BS: Iceland Gov Failed

Subject: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Deckman
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 01:40 PM

I just heard that Iceland's government has collapsed. Bob(deckman)Nelson

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 01:43 PM

Our Icelandic member told us theie banks all failed 4 months ago.

It seems they invested in some US securitized mortgages that had a triple A rating. (apparently they fell for it hook line and sinker.)

Anyone here want to go and form a new government in English?

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: CarolC
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 01:46 PM

Here's a link to the story in the Iceland Review Online...

http://www.icelandreview.com/icelandreview/daily_news/?cat_id=16539&ew_0_a_id=318956

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 01:47 PM

From HERE:

LONDON (MarketWatch) - Iceland's coalition government fell apart Monday, Prime Minister Geir Haarde announced Monday, succumbing to a financial crisis that's wrecked the tiny, North Atlantic island nation's economy.

The decision follows Haarde's announcement last week for early elections on May 9. Haarde at the time also said he wouldn't run due to health elections.

Monday's announcement followed unsuccessful talks between the coalition partners made up of Haarde's Independence Party and the Social Democrats.

Iceland fell into crisis last October as its once-vibrant banking sector collapsed, sending its currency into a nosedive and unemployment soaring.

The International Monetary Fund in November approved a two-year, $2.1 billion loan for Iceland. The country has also secured loans from other countries.

This is sad and alarming, even though Skarpi told us about the banks earlier. I hope Skarpi and his family will be all right.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Donuel
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 02:52 PM

I will govern for food.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: skarpi
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 04:11 PM

well Kat, we are sinking slowly its only the head left in the water .

and I am afraid , more countrys will be goin the same way , UK is next on the list . Gordon Brwon has failed they say ?

well if they do not make a new coverment tomorrow we are doomed .


Skarpi .

P.s , its gettin harder and harder here every week and I am afraid February , March and April will be tough. Many people in Iceland
have not money to get food for them self and their kids and this is new for Iceland , its sad
and in the mean time the people who owned the banks and did us bankrupt
are traveling in south pol on jeeps havin fun ...... this is not right

but I guess this also in other countrys around the world .

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Big Mick
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 04:29 PM

Skarpi, first let me say that I am worried sick for you and your family. You are in my thoughts and prayers, good friend.

Secondly, the events of these past months are leading me down the path to a radical place. WTF are these people thinking? These bastards are flaunting their greed in such contemptuous ways that it almost beggars belief!!!! Just today we heard that one of the banks that got a bailout turned around and ordered a $50 million corporate jet with all the amenities!!!! There have so many stories here and abroad of this, that we are almost becoming dull to it all and accepting it as "the way it is". It is my opinion that if a handle is not gotten on this, and soon, folks that are desperate will take drastic measures. Who could blame them? They are trying to keep their houses warm and their kids fed while the bankers are telling them to eat cake. Surely this will go down as one of the times in history when the greedy were the most despicable.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: SINSULL
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 04:31 PM

Candle remains lit for you and many others. Keep you and yours safe, skarpi.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Maryrrf
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 04:36 PM

Yes Skarpi it's difficult all over but I know that Iceland got hit especially hard, so my thoughts are very much with you and Gunna. And I second what Mick said. Have these people no shame?

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 04:58 PM

hows Chris Foster,anyone know?

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: skarpi
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 05:15 PM

Birdseye , chris are fine , I am meeting him next Friday

far as I know he´s good .

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Deckman
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 05:26 PM

You know Skarpi ... there just must be a horrible RAGE sweeping your country. We over here in the USA got hit also, and the degree of damage is just now beginning to surface. We have friends that have lost 60% of their savings and retirements. That's the legacy of george bush (I refuse to capitalize his name). I know it's cold help, but ... you are NOT alone. CHEERS, Bob Nelson

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Rapparee
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 05:28 PM

Skarpi, were I violent and vindictive and vengeful and all that V-for-Viking stuff I'd be tempted to Do Nasty Things to those people. The Sagas have some good ideas for that.

But I'm not that way at all. Nope, not me. I just think that those responsible should be required to pay it all back, preferably by the sweat of their brows.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 05:54 PM

Skarpi, thanks for keeping in touch. You and Gunna have so many friends here and we all share a deep concern for you and your country.

Another Mudcatter sent me a link to a really good article about this which also has general info about Iceland at the end, including the fact that the Icelandic parliament, is the oldest functioning legislative assembly in the world, which was established in 930.

I had not idea it was that old.

I am giving thanks for a swift return for all peoples to prosperity in all ways.

Ast,

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Ebbie
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 06:47 PM

Skarpi, my alarm for you and yours and your beloved country is palpable. The only good thing I can see about it is that being small Iceland has the potential of getting a grasp on a solution that will point a way out for the rest of us. I certainly hope so- and may it come quickly.

