Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards

Subject: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Feb 11 - 05:37 PM

Best Band and Best Live Band (for the 6th time I believe).
Congratulations

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 09:44 AM

Well deserved. Best live band I've ever seen by a long way

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,steve th
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 09:50 AM

but rather predictable, they seem to win every year. a great live band but there are other bands out there just as great that never even get a nomination never mind the award.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Alex
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 11:08 AM

Like who, Steve? Who are the bands just as great as Bellowhead who never get nominations, let alone awards?

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: squeezeboxhp
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 11:16 AM

Steamchicken
Peeping Tom
for 2

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Tim
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 11:19 AM

Going off on a slight tangent, I heard from a rather reliable source that they're going to re-record the theme tune to the Archers as part of the 60th anniversary celebrations. I wonder how popular that will make them?

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 11:23 AM

You know the BBC banned Best Live Act from being a public voted award because Show of Hands 'would just keep winning it'...as Mel, the Smooth Ops host of the F&A Board told everyone. There was a huge outcry of disgust from some of the Traddies when SoH *did* win, amidst accusations of vote rigging too, as they have such a large fan base...

I took this to task, stating that bands who have such a large fan base do so for a particular reason, and that is that they're very popular and appreciated by many folks, so therefore, they deserve to win.

But nope, out went the public vote after just ONE year...Yup, the FIRST ever public vote, Show of Hands won it...and those in control and I do mean ****CONTROL**** of the Folk Awards banned the public vote there and then...

Now of course, the band beloved by Those in Control of the Folk World 'just keep winning and winning' every year...and blow me down, no-one says a word about it....

One rule for the public and Show of Hands...and one rule for Those in Control and Bellowhead.

It's why I don't give a flying fiddle about The Folk Awards any longer because the whole thing is, in my humble personal opinion rigged and deeply incestuous.

I do acknowledge that Show of Hands *have* won many awards, but it's the 'year after year after year' handouts that I'm talking about...

Heyho...

Personally, I think The Duncan McFarlane Band should win Best Live Act and/or Best Band...and they are WAY overdue to win it too..but how the fiddle are other bands EVER going to get a chance when the same old same old keep on getting there, voted in by the cronies who run the show and adore their prodiges?

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 11:28 AM

'Prodigies, Promises & Prizes'

A good name for a Folk Awards CD one year, possibly, maybe..brought to you by Incestuously Smoothly Done Operations Inc.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 11:45 AM

Bellowhead are indeed fine musicians but I can't stand them.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 11:46 AM

just curious.. how many of Bellowhead are ex-public school.. ???

not that it means anything at the BBC..

or any awards nominations..


or anything..


errrmmm...


maybe they all went to ruff 'n' tuff comprehensives.. ???

or were even 'excluded' street urchins...

beating up posh kids and mugging them for their trombones and violins.....

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: SteveMansfield
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 12:01 PM

Well done to Andy Cutting for the Musician Of The Year award (2nd time).

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,S.T.M.
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 12:06 PM

Err, punkfolkrocker...what has that got to do with anything? Even if they were all bought up with silver spoons in their mouths (which, I don't know if they were or not) but, why would it matter if they were?

Seems like a bizarre and prejudiced comment to make.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 12:12 PM

nah.. just cheeky & mischievous..

I really like Bellowhead..

but then again, I passed the '11 plus' for all the good it did me..

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Ian Hendrie
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 12:16 PM

I'm getting a bid fed up with negativity and rants about Show of Hands so I'd just like to say I really like Bellowhead and am looking forward to seeing them at Buxton in a week or so's time.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Chris Murray
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 12:32 PM

I like Bellowhead. They are the best live band that I've seen in many a year. I was glad they won but there was a little part of me that would have liked to see Fiddlers Bid win. They're very exciting on stage but I don't think that many people outside Scotland will have seen them. We had to go to Shetland!

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 01:04 PM

"I'm getting a bid fed up with negativity and rants about Show of Hands so I'd just like to say I really like Bellowhead and am looking forward to seeing them at Buxton in a week or so's time."


Show of Hands just happened to be the band concerned at the time, Ian. I'm not ranting or raging that they didn't win anything. My post would have been exactly the same had Bellowhead won the first public vote, then been told that vote was being removed because 'they'd just keep winning it' due to their large fanbase, had they had the same numerically successful fanbase that the other band had way back then.

Of course, my argument is also that this probably would *never* have happened, because the Bellowhead lads and lassies are totally accepted, supported and much loved by those who control the Folk World.

This is NOT a rant about SoH or anyone else, merely about the crooked and incestuous system that for was too long has dominated the folk world.

If folks are happy to put up with it, fair enough.

