Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Keith Cunningham
Date: 11 May 04 - 01:23 AM

She was a delicious young broom-seller. I don't see the problem....

KC

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Anne Croucher
Date: 11 May 04 - 10:09 PM

My grandmother grew up in the wilds of Derbyshire, and she called a dulcimer a 'miracle' and the things with the handle and levers - the stringed instrument with a wheel to make a drone the name of which totally escapes me - but she called that a 'music'

So - me with my music walking down the street - he played a hurdy gurdy!!

Maybe?

Anne

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 08:31 AM

Malcolm and Greg have between them given pretty much all the useful information there is about this song. There is an interesting new article by Roly Brown on the Musical Traditions website about William Graham, the Cumberland poacher, who is said to have written Lish Young Buy-a-Broom. The article deals instead with the story of William Graham's 1857 trial for killing a gamekeeper, and his subsequent transportation to Western Australia. The story is told in two little known broadside ballads, which appear to celebrate William Graham as a sort of local hero. One of the broadsides can be seen in the Bodleian Allegro Catalogue of Ballads ref. Frith c.19(55), while the other as yet unpublished ballad can be found in Carlisle library.

There is nothing to prove that the poacher William Graham was the author of the song Lish Young Buy-a-Broom. In 1953 Len Irving of Wreay, Cumberland, was recorded singing the song, as Greg has already mentioned above. Len Irving had been singing the song for forty years, and introduced it by saying that William Graham the Cumberland poacher was said to have written it. This might be only a local tradition, but at least it goes to show that nearly 100 years after his trial William Graham's fame endured enough for him to be thought of as the author of one of Cumberland's best loved songs.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Peter Taylor
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 06:01 PM

Geoff Wood is alive and well and attends the Grove Folk Club in Leeds, which he ran for many years. He has described how he recorded this song in the Gents' at the pub where he found the singer, this being the only place he could do it undisturbed, but even there the singer's wife kept banging on the door. Whether he was the first/only collector of this song is another matter, but certainly he has been credited with it.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: greg stephens
Date: 08 Nov 06 - 07:20 PM

Interesting your mention of Geoff Wood and "collecting" this song. The terms "collecting" and "traditional" are being discussed elsewhere on Mudcat, and it is intriguing in this context. The Lish young Buy-a Broom was a universal pub song in the northwest of England, sung everywhere by the aboriginal population till at least the seventies(and still is in enclaves were the indigenous population congregate). So, in view of the universal populatity of the song, I am not all sure that "collecting" is a relvant term. I think "learnt" is the word. I learnt the Lish Young Buy-a-Broom singing it in pubs in the 60's. I am not sure that "collected" is the right term. I learnt Blowing in the Wind at the same time. I would not say "collected".

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Sue Allan
Date: 06 Jan 07 - 12:21 PM

Following this thread after reading the article on William Graham, the Poacher on Musical Traditions website - and Matthew Edward's further comments about Len Irving on Pass the Jug Round album - I thought I might as well add my own two penn'orth. I was responsible for getting the archive recordings which make up Pass the Jug Round made into commercial recordings in the first place, first in vinyl in 1983 and then as a Veteran CD a couple of years ago. I did the sleeve notes for both (and please note Matthew, that my surname is Allan not Allen!) The insert with notes on songs and singers in the vinyl recording uses the picture of a man with a gun copied from the broadside of A New Song on William Graham which is in Carlisle library, by way (if anyone wants a photo of that ballad, I have one I can email).

Transcriptions of both Lish Young Buy a Broom and William Graham can also be found in the Frank Warriner collection in Vaughan Williams Memorial Library. The transcriptions were made by the late Stuart Lawrence of Dalton in Furness from Frank Warriner's own notebook, apparently dating from c.1930, of songs he got from variety of sources including the Denwood family of Cockermouth - and Folk Song Journals! Warriner later became more involved with dialect than folk song. He was one of the founders, with the late Lance Porter, of the Lakeland Dialect Society in 1939. Stuart Lawrence also transcribed a couple of broadside ballads in Porter's posssion, which included the one on William Graham (Bodleian version rather than Carlisle one, interestingly), the chap alleged by Len Irving to have written Lish Young Buy a Broom. Nice story if he did. Born in 1899, Irving lived at Wreay and was stationmaster there for many years.
      
