BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.

Subject: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 04:18 PM

Hat tip to thread.cfm?threadid=106505&messages=20 "American pie has a lot to answer for."

After all, traditions are a terrible thing to waste-including Mudcat's tradition of coming up with thread titles that are play on words of another thread title.

So, this thread is all about pies-American and otherwise.

Got any questions & answers about pies? Got any great recipes for pies? Post them to this here thread.

But no pie tossing allowed. That seems like such a terrible waste of good eatin-especially when people are starving overseas.

I'll share some pie questions my next post to this thread. You're welcome to dish out the answers and come back for more questions & answers besides those ones.

Thanks, in advance for posting to this thread!

:o}

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 04:24 PM

Okay, let's start with the obvious-what's your favorite pie and what's your least favorite pie?

And what's the difference between American pies and any other kind?

And how that tradition of throwing pies in folks faces come about anyway? And what's so funny about throwing pies at people?


Anybody got any great pie recipes they'd like to share?

Do you have any good memories of pie baking or pie eating? How 'bout sharing them too.

Also, {since there's no rule that song lyrics can't be part of BS threads} what songs/poems do you know about pies?

Bring 'em on!

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Jeri
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 04:30 PM

Azizi, in your effort to create yet another copycat thread, you've excluded a good part of the world. It might be better to ask "What pies ARE American?"

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 04:30 PM

My favorite pie is apple {warm with French vanilla ice cream}. But I also like lemon merangue pie {without the merangue}. And I like sweet potato pie.

I've been faked out a couple of times thinking that pumpkin pie is sweet potato pie. They may look alike but they sure don't taste alike.

I'd take sweet potato pie over pumpkin pie any day.

{Well, actually, I shouldn't take either every day since that would lead to considerable weight gain. But you know what I mean}

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 04:35 PM

Jeri, sometimes copycatting can be fun.

You suggested that I ask "What pies ARE American?"

In my initial post I did write that "So, this thread is all about pies-American and otherwise."

Also, the question in my second post "And what's the difference between American pies and any other kind?" is another way of asking the same question you asked.

Great minds and all that...

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 04:39 PM

Well, on second read those questions aren't actually the same, but they each demonstrate a desire to include and not exclude non-Americans from the conversation.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: peregrina
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 04:39 PM

sweet potato pie...sounds good...never tried it...how about a recipe please!
(Canned pumpkin is hard to come by where I live. Yup, I prefer using canned or jars...but sweet potatoes can usually be found).

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Jeri
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 04:54 PM

Copycat threads can be fun. Hardly ever funny - to me, but possibly not many other people.

Apple pie didn't originate in the colonies as people brought recipes from their homelands. See Pie: A little slice of history (about 1/3 of the way down the page)

To find pies that are more American than something-else-ian, maybe look for pie innards no one used before us. Probably pumpkin, possibly rhubarb. What had the first person to think of THAT been smoking?
Sweet potatoes" Yams were in Africa and probably other places, but I doubt anyone had previously stuck them in a pastry shell. I could be wrong. Key lime pie, but that's because Key limes live here.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 05:49 PM

Here's a recipe for sweet potato pie:

PREP TIME 30 Min
COOK TIME 1 Hr 50 Min
READY IN 2 Hrs 20 Min
SERVINGS & SCALING
Original recipe yield: 1 - 9 inch pie
US METRIC
      
About scaling and conversions

INGREDIENTS
1 (1 pound) sweet potato
1/2 cup butter, softened
1 cup white sugar
1/2 cup milk
2 eggs
1/2 teaspoon ground nutmeg
1/2 teaspoon ground cinnamon
1 teaspoon vanilla extract
1 (9 inch) unbaked pie crust

DIRECTIONS
Boil sweet potato whole in skin for 40 to 50 minutes, or until done. Run cold water over the sweet potato, and remove the skin.
Break apart sweet potato in a bowl. Add butter, and mix well with mixer. Stir in sugar, milk, eggs, nutmeg, cinnamon and vanilla. Beat on medium speed until mixture is smooth. Pour filling into an unbaked pie crust.
Bake at 350 degrees F (175 degrees C) for 55 to 60 minutes, or until knife inserted in center comes out clean. Pie will puff up like a souffle, and then will sink down as it cools.


http://allrecipes.com/Recipe/Sweet-Potato-Pie-I/Detail.aspx

This page also includes some reviews from folks who used this recipe.


-snip-

I use a recipe for pumpkin pie that I got out of a Betty Crocker cook book and substitute a large can of sweet potatoes {or yams} instead of a can of pumpkin. If you use the canned sweet potatos, empty out the water in the can first before putting the sweet potatos in the mixer.

Fwiw, I use margarine instead of butter. And I don't add vanilla, but I do add clove flavoring with the cinnamon and allspice.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 05:59 PM

Fwiw, I think that African Americans who I've met :o} are much more familiar with sweet potato pies than pumpkin pies. I definitely prefer sweetpotato pies to pumpkin pies-but maybe it's the flavoring and not the vegetable-or are pumpkin/sweetpotatos fruit?

Also, when I went to school near Newark, New Jersey in the mid 1960s I learned about another kind of pie-bean pies.

Here's a Wikipedia article about bean pies-

"A bean pie is a sweet custard pie whose filling consists of mashed beans, usually navy beans, sugar, butter, milk, and spices. Bean pies are commonly associated with soul food cuisine. Additionally, they are associated with the Nation of Islam movement: its messenger, Elijah Muhammad, encouraged their consumption in lieu of richer foods associated with African American cuisine, and the followers of the religion commonly sell bean pies as part of their fund-raising efforts."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bean_pie


Here's a bean pie recipe:

2 cups Navy Beans (cooked)
4 Eggs
1 14 oz. can evaporated milk

1 stick butter
1 teaspoon nutmeg
1 teaspoon cinnamon

2 T. Flour
2 cups Sugar
2 T. Vanilla


Cook beans until soft. Preheat oven. to 350 degrees.

In electric blender, blend beans, butter, milk, eggs, nutmeg and flour about 2 minutes on medium speed. Pour mixture into a large mixing bowl. Add sugar and vanilla. Mix well. Pour into pie shells. Bake about one hour. until golden brown. Makes 2 or 3 Bean Pies.

