BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: BTNG
Date: 08 Nov 11 - 07:17 PM

a rose by any other name

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Bert
Date: 08 Nov 11 - 07:05 PM

saulgoldie, That sums it up precisely.

That would make gnu - ugn.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: BTNG
Date: 08 Nov 11 - 05:19 PM

right

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: gnu
Date: 08 Nov 11 - 04:58 PM

Said it before.... the real time is Stardate -311145.8977042112.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Ed T
Date: 08 Nov 11 - 11:27 AM

The International Space Station uses UTC/GMT.


facts about time

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Ed T
Date: 08 Nov 11 - 11:23 AM

Offset time zones
time zone map

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: BTNG
Date: 08 Nov 11 - 09:44 AM

Sir Stanford Fleming Inventor of worldwide standard time

After missing a train in 1876 in Ireland because its printed schedule listed p.m. instead of a.m., he proposed a single 24-hour clock for the entire world, located at the centre of the Earth and not linked to any surface meridian. At a meeting of the Royal Canadian Institute on February 8, 1879 he linked it to the anti-meridian of Greenwich (now 180°). He suggested that standard time zones could be used locally, but they were subordinate to his single world time, which he called Cosmic Time. He continued to promote his system at major international conferences[4] including the International Meridian Conference of 1884. That conference accepted a different version of Universal Time, but refused to accept his zones, stating that they were a local issue outside its purview. Nevertheless, by 1929 all of the major countries of the world had accepted time zones.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Gurney
Date: 08 Nov 11 - 02:01 AM

Uncle Dave, I thought that standardisation of time zones was for navigational purposes? Specifically, navigation by the Royal Navy?

I may be wrong, of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: ChanteyLass
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 10:48 PM

Thank you for the opinions on the question I raised about pay to third shift workers who work when the time changes.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: gnu
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 06:44 PM

Yes, Bill D but some disagree just to disagree, so it seems.

Others seem to chime in on such diasagreement without saying they haven't read the thread. BTW, for those posters, it's obvious eh? NNWW.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 06:37 PM

"Time zones make sense. Shuffling the clocks back and forth doesn't, except possibly in far north and far south latitudes. "

If it makes sense for a majority, it makes sense for everyone to comply. We have not only railroad timetables, but radio & TV broadcasts and airline schedules. Having a different basic time for Maine than California makes sense because they are 3+ hours apart, but it would NOT make sense for Maine & Florida in the same basic longitude to have different times. The fewer complexities the better.

Think about it... people on the Eastern edge of a time zone already see a significant difference in sunrise/sunset than those on the Western edge. If North/South were added in, it would be crazy.

It is my opinion that the ONLY real effect the change is, is the suddenness of it. If all our clocks & computers, etc. were automatically changed by a few minutes a day as the seasons change, we'd barely notice. Farmers would still do certain tasks according to the light, but the 'time' they did would gradually change.

In Dec./Jan. some kids would be walking to school or waiting for a bus in the dark if we made DST year 'round, and in the Summer, vacation activities would be curtailed unnecessarily if no changes were made. DST does make sense....perhaps more for some than for others, but in a global society, we need a coherent, orderly system.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Ed T
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 06:24 PM

Light Verse

It's just five, but it's light like six.
It's lighter than we think.
Mind and day are out of sync.
The dog is restless.
The dog's owner is sleeping and dreaming of Elvis.
The treetops should be dark purple,
but they're pink.

Here and now. Here and now.
The sun shakes off an hour.
The sun assumes its pre-calendrical power.
(It is, though, only what we make it seem.)
Now in the dog-owner's dream,
the dog replaces Elvis and grows bigger
than that big tower

in Singapore, and keeps on growing until
he arrives at a size
with which only the planets can empathize.
He sprints down the ecliptic's plane,
chased by his owner Jane
(that's not really her name), who yells at him
to come back and synchronize.

— VIJAY SESHADRI, author of "The Long Meadow"

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Ed T
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 06:18 PM

""Benjamin Franklin conceived of it. Sir Arthur Conan Doyle endorsed it. Winston Churchill campaigned for it. Kaiser Wilhelm first employed it. Woodrow Wilson and Franklin Roosevelt went to war with it, and the United States fought an energy crisis with it"".

Definitive Book on Daylight Saving Time

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: BTNG
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 05:31 PM

all this fuss over nothing LOL

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: saulgoldie
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 05:20 PM

When told the reason for daylight savings time the Old Indian said, "Only the government would believe that you could cut a foot off the top of a blanket, sew it to the bottom, and have a longer blanket."