It does make me wonder just how much the western world will take before there is real revolution.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Art Thieme
Date: 26 Jan 09 - 10:45 PM

Skarpi, I, too, am so sorry to hear this sad news. Rage would be a logical emotion to have in this chaotic time. Here, in the USA, those getting helped by our government are running faster and further with more and more billions of dollars. I've never understood extremes like the guillotine---but now I am beginning to see a place for concepts like that. In California a person caught 3 separate times stealing a loaf of bread for the family is automatically sentenced to life in prison with no recourse while these new robber barons are enbcouraged and protected by the powerful. I am truly sickened by all of it.

For what it is worth, all the best to you and your family.

Art

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 12:54 AM

(Not to defend three strikes, Art, but you might feel better knowing that if a person has two or more convictions for a serious or violent felony and subsequently gets arrested for a new felony, he can get life in prison, even for a non-violent felony. If the person has only one prior conviction for a serious or violent felony he faces a doubling of the sentence for a third felony. Judges can ignore earlier strikes, too, to avoid injustice.)

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: open mike
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 02:44 AM

best wishes for Skarpi and his family and friends--
i hope conditions improve soon.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 03:42 AM

I am not sure that Gordon Brown has failed. The last run on bank shares here in the UK was directly caused by the incredible stupidity of the FInancial Services Authority, which removed its ban on short selling of shares - and only gave the Chancellor (Darling) one hour's notice. Otherwise, I think Brown and Darling have done everything right, and with Obama starting a New Deal type programme in the USA, I think we maybe on our way.

A friend of mine (he does clever things with computer programs that deal with money) is saying that the number of ads for his type of jobs has probably doubled in the last month, and another who is trying to finance an age-related leisure concept is saying that many more doors are opening.

The important thing to remember, as I think I was saying when the UK first put bank rate decisions into an independent Bank of England is that governments must control their bans, not vice versa. Look at Poland. Best economy in Europe right now precisely because the banks were not allowed to play Arthur Daley sleight-of-hand shell games with derivatives and were compelled to keep to proper on-book transactions and capital ratios.

When the IMF loans start rolling (to Iceland, and they may well to other places - the Repulic of Ireland, who also went heavily down the "enterprise culture" road, springs to mind) the FIRST thing the IMF should be insisting on is proper bank regulation, not the "screw-the-workers" capitalism they usually require.

Governments should also take power to delay larger withdrawals from banks in a crisis. Most (that's "most" not "all") bank failures are not about capital deficiency, unless they have really lost it big time, but about cash flow, and if withdrawals can be delayed while assets are realised in an orderly fashion the bank may survive and the majority of deposits saved without having to rely on government guarantees. It is the administration culture - or, as I understand it, to US readers, Chapter 11 not Chapter 7 - but without the adverse effect on so many creditors.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Deckman
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 05:18 AM

An old expression my Father taught me: "You can rob Peter to pay Paul ... but soon you'll have a broke Peter!" bob

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: The Sandman
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 05:21 AM

I agree with Richard Bridge .
I dont think any opposition politician could have done anything better,and I dont think a change of english government will help.
I have my criticisms of Gordon Brown ,but see little alternative .

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 05:33 AM

What English government? Oh, you mean the one run by Scots!

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: GUEST,Jim Martin
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 05:48 AM

Looks like Ireland's going the same way:

http://www.glor.ie/About%20Us/_default.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: GUEST,Jim Martin
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 05:56 AM

I'm sorry, that was the wrong link, don't know how that happened! Here's the correct one:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/jan/24/savings-banks

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Dani
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 08:20 AM

Probably ironic timing that I'm reading Uris' Trinity. The true horror of how the decisions of one, or a few, can effect the destiny, and assure the suffering, of so many is alarming.

Thinking of you, and your beautiful country, Skarpi.

Dani

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: SINSULL
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 08:33 AM

The Deptford Trilogy, Dani. A rock in a snowball - a boy's prank - changes evrything for everyone for life. Brilliantly done.


These past six months have made me wonder if absolute greed like absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Keep you and yours safe skarpi. You have friends here if you need them.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 09:40 AM

Wow Sins, thanks for reminding me of one of the best literary works ever. My favourite book of the three (and the one I read first - they do stand individually) was The Manticore. Author is Robertson Davies, and his non-fiction is sterling too. Go to the Mudcat home page, click on the Amazon link halfway down, and check out this author and title (you can Look Inside). You won't regret it.

You are in my thoughts, Skarpi -

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 10:35 AM

Any and ALL of Robertson Davies' books are at the top of my reading list.