Tip: 5 minutes after removing pies from oven, cover with plastic wrap that clings.

http://www.muhammadspeaks.com/Pie.html

**

I've never baked a bean pie. But I like them. They remind me much more of sweet potato pies than pumpkin pie. But all three of these pies look the same to me.

{which is a bit of a joke, if you get my drift}

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: catspaw49
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 06:11 PM

Ziz....No objection to a pie thread but I hate the damn copycat things. Perhaps you missed this the other day, but it got a bit contentious(;<))


Subject: RE: BS: Do you sing from mammary?
From: catspaw49 - PM
Date: 18 Nov 07 - 06:23 PM

Do we have to have some dumbass copycat cutesy thread on every fuckin' thread around here? Yeah.....I know I should get over it and all that shit but for the love of Christ..............It was funny once or twice....Maybe even 3 dozen times, but as we get into the thousands of times, enough is probably Fuckin' A enough.

Rant over

Spaw


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Subject: RE: BS: Do you sing from mammary?
From: Morticia - PM
Date: 18 Nov 07 - 06:54 PM

Uncle Pat, I love you...oh, and fucking ditto.


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Subject: RE: BS: Do you sing from mammary?
From: WYSIWYG - PM
Date: 18 Nov 07 - 07:05 PM

That's odd, I think I'm channeling Morty.

Ya know, skipy, this kind of cuteness could also have been put in the existing "Memory" thread as a mere comment instead of making a new thread, or it could have been a post in the Misread Threads thread, or any number of other approaches. Be a leader-- stop the madness!

~S~


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As to pies? I'll repost my favorite later and the best pumpkin/squash/sweet tater type recipe I know....Dead simple and always a hit.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 06:26 PM

Spaw, no, I didn't have the pleasure [?] of reading that "Do you sing from mammary?" thread. Yes, I recognized the play on words on the Do you sing from memory thread. But it didn't faze me one way or another that someone had posted a play on words-aka copycat [title]- thread.

Obviously, I don't have a problem with this type of thread. Sometimes the titles are more witty than others. And sometimes they're not witty at all. Sometimes the content of the thread is interesting to me, and sometimes it's not.

Such is life.

As for me and this thread, I just felt like being light hearted, and sharing information at the same time.

I certainly don't feel like being contentious.

And btw, Spaw, I look forward to you reposting your "best pumpkin/squash/sweet tater type recipe".

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Sorcha
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 06:32 PM

FIRST ya gotta get the pastry right! Here is a No Fail Short Crust
(honest, no fail)In US measurments, makes enough for 4 10" one crust pies, or a little more.

1 3/4 cups solid fat, ie Crisco
4 cups UN sifted flour
2 tsp salt
1 Tbsp sugar (optional, leave it out for savory pie)
Cut the fat into the flour,salt, sugar mix.

Mix well in separate bowl:
1 Lg or med egg
1 Tbsp white or cider vinegar
1/2 cup cool water.
Mix well and add to the flour mixture. Mix with hands gently until a ball forms, just a tad bit more of flour might be necessary. Divide into fourths.

This dough freezes very well. Wrap in cling film or put in a plastic baggie and squeeze most of the air out.

Pie stuff later!

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: catspaw49
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 06:52 PM

By far my favorite pie is an old standard not generally made often in this day and age of watching the calories and sugar


BUTTERMILK PIE (makes 2 pies)

Make up two of your favorite recipe deep dish pie shells (I'd suggest Sorcha's above which seem to follow a close formula to what KLaren does) or buy a couple of premade....your choice. Brown them a bit before adding the filling.
FILLING:
Ingredients:
5 Cups Granulated Sugar
6 Tablespoons Flour
10 Tablespoons Butter
6 Eggs
3 Cups Buttermilk
2 teaspoons Vanilla
2 teaspoons vinegar


Combine the sugar and flour. Melt the butter in a separate bowl then mix in the eggs,buttermilk,vanilla,and vinegar. Mix well!!! Add in the sugar/flour and continue mixing.....good mixing is important.

Pour the filling mixture into the pie shells and bake at 350 for 45-60 minutes (clean toothpick check). Let cool and EAT!!!

Have a supply of antacid handy and some rope to tie up your kids is helpful too.

Enjoy (and so will your dentist)

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Bill D
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 07:04 PM

I'm more a pie eater than a pie baker...but that's ok, 'cause I've become an expert by specializing.

I like many, many types of pie...but am not much on pumkin, rhubarb. Sorry...that's just how it is. Yesterday, we had pumpkin, apple and **PECAN**. I ate the apple happily, but went for the pecan to finish. Now a well-made pecan pie will simple cause my pleasure cells to overload..YUM.

But as a kid, my favorite was cherry, and I'd probably still choose a good cherry pie with vanilla ice cream for dessert on my 'last meal'. ('good' means NOT overly sweet and plastic).

I also LOVE good fruit pies...peach is good...but so is fresh blackberry. Still, if I had to choose ONE pie...(not as a 'last meal'), the one I want is fresh, homemade....GOOSEBERRY!. It is a very mild, delicate flavor and gooseberries are not easy to find these days...but it is wonderful!

Recently, the best homemade pies I've had were at parties where a friend made a cranberry-walnut pie. She says it is dead simple, and I am going to GET that recipe!

About 30 minutes from us is an Amish/Dutch market which operates 3 days a week, and when I'm near it and it's open, I will often treat myself to one of the best coconut creme pies I have had. They make others quite well, but, they do coconut creme about as well as any I've had.

Then again, if none of those others are available, Key Lime or Lemon pie is always delicious....always assuming that they are 'right' and not commercial junk!

So...I am easy to please, as long as there are choices other than Pumpkin and Rhubarb..etc. You may have my share.

Pardon me....I have this piece of left-over pecan to finish.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Bill D
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 07:06 PM

Oh...and BTW..many years ago, I had 'mock-apple' pie, made with soda crackers. I was surprised how good it was!

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: catspaw49
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 07:11 PM

Ziz.......I use the same simple recipe for the filling of any kind of squash type pie, that means pumpkin or sweet potato too.


Simply Great "Gourd" Pies

Never use canned fillings. I cook and drain 2 cups per pie of whatever......In order, our preferences are Acorn Squash, Sweet Potato, Butternut Squash, Pumpkin. If you find any "Sweet Dumpling" squash, USE THEM!!!!!

