BS: Groan...another US Presidential election

Subject: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 07:14 AM

Here in the UK the news coverage has already begun. Only another 11 months to endure...

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: number 6
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 07:40 AM

I agree ..... it's about as boring, stupid, and honest as a season of American Idol and it has the same hyped up, over produced drama.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: catspaw49
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 08:55 AM

Y'all have already missed the Iowa Caucus where we were treated to the great Circus Debates. The Klown Kar would pull up and this shitload of clowns would emerge and say some really funny stuff. Really!


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 08:58 AM

Grrrr-r-r-r-o-o-o-o-o-a-a-a-a-n-n-n-n-nnnnnn!

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: GUEST,999
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 09:11 AM

"If we would learn what the human race really is at bottom, we need only observe it in election times."

Mark Twain


"ELECTOR, n. One who enjoys the sacred privilege of voting for the man of another man's choice."

Ambrose Bierce

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: GUEST,Wesley S
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 09:18 AM

I'm luckier than most folks. My TV has an off switch and when the election news gets to be too much for me I use it. Sometimes I even change the channel.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Musket
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 09:22 AM

Look on the bright side. Here in The UK, it used to be important to see who had most world influence, (traditionally, the tenant of The White House) so we took a passing interest.

In terms of world super powers and influence, I suppose we should at least get to know the name of China's President, even if we 1) have contempt for his regime and b) have even more contempt for those who court his money, hence giving respectability to their experiment with state capitalism.

There, that's my "some of my best friends are socialists" rant of the day done. Now back to feeding mammon.

(Out of interest, will he have a clear victory or has The Republican Party found someone yet who doesn't go to tea parties and might just be electable?)

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Rapparee
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 10:30 AM

If you think it's bad in the UK, you oughta live in the US.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: GUEST,999
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 10:33 AM

You can now be arrested for saying that, Rap.

Omerta, capiche?

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 12:41 PM

Horrifying, isn't it? Well, try to look on the humorous side of it, I guess. I thank God I am not obliged to choose between the Democrats and the Republicans at election time!

This time, strike a blow for freedom! Vote for Chongo and the APP. Put a REAL chimp in the White House.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 12:54 PM

Unfortunately I'm not allowed to vote!

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: gnu
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 02:34 PM

As said on previous threads... there oughta be a law! In Canuckville, it's 6 weeks (although that has lately been subverted by negative ads in advance of an election call). Of course, in the US it would have to be longer but it's ridiculous in it's length and moreso in the way it's done. Then again, the US can't even convert to the System International for weights and measures so I suppose changing the electoral systems rules ain't gonna happen any time soon.

Sorry if that pisses anyone off. Just the way I see it.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Ebbie
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 03:53 PM

I actually enjoy the process; well, I can't really say 'enjoy', but I do find it interesting, if only for the flabbergasting aspects.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 04:14 PM

I watched the Iowa caucus extensive reporting by Kattie Kay on the BBC. She was all excited about that non-event; but she didn't know the difference between a caucus and a primary, and seemed to imply that the result here was all that was needed to give Romney the nomination at the Convention. Amusing!

As I noted elsewhere, some 100,000 balloted, but in an election, Iowans cast some 1.5 million votes. The Ambrose Bierce definition of an Elector (voter) as given above by 999 is apt. Those few caucusnuts determine Iowans vote in the Republican Convention.

Agree with catspaw, but the KlownKar really was loaded with Asylum escapees.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: GUEST,olddude
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 04:50 PM

Yup the suffering starts in this country also ... Hopefully one of them does something to make us laugh as Spaw says , otherwise it will be a long haul to endure

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 05:03 PM

The least funny one is Romney and he chases issues around like a kitten chasing a string.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Donuel
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 05:16 PM

Aren't you the least bit curious to find out what 40 billion dollars (of which only 10% is traceable) will buy this election cycle?

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 06:19 PM

I think it'll buy more of the same.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Janie
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 08:36 PM

As I listen to the sound bites and spin, I often ask myself - how mindless do they think we are? Then, as I listen to the polling numbers in reaction and the interviews with "the person on the street" I realize how lazy and thoughtless and easily manipulated John and Jane Q. Public really are. (regardless of their main political paradigm.)