Saul

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: GUEST,999
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 04:15 PM

This thread was off the rails at post one.

EST--Eastern Socialist Time
CST--Central Socialist Time
PST--Pacific Socialist Time

Nothin' to do with those damned commies.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 04:05 PM

Time zones make sense. Shuffling the clocks back and forth doesn't, except possibly in far north and far south latitudes.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Genie
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 03:04 PM

DK if DST is a commie plot, but at least now that we're actually on Standard Time, when people and the media, etc., keep announcing that something happened or will happen at such-and-such o'clock "EST" or "CST" or "PST," etc., they'll be right.   

When DST is in effect, they really mean "EDT," CDT," "PDT," etc.

DK why even the professional media can't seem to grasp the correct terminology. (How could "PST" stand for "Pacific Daylight Time" or "CST" stand for "Central Daylight Time?"

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Ed T
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 02:40 PM

If it's your shift when DST starts, you either work an hour less or more. But, of course they get paid ;)

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 12:31 PM

We all have a 'Body Clock', and to try and trick it is a dodgy business. I'm always awake and up early, 6am, need a nice nap mid-afternoon, and go to bed early, 10pm say. When travelling I can doze off if it's my usual sleep time, even leaning against an airport wall in a queue! But trying to keep awake until 1am to board a cheap flight I feel dizzy, shivery and ill. I honestly can't see the point nowadays of changing the clocks twice a year. What is it FOR?

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 09:46 AM

ChanteyLass and Ed T: I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "docked." Ordinarily (I think) "docked" means reduced pay, not reduced hours. If you're implying workers work 8 hours but only get paid for 7 (which is what I thought you meant at first), I'm sure you're wrong. But (as I finally realized after pondering this problem for a long time) that's probably not what you meant.

My guess is, in the spring, when DST begins, one shift works for 7 hours, and in the fall, they work 9 hours. There might be other, more complicated ways of managing the change. You might have 3 shifts in a row each work 7 hours and 40 minutes in the spring, and 8 hours and 20 minutes in the fall, which would be safer and more fair, in my opinion. But regardless, each worker should get paid for the actual number of hours he/she works.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 09:46 AM

Katlaughing said:

My dad, who really wasn't religious, said Standard Time was "God's Time" and good enough for him. Me, too.:-)

Kat, Standard Time is neither "God's Time" nor natural time. The establishment of time zones is a creation of government just as much as Daylight Saving Time. "Natural time" or "Sun Time" is smooth, as gradual as the relative position of the sun. If there are four cities, let's say in a straight line east and west, even if they were fairly close to each other the natural or sun time will be different in each.

Time zones were created (by government) largely to facilitate the building of the transcontinental railroads. You couldn't run the railroads efficiently or safely when every point on a railroad had a separate time of its own; there had to be a standard time structure in order to organize the scheduling of train traffic.

Daylight Saving Time is no more artificial nor governmental than Standard Time.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 07 Nov 11 - 08:41 AM

Or why not wait until the Christmas break to put the clocks back when most people are at home. All we gain in October is a short time of lighter mornings. In the UK we have had the hottest October on record if we keep on having hot Octobers like this what is the advantage of an extra hour in bed?

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Ed T
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 09:43 PM

ChanteyLass -I believe it is as you state.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: ChanteyLass
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 08:53 PM

Has anyone here worked third shift which includes the 2 AM hour at which we are supposed to set clocks back or ahead? I have always wondered if workers get an extra hour of pay in the fall but get docked an hour in the spring.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Bert
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 08:13 PM

...Wait...aren't we going off Daylight Idiotic Savings Sure Time instead of going on it?...

Of course mg. But going ON it isn't a problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Ed T
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 08:02 PM

So, why are all so neggy on night life? I suspect many of us were conceived outside of daylight hours.


""Night time is the right time, to be with the one you love"" Ray Charles

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: mg
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 07:50 PM

Wait...aren't we going off Daylight Idiotic Savings Sure Time instead of going on it? And go on it in the summer? mg

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: gnu
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 07:50 PM

Oh come on, read my lips.. or my entire posts? Do you honestly believe that this has been adopted by MANY jurisdictions around the world because they are stupid or want to control you?

Unfuckingreal to me.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: BTNG
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 06:40 PM

oh right it's a government plot now, not a "commie plot"

Conspiracy theorists unite you have nothing lose but sleep!