In any case, when cooked, drain well and I even squeeze out as much water as possible to make a denser pie. The key thing now is DO NOT WHIP/PUREE the filling. Mash the squash/pumpkin/sweet potato with a fork and leave the mixer in the pantry. Add two well beaten eggs to your two cups of your "whatever" and 1 can of sweetened condensed milk. Stir it together til blended. Add your favorite "gourd pie" spices (nutmeg/cinnamon/clove/allspice/etc.) to your taste then pour it into your favorite recipe pie shell (or frozen pie shell). Bake at 425 for 15 minutes and turn down the oven to 350 for an additional baking of 45 minutes. Toothpick/knifeblade check for doneness.

This is dead simple and gives the pie more texture. People love it and its dead simple

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 07:27 PM

Glad you said it before I did, Spaw et alia.

...traditions are a terrible thing to waste-including Mudcat's tradition of coming up with thread titles that are play on words of another thread title.

In this case it is not old enough to be a "tradition" and would not have been possible when we had to be careful not to crash the place. We've gotten spoiled with all of the bandwidth and that, of course, is not always a good thing. It's gotten old, really fast.

There are several recipe threads this could have been added to.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Bill D
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 07:59 PM

awww...c'mon...pie is a special case.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Neil D
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 08:16 PM

My mother's favorite pie is mince-meat pie. You seldom see it anymore. I believe this might be an example of one that is more a British than Americn tradition. I remember it as being spicy as well as sweet. I don't think it had meat in it but rather raisins and nuts. Perhaps some of the British Mudcatters could comment. Is this still a common Christmas treat on that side of the pond.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 08:27 PM

So far, folks have commented in this thread about traditions and practices, and fruit pies, and vegetable pies, and the pie crust that can not fail us.

But up until now we having talked about meat pies and poultry pies, and we having shared songs, and poems about pies.

Here's one poem/song about a different kind of pie:

CHICKEN IN THE BREAD TRAY

"Auntie, will yo' dog bite?-
"No, Chile!-No!"
Chicken in de bread tray
A makin' up dough.

"Auntie, will yo' broom hit?"-
"Yes, Chile!" Pop!
Chicken in de bread tray
"Flop! Flop! Flop!"

"Auntie, will yo' oven bake?"-
"Yes, jues fry!"-
What's dat chicken good fer?"
"Pie! Pie! Pie!"

"Auntie, is yo' pie good?"
"Good as you could 'spec'."
Chicken in de bread tray;
"Peck! Peck! Peck!


Source: Thomas W Talley; Negro Folk Rhymes: Wise And Otherwise {Washington, N.Y; Kennikat Press, Inc., 1968; pp.7; originally published, 1922}

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 08:38 PM

Neil D,

Mince meat pie was part of my family's Thanksgiving tradition as a child and as an adult.

However, now that I think about it, as an adult, when I baked mince meat pie,I was the only one who ate it. So consequently, I haven't baked that type of pie in a number of years.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: robomatic
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 08:56 PM

My favorite all-time pie is strawberry rhubarb. I use corn starch as a thickener and once when I had too much filling I found that the thickened pie juice, left in the freezer, turned into a nice little rhubarb strawberry sherbet.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 09:01 PM

Correction, I meant to write:

"But up until now we having talked about meat pies and poultry pies, and we haven't shared songs, and poems about pies".

Here's another poem/song about pies:

DON'T ASK ME NO QUESTIONS

Don't ask me no questions,
An' I won't tell you no lies;
But bring me dem apples
An' I'll make you some pies.

An' if you as questions.
'Bout me havin' de flour,
I fergits to use 'lasses
An' de pie'll be all sour.

Dem apples jues wa'k here;
An dem 'lasses, dey run.
Hain't no place lak my house
Found un'er de sun.

Source: Thomas W Talley; Negro Folk Rhymes: Wise And Otherwise {Washington, N.Y; Kennikat Press, Inc., 1968; pp.94-95; originally published, 1922}   

-snip-

My interpretation of this poem/song is that the cook "borrowed" the ingredients for this pie from the "big house's" storeroom or kitchen.

Among enslaved and post civil war free African Americans pies and candy and anything sweet were rare treats. Songs and poems about sweets reflect that social condition.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Bert
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 09:10 PM

Well I think it's fun Azizzi.

Here are some additives to the usual fillings

Pumpkin - use chopped crystalized ginger instead of ginger powder.

Apple - Soak some cloves in vodka for a day or two and add to taste.

Cherry pies - add some amaretto.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 09:21 PM

Off topic, it's interesting to me how widely used this "don't ask me no question" line is. One place you will still find it is in the "Miss Lucy [Miss Susie et al] Had A Steamboat" profanity avoidance handclap rhymes. A number of those rhymes can be found on the blog of the octopuses {Octoblog} page of contemporary children's schoolyard rhymes:

http://blog.oftheoctopuses.com/000518.php

Here's an example of one of those rhymes:


Miss molly had a steamboat,
the steamboat had a bell ding ding,
the steamboat went to heaven,
miss molly went to
hello operator,
give me number nine,
and if you disconnect me,
I'll kick you from
behind the yellow curtain
there was a piece of glass
Miss Molly sat upon it
and hurt her big fat
ask me no more questions
tell me no more lies
the boys are in the bathroom
doing up their
flies are in the city
bees are in the park
Miss molly's with her boyfriend
kissing in the
d-a-r-k
d-a-r-k
dark dark dark
dark in like a theater,
a theaters like a show
a show is like a movie
and that is all i know,
i know my ma
i know i know my pa
i know i know my sister
40 acre bra
i've seen her in the ocean
ive seen her in the sea
ive seen her in the bathroom
Oops i parden me!

posted by Vicky at June 18, 2004
http://blog.oftheoctopuses.com/000518.php

I've received permission from that blog's members to quote examples from that page.

I added the italics. Imo, the "i" in the last sentence of this handclap rhyme is probably a typo for an exclamation point.