I found on Veteran's website a transcription of the words of the Lish Young Buy a Broom (http://www.veteran.co.uk/VT147CD%20songs.htm)transcribed by John Howson, with song notes by Will Noble & John Cocking. It says 'Will first heard it sung years ago, by an old singer in the Lake District called Esme Smith, and then later heard the 'Pass the Jug' recordings which rekindled his interest in the song.'

I well remember Esme! A fantastic singer who was a fixture at the Blencathra Hunt annual shepherd's meets in the 1970s when I occasionally attended. It certainly seems to have been sung in many a pub in Cumbria over the years, whatever its provenance.

As an indigenous person of these parts myself, and one who has been singing, playing, learning, collecting and writing about Cumbrian folk music for over thirty years (greatly helped along over the years in the fiddle music research by one Greg Stephens - good on yer Greg!) I can also verify that the word 'lish' is still in use in Cumbria today, and does mean lithe and sprightly, as in the reply to the dialect question 'Hes t' ivver seen a cuddy lowp a five-barred yat?' which has it that:'It mun a been a gey LISH cuddy or a gey la'al yat!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: Betsy
Date: 06 Jan 07 - 01:30 PM

I remember Geoff Woods from the Grove - he was known affectionately as the Professor.I got the song from him in the 60's and have been singing it regularly ever since - I don't think he ever made any great claims to "collecting" - probably "resurrecting" the song would be a better word, and there was a great shortage of English / Northern English songs in those days.
I sing (in relation to the 14/6d) "a Sovereign on the table she threw ", looking at some versions /comments above - a Fiver would have been an enormous amount of money in those days.
Also, a lot of reference to Cumberland regarding this song in this thread - surely Kirby Stephen was Westmoreland and a long way for poachers to venture, but I also appreciate that Westmoreland has been absorbed into Cunmbria these days.

As for foreign tradesmen/women coming to the North of England, up to the 1960's , French onion sellers were frequent visitors to Newcastle - apparently called Onion Johnnies ( absolutely true you dirty minded so and so's ) so selling brushes was just part of the same scene.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: Anniecat
Date: 06 Jan 07 - 07:52 PM

I have an LP recorded by Jackie and Bridie in 1970 and one of the songs is called "Lish Young Biar". I can't remember how they introduced it at the folk club in Turville where I saw them, but don't remember any mention of broom sellers!
PS Weren't they great!!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 09 Jan 07 - 07:25 AM

My apologies to Sue Allan for spelling her name incorrectly - I must have been thinking of the Ellen Valley Band! 'Pass The Jug Round' is one of the best recordings of traditional singers I've ever heard, and Sue's role in discovering, researching and issuing them deserves the gratitude of all lovers of such music.

Thanks also to Sue for posting the copy of the 'New Song on William Graham the Poacher' at Musical Traditions (William Graham). It looks well worth singing.

Greg mentioned above how little research has been done into Cumbrian music and song, which is odd considering that it has to be nearly the most visited part of Britain over the last two hundred years. But in some ways the songs have stayed alive without the attention of the folk song movement.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Sue Allan
Date: 09 Jan 07 - 08:46 AM

IN reply to you Matthew, there's actually been a lot of research done by me into Cumbrian music and song: it's just that not a lot of it has been published. I have, over the years, published a bit in local publications including Cumbria Life magazine and a local folkie publication, plus the odd article in English Dance & Song and other national folk mags ... but none of those recently. Bands such as Greg Stephens' Boat Band (and his former band Crookfinger Jack) have also kept alive the tunes by playing and recording them, as have the late-lamented Ellen Valley Band, Cumbrian band Striding Edge ... and undoubtedly others too.

It is my intention to pull all my thirty years worth of research together within the next few years in order to publish a book on Cumbrian folk music, dance, song, folk plays etc. There's certainly more than enough material, it's just that I have to spend so much time earning my living as well!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: Matthew Edwards
Date: 10 Jan 07 - 12:33 PM

Sue, thats excellent news that you are planning to publish your material on Cumbrian music. I can appreciate that it will take a lot of time, but it will be well worth waiting for.

I rather hoped Greg would come by to add something to this thread, but perhaps there isn't a great deal more to say on the subject of Lish Young Buy-a-Broom.