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Bert
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 06:30 PM

gnu says "I cannot understand why some people think that such a simple concept which has such benefits is SUCH an inconvenience to them."

Because it is an even simpler concept to get up and go to bed when you need to or when you want to and not when the Government decides that you should. Then nobody is inconvenienced, and the benefits will be reaped by only those who want them.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Joe_F
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 06:29 PM

Noncommie comment

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Ed T
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 05:41 PM

I suspect North Korea and Cuba are the only true "commie" countries, anymore. Cuba does DST, North Korea does not. So, it's a 50-50 "commie plot", at best.

Who does it and who does not

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: GUEST,999
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 03:22 PM

I'm with you, gnu. Try running a business when yer in St John's and yer customer is in Victoria. And if a place like the UK thinks it has difficulties, imagine living in Russia:

"Russia Reduces Number of Time Zones

Published 23-Mar-2010. Changed 4-May-2010

Update: Russia will most likely make a final decision on time zone changes in the fall (autumn) of 2010, First Deputy Prime Minister Igor Shuvalov announced on Friday, April 30, 2010. There are currently three time zones in the Russian Far East, and the presidential envoy to the federal district, Viktor Ishayev, believed that one more should be dropped.

Starting Sunday March 28, 2010, Russia will have nine time zones instead of 11. Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin recently signed decrees to abolish the time zones of four Russian regions."

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 03:18 PM

New Brunswick, gnu? That's way south of us here in England. The same as the middle of France. You must have fiercely early school hours if the kids would be walking to school in the dark if the clocks didn't go back in the autumn. Or they must be walking an awfully long way to go to school.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: gnu
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 02:53 PM

In Moncton, New Brunswick, Canada and in a great percentage of the world, DST optimizes the use of daylight for working, saves energy and also allows children to walk to school more safely. I cannot understand why some people think that such a simple concept which has such benefits is SUCH an inconvenience to them. It's not all about you... is it?

Oh, I suppose we could change the time of work and study and whatever to acheive the same results but it's the SAME thing. Suck it up people. It ain't rocket science. If ya wanna change the time ya hafta be at work, go for it... petition the governments so you don't hafta spring back and fall forward. Just remember... it's still gonna be the SAME to acheive the SAME benefits. The ONLY difference is that you don't hafta change yer clocks and that businesses will have to put up new sign's for their hours of operation, change their adds in the yellow pages, change their telephone ansering machines... need I go on? GEEZE OH EH?

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: GUEST,Arkie
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 02:47 PM

All available from the internet for the curious. Here are some shortcuts for the semi-curious who want to avoid the search.

Rationale

B. Franklin Essay

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Gurney
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 02:44 PM

Well, that's Bobert's assertion that DST is a commie plot shot down in flames! One glance at McGrath's map shows that the commies don't do it.

I suppose he could mean that they are trying to bring down the western world by making them get up earlier. But they'll have to get up earlier themselves if they want to do that!

All DST means to me is that I get an extra hour of sleep in Spring. Sounds silly to say that, but it is the Morning Chorus of birds that wakes me up.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 02:24 PM

Where's "here" gnu? Not where moist people live, I think. Maybe up near the Arctic Circle it might make sense. So that's where to keep on doing it.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Bert
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 01:49 PM

And isn't it funny how just by changing the name of something they can get people to agree to it.

If they were to come out and say "Everyone has to get up an hour earlier" there would be worldwide protests and the whole idea would die quickly.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Bert
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 01:46 PM

I'm with GUEST Eliza on this as I wake up an hour earlier and can't get back to sleep for weeks after they put the clocks back. I think that we should all get the home phone numbers of our representatives and spend that hour every day calling them.

And what McGrath says is really the truth of it and it bears repeating.

"It's a bloody silly idea anyway. I think governments do it just do it so that twice a year they can feel important, with everybody doing what they are told, even though it makes absolutely no sense."

It is really a Bureaucratic Plot. And unrestrained bureaucrats are the biggest threat to modern society.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: gnu
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 01:27 PM

"...other than kids walking to school..but that is offset in the afternoon..."

Not here.

Think of the children! >;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 12:45 PM

you're getting an extra HOUR of sleep

Rubbish. They just take it back from you in the spring.

It's a bloody silly idea anyway. I think governments do it just do it so that twice a year they can feel important, with everybody doing what they are told, even though it makes absolutely no sense.