Now about greed...alas, tied (thanks to the US Republican Party) to power. All of the regulations put into place after the Great Depression were systematically dismantled starting with the Reagan administration right down through the Dubyah administration. Then somebody came up with some really iffy ideas about bundling and selling crap as mortgaged backed "securities". Lenders certainly wouldn't take responsibility for no money down, etc. loans -- besides, by the time it all came crashing down, they'd have taken the money (and maybe run). Instead they're getting "bailed out" -- which amounts to rewarding the very people who trashed the companies in the first place.

I could go on...

Excellent article by Niall Ferguson in the December issue of Vanity Fair (which, besides commenting on rich people acting badly, has some of the best political and financial reporting around). The article is entitled "Wall Street Lays Another Egg" -- "The author charts the emergence of an abstract, even absurd world -- call it Planet Finance -- where mathematical models ignored both history and human nature, and value has no meaning."

Skarpi, we're holding you and your family in our hearts and thinking about you and your whole country's situation a lot. We're not immune here in the US, but at least I've still got a job and Tom still has his"seasonal" job and things look more or less "secure" (as far as that goes) on the income front.

Linn

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: skarpi
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 06:32 PM

what I am thinking of is all of us , how are we all doin ??? it has not just hit me and my family , yours as well and dont forget that .

it has hit USA hard and now UK and Ireland are goin the same way as Iceland .

well we´ll all get through this one way or another , and let me asure you all that I think about you all everday , how are they doin out there
, do they have a job , have all got food and so on ..... becouse the news I get from the US and UK are not good at all .

Next Thursday a contaner will arrive to UK from Iceland , in that container are blankets and clothes for older people of UK , we are told that many thousand older people die of cold every winter , so we all Icelander s collected alot of woolin clothes and blankets for them . This will be broadcast at BBC in some Morning show ??? I dont know more details .


we are all in the same soup , stay well all and have faith .


All the best from Skarpi

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Riginslinger
Date: 27 Jan 09 - 09:44 PM

Iceland is way ahead of the US. When the government in Iceland failed, everyone knew it right off. When the government in the US failed, it took almost thirty years for the people in power to realize.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Ebbie
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 12:54 AM

To answer your question about jobs and economic conditoins, Skarpi, I don't know many details but Alaska's unemployment rate stands at above 7.5% and the homeless shelters say they are serving ever more people.

However, most of the homeless are people who have been in the state less than five years- they came from 'down south' - and unemployment in Alaska is almost always higher than it is down there. Plus it depends very much as to where you live.

There are Native Alaskan villages where unemployment is close to 100% and I know of several small towns that have 25% unemployment. But that has been true for a long time; I don't know how much of a change there has been recently.

I don't personally know anyone who is unemployed so far as I know. It's always possible that there is desperation out there that I know nothing of. It can be a sad world.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: GUEST,Dani
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 06:52 AM

Though the part of NC we live in is fairly well-off compared to many, I know several people who are struggling to find jobs, and have ALWAYS known people who work 2, 3, 4 jobs just to live simply, because there are never enough good-paying jobs to go around, especially if you lack education, training, experience.

One of my great fears is the backlash against the Hispanic workers who have been willing to do our shittiest jobs for so long, and no one really noticed until the better jobs got a little more scarce. There was a story last night on the news about an 'illegal' immigrant un-licensed driver who caused a serious accident. The comments on the story have been a snapshot of the feelings around this subject in NC. And a little scary.

There is so much ignorance about our American economy. Not that much has changed over the generations. Those living in comfort and wealth have always done it on the backs of poor, uneducated, mainly immigrant workers. We've done so with more or less awareness as resources become more or less scarce. I hope the current situation makes people more mindful of the realities of life in this country for 'the others', and not just lash out at them as scapegoats.

Dani

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Rapparee
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 07:21 AM

Unemployment here is, at the moment, about 4%. That's in town; in the statistical area it's about 6%. We expect it to reach 8% or higher.

Out on the Shoshone-Bannock Reservation it's around 40% and climbing.

The Food Bank is now providing food to "suits" -- not just to those they always dealt with, but also to "middle class" unemployed. Usage at the Library is up, way up, as it is across the US, and that is a traditional sign (to the librarians) that Hard Times have come again some more.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: SINSULL
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 11:08 AM

Reuters says there is hope:
http://www.reuters.com/article/reutersEdge/idUSTRE50R2IL20090128

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Ebbie
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 10:52 AM

From the link:

"It is a big misunderstanding within the opposition parties that we would want them to take over," said Bjorgvin Mar Kristinsson, a teacher. "We don't want them at all either. New people and a new democracy is our demand."

