Rod Stewart Maggie May!

Subject: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,padgett
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 05:34 AM

folk musician says he is to take legal action against Rod Stewart over the 1970s hit song Maggie May.


Ray Jackson, who found fame with Geordie folk/rock band Lindisfarne, says he was paid just £15 by the pop superstar

from BBC News! check full story

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 06:01 AM

See here for the story.

Shame I didn't know about this last night. Another ex-Lindisfarner, Steve Daggett, runs an open mic near me on Tuesdays. Could have got his take on it. Won't see him now for a couple of weeks.

Interesting story though - Not the first time Rod the Mod had ripped off folkies. Remember the Wild Moutain Thyme story?

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 06:19 AM

I have just read the real sickener - At the end of the article it says The sleeve of Rod Stewart's Every Picture Tells a Story album reads: "The mandolin was played by the mandolin player in Lindisfarne. The name slips my mind."

Couldn't even be arsed to credit the guy properly! What a tosser.

Dave

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Nick
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 06:24 AM

Perhaps in contrast look at Herbie Flowers' comments about his contribution to 'Walk on The Wild Side' which surely wouldn't be the same without his wonderful bass line...

"People ask if I feel bitter about only getting a session fee for playing the bass on Reed's Take a Walk on the Wild Side'. Nope. A bar of C and a bar of F for four minutes. Not my song. My job."

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: KeithofChester
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 06:34 AM

That BBC page is from March 2003. That is four years ago. Mind you, given the song is 35 years old these things may be taking their time...

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,PMB
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 06:40 AM

Except that the mandolin is an essential feature of the arrangement (who composed it? Was the mandolin improvised?), and Lindisfarne were still prominent when Maggie May was (sadly) recorded... which is probably why Ray Jackson got the job.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Silver Slug
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 08:03 AM

Every Picture is one of the great albums of my time, by far the best thing that Stewart ever did. I assume that Jackson knew how much he was going to be paid so I have little sympathy for him and can't understand on what grounds he wanted to sue.

I think your timing is out a little as well because I don't think that Lindisfarne had achieved national fame at the time that Stewart released his LP.

Finally, the best thing that Lindisfarne produced was Jack the Lad!

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 11:24 AM

I deal's a deal, I suppose. Didn't Bert Jansch only get a one-off £100 payment for his first album? I bet its never been out of print in over 40 years. I wonder if there are any current sale figures for it.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Greg B
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 11:41 AM

I don't get it. Studio musicians generally don't get royalties,
and rarely even get a 'some bloke from Linisfarne' credit. Whether
they play a written part or improvise something (which may at some
point be aped by a member of the road band).

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Cluin
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 12:29 PM

Hmmm. I always thought Ron Wood played the mando part on this song. Learn something every day around here.

So are studio musicians supposed to get a cut of the royalties now?

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,DonMeixner
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 12:48 PM

I played on a few LPs for some people locally. I was paid what I was paid. I didn't write a contract to say I was in need of a credit altho' I got some on the LP. I didn't write a contract that said I was to recieve any royalties either.

Rod deserves a bit of a manners refreashment for not know the guys name I'd think. But unless there is a lot more than meets the ear this is an arguement without many legs.

Don

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,Hootenanny
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 02:04 PM

Hasn't the record industry always been like this? a someone sells a song/accepts a session fee and goes home very happy. Sometime later the track starts earning lots of moolah and said songwriter/performer realises he made the wrong choice. Tough shit, life is like that, and to add insult to injury some time later the featured artist who has probably played with a couple or three musicians in his time can't recall the mandolin player's name, shame on him. I wonder if the mandolin player has registered with PPL, if not then should and he can then thank Rod for using him on the record and ensuring that he earns royalties each time the recording is used. On a hit the size of Maggie May that should not be sniffed at.
The so called "music business" is full of sharp practice and bullshit BUT it is also full of whining musos who made a mis-judgement.