Here is a world map showing where it's done (th e blue bits)and where it's not done. The encouraging thing is the orange part, showing where they have given up doing it.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: BTNG
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 12:27 PM

yup that Saskatchewan for you...I know, I live here LOL

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: GUEST,999
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 12:24 PM

"TIME SYSTEM IN SASKATCHEWAN
FACT SHEET

The provincial government (of Saskatchewan) received requests to adopt Daylight Saving Time, has examined the issue in detail and has decided to retain the current time system established under The Time Act for all of Saskatchewan. This issue is a divisive one with no consensus apparent within the whole province.

Saskatchewan is naturally located within the Mountain Standard Time (MST) zone which runs from just west of Winnipeg, Manitoba to just east of Lethbridge, Alberta.

Under The Time Act, Saskatchewan adopted Central Standard Time and therefore shares the same time as Alberta during the summer months and the same time as Manitoba during the winter months.

Prior to the implementation of The Time Act in 1966, the question of time was the responsibility of municipalities. Under The Cities Act and The Towns Act of the day, bylaws could be passed at any time through the conduct of a plebiscite on the question of observed time. This resulted in a patchwork of time zones in Saskatchewan with communities using Central Standard Time, Mountain Standard Time or Daylight Saving Time as their local time.

The Time Act of 1966 was a compromise solution that allowed all of the province to observe Central Standard Time. During the summer months all of Saskatchewan observes Central Standard Time. Only the Battle River (Lloydminster) Time Option area follows Mountain Standard Time during the winter. The rest of the province is on Central Standard Time year round."

Lloydminster has a neat history.

The History of Lloydminster

The Lloydminster area was first settled in April, 1903 with the arrival of the Barr Colonists, approximately 2,600 people from England. The new settlement was named in honour of Rev. Lloyd for his efforts in leading the colonists.

Lloydminster is derived from Rev. Lloyd and the word "minster", meaning "mother church". The newly founded hamlet of Lloydminster was located astride the 4th Meridian in the Northwest Territories. When the provinces of Alberta and Saskatchewan were created in 1905 and the 4th Meridian selected as the inter-provincial boundary, the Village of Lloydminster was split in two. The Alberta portion of the divided community was incorporated as a Village in Alberta in July, 1906, while the Saskatchewan portion was incorporated as a Town in Saskatchewan in April, 1907.

This peculiar situation resulted in the duplication of all municipal functions such as the creation of two separate municipal councils, two municipal offices and two fire departments. Common sense prevailed and the two communities were amalgamated into a single municipality - the Town of Lloydminster, by an Order-in-Council of both provinces on May 20, 1930. On January 1, 1958 the Town of Lloydminster received its charter as the City of Lloydminster and became the 10th City in both provinces."

(I know a fellow in Quebec who lives in a house that straddles the Canada-US border. He watches TV in Canada but gets snacks from his fridge in the US. Don't know what will happen to him and his home when Homeland Security builds the wall.)

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: BTNG
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 12:09 PM

There are parts of North America, where it doesn't matter...the time never changes so we don't have to worry about changing the time on the clocks, twice a year!

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: GUEST,999
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 11:59 AM

If DST had been a commie plots, it would have been dragged before the Senate in the HUAC hearings.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 11:45 AM

Amos, the cows do care. They are very compassionate creatures. ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 11:35 AM

MtheGM - Hey, I'd be absolutely delighted to live in Cuba...if I had a means of making a living there and the other basic legal and practical arrangements in place there. The weather's nice (with the exception of an occasional hurricane), the people are wonderful, the social life is marvelous, the attitude to life is relaxed and friendly, the elections are honest, and it's altogether a really nice place to be.

However, my job, my property, and all my practical and legal basics are presently established in Canada. Therefore, I am glad to live in Canada, because it's a pretty nice place to be too. (except for the winter weather)

If all my practical and legal basics were established in France, I'd be happy to be there too.

Ditto for Vietnam, Norway, Denmark, Germany, Sweden, Italy, and a variety of other places I can think of.

Communism's got nothing to do with it.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Daylight's Savings Time a Commie Plot
From: Amos
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 11:20 AM

I believe the driving force behind time standardization was the railroads, who needed it for obvious reasons--they connected all the local zones and couldn't change their schedules for everybackwater's neighborhood opinion.

As for DST, I don't think it makes a whole lot of sense. After all, if you want to sleep another hour, why not just get up at 5:30 instead of 4:30?

Do the cows care?

A