BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral

Subject: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 06:47 AM

In the next day or so, I will have to arrange a funeral. Because my father did not have any involvement with "organised religion", the readings chosen will be of favourite and appropriate poetry. However, many years ago, I remember him saying after the funeral of a relative who had been a joiner, that he had liked one of the texts from the Christian Bible, and I'm hoping that someone could suggest what it might have been; all I remember him saying was that he liked how it was about a man who worked with his hands, a manual worker. I'm guessing it would have come from the four Gospels, most likely those by Matthew, Mark or Luke, but at present cannot get the time to read through these. I should be most grateful for any suggestions.

Should anyone among the Mudcat community think this request offers an interesting topic for discussion in its own right - and I can see that it does - I'll only ask that they compose a slightly different Thread Title, and begin a separate discussion there.

Robert.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 07:24 AM

Not a Christian either, but had to learn bits of the bible at RE in my school days, and this always stuck with me.

Corinthians
13

Love
1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.

2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains,and have not charity, I am nothing.

3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.

4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,

5 doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;

6 rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;

7 beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.

9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.

10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly, but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Emma B
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 07:36 AM

one suggestion -

1 Thessalonians 4:11
Make it your ambition to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business and to work with your hands.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Emma B
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 07:58 AM

Sorry, the full quote from the International Standard Version should be

Also, make it your goal to live quietly, to mind your own business, and to work with your own hands, as we instructed you, so that you may win the respect of outsiders, and have need of nothing.

I too am not a Christian but remember this advice from 1 John 3;18

Little children, we must stop expressing love merely by our words and manner of speech; we must love also in action and in truth.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: freda underhill
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 08:07 AM

2 Chronicles 24:12-13 And the king and Jehoiada gave it to such as did the work of the service of the house of the LORD, and hired masons and carpenters to repair the house of the LORD, and also such as wrought iron and brass to mend the house of the LORD. So the workmen wrought, and the work was perfected by them, and they set the house of God in his state, and strengthened it.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Marion
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 09:27 AM

Sorry to hear of your loss, Robert. Your question is interesting; I flipped through the gospels (i.e., Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John) to look for passages that mention working men and might have been read at the earlier funeral. These are my suggestions:

Matthew 7:24-27: a wise man builds his house upon a rock so that it withstands the weather, whereas a foolish man builds his house upon the sand and it is destroyed in the first storm.

Matthew 13:1-23: a farmer sows seeds on four different kinds of ground, and the crop grows or not depending on how receptive the soil is. Jesus goes on to explain that the seed is a metaphor for his message.

Matthew 18:10-14: if the owner of a hundred sheep loses one, he leaves the 99 to search for the lost one, and is happier about finding it than about the ones that never wandered away. See also John 10:1-16 about the good shepherd who calls the sheep by name, and the sheep know his voice and follow him. When a wolf threatens the flock, a hired hand will run away but the true shepherd will die to protect the sheep.

Luke 5:1-11, or Mark 1:14-20: Jesus approaches 3 or 4 fishermen as they work and calls them to be his disciples.

Matthew 11:28-30: a famous quote from Jesus is "Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy-laden, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly of heart, and ye shall find rest unto your souls. For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light." This passage is in Handel's Messiah as an alto/soprano duet; the soprano sings the verse I just quoted, and the alto sings a quote from the Hebrew Bible which is also related to labour. (Isaiah 40:11: "He shall feed his flock like a shepherd: he shall gather the lambs with his arm, and carry them in his bosom, and shall gently lead those that are with young.) If your father wasn't religious, maybe having the Biblical reference in song rather than as a reading would feel more appropriate, if you like this passage and think it's possible that it's the one your dad liked. Harder to arrange on short notice, though, but if you know a couple of female soloists, there's a good chance that they'd be familiar with the piece.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Sorcha
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 10:06 AM

Ecclesiastes 3:8

Text

"A time to love and a time to hate", etc

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Sorcha
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 10:07 AM

Oops....

"1 There is an appointed time for everything. And there is a time for every event under heaven—
2 A time to give birth and a time to die;
A time to plant and a time to uproot what is planted.
3 A time to kill and a time to heal;
A time to tear down and a time to build up.
4 A time to weep and a time to laugh;
A time to mourn and a time to dance.
5 A time to throw stones and a time to gather stones;
A time to embrace and a time to shun embracing.
6 A time to search and a time to give up as lost;
A time to keep and a time to throw away.
7 A time to tear apart and a time to sew together;
A time to be silent and a time to speak.
8 A time to love and a time to hate;
A time for war and a time for peace.
9 What profit is there to the worker from that in which he toils? 10 I have seen the task which God has given the sons of men with which to occupy themselves.

God Set Eternity in the Heart of Man

11 He has made everything appropriate in its time. He has also set eternity in their heart, yet so that man will not find out the work which God has done from the beginning even to the end.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Mrrzy
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 10:45 AM

Sorry about your loss, too.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Rapparee
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 12:36 PM

"Turn Turn Turn" was originally by Pete Seeger -- the song, I mean. You might consider singing it.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 02:12 PM

Thanks to everyone who has responded. Those quotations by Emma and freda seem the most likely; I didn't write in my original post that, like John MacKenzie, although I'm not a Christian I nevertheless have a good deal of "Bible Knowledge", at least of the most poetic parts such as those quoted above, but obviously the minister who conducted the funeral years ago had chosen something less familiar but appropriate to the person. I'm already going to do my best to sing a song which, years ago, my father mentioned (on hearing it on Television one January 25th) he would like done at his own funeral, Robert Burns's "The Lea-Rig". Anyway, thanks for the time taken.

Robert

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Emma B
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 02:21 PM

Fáilte Romhat Robert and I'm sorry for your trouble

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Kent Davis
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 10:01 PM

I am sorry for your loss. Here are Paul's words when he made his last good-bye to the elders of the church from the city of Ephesus:

Acts 20:33-35
3 I have coveted no man's silver, or gold, or apparel.

34 Yea, ye yourselves know, that these hands have ministered unto my necessities, and to them that were with me.

35 I have shewed you all things, how that so labouring ye ought to support the weak, and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.
KJV

Kent

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: Donuel
Date: 24 Mar 09 - 11:57 PM

Biblical text for a secular funeral:
Proverbs can be translated into secular modern speech with great effect.

Believe it or not many of the proverbs are surprisingly upbeat.

Using a thesaurus the way Johnny Carson did is not recommended.

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: robomatic
Date: 25 Mar 09 - 02:18 PM

I've had a soft spot for Romans 12:2 which was a chapter header in my Fourier Series textbook in college:

"And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind(, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.)"

Subject: RE: BS: Biblical text for a secular funeral
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 28 Mar 09 - 11:25 AM

Thanks once again to all who have written. I have decided what to do. By taking a few lines from the Ecclesiastes "a time to..." verses (after having mentioned that there will not be anything specifically religious), I'll both show how the truth and poetry of some famous passages are universal and, at the same time, move on quickly to some verses often quoted by my father if spiritual/mystical/religious &c speculation/assertion/belief &c were to arise. Omar Khay'yam, anyone?