Personally, I think it stinks, have been saying so for years, and will continue to say so, because this system is deeply unfair to the huge amount of other folk bands/performers out there who never get a look in because they are outside The Magic Folk Circle....some are new and younger, some have been kept outside for a very long time...and quite simply, in my opinion, that is totally wrong.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 01:16 PM

Agreed fifthwith Lizzie!!

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 01:58 PM

Thanks sfmans - I was at the folk club on Monday evening and missed the news about Andy Cutting (whom I've known since he was at primary school....)

Kitty

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Will Fly
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 02:14 PM

Fiddlers Bid are indeed a superb band - and I had to go up to Alnwick to see them last September.

To be honest, there are so many good folk bands/groupings of one sort or another out there that the whole 'award' schtick just seems utterly irrelevant to me.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: JennyO
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 02:18 PM

Bellowhead and Show of Hands are both exceptional bands, and as far as I am concerned, I'd be happy to see either of them win anything.

I don't know much about the history of these awards and who has won them in the past, but a duo I'd like to see win (if they haven't already) is Belshazzar's Feast. They are also brilliant!

Also well deserved congrats to Eliza and Norma for their award, to Andy Cutting for his, and for James and Nancy for theirs. All wonderful performers.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Chris Murray
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 02:28 PM

I'm also going to see Bellowhead at Buxton and I'm counting off the days.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 02:52 PM

Btw GUEST,S.T.M.

you may or may not find this recent mudcat thread an interesting read..

[just substitute "folk" for "pop".. in this context]


"pop as upper class culture"        


thread.cfm?threadid=135269


"yes m'Lady, just carrying young master Toby's instruments and amp to the stage,
.. prepare a refreshing ice bucket of champers and a freshly laundered towel,
then standby for further orders.
It's a privilege to roadie for such a fine young gentleman from such a good family, Ma'am..."

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: theleveller
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 03:25 PM

Well done yet again to Bellowhead and delighted for Ewan Mclennan - superbly talented man.

I agree with Lizzie that Duncan McFarlane Band are well overdue for an award. They must be Yorkshire's best-kept secret.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: The Awkward Recruit
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 03:55 PM

@JennyO - Belshazzer's Feast were nominated for best duo last year - but lost out to the duo Show of Hands (Steve Knightley, Phil Beer and Miranda Sykes.)

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,lively
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 04:08 PM

lizzie tells an interesting story. Certainly one worth contemplating. Cant be having the common folk having any say in the "folk awards" or any kind of common place comprehensive bred ruffian might be getting awards. Saw the levellers on bbc folk awards, one bit of life among the well bred blandness of the rest of it.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Olive Bennewith
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 04:24 PM

I think Fiddlers' Bid are amazing. They may be touring in England this autumn.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 04:49 PM

Just seeing Chris Wood performing "Hollow Point" put the whole evening in context.
And it was great to see Danny Thompson. Shame he was playing for Donovan though.
Slightly amazed that nobody on this thread has slagged off Kate Rusby yet?
I'll give you time.....

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,guest stan
Date: 09 Feb 11 - 05:05 PM

why did seeing Chris put it all into perspective then Ralphie?

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 04:24 AM

"I agree with Lizzie that Duncan McFarlane Band are well overdue for an award. They must be Yorkshire's best-kept secret"

Thanks, levels..

Their gigs from years back are still fresh in my mind, not only at the first ever Sidmouth Folk Week, where they literally brought the town to LIFE! But in Otley too, at that fabulous gig in the wine bar, which was actually Otley Folk Club...I have NEVER seen so many people crammed into one room to see a band! People of all ages, young and old, all shouting and cheering, bobbing up and down as Duncan and his Band gave the full folk rock version of their repertoire...

It was nothing less than SENSATIONAL and I took as much pleasure from watching the audience react, as I did from watching and hearing the band..One of the best gigs I've ever been to. Just wish I lived closer to them all.

Later in the week we saw a very different band, this time giving their acoustic set...gentle and quiet, lulling their appreciative audience into good places. That was some gig too..and so good was the atmosphere, so friendly and relaxed, that I didn't really want it to end...



I tell you who else is WAY overdue for an Award...Reg Meuross. Reg is not just a highly professional performer, but a wonderous weaver of stories into songs. He's got the magical ability to touch the heart with his words and I fully agree with Mike Harding that Reg is one of the best songwriters this country now has.

This is why I get so angry that the same old same old keep on winning. It's hugely under-representative of the rest of the major talent in the folk world, and it's highly unfair too. I don't think there can actually be any other Award Show where the same people from the same Inner Sacred Circle keep on winning, year after year after year...

And to remove the public vote after the first year, as they did, PURELY because they realised that a band from the Outer Circle would keep winning, more than likely, was preposterous and it showed me in absolutely blinding light how corrupt and controlled the whole Folk Awards system is.