However as Sue has mentioned Frank Warriner's collection in the VWML its worth pointing out that the version of the song there is so different from any of the other printed or sung versions that it would have to be described as a creative remaking.

Out of interest though, here is an unflattering description of Buy-a-Broom sellers from around 1825, (scroll down the page) in the Electronic Edition of William Hone's Every-Day Book, 1825-1826.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,crucialmusic
Date: 22 Apr 08 - 04:20 AM

There is now the CRAIG DUGGAN version to add. A CD called Songs of Cumbria to be found on iTunes and http://cdbaby.com/cd/craigduggan.
I hear Craig is planning a Volume 2 so anyone with suggestions can email him via the CDBaby website as I don't have any current contact details

Subject: For Sue Allan -RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Jonnette
Date: 11 May 08 - 04:32 PM

Dear Sue Please contact me on [e-mail]. I am most interested in your interest of Cumbria and it's music. The Denwoods of Cockermouth are the ancestors of my husband. Kind regards

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Oz Childs
Date: 09 Aug 14 - 07:10 PM

What a wonderful lot of research on one of my favorite Tim Hart/Maddy Prior songs! I just assumed that the buy-a-broom was a local product. Women who made brooms and sold them along their road are mentioned in Northumbrian song ("buy broom besoms"). But my assumption had been that most sellers of besoms (brooms) were *old* women, not "lish" at all.

Now I know about the Bavarian girls. That is clearly what prompted the song Hart and Prior sang, which first appeared in print circa 1860 -- maybe earlier, for all I know.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 03 Dec 21 - 09:57 AM

Please forgive me for reviving this decade old thread, but I would like to share some information that has come my way from the Gypsy Folk, and researches into the 18th 19th Century Cant language, some of which is still in use today.
To 'Buy a Brush' (broom) is to abscond with someone else's property. To this day we talk of a 'Brush' with the law.
Secondly guineas in a 'Slap' refers to a 'Slap Bang Shop'. This is somewhere to buy or fence items. A sort of early money laundering.

Our 'lish young Buy a broom', needs a young man to give her an air of respectability to get her into a lodging house wherein she steals all she can lay her hands on, gets rid in a 'slap house' and offers him a job to do the same abroad. By the way 'Beat my little drum, refers to her rear quarters. No need to explain. Notice the change of Clothes with the ribbons etc. All bought in the 'slap shop' with no questions asked. I think I may have cracked the meaning of this song but my mind is wide open.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: RunrigFan
Date: 03 Dec 21 - 10:25 PM

As I went a-walking in the North Country
Down by Kirby Steven I happened for to be
As I was a-walking up and down the street
A pretty little buy-a-broom I chanced upon her to meet

For she was right, I was tight, everybody has their way
It was the lish young buy-a-broom that led me astray

She kindly then invited me to go a little way
Yes was the answer to her I did say
There was me with me music walkin' down the street
And her with her tambourine was beatin' hand and feet

For she was right, I was tight, everybody has their way
It was the lish young buy-a-broom that led me astray

Straight way out for Kendal town we steered her and I
Over young green mountain the weather being dry
We each had a bottle filled up to the top
And whenever we were getting dry we took a little drop

For she was right, I was tight, everybody has their way
It was the lish young buy-a-broom that led me astray

The night was coming on and good lodgings we did find
Eatables of all kind and plenty of good wine
Good bed and blankets just for we two
And I rolled her in me arms me boys, and wouldn't you do too

For she was right, I was tight, everybody has their way
It was the lish young buy-a-broom that led me astray

Early the next morning we arose to go our way
I called unto the landlord to see what was to pay
Fourteen-and-sixpence, just for you two
Four crowns upon the table, my darling then she threw

For she was right, I was tight, everybody has their way
It was the lish young buy-a-broom that led me astray

Well, the reason that we parted, I now shall let you hear
She started off for Germany, right early the next year
But me being unwilling for to cross the raging sea
As sung by Clannad. The lyrics is wrong

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: meself
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 01:00 AM

Seems to me a 'brush with the law' simply uses the common meaning of the verb 'brush': "a quick light touch or momentary contact in passing" - no more obscure origin required.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 03:52 AM

Wrong. Check 'Dictionary of the Vulgar tongue' , Senate Press. under B Brush to run away. On line references as well.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 03:52 AM

