BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 06:50 AM

no friend of the working men and women of this country

Exactly, the ECJ already appears to rule in favour of employers all we need is Mandelson jumping on the bandwagon.

Even he was surprised when Brown welcomed him back into his cabinet; hopefully he won't be there for long.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: goatfell
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 07:27 AM

neither is new/old Labour

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 07:50 AM

VirginiaTams's first post summed up the issue. I will be amazed if eanjay turns out to be justified in his or her belief that Brits were discrimintated against by the LOR subcontractor. But let's wait and see.

To deal with The Villan's question, wildcat strikes are allways potentially disastrous for employees because employers will always profit from division in the ranks. Whether we like it or not, the EU is a single labour market and xenophobic squabbles within that market again will benefit only employers. The NUM became Britain's strongest union through the discipline of its members. Scargill's inciting of illegitimate strikes before and during his national presidency destroyed it.

Pedant point for LtS: there has never been a UK union called the National Association of Local Government Officers!

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: manitas_at_work
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 07:56 AM

?

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Association_of_Local_Government_Officers

How is this not a union?

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: manitas_at_work
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 08:00 AM

Ah! I see your point now. Still, prior to 1952 it was as Liz said.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 08:10 AM

Peter K (Fionn), I think you are probably right; I'm sure that legal loopholes will show that I am not justified.

This is an interesting article. Some of the arguments that have been put forth, by companies involved, such as the argument that British labour is not as highly skilled and qualified or the implication that foreign health and safety is superior are just rubbish.

Jean

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 11:05 AM

I was the Union H&S rep, I think I'd know who for - even if I did misremember one word... I haven't been NALGO since UNISON formed, and that was considerably more than 10 years ago, but I am still a rep....

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: The Sandman
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 04:07 PM

Mandelson IMO is without morals.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 05:43 PM

No, I was indeed wrong, m@w, for which apologies. I hadn't realised NALGO ever existed under the name Liz used. Pedant point for Liz: two words wrong - not bad going for the name of your own union!

eanjay, I go with you some of the way. For instance I regard the ECJ directives as objectionable if they are as described in some recent media reports. But I'm not clear that those directives have been invoked in this case. Even if they have been, I wouldn't regard that as justifying wildcat strikes, though I have no problem with peaceful protest nor in extremis with civil disobedience.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: GUEST,member
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 03:32 AM

Looks to be sorted out this morning. There will be BRITISH JOBS FOR BRITISH WORKERS.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 05:46 AM

Oh no it isn't, at least thats what the BBC are reporting this morning.
Quote
Workers battling against the use of foreign labour at North Lincolnshire's Lindsey Oil Refinery have refused to accept a deal proposed in Acas talks.

The suggested solution came after talks between unions and the refinery owner.

There were reports that about half of the disputed 200 jobs would be offered to British workers, but workers have been told it would be less than 25%.
Unquote

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 06:58 AM

Unite were asking for 50% but the offer was 21% and that was rejected. The GMB union says that an improved offer has been made for 101 British workers out of the 198 construction engineering jobs on the project which is 51% but they are waiting for the offer to be put in writing.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 07:04 AM

The 51% is my calculation from the figures but I'm not sure that is correct. The original offer was 40 skilled workers plus 20 ancillary staff so my percentage may go down depending on the split between skilled workers and ancillary staff.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: The Sandman
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 07:09 AM

villan, why are you against wildcat strikes?

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 07:23 AM

Dick
Becuase they are not official. Why be in a union?
Les

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 07:35 AM

Oh, and just before you may make comments.

My father was on of the staunchest Trade Unionists going. I worked for many years at probably one of the biggest employers at that time in Birmingham GEC Witton.
I was brought up to believe that the correct way to deal with issues like this was through the correct channels.
Unofficial Strikes are like taking the law into your own hands.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 09:15 AM

I prefer things to be done the right way too.

The government has chosen to ignore certain issues and, of course, all it takes is a recession for things to come to a head. I do have some sympathy with the strikers; it was probably the only way they could get some immediate action. I find it unforgiveable that some members of the government have tried to make this look as though it is a racist issue - which it is not.

Builder and Engineer online outlines Derek Simpson's plan to deal with the situation.

Derek Simpson, joint leader of Unite has proposed a three point plan for dealing with the current wave of unoffical strike action taking place across construction sites in the UK. He said: "Unite is proposing a three point plan that the UK government should follow to resolve the wave of unoffical unrest gripping the UK. There needs to be a systematic aproach which deals with the immediate problem of the current unoffical strikes and then addresses the root cause of the discontent. "

1. Resolve the immediate problem that exists at Total's Lindsey oil refinery. Reach an agreement which gives fair consideration for UK labour to work on the contract.

2. Carry out an investigation into the practices of contractors and subcontactors in the engineering and construction industry. Follow by action from the government which will insist that companies applying for contracts on public infrastructure projects, sign up to Corporate Social Responsibility agreeements which commit to fair access for UK Labour.

3. Overturn European legal precedents which allow employers to undercut wages and conditions. A European Court of Justice precedent gives employers a license for 'social dumping' and prevents unions form taking action to prevent the erosion of UK workers' pay and condition.

"The government is failing to grasp the fundamental issues, " he added. "The problem is not workers from other European countries working in the UK, nor is it about foreign contractors winning contracts in the UK. The problem is that employers are excluding UK workers from even applying for work on these contracts."

Point 3. (IMO) should have been done well before now.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 10:29 AM

A deal has been "agreed" so hopefully the strikes will end.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 11:06 AM

Well BBC report this

The final number of jobs on offer for British workers is expected to be about 100.

The full details, plus a recommendation from the unions to return to work, would be confirmed at another mass meeting on Thursday morning, he said.

End of quote

So not completely there yet.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: The Sandman
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 11:16 AM

Villan,in the past wildcat strikes have[sometimes] been agreed by management and unions,when there has been slight over production,quite sensible really.
The reason,to be in a union , is to get better conditions.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: goatfell
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 01:56 PM

toi quote Megan L this is a racist thread if you back the workers

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 04:19 PM

On this thread that's probably what the government would say.........but we know it's a load of rubbish :-)

LOL

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 04 Feb 09 - 06:15 PM

OK Goatfell, that comes under personal vendetta and you need to stop it now.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Rasener
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 08:41 AM

Well I don't know if there is a personal vendetta, but please refrain from flaming if thats whats happening. This is about Wildcat Strikes and the discussion should be open and non personal.

Anyway, as Roy Orbison sang "It's Over"

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 09:28 AM

Great news.

The PM has agreed to look at workers' rights which should go someway to helping to prevent these strikes in the future. This should of course have been done before now.

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 11:28 AM

They are pathetic, even more so with their hideous northern accents!

Subject: RE: BS: Wildcat/Unofficial Strikes in the UK
From: goatfell
Date: 05 Feb 09 - 12:07 PM

anding insult injury a wee bit of snow hits the south of England and the coutry grinds to a halt