**

Fwiw, it appears that a number of children/youth used to post on that website's page of school yard rhymes. Unfortunately, that page seldom gets any post nowadays. That's a shame. However, it still is a rich repository of children's contemporary rhymes.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: catspaw49
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 09:21 PM

Now I love meat pies, especially turkey, but I think of Mrs. Lovett and "The Worst Pies in London":

Mrs. Lovett

A customer!
Wait! What's your rush?
What's your hurry?
You gave me such a...
fright! I thought you was a ghost!
Half a minute, can't ya sit?
Sit ya down!
Sit!
All I meant is that I haven't seen a customer for weeks.
Did ya come here for a pie, sir?
Do forgive me if my head's a little vague.
Ugh!
What is that?
But you'd think we had the plague.
From the way that people
keep avoiding!
No you don't!
Heaven knows I try, sir!
But there's no one comes in even to inhale!
Right you are, sir, would you like a drop of ale?
Mind you I can hardly blame them!
These are probably the worst pies in London.
I know why nobody cares to take them!
I should know!
I make them!
But good? No...
The worst pies in London...
Even that's polite! The worst pies in London!
If you doubt it take a bite!

Sweeney Todd (spoken)

Ugh!

Mrs. Lovett (sung)

Is that just, disgusting?
You have to concede it!
It's nothing but crusting!
Here drink this, you'll need it.
The worst pies in London
And no wonder with the price of meat
what it is
when you get it.
Never thought I'd live to see the day.
Men'd think it was a treat
findin' poor
animals
what are dyin' in the street.
Mrs. Mooney has a pie shop.
Does a business, but I notice something weird.
Lately, all her neighbors cats have disappeared.
Have to hand it to her!
What I calls,
enterprise!
Poppin' pussies into pies!
Wouldn't do in my shop!
Just the thought of it's enough to make you sick!
And I'm telling you them pussycats is quick.
No denying times is hard, sir!
Even harder than the worst pies in London.
Only lard and nothing more-
Is that just revolting?
All greasy and gritty?
It looks like it's molting!
And tastes like...we'll pity.
A woman alone...with limited wind
And the worst pies in London!
Ah, sir
Times is hard.
Times is hard.

Sweeney Todd (spoken)

Isn't that a room up there? Over the shop?
If times are so hard, why don't you rent it out? Should bring in something...

Mrs. Lovett (spoken)

Up there? Huh, no one'll go near it.
People think it's haunted.
You see years ago something happened, something not very nice.

But Sweeney takes the place anyway and brings prosperity to Mrs. Lovett whose meat pies immediately improve and many are saying, "God, That's Good!":

TOBY:
Ladies and gentlemen, may I have your attention please?
Are your nostrils a quiver and tingling as well at the delicate lashes ambrosial smell?
Yes they are I can tell
Well, ladies and gentlemen, that aroma enriching the bees
Is like nothing compared to its succulent source as the gourmets among you will tell you of course
Ladies and gentlemen you can't imagine the rapture in store
Just inside of this door!
There you'll sample Mrs. Lovett's meat pies
savory and sweet pies as you'll see
You, who eat pies Mrs. Lovett's meat pies
conjure up the treat pies used to be

MRS. LOVETT:
Nice to see you dearie
how have you been keeping?
Coo m'bounds is weary
Toby, one for the gentleman
hear the birdies cheeping
helps to keep it cheery
Toby, throw the old woman out!

ENSEMBLE:
God, that's good!

MRS. LOVETT:
What's your pleasure dearie?
No we don't cut slices
Coo m'eyes is bleary
Toby, none for the gentleman!
I put up m'prices
I'm a little leery
Business couldn't be better now!

ENSEMBLE:
God, that's good!

MRS. LOVETT:
Knock on wood!

SWEENEY: Psst!
MRS. LOVETT: Excuse me
SWEENEY: Psst!
MRS. LOVETT: Dear, see to the customers
SWEENEY: Psst!
MRS. LOVETT: Yes? What love? Quick, though the trade is brisk
SWEENEY: But its six o clock
MRS. LOVETT: So its six o clock
SWEENEY: It was due to arrive at a quarter to five and its six o clock! I've been waiting all day
but it should have been here by now
MRS. LOVETT: and its probably already down the block it will be here, it will be here have a pitcher of beer and it
should've been here by now now

ENSEMBLE:
More hot pies!

MRS. LOVETT:
Will you wait there cooling
'Cause my customers truly are getting unruly
SWEENEY: You come back when it comes!

MRS. LOVETT:
and what's your pleasure dearie?
Oops I beg your pardon
Just m'hands are smeary
Toby, run for the gentleman
down to Lover Garden
always makes me teary
must be one of them foreigners

ENSEMBLE:
God, that's good! That is delicious!

MRS. LOVETT:
What's my secret?
Frankly dear, forgive my can of firmly secret all to do with herbs
things like being
careful with your curry and that's what makes the gravy grander

ENSEMBLE:
More hot pies! More hot, more pies!

SWEENEY: Psst!
MRS. LOVETT: Excuse me
SWEENEY: Psst!
MRS. LOVETT: Dear, see to the customers
SWEENEY: Psst!
MRS. LOVETT: What now, love? Quick, though the trade is brisk
SWEENEY: But its here
MRS. LOVETT: Its where?
SWEENEY: Coming up the stair
MRS. LOVETT: I'll get rid of the slaughters they're still pretty hott it will soon be there
SWEENEY: It's about to be open to don't you care?
MRS. LOVETT: No Ill be there, I will be there but then none will get sold if I let them get cold
SWEENEY: But we have to prepare!

MRS. LOVETT:
Oh and incidentally dearie
you know Mrs. Mooney
sales have been so dreary
Toby, poor thing is penniless
What about that loony?
Lookin sort of beery
Oh well go get them upinsin that will be thruppinsin

ENSEMBLE:
God, that's good! That is de-have-u-licious at the tasty smell such oh my god what's more that pie's good
ooh ooh ooh
ooh ooh ooh

SWEENEY: Is this a chair fit for a king?
How wondrous meet and most particular chair
MRS.LOVETT: Its gorgeous, its gorgeous
SWEENEY: You tell me where is a seat can half compare with this particular thing
MRS. LOVETT: Its perfect, its gorgeous
SWEENEY: I have a few minor adjustments
MRS. LOVETT: You make your few minor adjustments
SWEENEY: to make
they'll take
MRS. LOVETT: You take, your time
SWEENEY: a moment
MRS. LOVETT: I'll go see to the customers
SWEENEY: I'll call you
I have another friend