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 08:40 PM

$40 billion is only about $300 per vote. Greases the economy a little bit. So what?

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Donuel
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 08:49 PM

This is rich...

The Republican party in Virginia has created a rule that requires people who vote in the primary to take and sign an OATH that they must vote for the final chosen candidate of the Republican party in November 2012.

The only thing different than a similar rule in 1933 Germany is if they check up on people to be certain they kept their oath.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Rapparee
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 08:53 PM

I wonder if the VA Republicans have heard of the Constitution?

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Janie
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 09:01 PM

Can you provide a link for that, Donuel?

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Rapparee
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 09:11 PM

Virginia Lawmaker Criticizes GOP for Requiring Primary Loyalty Oath

Published January 01, 2012 | FoxNews.com

A Virginia Republican lawmaker is criticizing his state party for requiring primary voters to sign a so-called loyalty oath in order to vote in the March 6 presidential primary.

The state's Board of Elections approved the proposal earlier in the week. Going forward, voters who arrive at polling sites in March will be required to sign the following statement:

"I, the undersigned, pledge that I intend to support the nominee of the Republican Party for president."

The idea is to keep out impostor Republicans, given that Virginia has an open primary, meaning voters of all political stripes, not just Republicans, can participate in the party's presidential primary.

But Robert Marshall, a state delegate, told Fox News the plan effectively would require residents in some cases to commit to a candidate they're not yet familiar with.

"For the Republican Party to depart so far from what the founders wanted, I think, is a mistake," he said.

It's not the first time the state GOP has made voters pledge their allegiance. Back in 2000, they had voters sign a pledge saying they wouldn't participate in the nominating process of any other parties. The latest measure is more strict -- even though it is not enforceable and anybody who breaks the pledge will face no punishment.

According to the Richmond Times-Dispatch, even absentee voters will receive a notice to inform them of the pledge.

Meanwhile, Virginia's presidential primary ballot currently only includes two candidates -- Ron Paul and Mitt Romney. The rest did not meet the state's signature requirement, though the other candidates are challenging their exclusion in court.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Bobert
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 09:14 PM

Yes, the Republican dominated Virgina General Assembly did push thru "The Oath" but seems that the backlash bas been so great that, if I have it correctly, even Virginia's Attorney in General, Ken Cucinelli, who BTW is a thug, is going to try to have it reversed...

As for the election??? We no longer have governing... We are in a low grade civil war and everything has become a campaign for the next election...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Janie
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 09:57 PM

Thanks, Rap.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Bobert
Date: 06 Jan 12 - 10:55 PM

Thanks, Rap...

I check out the Richmond Times-Dispatch every day on line... I have been readin' about this one...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: David C. Carter
Date: 07 Jan 12 - 06:18 AM

We've got one coming up soon,April I think.

The only person in our house who can vote is our son,and I really don't think he's going to drag himself across the street to do so.

Anyway,seems most people here vote,not to put someone in,but to boot out the rabble that hold power at present,Sarkozy and Co.               


David

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Bainbo
Date: 07 Jan 12 - 06:36 AM

I read one UK newspaper columnist who claimed to have friends who were looking forward to it because they regarded it as a "soap opera for clever people" ... by which, of course, they meant themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 07 Jan 12 - 10:46 AM

Strikes me that "The Oath" requirement is a waste of time anyway unless the ballot for the chosen candidate isn't secret, which it surely is?

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Rapparee
Date: 07 Jan 12 - 12:36 PM

Yes, they admit that it's unenforceable and that makes the whole thing even more stupid than it has to be.

Out here in Idaho the Republicans get a requirement passed requiring a photo id to vote. Then they discovered that, for instance, a new address might not be on a driver's license -- they learned this when the head of the Republican party here was denied a vote in the election last November because the address on his driver's license didn't match with one on the polling records.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Ebbie
Date: 07 Jan 12 - 01:35 PM

In America voted ballots are secret. Except when they are not.

