BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 02:46 PM

:0)

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,999
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 02:42 PM

`Don`t matter what people call you; it matters what you answer to.`

WC Fields

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 02:40 PM

""Plenty of destructive power there was endured by quite a few Jews, gypsies and homosexuals, among others, as I recall... ""

Ahem....you forgot to mention who they went for first Don....."The Commies"; and as I've been a Commie most of my life, I would suggest that a Tory like you is nearer to Mr Hitler's mindset than I am.

Oh and Don,you've stumbled on my blackest secret.....I'm a closet "liberal"........I hate everyone....equally! :0)

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 01:58 PM

Hello Al...nice to see you back.
I agree pretty much with your take on the psychology of most BNP supporters(from what I have seen of them),they do feel disenfranchised, like many more from all political positions.

We have all see the excesses of "liberalism" even the financial mentdown could be tied to the ideology.
The two most contentious "liberal" issues, "multiculturalism" and the promotion of homosexuality...are not party political but social and health issues....and people hold differing opinions on them regardless of which party they belong to.
When capitalism is in decline, as it is now in the UK, society splits into battle lines, but the problems which lead to that split should be addressed now. The survival of society is more important than the civil rights of often transient racial groups, or sexual minorities.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 01:32 PM

""Plenty of destructive power there was endured by quite a few Jews, gypsies and homosexuals, among others, as I recall... ""

No good trying to talk to Ake about those groups Steve. He's way further to the right than Nick's forerunners on that subject.

Don T

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 01:25 PM

""So we just wait patiently for a couple of hundred years?

Get a fuckin' grip!""

No mate. You get a fucking grip and haul what we laughingly refer to as your mind out of its twelfth century attitudes.

There is no limit to the number of people you hate, or despise, for the differences between us and them, and your bias is couched in the most immoderate language, but no matter how inflammatory your comments, it makes not one jot of difference to the lavck of truth.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 02:49 AM

I've been thinking about what you said in this thread about Blair, Ake.

The thing is, that Blair was no better, no worse than most of the others in his position. Sure he disappointed - but which PM didn't. They're all not really in control of the situation, up the yanks bum by necessity - riding the rollercoaster of international finaciers - admittedly made easier by all the deregulation of recent years, but how much choice did Thatch and major have in that. You have to wonder.

The BNP is something different. I don't think their real aim is to win elections. Their main thing is to recruit people who would like to kick your liberal teeth to the other side of your head. People who feel disenfranchised and are tired of being shouted at by Jeremy Kyle.

You know, Hitler didn't need major numbers of storm troopers to impose his will. Just in little towns all over Germany, they knew if it were requested the storm troopers would arrive.

They'll be arriving in Oldham this week. Coloured folk will walk on the other side of the road when they see gangs of bullet heads in a little knots giving out leaflets. Getting them to wear stars is only a small move from there.

When they've been to a town near you - you will understand.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 19 Dec 10 - 02:03 AM

He's something starting with A
(cryptic clue - everyone'es got one, a location noted for lack of sunshine)

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Smokey.
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 08:50 PM

Is Griffin an atheist?

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 07:42 PM

Anyone who laments the fact that, in the 60s, we called Pakistanis "Pakis," yet are now disapproved of if we talk the same way, and think that this constitutes the loss in part of our heritage, doesn't enjoy the kind of heritage that I want to hang on to, thank you very much.

As for the BNP not having the same destructive power as our mainstream parties (with whom I have no allegiances, by the way), well that could be something to do with the fact that they have not actually had power. Sorry to raise such an obscure point. I could, however, as some sort of indicator at least, point to the destructive power of their fellow travellers in Europe 70 years ago. Plenty of destructive power there was endured by quite a few Jews, gypsies and homosexuals, among others, as I recall...

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 07:09 PM

Yes Silas, they get bored with pedestrian intellects like our own who think Griffins a complete twat, I bet he's off to read the TV times and discuss it with Steamin Willie.

Socrates and Aristotle....

As Tony Hancock said about the leader of his poetry society, "He's on a much higher level. This bloke thinks Bertand Russell is a bit of a charlie...."

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 06:47 PM

What are you talking about Ake?

Surely we should worry about all extreme dangerous authoritarian religions.

The problem with your PoV however is that if you do a bit of reading (other than the daily mail) while there may be room for concern about some expressed views as to the basics of Islam (eg is Jihad the primary duty, and does it refer to the armed struggle against infidels or does it refer to the constant struggle to improve oneself?) it is not in theory a topdown authoritarian belief (unlike catholicism) but one in which the believer must for himself interpret the religion. I hope I have that right.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Smokey.
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 04:26 PM

I'd be interested to know if there's anyone here who thinks 'everything's OK'.. or indeed, that having things 'shaken up a bit' by that fat one-eyed twat and his bunch of ugly crayon chewers could possibly be beneficial to our predicament.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,Silas
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 04:10 PM

Leaving? Again? Really?