TOBY:
Is that a pie fit for a king?
Oh wondrous sweet and most particular thing
MRS. LOVETT: Its gorgeous its gorgeous
TOBY: You see maam why there is no meat pie can compete with this delectable pie
MRS. LOVETT: Its perfect its gorgeous
TOBY: The crust all velvety and wavy
MRS. LOVETT: The crust all velvety and wavy
TOBY: that glaze, those crimps
MRS. LOVETT: That glaze, those crimps
TOBY: and then the thick succulent gravy
SWEENEY: Then down they go
The cellar waits below
TOBY: one whiff will make me glimpse
a wonder that we surrender
SWEENEY: On with, the show

SWEENEY: Psst!
MRS. LOVETT: Excuse me
SWEENEY: Psst!
MRS. LOVETT: Dear, see to the customers
SWEENEY: Psst!
MRS. LOVETT: All set, love?
SWEENEY: Hear me
MRS. LOVETT: My heart's a flutter
SWEENEY: When I pound the floor
MRS. LOVETT: When you pound the floor
SWEENEY: Its a signal to show that they're ready to go when I pound the floor
MRS. LOVETT: Yes I know you told me you'd be ready to go when you pound the floor!
Will you trust me? Will you trust me?
SWEENEY: I just want to be sure
MRS. LOVETT: I'll be waiting below for the whistle to blow
SWEENEY: when I'm certain that you're in place
I'll pound three times
three times
To warn you
three times
that means

ENSEMBLE:
Exactly more hot pies! God!
More hot! right! More pies! More! Right!

MRS. LOVETT:
How about it dearie?
be here in a twinkling
just confirms my theory
Toby, god wash this off of here
sit and have an inkling
Toby, throw the old woman out

TOBY: (at same time as MRS. LOVETT)
Is that a pie fit for a king?
Oh wondrous sweet and most delectable thing
you see maam why there is no meat pie

ENSEMBLE:
God, that's good! That is de-have-u-licious at the tasty smell such oh my god what's perfect more that pies such flavor God
that's good!


I generally hate musicals but I love Sweeney! I thought George Hearn was terrific with Angela Lansbury as Mrs. Lovett, but I admit to looking forward to see it done by Johnny Depp. He'll be great!

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 09:30 PM

Sorcha has given the basic recipe for a fine crust- Lard or Crisco is absolutely necessary; these abominations made with crushed cookies or low fat ingredients are offal-awful however one wants to spell it.
Favorite fillings:

PECAN PIE I

3 eggs
1/4 teaspoon salt
3/4 cup sugar
1/2 cup melted butter
1 cup dark corn syrup
1 1/2 cups pecan halves

Roll out pastry, line a 9-inch pie pan and bake in a preheated 450 F oven for 5 minutes. Cool.
Beat eggs ans salt until light and lemon-colored. Beat in sugar a little at a time. With a wire whisk, fold in melted butter and syrup. Pour into partially baked shell and arrange pecan halves on top, broken side down. Bake for 10 minutes in preheated 425 F oven, reduce heat to 325 F and bake for 30 minutes.
Serves 6-8 (or less). This from American Heritage Cookbook, 1964, vol. 2, Recipe editor Helen McCully.

Now my wife's variant-

PECAN PIE 2

3 eggs well-beaten
1/4 teaspoon salt
1 cup sugar
1/4 cup melted butter
1 cup corn syrup
1 tablespoon fresh lemon juice
1 cup pecan halve (or more)

Follow directions for PECAN PIE 1 but after pouring into shell and arranging pecans, bake at 350 F for 15 minutes and 300 F for 40 minutes.

SWEET POTATO PIE

1 1/4 cups cooked, mashed sweet potatoes*
1/2 cup soft Demerara brown sugar, firmly packed.
2 eggs, well-beaten
1/4 teaspoon salt
1/4 teaspoon cinammon (or more)
1/4 teaspoon allspice
3/4 cup milk
1 tablespoon melted butted
3/4 cup milk
1 cup pecan halves (optional)
or whipped cream topping**

Line an 8-inch pie pan with pastry. Chill.
Combine sweet potatoes, brown sugar, salt and spices in a bowl. Mix together beaten eggs, milk and butter and stir into sweet potato mixture, mix thoroughly. Pour into chilled pie crust. Bake in preheated 400 F oven for 45 minutes or a probe comes out dry when inserted in the center.

* Microwave on high the greased sweet potato, with a few small holes pricked in the skin, for about 5 minutes or until soft. Time varies with size. Saves cooking time and does just as well.
** If nuts not used, when serving, cover top with whipped cream whipped with sugar, brandy or bourbon flavored, and a dusting of nutmeg.

CREAM
1 cup chilled whipped cream
2 tablespoons sugar
1 tablespoon brandy or bourbon
Beat and whisk until peaks form. Chill.


PUMPKIN to follow-

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 09:35 PM

One of the questions I asked in my 2nd post to this thread was about the practice {tradition?} of throwing pies.

I suppose most of the pies that are thrown are custard pies, but maybe other types of pies are used too.

Here's a link to a Wikipedia page which provides information about how that practice started and how it is evolving.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pieing

Here's an excerpt from that entry:

"Pieing is the act of throwing a pie at someone. Originally a staple of slapstick comedy, pieing has also come to be used for political purposes, in which throwing a pie at an authority figure, politician, or celebrity is a means of protesting against the target's political beliefs, or against a perceived flaw — arrogance, hubris — in the target's character. (A variation of pieing, when the target is hit with a cake instead of a pie, is called "caking".)

The political act of pieing has its origins in the "pie in the face" gag from slapstick comedy (first popularized by movie director Mack Sennett around the year 1914 in his Keystone Cops silent movies). Throwing pies as a comedy staple came into its own in the Laurel & Hardy classic short film, "Battle of the Century" (1927)[1] which, according to legend, required four thousand pies. Pie-throwing became a convention of early slapstick movies made by the Three Stooges,[2][3] and others. Other comedians and cartoon characters famous for pieing are Bugs Bunny, Charlie Chaplin, Monty Python, and Soupy Sales.