Absentee ballots have to be read and logged. Although there are strict rules governing the person(s) checking in the absentee votes, each absentee ballot has to be signed or it is not legal. Therefore, if that voter had signed such a pledge it would be possible to invalidate that person's vote.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 07 Jan 12 - 01:36 PM

The Chinese water torture of the drips in the GOP "debates" has shifted into a full-on tap - thus beginning the waterboarding of America by the next 11 months of political campaigning. It must look like so much navel-gazing to the rest of the world.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Stringsinger
Date: 07 Jan 12 - 02:03 PM

This may be one of the worst in U.S. history. Democratic warmongers. Insane Republican elitists. Money controlling both parties and ignoring the needs of
the American people. A corrupt Supreme Court, a recalcitrant Senate and House,
a spewing of phony religious parsimony, a misappropriation of the American economy by special interests, and a crackdown on honest freedom of speech by bought and paid for law enforcement bodes very poorly for our country, not to mention a trashing of our Constitutional rights.

We are in big trouble.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Ebbie
Date: 07 Jan 12 - 03:31 PM

When I look back upon most of the last several American elections and administrations this year presents a predictable scenario. From at least Reagan on, candidates and outcomes have been pointing in this direction.

The really scary part is that we can't be sure that we have reached the nadir. The trend may continue.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 07 Jan 12 - 10:43 PM

Ummm..is that the time we all get lied to by everybody???...Jeez, what a bunch of 'suspense'.....soap operas for old people!

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Allan C.
Date: 08 Jan 12 - 08:45 AM

I imagine that one of the most difficult jobs is being a political reporter whose task it is to find anything exciting to report.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Jan 12 - 12:26 PM

They solved that years ago. Now, they make it up.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 08 Jan 12 - 12:51 PM

When I first skimmed a newspaper article (no, I didn't read it), I thought one of the candidates was called Sanitorium!

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: GUEST,999
Date: 08 Jan 12 - 04:00 PM

Regarding the thread title, was there supposed to be an 's' on election?

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 08 Jan 12 - 04:40 PM

Pete Jennings: "When I first skimmed a newspaper article (no, I didn't read it), I thought one of the candidates was called Sanitorium!"

Absolutely NO relation!!!..Nor are we from the same neighborhood!!!

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Little Hawk
Date: 08 Jan 12 - 11:55 PM

Here's the latest article from Eric Margolis:

A GENTLE VOICE OF REASON IN IOWA'S RIGHT-WING DEMENTIA
NEW YORK

January 07, 2012

America has come back, at least politically, to where it was in the far-off 1950's when Communist-scares and the modern fascism of Wisconsin Senator Joe McCarthy kept the republic in a state of anxiety and deep fear.
"Reds under our beds" was the slogan in those days of paranoia and witch-hunting. Today, the new scare is: "Muslims under our mattresses," and "Iran threatens the world."

In the McCarthy era, his Republican Party was run by East Coast moderate conservatives from New York, Boston and Washington who were well educated and worldly.

The Republican elite eventually became sickened by McCarthy's lies and alarms that the government was filled with Communists and Soviet spies.

The Soviets and their fellow travellers were a real danger, but not to the absurd degree of McCarthy's fevered claims. But for a while, his anti-Communist campaign intimidated American and held it in thrall.

Last week, we witnessed the rebirth of McCarthyism in the Iowa presidential caucus (an informal vote) as five Republican candidates struggled to outdo one another in warning of the peril of Iran and Islam – the new Red Menace.

The only Republican candidates who spoke responsibly about US foreign policy were Congressman Ron Paul and minor candidate Jon Huntsman. The other Republicans issued blood-curdling threats against Iran, and salaamed Israel without stop, heedless of the awful image of America they were presenting to the rest of world.

Iowa, a remote farming state filled by fundamentalist born again Christians, accounts for only 1% of US voters. These Bible Belt religious zealots get much of their view of the outside world either from extreme right-wing Christian radio networks, or equally right-wing, pro-Israel Fox News.

Over the past 30 years, the Republican rightwing has become joined at the hip with Israel's hard right Likud Party, hence the emergence of so-called "Christian Zionists" who are cynically exploited by Israel's Likud Party even though a generation ago their fathers may have belong to the racist, Jewish-hating Ku Klux Klan.

In short, fertile ground for the Republican party's far right. We are reminded of the great American writer Upton Sinclair, who wrote in the 1930's "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross."