"Grassroots movements have organized many of the anti-government demonstrations and might fill the power vacuum left by the diminished support for the island's traditional political parties, Kristinsson said.

"There is no doubt there is some room there," he said. "The old parties have lost a lot of their credibility. Lots of their former supporters are looking for something new and clean."

"Some of the protest groups have already begun preparing to form a political party that might run in early elections. All parties agree there should be a ballot within months."

Man. That is where many in the US have also been. Being smaller, I hope Iceland is able to shake it up and re-form itself.

In the US we again have hope that our new government can make a profound difference, but I don't understand the mindset that lets so many of the same figures stay in their positions, the CEOs of the auto industry, the heads of the banks, the insurance companies, on and on.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Arnie
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 11:16 AM

Quite humbling for us in the UK really, but I read a few days ago that Icelanders were collecting warm clothing for pensioners in the UK! They were appalled that elderly people in the UK were suffering from the cold as they can't afford to heat their homes due to high gas and electricity prices. That really says it about skarpi and his countrymen/women - even in the midst of their own problems they take time out to do something positive for UK pensioners. This is not a spoof either, as the report said that the first boatload of clothing has already arrived at Grimsby! Wonder if I can get hold of one of those nice patterned woolly pullovers....

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: GUEST,Jim Martin
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 11:41 AM

Irish people used to be like that too, I'd like to think they still are - but since the so called 'Celtic Tiger', their numbers are probably a bit depleted!

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Donuel
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 05:20 PM

Ebbie said "I don't understand the mindset that lets so many of the same figures stay in their positions, the CEOs of the auto industry, the heads of the banks, the insurance companies, on and on."

Unless the companies are fully nationalized, who is going to fire them or replace them?

When Enron collapsed under the weight of their accounting fraud and extortion via controlling supplies of energy, the accountants that had developed the crooked book ENRON system of accounting got jobs at other firms touting their first hand experience in showing more profit than exists while hiding losses.
The companies that hired these Enron employees were happy to share their special talents. Companies like Lehman Brothers, Bear Sterns, Merril Lynch and many other banks that were dabbling in the investment market with money they did not have, welcomed the Enron expertise to hide their double dealing.

Prosecuting only a CFO or CEO was obviously not the correct way to stem the criminal activities of these new financial wizards.
They should even prosecute those who hired these ciminals.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Riginslinger
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 04:59 PM

Donuel - If the regulations had not been relaxed, and if the auditors were doing their jobs (assuming there were enough auditors to do their jobs) wouldn't they simply look for and find wrong-doers and prosecute them for their crimes?

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Sorcha
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 06:03 PM

"Iceland's PM marks gay milestone

Johanna Sigurdardottir
Few Icelanders seem concerned about the PM's sexual orientation

Johanna Sigurdardottir, named as Iceland's prime minister on Sunday, is the first openly lesbian head of government in Europe, if not the world - at least in modern times."

From: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7862804.stm

Posted without comment. Acutally, I think it's pretty NEAT!

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Stringsinger
Date: 06 Feb 09 - 04:24 PM

Iceland was a casualty of the IMF and other economic boondoggles.

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: wysiwyg
Date: 06 Feb 09 - 11:27 PM

While I too have concern for Skarpi, I have more concern for what he holds dear and for his heart to bear it. Because Skarpi, as we here know, is one of the finest people on earth.

And that means that he will be a beacon of light for others around him, a strong, flexible tower of cheer, buckling down and leading others to buckle down to take care of each other. Why, the Skarpi I have seen around THIS place can damn near bring all the Icelandic people over here to Mudcat in PERSON for a Gathering, until things clear up.

So Skarpi, remember to trust your gut. Keep your eyes open for the blessings, and do not forget to take a rest from the troubles often enough to keep your mind focused in the right direction.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: Ebbie
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 11:02 AM

Skarpi, here is an LA Times editorial. Does it accurately state the circumstances in Iceland?

Update

"Let's hope that we're imaginative enough to concoct real alternatives. Iceland has no choice but to lead the way. "

Subject: RE: BS: Iceland Gov Failed
From: bobad
Date: 11 Feb 09 - 11:14 AM

Icelanders eye Manitoba as land of opportunity
Monday, February 9, 2009
CBC News

The global economic crisis is prompting some people in Iceland to consider a move to Manitoba.

The province is already home to the largest Icelandic community outside of that country. Now, the Manitoba government is offering to help unemployed Icelanders fill job vacancies in the Prairie province.

Manitoba Labour Minister Nancy Allen sent a letter to Iceland's new government last week, offering to arrange a "special labour initiative." She is willing to help fast-track applications made under Manitoba's provincial nominee program and Ottawa's temporary foreign worker program.

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2009/02/09/icelanders-manitoba.html