The probable originator of pieing as a political act was Aron Kay [4], a Yippie, who pied singer and anti-gay-rights activist Anita Bryant in Des Moines, Iowa, in 1977 (audio footage of the incident is included in the Chumbawamba song Just Desserts, a homage to the concept of pieing).[4] Kay subsequently pied, among many others, William F. Buckley, G. Gordon Liddy, E. Howard Hunt, William Shatner, and Andy Warhol. Kay retired in 1992 after pieing right-wing activist Randall Terry. His exploits live on though. He appears in cartoon form in a 2003 animated music video, "Death penalty for pot" by Benedict Arnold and The Traitors, where he and Dana Beal pie George W. Bush and former U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft (at 2 minutes and 33 seconds into the video).[5]...


-snip-

One political blog that I read "DailyKos" uses the term "pie fights" as a referemt for discussions that are highly contentious. I'm not sure whether that term is widely used on other blogs.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 09:46 PM

LOL! Spaw. I see I have been culturally deprived. I'll have to check out Sweeney Todd.

**

Thanks to all who have posted material to this thread!

Keep it comin if you have a mind to and the stomach for it.

LOL!

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Sorcha
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 10:10 PM

Additives for Pie! (Come back, bring PIE!)
Peach--a dash of grated nutmeg
Cherry--drop or two (not much!) Almond extract (Amaretto works too!)
Coconut--toast the coconut lightly before adding to the custard
Lemon or lime--a teaspoon or so of finely grated peel (aka zest)
Chocolate custard--dash of cinnamon
Pecan--drop or two of Mapeline
Apple--I always use brown sugar instead of white
Pumpkin--I always double the cinnamon called for, and increase the ginger,nutmeg and clove. Be careful with the last 2 or it will be bitter and nasty. Look, I think pumpkin should be spicy not blah.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 10:13 PM

PUMPKIN PIE

Pastry according to Sorcha's recipe
Filling-

pure pumpkin* 28 oz. tin
1 cup brown Demerara sugar
1 cup white sugar
2 tablespoons molasses
1 1/2 teaspoons powdered ginger
1/4 teaspoon powdered cloves
3 teaspoons cinammon
1 teaspoon pure vanilla extract
1 short teaspoon salt
1/4 teaspoon allspice
4 large eggs, slightly beaten
2 cups scalded milk (or part cream)
Mix ingredients in order given. Pour into two 9-inch partly baked pie shells (see PECAN PIE I, above).
Bake 15 minutes at 425 F in preheated oven. Reduce heat to 325 F and bake one hour.
*We use pure canned pumpkin, E. D. Smith, 28 oz tin (796ml). Good fresh pumpkin of the proper variety is not found in our stores.

When serving, top with bourbon-or brandy-laced cream. Recipe given with SWEET POTATO pie, above.

I gave this recipe in another thread a while back.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Bee
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 10:13 PM

I'm an eater not a baker... but sour cherry pies are my favourite - hard to get sour cherries anymore, just those big sweet ones. And of course, cold tart apple pie, leave the cinnamon out of 'er! Strawberry rhubarb, yessir. And one I've come to love, cranberry apple pie!

My one grandmother used lard, not much sugar, and baked her pies four at a go, eight pies at once, in the coal stove oven. Her pastry was not flaky at all, but thin and soft, and her pies were mostly eaten at breakfast.

My other grandmother made delicate flaky pastry, and made the best mincemeat (venison and beef together, usually) on the Island, kept it in 'stone' jars in the cold cellar.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 10:27 PM

Sour cherries are available canned in stores here (western Canada), from Roumania! Fresh are unobtainable here, and the tiny Nanking (good for jelly) is the only cherry that grows here on the prairies.

A good apple pie, served almost hot, with a generous slab of Stilton cheese on top, is great. Samuel Johnson, the 18th c. lexicographer, regarded England outside of London as uncouth and uncivilized, but somewhere in northern England while touring, he found an inn which served apple pie with Stilton, and said it was the only worthwhile thing he found on his trip.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: mg
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 11:16 PM

I'm generally not a pie eater as I don't like gooey things, but a good chocolate pie is great..or key lime...

And I don't see any relation at all to this quite sensible thread and the cutsie ones that I avoid. No reason at all not to ask people for pie recipes that I can see...not that I have any...mg

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Nov 07 - 11:27 PM

My wife does a great Key Lime pie, but it is beyond my skills (or lack thereof).
Also like lemon meringue (ditto).

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Bee
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 12:14 AM

The closest I come to baking pie is not pie at all, but little shortbread lemon tarts. I think my mother may have invented them about forty years ago. You make mini tartshells (in those tiny muffin tins) of a simple shortbread: "one half of brown sugar to one of butter to two of flour", bake them briefly at 350F. Let cool, and fill with: one can sweetened condensed milk with one half cup fresh lemon juice and dash of salt stirred until milk thickens - about three minutes. Keep the filling refrigerated and fill tarts as required, which in my house is 'as long as its there I'm going to eat one... or two... or three...'

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: katlaughing
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 12:43 AM

If you want what they call "pie cherries" here, which are sour (to my taste), let me know. We have them all over the valley and some places freeze them so one can buy them over the winter, even.

My cousin whose mother was an excellent baker, said I made the best pies, esp. my crust. I got it out of a Better Homes and Garden cookbook and it was made with oil. Here's the old recipe. I use olive oil:

Oil Pastry 2 cups flour 1 1/2 t. salt 1/2 cup salad oil (canola oil) 5 T. cold water or milk Mix flour and salt,pour oil and water into measuring cup but do not stir. Add all at once to flour. Stir lightly with a fork. Form into two balls; slightly flatten. Roll between two 12 in squares of waxed paper. (dampen table slightly) Roll dough to edges of paper,this will be the right thickness.Peel off top sheet of the paper and fit dough,paper side up,into pie plate. Remove the paper. Put in filling and roll out top crust. Makes 8" or 9" pie: double crust. From the Better Homes and Garden Cookbook

Dampening the surface before you put the waxed paper down will keep it from sliding around.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Janie
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 01:46 AM

In the years since moving to North Carolina, I notice that Sweet Potato pies seem to be favored over pumpkin. It may be a southern preference that African-Americans have carried with them. Or, it could be that African-American slave cooks made it popular in the South. Since both pumpkins and sweet potatoes grow well here, but sweet potatoes will store in root cellars through the winter, it makes sense that they would have become the more used and preferred.

I prefer pumpkin to sweet potato, probably because I was raised on it, but I also prefer the texture of the pumpkin custard to a sweet potato custard.

