BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!

Subject: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Jan 12 - 04:29 PM

http://www.npr.org/2012/01/13/145059502/when-did-kumbaya-become-such-a-bad-thing?sc=fb&cc=fp

Seems like US Politics is rife with attacks on this venerable song! :-0

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Jan 12 - 05:03 PM

npr.com article

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: gnu
Date: 13 Jan 12 - 05:23 PM

Smoke and tears?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Crowhugger
Date: 13 Jan 12 - 05:59 PM

I "declared war on" that inane melody which repeats itself for the chorus some 40 years ago when I became thoroughly sick of it. "Declared war on" simply means I never sing it, I don't stay in the room if someone else sings it and if anyone suggests singing it I lobby as strongly as possible against that path short of destroying friendships--which is where leaving the room becomes an option.

But it's totally a matter of taste in my case, not anything as complex as one person's view as quoted in the NPR news item:
"In current political parlance, Vatz says, a reference to the song is used to sarcastically disparage consensus "that allegedly does not examine the issues or is revelatory of cockeyed optimism."

I don't think I have any songs in my repertoire that use the same melody for the verse and chorus. I find it tedious at best.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 13 Jan 12 - 06:28 PM

The article amused me. I do think that they are unfairly and ignorantly picking on that one song. But are these fair and wise people?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Joybell
Date: 13 Jan 12 - 06:35 PM

This is an interesting story for discussion. However the use of this song as a political tool is the point here. The song's musical structure is not relevant, much as I might agree. Except it's more like 50 years, I think.
Cheers, Joy

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Paul Burke
Date: 13 Jan 12 - 07:00 PM

2πr Lord,
2πr,
2πr Lord,
2πr,
2πr Lord,
2πr,
O Lord 2πr.

g cos Φ Lord,
2πr
g cos Φ Lord,
2πr
g cos Φ Lord,
2πr
O Lord 2πr.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Janie
Date: 13 Jan 12 - 07:17 PM

From the article, "A Simple, Sincere Song."

That is how I think of Come By Here (which is how I learned it,) and I really think it is a lovely and evocatively simple song suited for the experience of people joining their voices together in song. Maybe I like it because I wasn't over exposed to it - I wasn't a summer camper in my youth, and have also been crowd-averse my entire life, so have participated very little in mass sit-in's, marches and rallies.

Unity and commonality are not synonyms. Humans, in my very, very humble opinion, fair much better when we are reminded of all that we share in common, even if we are not united in our views.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Little Robyn
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 06:18 AM

I really enjoyed the 1963 video of Pete Seeger singing it - that's the way I learnt it back then and although it became boring with overuse, seeing/hearing Pete just took me back - almost 50 years!
Wow! I can't believe it was that long ago!
Robyn

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 07:04 AM

Typical USAian claptrap

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 07:29 AM

You should hear 'Come By Here' sung by a West African choir, with the very deep male voices rumbling down into "Oh.. Lord.." and the strange tone of the women's shrill upper reaches. It positively thrills the blood, and is nothing like the European or USA versions. I imagine something like the South African Ladysmith Black Mambaso choir would perform it just as superbly, and I believe the phonetic "Kum By Ah" represents southern African pronunciation.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: greg stephens
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 07:36 AM

I think you will find the Kum By Yah pronunciation is USA:Georgian Sea Islands(or somewhere in those parts) rather than southern Africa.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Mr Happy
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 07:39 AM

O Lord 2ðr?

All Greek to me!!

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 07:41 AM

Now that's very interesting, greg. For some reason I always imagined a South African black person singing it! They do pronounce 'here' as 'eeyah'. You've got me thinking! Is there anywhere we can find out where it was originally written/performed? By the way, Ladysmith Black Mabazo do sing it. I wonder if it was originally sung by African slaves? (Forgive me if everyone is now going "Der.." because I know I'm rather ignorant of folk-song origins!)

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: greg stephens
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 07:48 AM

The black people in those parts(Georgia/S Carolina coast were known as Gullahs...fairly self-contained communities out in the sticks, freed slaves. They had a particular dialect, and as far as I know this was one of their songs. They were the people portrayed in Porgy and Bess by George and Ira Gershin(from a novel by someone whose name I can't remember).
I sort of imagine Pete Seeger popularised it.I think the derision it receives now is well deserved: not deserved by the song, it's a fine song. But because of the unctuous way it was done to death by the self-admiring folk of the 60's.
The English scene had its own brown-paper-bag song. Remember when people sang The Keeper Did A-Hunting Go?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 07:51 AM

Have just looked it up on Wikipedia, and it does in fact originate in the Georgian Sea Islands, is in Gullah, a pidgin/creole language, which in turn has origins in the West Indies and before that in Sierra Leone in... WEST AFRICA! Wow! Isn't that fascinating?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 07:56 AM

You're so right greg, some songs are so sanitised they sound as if they're being sung by Victorian Sunday School teachers! I used to meet this problem when encouraging my pupils to sing with a bit of character and gusto, it was hopeless. I was always reduced to giggles when they solemnly intoned "Yo! ho! ho! and a bottle of rum!" like a bunch of novice nuns!