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Brian May
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 04:07 PM

Monsieur Akenaton

I really believe we have far more in common than I thought . . .

I find very little to argue with in your last couple of posts.

You, at least, seemed to have grasped my point that it's not actually the immigrants per se (who can blame most of them), but the "it's about misguided souls lining up to give up our heritage to many people who are cynically here (UK) to take, take, take and regard our country with contempt".

I find the 'everything's OK lobby' pretty sickening. If it takes the BNP to shake things up a bit, then he can't be all bad.

I really am going to leave this particular discussion as it will take 20 years or so for these plonkers to realise what they allowed to happen.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 02:17 PM

Well Al, I have a much bigger grievance against Mr Blair, Mr Straw and other assorted "socialists" from the New Labour fold than I do against Mr Griffin and his rag tag faction.

As far as destructive power goes the BNP are not in the same league.
The real enemy are the do-nothing "liberal" evolutionists....."the enablers of Capitalism"

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 02:08 PM

How d'you get from Nick Griffin to this?

You can't vote for him. He's bonkers. that's all there is to it.

Have you seen the BNP? The politicians look(and sound) like The Pub Landlord. The followers look like door men at a night club - all bullet heads and leather jackets and medallions - they look like the kind of people who keep fierce dogs - and that's only the women.

The Mekons probably seemed to have one or two good ideas, but Dan Dare had the measure of them.

If the BNP come round canvassing, give them a blast with your ray gun. Dan Dare would.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 01:30 PM

Exactly so, Smokey!

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Smokey.
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 01:23 PM

The important thing now is to recognise how we have been conned and robbed by our economic system

Darn right it is, Ake, but few want to face up to the reality of that, it seems. It's easier to keep borrowing, and assuming that if everyone pretends it's real money, it'll turn into wealth.

I'm inclined to agree with you about rights and equality too; although laudable ideals, they don't actually exist yet.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 01:00 PM

Sorry pressed the wrong button.

This "liberal" ideology of "rights" and "equality" above all else is madness....Rights and equality are only words they never existed and never will exist especially now when we are going to be struggling to survive....will the pensioner in some sink estate who's heating bills are about to double and whose social services will be cut to the bone through the failure of a stinking greed inspired system have any rights or equality.....I dont fuckin' think so!

And you prats waffle on about the civil rights of religious fanatics who see us as weak dissolute scum; and the civil rights of sexual minorities who behaviour makes them the most unhealthy(and expensive) sections of society.

The important thing now is to recognise how we have been conned and robbed by our economic system ....and to remedy that state of affairs quickly before we are all enslaved in real terms, not just economic terms.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 12:43 PM

So we just wait patiently for a couple of hundred years?

Get a fuckin' grip!

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 09:42 AM

""The 7/7 attacks may have been brought on by our foreign policy, but make no mistake they were a symptom of a clash of cultures, and we will see many more symptoms in the future, unless we are prepared to be assimilated into their way of thinking.

The vast majority of Muslims are devout...nor like us wishy washy Christians.....its no contest really!""

That's what the Normans thought!!!

It's a question of numbers. As more second and third generation immigrant descendants marry English spouses, the division between "us" and "them" grows more indistinct.

In the time of Richard I, it was utterly unthinkable for an English person to marry a jew, whereas now, while the Jews still practise their religion, intermarriage is not only possible, it is commonplace.

Since when did we require anybody to give up the practise of their religion to fit in?

Don T.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Silas
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 09:20 AM

Why should they be 'assimilated? There is nothing wrong with cultural diversity and never has been. We are a richer and better nation for it. There will be points where our cultures converge and there will also be areas where we diverge - that is life. We don't have to hate each other for it.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 09:12 AM

As I have stated several times many racial and religious minorities have absolutely no intention of being "assimilated"

In fact many are prepared to die to stop that "assimilation"

The 7/7 attacks may have been brought on by our foreign policy, but make no mistake they were a symptom of a clash of cultures, and we will see many more symptoms in the future, unless we are prepared to be assimilated into their way of thinking.

The vast majority of Muslims are devout...nor like us wishy washy Christians.....its no contest really!

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 08:35 AM

""Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Brian May - PM
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 01:02 PM

"Loss of our heritage"

I don't know what it means to Nick Griffin, but I do know what it means to me.""

Do you really Brian.

Perhaps you would tell me to which heritage you refer?


The Pict, Scot, or Celt heritage?
The Jute heritage?
The Angle heritage?
The Dane heritage?
The Viking heritage?
The Saxon heritage?
The Roman heritage?
The Norman heritage?
The Dutch heritage?
The German heritage?