Wrong. Check 'Dictionary of the Vulgar tongue' , Senate Press. under B Brush to run away. On line references as well.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 04:55 AM

Sorry did that by accident. I meant to finish by saying that the 'Buy a Broom' line is more a signal of her availability within the ranks of the 'Canting Crew'. Somewhere above a 'Doxie'. All interesting stuff.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: Reinhard
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 04:55 AM

The whole entry in the 1811 Dictionary of the Vulgar Tongue:

TO BRUSH. To run away. Let us buy a brush and lope; let us go away or off. To have a brush with a woman; to lie with her. To have a brush with a man; to fight with him. The cove cracked the peter and bought a brush; the fellow broke open the trunk, and then ran away.

So, 'bought a brush' is confirmed as 'ran away', and a brush with the law should be a fight with the law (officer).

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 05:34 AM

Thanks Reinhard. So you can see the Brush' Broom, motif works on a number of levels within the song. Take a look at 'Slap' used in the broadsheet version above.
I am planning an article for LT on the inner meanings of some well known songs.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: meself
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 11:43 AM

"a brush with the law should be a fight with the law (officer)"

So far, no indication that that idea is the origin of the expression "a brush with the law", or that it's related to the "brush/broom" cant usage -just speculation. An historical example would be more convincing.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 12:21 PM

Take a look at the original broadside for rigs of London Town. It's in heavy Cant and deals with similar story lines.
With respect I think that the modern usage of the 'Brush' motif may have been rationalised from the 'Pick Pocket Eloquence' that sired it.
This is not always the case of course. The word Peter, is still used to represent a box, but mainly used as a slang word for a Prison Cell.
The 'Buy a Broom' song was certainly rationalised by any number of singers. Taken at face value, there is no problem, but further investigation suggests the story was a darker one. Despite Tim and Maddie's album notes the song has nothing to do with Gypsies by the way. Gypsy Folk do not sleep around then or now.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: leeneia
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 01:23 PM

According to my unabridged dictionary, 'lish' is from Scotland and the north of England, and it means "active, agile, quick."

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 04 Dec 21 - 03:23 PM

Gypsy Folk use it as thin but strong. (Lish underworks to a Gypsy Wagon) I was asked to paint lish scrolls, thick to thin signwriting 20mm to 5mm thick thin.
Lish for a woman is slim and willowy.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: leeneia
Date: 05 Dec 21 - 10:16 AM

Thanks for the info, Nick.

The title of this thread, and perhaps of the song, should be punctuated. Lish, Young Buy-a-broom. When I first saw it the title, I thought Lish Young was probably the singer, and Buy a Broom was the name of the song.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: Dave Earl
Date: 05 Dec 21 - 12:13 PM

I got disqualified from the Landlubbers non shanty session (no mention of Sea, Ships Sailors etc) at a Lancaster Maritime Festival for singing this song. I was alright until I got to the penultimate line.
Claiming that it was by no means a sea song didn't help. Rule said "no mention of" so that was me disqualified.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 05 Dec 21 - 03:16 PM

Too harsh! I do hope your disqualification didn't stop you singing the song.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Dec 21 - 06:14 PM

Lish is definitely Cumberland and Westmorland dialect for lithe, agile, fit. And the song is set in Kirkby Stephen and Kendal, both in Westmorland (now Cumbria) I don’t see any reason to look for Gypsy sources for the word when it’s in common usage here.
Sue Allan (in Cumbria)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 05 Dec 21 - 07:06 PM

No I wasn't suggesting Lish was of Gypsy origin, just letting you know that that is where I heard it used, and it's still used, as are numerous dialect words, somewhat uneasily against the Romany language.
However that's a different thread.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lish Young Buy a Broom
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Dec 21 - 04:44 AM

Interesting, Sue. In Northumberland, Newcastle in particular where I worked for a good while, "lush" is used for good looking as in "Wor lad's propa lush, like". Or to describe something pleasant as in "Why aye, that pie were lush". Confused this Lancashire lad no end at first as lush, for me, meant someone who liked their booze a bit too much. Same root I guess.

And thanks for the explanation of "slap ", Nick. It never made sense to me before so I substituted it with "sack". I now know better. Mind you, it would also be better if I wasn't always tempted by "I was right, she was tight..." :-)