Big Fish in a Small Bowl rule it with an iron fist...and even though some headway has been made, it is not nearly enough.

Any other system that behaved in this way would, I'm more than sure, have a full investigation launched into exactly what's going on, but the folk world seems to be above and beyond all...

I like Bellowhead now and then, but I far prefer Spiers & Boden on their own and find the Bellowhead line-up way over the top at times...I'm afraid I cringed when I saw them last on Jools Holland and I do NOT think they are hugely representative of the magnificent talent which lies within the English Folk World.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 04:27 AM

If I may, I'd like to just put this part in a separate post, as it got lost in my many words above.

"I tell you who else is WAY overdue for an Award...Reg Meuross. Reg is not just a highly professional performer, but a wonderous weaver of stories into songs. He's got the magical ability to touch the heart with his words and I fully agree with Mike Harding that Reg is one of the best songwriters this country now has."

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 10:33 AM

Guest Stan.
Apart from his telling song about the murder in Stockwell 2 years ago. His comment during his acceptance speech included the line "Folk music is the raspberry seed in the back tooth of the establishment" says it all really.
That, and his other writings over many years make him a really worthy winner.
and his comment "Thanks to all that voted for me, and Balls to those that didn't" gives one an idea of someone with a sense of humour.
That's why it was a defining moment for me.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 10:42 AM

And futhermore, anyone who gets Tulse Hill, Brixton and Stockwell into one song gets my vote.
And I wasn't that far away that morning when the murder happened. London.......Doncha love it?
Well done Chris, and thanks for writing the song.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: theleveller
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 11:32 AM

"I tell you who else is WAY overdue for an Award...Reg Meuross"

Agree with you there too, Lizzie. His new CD is his best yet IMO. Plus, he's a really nice bloke. Hope to get to see him and Jackie at The Rock later this year.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 11:40 AM

Just watching Reg and Bethany Porter, levels..coincidence, eh! :0)

'...and Jesus Wept'

I love Bethany's input on this song..sounds lovely.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: alex s
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 12:31 PM

As Will says "there are so many good folk bands/groupings of one sort or another out there that the whole 'award' schtick just seems utterly irrelevant to me"
Spot on, Will

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 12:56 PM

A band with as many members as Bellowhead recording a CD at Abbey Road with veteran producer John Leckie
and "living in beautiful apartments in St John's Wood for two weeks and being able to walk to Studio 2" [Sam Sweeney]
won't have been as 'cheap as chips', and will have to be paid for in full somehow...

So can't really be surprised Bellowhead need to maintain as high a media profile as possible
to try push their products to a mass consumer market..

But that kind of commitment to success has got to involve unenviable levels of pressure and stress
that most folkies would most happily live and perform without..

Just seeing 2 girlfriends at the same time at opposite ends of the country when I was 22
caused outbreaks of eczema and panic attacks..

so be buggered if I could have coped with being hounded by ruthless record company executives & accountants....

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: SteveMansfield
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 03:06 PM

Slightly amazed that nobody on this thread has slagged off Kate Rusby yet?

Ah, Ralphie, everyone's far too busy giving Bellowhead their traditional MudKicking. Withing about four weeks Bellowhead and Kate Rusby are both gracing the stage of the Buxton Opera House and I am looking forward too, and shall no doubt be a very happy punter at both events.

We now return you to our regular programmes ...

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 03:47 PM

Kate Rusby's wonderful. :0)

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 07:14 PM

kate is wonderful but i really didn't like her live song on Monday night,
would have loved to see a live set from SoH and Bellow Head

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Bounty Hound
Date: 10 Feb 11 - 08:18 PM

Don't hold too much with award shows myself, but see them as symptomatic of our celebrity obsessed culture. That said, I'm a charitable soul and would congratulate the winners.

But if Bellowhead are best band, then The Bounty Hounds can be proud of themselves to have had 6 times more plays than Bellowhead on the Rochester Sweeps Myspace page. (and before anyone says, I know it's not a particularly representative sample, but I can dream)

If we have to have these things, it would be good if they were more representative, and I can only agree with the comments above about the Duncan McFarlane band, I had the pleasure of seeing them at Shrewsbury a couple of years ago. My only comment would be that I found Duncan's stage antics a little off-putting and distracted from some excellent music. If they are Yorkshires best kept secret, perhaps the 'Hounds' can stake a claim as East Anglia's best kept secret!

John

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,Folkiedave
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 03:05 AM

I am not defending the folk awards folk awards but:

Ask Ewan McLennan or Moore Moss Rutter in six months time if the award makes any difference. Hands up those people who have actually seen Ewan perform. So young and up and coming artists do get a look in. Ewan is 24.