Pumpkin pie made from scratch with fresh pie pumpkins and honey instead of sugar is my is my favorite pie. After that, it is a close toss-up between cherry and apple.

I like the simplicity of making an apple pie. I don't have a recipe, but people generally seem to like my apple pies. I have a lovely old-fashioned gizmo that cores, peels and slices the apples with the turn of a crank. I keep cranking and dumping the result into a pie shell until the pan is heaped with apples. Then I sprinkle the apples with cinnamon, nutmeg and cornstarch, (kept in a cheese shaker)toss them in the shell, drizzle with lemon juice and a little honey, cover with the top crust, and bake.

I'm with 'Spaw and Sorcha. Forget healthy if you want a really nice pie crust. It is the crust that will ultimately distinguish between a good pie and a great pie. Lard really does make the best crust, but it is SO bad for you, that I stick with Crisco. Butter, or coconut based shortenings may work for a for a tart shell, where some texture has to be sacrificed for a crust sturdy enough to be a stand alone container for the filling, but can not deliver the proper texture for a pie crust. I've played around with a lot of pastry recipes, and finally decided that the recipe on the Crisco label is my favorite for most pies.

I swear by the use of a pastry cloth and rolling pin cover for any pastry or biscuit dough. I store them in a baggie in the freezer.

Janie

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 07:46 AM

Up thread, when I mentioned the reasons why I started this discussion, I wrote "As for me and this thread, I just felt like being light hearted, and sharing information at the same time".

Those reasons are incomplete as I omitted that I also started this thread to learn from other folks who I hoped would post to it.

Thanks again for your posts!

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 08:22 AM

Besides eating, and starting lots of category threads on Mudcat such as thread.cfm?threadid=105855 "Religious Songs That Speak To You", I like learning about the origins & meanings of words.

So what's the difference between a yam and a sweet potato? I thought that "yam" was just another name for "sweet potato", but I was wrong.

Here's an excerpt from About.com: Home Cooking

"Yam or sweet potato, what in the world is it? Many people use these terms interchangeably both in conversation and in cooking, but they are really two different vegetables...

Sweet Potatoes
Popular in the American South, these yellow or orange tubers are elongated with ends that taper to a point and are of two dominant types. The paler-skinned sweet potato has a thin, light yellow skin with pale yellow flesh which is not sweet and has a dry, crumbly texture similar to a white baking potato. The darker-skinned variety (which is most often called "yam" in error) has a thicker, dark orange to reddish skin with a vivid orange, sweet flesh and a moist texture...

Yams
The yam tuber has a brown or black skin which resembles the bark of a tree and off-white, purple or red flesh, depending on the variety. They are at home growing in tropical climates, primarily in South America, Africa, and the Caribbean...

The word yam comes from African words njam, nyami, or djambi, meaning "to eat," and was first recorded in America in 1676...

Yams contain more natural sugar than sweet potatoes and have a higher moisture content. They are also marketed by their Spanish names, boniato and ñame..."

-snip-

What?! Sweet potatos aren't yams?! Well, I guess they're the closest thing to yams that we had in the USA-that is, until imported vegetables became available for purchase at our nearest super markets. But don't get me started on the subject of imported foods.

That's a whole 'nuther subject.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 08:40 AM

When I listed those things I like to do, I forgot to mention the collecting, reading, listening to, and watching children perform children's rhymes.

I suppose that there are a number of children's rhymes that mention pies. But the one that immediately comes to my mind is a hide & go seek rhyme that the person who is "It" chants while other children scatter and hide:

Apple, peaches, pumpkin pie
whose not ready
Holler I

-snip-

This children's hide & seek rhyme was cleverly used as the theme of this 1967 R&B song:

APPLES, PEACHES, PUMPKIN PIE
{Jay & The Techniques}

Ready or not here I come
Gee that used to be such fun

Apples peaches pumpkin pie
Who's afraid to holler I?
That's a game we used to play.
Hide and seek was its name.
Oh ready or not, hear I come,
Gee that used to be such fun.
I always used to find a hiding place,
Times have changed.
Well I'm one step behind you, but still I can't find you
Apple peaches pumpkin pie,
You were young and so was I.
Now that we've grown up it seems
You just keep ignoring me.
I'll find you anywhere you go,
I'll follow you high and low.
You can't escape this love of mine anytime.
Well, I'll sneak up behind you,
Be careful where I find you.
Apple peaches pumpkin pie,
Soon your love will be all mine.
Then I'm gonna take you home,
Marry you so you won't roam.(2x)
Right now I'll find you anywhere you go,
I'm gonna look high and low.
You can't escape this love of mine anytime.
Well, I'll sneak up behind you,
Be careful where I find you.
Ready or not here I come,
Gee that used to be such fun

http://lyricsplayground.com/alpha/songs/a/applespeachespumpkinpie.shtml

****

Here's a YouTube audio clip of this song witha photo collage:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwzYtiDcGkE

Btw, the viewers' comments often make interesting reading. For instance, here's one comment:

"One of my all time favorite records. There seems to be 2 different versions around.This I believe is the original 45 version, its quicker and faster. And there is a slower version with more bass and more laid back . The slower version is the better record. I still love both versions. To me him and his girl use to play hide and seek when they were kids now they're grown up and he still wants her.Very romantic."
-jameycruz

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 08:51 AM

Here's some more music trivia about the song "Apples Peaches Pumpkin Pie" which was written by Jerry Ross,Kenny Gamble, and Leon Huff.

"AW: Don't I hear Ashford & Simpson singing background?

JR: Funny you should ask. Nick Ashford, Valerie Simpson and Melba Moore sang background on "Sunny", "Mr. Dream Merchant", with Jerry Butler, "Apples, Peaches" and all my Dee Dee Warwick productions. They were always my "go to" backgrounds.

AW: "I'm Gonna Make You Love Me" (Ross/Gamble/Huff) is one of my favourite songs of all time! How did that come about?

JR: When I went to New York to A&R at Mercury, I'd always have Kenny Gamble and Leon Huff come up from Philly and write with me - I gladly opened many doors for them - whenever I had an album to do for Bobby Hebb or Jerry Butler or Jay & the Techniques. "Apples, Peaches, Pumpkin Pie" had just gone Top 10. I always kept an open door for new writers, especially for Kenny and Leon. I loved them and I loved their creativity. They had not started to produce their own records yet. By the way, Tommy Bell was often my keyboard guy.