Forget about Akenaton's rather transparent red herring, because it doesn't matter how or why they arrived. What matters is that we assimilated them.

Our language is primarily composed of Latin and Greek derived words, with a smattering of all the other languages.

We don't speak French, so we must have assimilated the Normans into our culture, not vice versa, and even Dutch and German imported monarchs adapted to our culture.

Our whole history is one of adaptation and change, and we are arguably the stronger for it. The current situation is merely a step along that road. By espousing or even entertaining the views of bigots, you give credence to their disruptive ideals.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 07:41 AM

Richie. The Christian Council of Britain is a B_N_P front. Among its leaders is the B_N_P_s tame "christian", "Rev." Robert West. The man is a fraud. He is no more a reverend than I am.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 18 Dec 10 - 06:17 AM

I wouldn't blame 'loss of heritage' on any other ethic group. it is a case that the majority of "white British" are so apathetic about our own heritage and traditions, whereas other cultures embrace their heritage and customs.

In terms of major customs, e.g. Christmas, Easter, the have become so commercialised, and I would predict that more people are interested in what is on television in the evening, than looking at either the religious significance, or even the older secular traditions.

If anything, the biggest loss of heritage, in my opinion, was in the first half of the twentieth century, with many customs being revived post-war, and I would argue that our heritage is more alive now than it was 60 years ago.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: frogprince
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 07:58 PM

"foreigners were even welcomed as they actually had FEWER rights than those of us who were born and grew up here."

Would you like to restate that, and see if it still sounds like what it could imply as it's worded now?

"count the mosques"

How many mosques for each church at this point?

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Smokey.
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 07:38 PM

My criticism is of the party's use of that notion as propaganda. We all know fings aint what they used to be, but they never were.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Brian May
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 06:30 PM

You're correct of course, that never occurred to me, how could I be so shallow . . .

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Smokey.
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 05:46 PM

"Losing our heritage" is something that could, and probably has, been claimed at any point in our history. The only constant thing we've ever had is change; it's a nonsensical claim.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Brian May
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 05:30 PM

Whilst that's the mother of back-handed compliments, accepted and thank you.

I most certainly do NOT support bully-boy tactics of any flavour.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,999
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 04:41 PM

I meant no offense to you, Brian. I do understand in a way. But Asshole and his ilk are NOT the answer. I do not perceive you to be a supporter of theirs. You have an IQ over fifty and therefore couldn`t possibly see much good in them.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Brian May
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 04:34 PM

I don't recall giving the BNP any support at all, - beyond saying not everything Nick Griffin says is wrong - it would be an almost inhuman ability for anyone living to be able to get it wrong ALL the time (mind you Dubya got close).

I really don't consider that to be support to 'asshole Nazis', quite the opposite actually, because I'm willing to discuss the topic rather than rely on trotting out the normal stereotypical rhetoric.

I don't support the attacks you've mentioned on ANYONE, irrespective of who they are. What's that actually got to do with the observations I made above - it's also NOT the immigration laws at all - it's about misguided souls lining up to give up our heritage to many people who are cynically here (UK) to take, take, take and regard our country with contempt. History will judge.

Anyway, there are none so blind as those who will not see, so I shall desist from further comment.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,999
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 02:21 PM

Possibly what you do not know and maybe should: these people have fucked people over on Myspace, Youtube and Facebook. I now have two addresses of those who were involved. I expect we will meet at some time or other. I shall certainly try, anyway.

The B-N-P are asshole Nazis, and that`s the best that can be said of them.

As to your immigration laws, speak with your government.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Brian May
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 02:17 PM

'aimed at Brian'

Why on earth would I be ashamed of myself. For not being happy about where this country is going?

Or for being so outrageous as to suggest that just because Nick Griffin is so reviled that everything he says is not wrong.

I think I have again encountered closed minds.

One day, perhaps, you'll wake up and realise just what is gone . . .

What I find surprising is just how spiteful, vehement and vicious people can be that are unwilling to even consider another viewpoint - that's a bit like the things they accuse Nick Griffin of.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,999
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 01:57 PM

`Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect`

So, he`ll be sober that day I guess.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Silas
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 01:16 PM

My post was aimed at Brian

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Silas
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 01:15 PM

So, it's foreigners' that are responsible for all this is it?

Seldom do I get the opportunity to read such mindless drivel - you should be ashamed of yourself.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Richie Black (misused acct, bad email)
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 01:14 PM

My late wife was born in South Africa of British parents. We lived out there for a short time. Griffin reminds me of Ian Smith. Smith Was a nasty piece of work. He also used to go on about his service in the RAF. His Hurricane crashing, his Spitfire being shot down. Smith was a narrow-minded bigot who promoted division and hatred. Why do these people always bring up service history ?

