12:06 PM

If it's acid, can't you just mix it with a base (say, baking soda) and neutralize it, then dispose of it? Or am I missing something here?

Alex

Subject: RE: Not Music-Sheepskins
From: Llanfair
Date: 31 Jan 01 - 04:09 PM

I'm a bit thick when it comes to chemistry, but that sounds like a straightforward way of dealing with it. Alkaline neutralises acid, right?
Cheers, Bron.