Hoot

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Greg B
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 02:23 PM

You know, as I thought about it, it seemed to me that he could have
made lemonade of it. He could have billed himself as 'whats-his-name
the mandolin player on Maggy May.' Probably a lot more memorable,
and a good conversation starter besides. And he would have got all
the perks that he claims to have missed out on.

I'd bet that the gambit here is to just get a settlement to get him
to shut up. Some attorney probably said, "I can get you five or
six figures on this, just to go away" and he looked at his bank
balance and said "Yeah, okay."

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 03:54 PM

Is there more than one notable singer named Rod Stewart? The only Rod Stewart I know of seems very unlikely to have recorded Maggie May.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,meself
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 04:49 PM

Maybe Mr Mando didn't want his name on the album at the time, for reasons known only to him - and his lawyer, his ex, the bailiff, his unacknowledged progeny, his bookie, and the Chancellor of the Exchequor ...

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Cluin
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 04:52 PM

What Rod Stewart were you thinking of, leeneia?

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 05:01 PM

Leeneia: Which Maggie May were you thinking of?

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,Don Meixner
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 05:17 PM

Hi Leeneia

is it

Oh Maggie, Maggie May
They have taken her away
To slave upon Van Dieman's cruel shore.
Oh, you robbed so many whalers, and dosed so many sailors
But you'll never cruise 'round Peter Street no more.

or

Wake Up Maggie I think I got something to say to you,
It's late September And I really should be back at school.


Don

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Greg B
Date: 15 Aug 07 - 08:15 PM

With his Rod in her Maggie?

Maggie may, but Mary's a sure thing.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 16 Aug 07 - 01:21 PM

The Rod Stewart I was thinking of sings a ragged falsetto.
The Maggie May I was thinking of starts

The spring had come with flowers in bloom
The birds sang out their lay.
Her heart was ever pure and true,
my little Maggie May.

My little witching Maggie, singing all the day.
Oh how I loved her none can tell
my little Maggie May!

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: JennyO
Date: 16 Aug 07 - 01:31 PM

Right Rod Stewart, wrong Maggie May.

Think -

Wake Up Maggie I think I got something to say to you,
It's late September And I really should be back at school.

as Don said.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: katlaughing
Date: 16 Aug 07 - 01:44 PM

My uncle sold "Tea for Two" to his cousin, reportedly for a hundred bucks, and never made one more cent from it. I don't remember him being bitter and I know he never sued anyone over it.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Cluin
Date: 16 Aug 07 - 02:56 PM

Since Rod never sang the full name Maggie May in his song (he just called it that after the Liverpool folk song about an old slapper there), the confusion is easily understood. Maybe you thought it was called "Wake Up, Maggie" or "Maggie I Couldn't Have Tried Any More". I'm sure you've heard it.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 17 Aug 07 - 11:37 AM

Not unless they played it in in the supermarket.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Aug 07 - 12:51 PM

why did he wait so many years to sue?

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 18 Aug 07 - 01:43 AM

Maybe the old bank balance is looking a little slim - I'm sure there aren't that many new Lindisfarne fans out there buying CDs and the old fans will have replaced their vinyl with CD years ago.

LTS

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 18 Aug 07 - 04:35 AM

What about the sax player on "Baker Street". Should he be entitled to more than a session players'rate? Interestingly, and very importantly, I think I read somewhere that the motif that sax man plays was actually composed by Gerry Raferty.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,Johnmc
Date: 18 Aug 07 - 10:16 AM

Funny how you never hear about a session musician who was paid handsomely for a performance offering to hand back some of it to the artist who, because the record never sold, finds himself nearly bankrupt.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,ifor
Date: 18 Aug 07 - 11:29 AM

The sax on Baker Street was played by the wonderfully named Raphael Ravenscroft.
IFOR

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Darowyn
Date: 18 Aug 07 - 12:49 PM

If you read the Musicians' Union mag, you will see ads every month trying to trace artists who played on recording sessions or broadcasts, in order to pay them royalties.
The rights of players have improved over the past few years and the change of policy has been retrospective.
Cheers
Dave

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Cluin
Date: 18 Aug 07 - 01:12 PM

Guys who play recognizable riffs and solos are in high demand from other recording artists who want something like it in their songs. David Lindley, who played the guitar solo on Jackson Browne's "Redneck Friend" was asked to basically play the same solo over and over again on every project he played on afterwards.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Becca72
Date: 18 Aug 07 - 02:12 PM

"Not unless they played it in in the supermarket."