The British National Party worship a regime and political philosophy that would enslave the British people. The BNP offer hope to no one. They are built on hate and full of poison, they are toxic.

They also call themselves a "Christian Party". Last year they held a secret meeting in Winsford Lifestyle Centre. They booked the hall under the name of the "Christian Council of Britain". Believe me, will not be allowed to do that again.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,Chris B (Born Again Scouser)
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 01:05 PM

I think Nanci Griffith should stand as well just to confuse 'em.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Brian May
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 01:02 PM

"Loss of our heritage"

I don't know what it means to Nick Griffin, but I do know what it means to me.

When I was growing up in the 50s and 60s, I could pretty much say or write what I pleased and the worst I risked was a bollocking from a 'grown up'.

We had toys called gollywogs - much loved by kids . . .

Nursery rhymes such as Baa Baa Black Sheep were fun for kids . . .

We had stopcocks for turning off fluids in pipes . . .

We had manhole covers that allowed inspections of sub-surface utilities . . .

I could describe myself as a 'Brit' and someone from Pakistan as a 'Paki' . . .

We looked forward to Christmas, not XMas, or Season's Greetings . . .

Asylum seekers who had been convicted of crimes, then fatally injuring a little girl with their car and leaving her to die . . . would have been sent home - without considering HIS human rights . . .

People were not afraid to clear the snow outside their house (and perhaps even the neighbour's too) because if someone slipped, they'd say 'oops' . . .

We played and enjoyed silly things like rolling cheeses downhill, playing conkers and riding our bikes (with lights) . . .

Perhaps this is just an insight to what I mean when I say 'loss of our heritage'. There's plenty more over the last 60 years, but above is just a sample.

We didn't even know what politically correct meant, foreigners were even welcomed as they actually had FEWER rights than those of us who were born and grew up here.

We were a lot more PROUD to be British (before that became a joke amongst the manic do-gooders).

So, is Nick Griffin a fascist? Probably, but that doesn't make everything he says wrong.

I lament the changes I've seen in the last few years, we are losing our identity or more accurately, it's being stripped and given away by well meaning individuals and groups who won't address reality for what it is.

WE are being exploited. If you doubt it, have a good read of Wikileaks, listen to what the vocal 'british Moslems' are saying, count the mosques.

But you can dismiss me as another 'rabid fascist' or you can consider the levels of frustration that causes a response such as this. Do me a favour, go back and read it again, suspend disbelief and consider that me and mine (generation) might just have a point too.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,alan whittle
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 11:26 AM

whoever is safeguarding our culture, I don't want the BNP doing it. Their record speaks for itself.

Some of the leaders have very dodgy backgrounds (possession of explosives )and one of their number did the gay pub bombing - isn't that so?

they're a bad lot.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Silas
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 11:24 AM

How can you possibly lose a heritage? What EXACTLY does it mean?

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Ringer
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 11:19 AM

"Phrases like 'concerned for the loss of our heritage' are exactly the mealy-mouthed utterances of a closet racist."

So how does one discuss our heritage and its possible loss without being labelled a closet racist by the fascist word-police?

Or is our heritage not a fit subject for discussion?

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 10:32 AM

SPB. Griffin won't win, or even come close. But Oldham is one of the BNP strongholds and it has a high Muslim population. The present election will be a very good opportunity for the BNP to stir up inter-ethnic conflict. They will stir it because they know there are people in this world who are daft enough to support them and blame the Muslim population for the resulting violence.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 10:27 AM

Akenaton. Nick Griffin's father wasn't fighting fascists in WW2. He worked in radar. Nothing wrong with that but, as David Dimbleby said when Griffin gave forth with this remark, "What's that got to do with it".

Griffin is a fascist whether his father fought in WW2 or not.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 10:23 AM

Is his intention of standing to win a seat, or just to bring in thugs (sorry activists) during the campaign to stir up as much hatred and racial divide as possible?

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: Silas
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 08:26 AM

Well, I don't. Far from it. Phrases like 'concerned for the loss of our heritage' are exactly the mealy-mouthed utterances of a closet racist.

Subject: RE: BS: Nick Griffin to stand in Oldham by-elect
From: GUEST,Alan Whittle
Date: 17 Dec 10 - 08:20 AM

The thing about the Conservative, Labour, Monster Raving Looney Party, etc - they don't involve huge police presence.

We should be able to charge them (financially) for costing us so much.

Given the fact that so many English people were killed in a war against fascism - the BNP is a bit like if I formed a Lets Shit in Drinking water Party. It outrages people - its very presence does.