Accordingly, Republican candidates Mitt Romney, Rick Santorum, Newt Gingrich, Texas governor Rick Perry, and Michele Bachmann vied with one another to proclaim themselves the most devout Christian, ardent patriot, social conservative and advocate of war against Iran and its friends. Prostituting oneself to radical special interests may be good politics in rural Iowa, but it bad, bad medicine for the nation these politicians claim to represent.

Almost as bad, the calm, reasoned, sensible words of candidate Ron Paul were barely heard thanks to a conspiracy of silence by the mainstream media which bitterly opposes his calls for an end to foreign wars and big government built on a mountain of debt.

No wonder. The 76-year old Dr Paul speaks for many Americans, particularly younger ones, who are sick of war, propaganda, the growing police state, and seeing government dominated by Wall Street and special interests.

Dr. Paul asked me to Washington to brief him on Afghanistan. After, I wrote that Paul was the most honest and bravest political leader I'd met in Congress.

Dr. Paul's strong finish sends a potent message of anti-war, rebellious sentiment to Washington and President Barack Obama. There is intense disgust and dismay among Democrats, independents and even some moderate Republicans that Obama has caved into Wall Street and Israel's American lobby.

Obama's stealthy signing of a bill over Christmas that allows the Pentagon to indefinitely lock up American citizens accused of "terrorism" without trial has deeply alarmed many Americans. Even George W. Bush didn't do this.

The Republican presidential contest now moves on to New Hampshire and South Carolina, both relatively conservative states, though very different from one another. Bachmann has dropped out.

Mitt Romney leads in both states. But most American's don't trust him and think he's a phony. So the race remains open and boisterous. The Republican establishment continues to look over its shoulder in fear at the candidate who really represents the true values of America, Ron Paul.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Ebbie
Date: 09 Jan 12 - 12:18 AM

"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross." Upton Sinclair

Wow

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Jan 12 - 12:33 AM

Yup. That says it in a nutshell. I've been watching it incubate for most of my life.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Janie
Date: 09 Jan 12 - 12:34 AM

Interesting perspective, LH. Much of that piece resonates as being on target. However, it is still has a powerful, subjective political slant that boils down to propaganda on behalf of Ron Paul.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Jan 12 - 01:17 AM

Margolis obviously believes that Ron Paul is a good candidate, a good politican, and an honest man. He believes this based on his own direct conversations with Ron Paul. Why should he not, therefore, speak out in his favour?

Is propaganda only to be called "propaganda" when it favours someone that the user of the term "propaganda" doesn't favour?

I recall that at the time Obama was elected in 2008, Margolis spoke very positively and hopefully about the good that Obama could do for America and for the world. He hailed Obama's election as a hopeful and positive change after the Bush-Cheney era.

Was that propaganda too?

It was only later that Margolis, like many others who had been well impressed by Obamn in 2008, became very disappointed in Mr Obama. Was it then that his opinion became "propaganda"? The subjective tone of the word "propaganda" is, as used in modern times, a very negative one (it wasn't always so).....but EVERY political cause inevitably uses propaganda almost constantly. Propaganda IS a stated subjective viewpoint on any political matter, and everyone out there has a subjective viewpoint on any political matter....not just "the bad guys" (which is again, a subjective viewpoint).

Under a fully realized fascist system, Eric Margolis would definitely be labelled as "a bad guy" and would probably end up being arrested and imprisoned at some point. So too would Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich, because they have openly opposed these foreign wars. Let's hope that fully realized fascist system doesn't happen. If it does, there isn't any one of us who will be safe.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Pete Jennings
Date: 09 Jan 12 - 06:01 AM

No, 999, but I see what you mean!

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Little Hawk
Date: 09 Jan 12 - 09:46 AM

Me too. I see it as a "selection" every time, not a real election at all. It appears to be a real election process, but it isn't...because the result is foreordained by those who control the purse strings and the mass media.

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 09 Jan 12 - 11:42 AM

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/shortcuts/2012/jan/08/republican-candidates-gay-rights-karger

Subject: RE: BS: Groan...another US Presidential election
From: gnu
Date: 09 Jan 12 - 12:15 PM

Here's a new option.