AW: You guys turned out some incredible stuff!..."

http://www.spectropop.com/JerryRoss/index.htm

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: jeffp
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 12:50 PM

Here's my recipe for Key Lime Pie.

Graham Cracker Crust:
1 paper-wrapped package graham crackers (1/3 of a 1 pound box) or 1 cup plus 2 1/2 tablespoons graham cracker crumbs
5 tablespoons melted unsalted butter
1/3 cup sugar
Filling:
3 egg yolks
2 limes, zest grated (about 1 1/2 teaspoons)
1 (14-ounce) can sweetened condensed milk
2/3 cup freshly squeezed lime juice (if you get Key limes, use them: otherwise use regular limes)

Topping:
1 cup heavy or whipping cream, chilled
3 tablespoons of confectioners' sugar

For the graham cracker crust: Preheat the oven to 350 degrees F. Butter a 9-inch pie pan. Break up the graham crackers: place in a food processor and process to crumbs. (If you dont have a food processor, place the crackers in a large plastic bag: seal and then crush the crackers with a rolling pin.) Add the melted butter and sugar and pulse or stir until combined. Press the mixture into the bottom and sides of the pan, forming a neat border around the edge. Bake the crust until set and golden, 8 minutes. Set aside on a wire rack. Leave the oven on.
For the filling: Meanwhile, in a electric mixer with the wire whisk attachment, beat the egg yolks and lime zest at a high speed until very fluffy, abut 5 minutes. Gradually add the condensed milk and continue to beat until thick, 3 or 4 minutes longer. Lower the mixer speed and slowly add the lime juice, mixing just until combined, no longer. Pour mixture into the pie crust. Bake for 10 minutes, or until the filling has set. Cool on a wire rack, then refrigerate. Freeze for 15 to 20 minutes before serving.

For the topping: Whip the cream and the confectioners' sugar until nearly stiff. Cut the pie in wedges and serve very cold, topping each wedge with a large dollop of whipped cream.


During the late summer into the fall I can get key limes at a local grocery store (Bill, it's the Weis Market on Rte. 1 in Savage). They're much, much better. A bag makes enough juice for the pie, with a couple left over to slice thinly for garnish. It's quite tart, but the whipped cream balances it out nicely. You can substitute bottled lime juice, but it's nowhere near as good.

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: wysiwyg
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 01:14 PM

Spaw, we did Sweeney in high school way back when. I enjoyed being stage manager, because I got to be sure the chair-flip was in working order every day. :~)

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 03:40 PM

Azizi said:

but maybe it's the flavoring and not the vegetable-or are pumpkin/sweetpotatos fruit?

Sweet potatoes (note "e") are a vegetable. Or I suppose you could make the distinction and say it's a tuber.

Pumpkin is fruit.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 03:49 PM

Thanks, Dave.

I admit to being uncertain about how to spell the plural of "potato" and it's all because of Dan Quale. :o}

For those who don't know what I mean,check out this Wikipedia entry:

"The singular spelling variants potato vs. potatoe co-existed into the 19th century. Potatoe in the 20th century came to be considered a misspelling, while the plural remains potatoes.

Vice President of the United States Dan Quayle became notoriously associated with this misspelling in a June 15, 1992 incident. Quayle went to a photo op at Munoz Rivera School in Trenton, New Jersey, where he was to officiate a spelling bee by drawing flash cards and asking students to write the words on the blackboard. Twelve-year-old William Figueroa wrote potato, but Quayle prompted him to append an "e" which, according to Quayle's 1995 Autobiography "Standing Firm", was the spelling on the flash card.[1] The incident briefly made national news in the United States and became a source of entertainment for the tabloid newspapers in the United Kingdom. For the June 25, 1992 rerun of The Simpsons episode "Two Cars in Every Garage and Three Eyes on Every Fish", Bart Simpson's opening chalkboard gag was hastily changed to read, "It's potato, not potatoe". This was also the cause of a Saturday Night Live episode "Mr. Casual Sex", in which Rob Schneider launches into a tirade against Quayle by saying that he is not qualified to discuss family values as he cannot properly spell potato."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potatoe#Spelling

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 03:58 PM

My favorite dessert pie is apple pie (preferably with Granny Smith apples), and with a big slice of SHARP cheddar cheese served with it.

Second favorite, banana cream pie. BUT, none of this instant pudding stuff, and not topped with whipped cream. It's got to be the real cooked sauce, and a meringue topping, about 1-1/2 inches thick. More's the pity, my Beautiful Wife doesn't have the knack for doing a real stand-up meringue, and it ends up thin to begin with and collapses from there.

We have a running joke in our family: When there's a difference of factual understanding or memory, I'll challenge her: "I'll bet you a chocolate souffle against a banana cream pie!" Over the years, she owes me a large number of banana cream pies, because she really drags her feet on making one (because of the unfortunate circumstance cited in the previous paragraph.) I've had to deliver twice, I think, on a chocolate souffle bet.

As to pumpkin pie, I loathe the frothy stuff they make with beaten gelatin. Heresy!

An unusual pie, which I've had only twice in my life, I think, is green-tomato pie. You make it just about like a green-apple pie, with nutmeg and cinnamon in it. It's really good.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 04:01 PM

Azizi, it's my understanding that most in-the-face pies are nothing but crust (if that) and whipped cream. The point is all display, of course, and that's quick, easy, and CHEAP.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: American Pies-Questions & Answers.
From: Jeri
Date: 24 Nov 07 - 05:40 PM

My mom made the crust with just a couple teaspoons of vinegar, which you couldn't taste at all after baking. I think maybe it was to reduce the glutenization. One big factor in making good crust is to not mix it too much. She used a fork.

I've got her recipe for the crust, but not the apple pie. If I could ask her what was different, she'd say, "You just make an apple pie and add a lot more cinnamon that what the recipe calls for." We also had a big hunk of cheese with apple pie - cheddar cheese, the stinkier the better. My parents referred to the appropriately aged cheese as 'rat trap' cheese. I loved cheese and I loved my mom's apple pie, but I remember thinking that the combination was something truly bizarre that adults did. I learned to love it though.

I think the separation between apple-pie eaters in the US who like cheese and those who don't may be geographic, with the cheddar fans being in the north east, but I don't know.