I've heard it in the one at which I shop... :-)

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Arnie
Date: 18 Aug 07 - 04:04 PM

The Rod Stewart hit I've always like is Mandolin Wind which has got some great mandolin playing on it - was that Ray Jackson or perhaps Simon Meyer?

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,Chris B (Born Again Scouser)
Date: 18 Aug 07 - 05:30 PM

'Mandoin Wind' was certainly Ray Jackson. He wasn't the world's greatest mandolin player, perhaps, but you could always tell it was him.

I don't think Ray Jackson was the only session player who felt short-changed off that record. Mick Waller was (if memory serves) famously pissed off about his relatively meager payments for playing on most of Rod Stewart's early solo hits. Sammy Mitchell, who played slide on 'Amazing Grace' on the same record, never made a lot of money. He died, pretty much forgotten, in Liverpool just over a year ago. A great shame.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Aug 07 - 06:46 PM

Just got the latest from another ex-Lindesfarne member. Apparantly Ray gave up the case about 6 months ago. The Lawyers responsible (I suspect it was neither Ray not Rod who fought the case!) decided it was costing too much on both sides!

Learned another thing about Rod the Mod's corner though - Aparantly it was argued that 'Man of Constant Sorrow' was also his! They don't 'arf try it on don't they:-(

D.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 29 Aug 07 - 11:54 AM

Well, he can just take his epicene mitts off one of my favorite songs.

I have given a little thought to how to sing "Man of Constant Sorrow" when I'm not a man. Judy Collins sang "Maid of Constant Sorrow," but I think that's a little precious. Then I had an idea, and I changed it to "I've lived a life of constant sorrow."

Go ahead and sing it that way if you want. I nobly disavow all copyright.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Aug 07 - 01:08 PM

I'm pretty sure that 'man' in the sense of the song is pretty much the generic term for person rather than the male sex. I'm sure no-one would mind you singing man anyway, leeneia. I have heard big hairy old blokes singing 'My name is Penny Evans and I'm just turned 21...'

:D

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: Cluin
Date: 29 Aug 07 - 02:36 PM

How do you deal with "I'm a Little Teapot"?

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 29 Aug 07 - 11:19 PM

I don't. My first grade teacher liked to sing that song, and it baffled me. My parents drank coffee made in a percolator, so tea was a complete mystery to me. Now if someone had written a ditty about the burbling of the percolator, it would have touched my soul.

Now that I'm older and have much more education, I realize that "I'm a Little Teapot" conflates the teapot, which serves tea, and the teakettle, which boils water and whistles.

Congress ought to look into this because it violates The No Child Left Mystified Act.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,Greg inTexas
Date: 06 Sep 07 - 12:26 PM

Patty Loveless sings the tune as Soul of Constant Sorrow. It's on the CD called Mountain Soul. Sounds good, as do most things sung by her...

That's a far better solution than Maid of Constant Sorrow.

Have enjoyed this thread.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Sep 07 - 10:19 PM

Step back....if the lad was good enough or have connections or have YouTube....Mr. Stewart would have been written songs for him....looks and sounds like sour-grapes to me.

Subject: RE: Rod Stewart Maggie May!
From: GUEST,Jonny Sunshine
Date: 07 Sep 07 - 08:54 AM

Nowadays there are (or at least should be) performance royalties for session musicians in the UK this is administered via PPL. It wasn't always the case , for instance Vic Flick as paid the standard session fee (£6 or so at the time) for playing the guitar riff on the James Bond theme.

If a session player contributes something that becomes an intrinsic part of the composition, he or she may be able to argue the case that they deserve some of the writing royalties, providing they had actually made up the part, and not signed off any further claim in the work. Otherwise it would come down to the lawyers.