The last time Norma or Eliza won anything was 2003.

Despite what people say Show of Hands won Best Duo last year - even though they are a trio! They have also won Best original Song, and Best Live Act, in the last ten years. So it doesn't look like they are excluded. The last time Eliza or Norma won an award was 2003.

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 03:38 AM

My point was *not* about Show of Hands being excluded, Dave. Please read my posts again.

It wasn't about them, personally, at all, actually, as whomsoever the band had been, under those circumstances, would, in my opinion, have been equally as unfair.

You can't just 'cancel' a public vote after the first year because those in control didn't like the band that got voted in...??????????

Well, actually, you can. And THEY did.

Now, had Bellowhead been voted in I'm pretty sure the public vote would still be in place to this day. Of course, I could be wrong, but...I doubt it.

Please, do *not* turn this into the usual 'Lizzie Loves SoH!' thread, because that is not the case.

It's the SYSTEM, (imo a very CORRUPT system) and those who run it, that I've been trying to call into question for years and years.

Also, for that same amount of time I've been asking for a list of the 'judges' who make these decisions to be made public, but as far as I'm aware only Ian Anderson of fRoots has been brought out into the open as being on the panel, I think pretty much year after year too.

Surprised? Moi? Non....

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,johnfromstoke
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 04:42 AM

i think lizzie is right in tthat neither showyourhands or belowhead are worthy winners or kate rusby surely a life time achievement award should go to sting?

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: GUEST,S.T.M.
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 05:16 AM

^ I don't think that was the point that Lizzie was trying to make. I think Lizzie was stating that she believes the folk awards to be a corrupt process because, as far as we know, the same panel of people are judges each year and they keep choosing the same acts as winners each time. Lizzie (I think) would rather the folk awards ran on public vote, rather like the Spiral Awards or something similar, so we get a fair representation of who the public deem as worthy winners.

I really don't think any of Lizzie's posts were attacking any band or saying that any band didn't deserve their award- she would have simply like to have seen a fairer process in them obtaining the award.

Also, your comments about Sting- why do you think he is a worthy winner of the lifetime achievement award? I know he has dabbled in folk and has some folk influences, but not as much so some other people. Anyway, I'm pretty sure they have tried to award Sting the lifetime achievement award, but he wouldn't have turned up...they would at least want to give the award to someone who would turn up! In my opinion, the lifetime achievement award should go to someone who has, in their lifetime and over a long period of time, contributed a lot to folk music; not just through music but through writing and programming. A worthy winner, I think, would be Martin Carthy. But that's just me. And I don't think Martin Carthy would pull in public interest, thus the funding wouldn't be as great, thus the awards couldn't be televised...

I would also like to point out that all of my posts are based on my opinions and assumptions. A lot of posters here seem to give the impression that they know what goes on behind the scenes at a more personal level. Maybe they do, but I don't, and I don't want anyone to get confused!

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Abdul The Bul Bul
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 05:20 AM

Ewan McLennan...Faversham Folk Club 23th Feb. Come one come all.
Al

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 05:21 AM

Thank you, STM x

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 05:40 AM

Another reason why Duncan and his Band should be up there in The Folk Awards....

The Duncan McFarlane Band - The Twohey Step

Now, I'm sorry, but can someone please explain to me why Bands as great as this are NOT being even nominated?

If someone 'official' could explain it to me, from the Smooth Ops team that would be even better, or from the fRoots board...that would be good too..

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: theleveller
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 06:09 AM

Duncan McFarlane Band always finish off the Moonbeams Wold Top Festival every year - it's a fantastic finale. This year Oysterband are also at Moonbeams, plus lots of other great artists. AND it's held in a brewery in the middle of the beautiful Yorkshire Wolds. My highlight of the year!

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 06:19 AM

That sounds great! How I envy you living oop north, levels..

Subject: RE: Bellowhead Win at BBC2 Folk Awards
From: Will Fly
Date: 11 Feb 11 - 06:53 AM

Lizzie's point is perfectly valid. If you believe that awards for folk music have any value for the music (I don't personally, but that's just my opinion), then surely those who do believe in it should know (a) who the decision makers are and (b) what criteria are being applied?

So, do the criteria include such things as: sales of albums/downloads? appearances live and/or in the broadcast media? influence on the development of the music? 'popularity' (measured by...)? recommendations by fellow artists? Etc., etc.

I would also say that - contrary to what sfmans believes, this thread is not giving "Bellowhead their traditional Mudkicking". I, like many another poster here, enjoy Bellowhead's music - I have all their CDs - and I don't believe this thread has actually much to do with Bellowhead or any other band. It's about the transparency or otherwise of a music award process - which is worth debating.