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: meself
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 10:56 AM

gullah

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Stringsinger
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 11:53 AM

Kumbaya has been bowdlerised by anglo-American church groups on the Left, but this is because there has been a scapegoating agenda by the Reactionaries to ignore the part about "someone's crying" and inhumanely denigrating the needs of the poor and disenfranchised. Somehow, when Peter, Paul and Mary sang it, it took on the veneer of "white bread" and lost the powerful surge from the African American roots. (Gullah).

Rick Perry's particular brand of racism is revealed by his derogatory use of the word, "kumbaya" which echoes the main stream media's scorn for those of us on the Left and their contempt for those who served in the Peace Corps, (a government sponsored agency).

I sense Frank Luntz in back of this vicious reframing of musical humanity, a typical Reactionary ploy. Notice I don't use the term "Right Wing" because there is nothing right about what these so-called " conservatives" do. Notice I don't even use the word "conservative" to characterize these radical reactionaries that are dominating our US congress now. To denigrate the song because it has been reframed as an empty idea of "can't we all get along?" is to deny the power that this song has had in the African American community. This attack is another white man's trick to diss black people.

Unfortunately, there are those on Mudcat who have bought into the reframing and decided to condemn the progressive young people's perhaps erroneous white bread interpretation of the song, which they show in sneering fashion by dismissing it's power altogether.
It's typical of the folk song snobbery that you see here occasionally by pseudo-purists.

Kumbaya is a religious appeal on a folk level, which I have to acknowledge as being part of the power of the African American community regardless of my hope that some day this important community will grow beyond the religious straight jacket of their institutions.

In the meantime, Kumbaya is a sincere folk music expressive song that attempts to reach out to human values such as healing and nurturing, something that some Mudcat pseudo-folkies are so eager to trash as being mundane.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 11:58 AM

Thank you, meself. Have watched your reference, and also some Gullah-Geechee dancers in Georgia. Called my husband to see them, and he immediately cried "That's just like the dances of African women, you can see the same dancing any day in Cote d'Ivoire!" He was amazed that it's in USA. Those slaves hung on to their culture somehow!

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 12:03 PM

Stringsinger, it isn't snobbery to prefer one version of a song to another. My pupils adored singing "We are walking in the light of God", but when I compare their delivery to that of an African choir, I find the latter extremely moving and mysteriously evocative. Does that make me a snob?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: greg stephens
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 12:45 PM

Srtingsinger: people have criticised the ghastly emasculated way the song ended up being used; that is by no means criticising the song, or its black origins.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 06:14 PM

The Seegar etc., "folksinger" version is pure claptrap.
Seems to me we have had 2pi x 2pi threads on it.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 06:29 PM

See the spiritual "Come by yuh" as posted in thread 65010 by Nerd. It is legitimate.
Origins

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: michaelr
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 09:11 PM

What this is about is that "Kumbaya" is right-wing shorthand for treehuggers, peaceniks and hippies - liberals who are not to be taken seriously by grown-up voters.

I'm not a big fan or the song, but I also don't give a fuck what Rick Perry thinks of the left. It's a tempest in a moving gourd...

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 11:50 PM

GOOD GRIEF!!!!...(Rolling the eyes)....

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Crowhugger
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 11:51 PM

Joybell, I'm not old enough to have become sick of the song 50 years ago.
:-)

Re: attention being given to the black orgins of the song: I don't care one way or another whether I may be related to those who originated the song (or at least related by my mother's skin colour). I still avoid the song like the plague. Maybe that makes me a musical-interest snob? A cultural heretic? BTW my mother didn't like it at all, either. I like what I like, not what was written by people who are a certain colour.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 15 Jan 12 - 04:12 AM

I think Stringsinger has the best take on this. I'm almost tempted to start signing it just to annoy the reactionaries.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 15 Jan 12 - 05:31 AM

you and me Richard, next Lower Stoke.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 15 Jan 12 - 10:30 AM

As Vanderbilt University political scientist John G. Geer said to Freedman in The New York Times, invoking kumbaya "lets you ridicule the whole idea of compromise."

I think that what the Republican Party is doing when it invokes the song is rejecting the ideas of empathy and solidarity.

It is the very power and essence of the song that makes it a fitting target.

The base of the Republican Party is a bunch of so called Christians who choose not to listen when "some one's crying." Perry and the others are telling these people that you do not have to worry about his policies being affected by the cries of the poor.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Stringsinger
Date: 15 Jan 12 - 02:02 PM

Eliza, my point is that some may prefer one version over another because they condemn their so-called " emasculated" version of a song which is indicative of a false folk snobbery.

I think that to prefer one version of a song over another doesn't indicate the snobbery.
It's the attitude that one version is condemned for silly reasons that indicates a snobbery.
I have been in musical circles where certain versions of songs have been treated with contempt by snobby folkies because they are not like the original sources .

I see the power of a song as subject to change which enables its life. I can see that a misunderstanding about a song can be subject to criticism, such as doing "Waltzing Mathilda" in 3/4 time because the singer believes that this is implied by the song title.

"Kumbaya" has a powerful life of its own which is why it is being attacked by Reactionary Republicans and their news representatives.

it can be done by various styles of singing without compromising its power.

The problem for some is that they have bought into the Republican playbook in the condemnation of the song because they feel it is reflective of weakness. Rick Perry in his macho Rambolike cartoonish reaction to "Kumbaya" attempts to flex his flaccid political muscle by saying that the song represents a kind of capitulation.

The song is not about capitulating to anything. It's asking for compassion.




Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Eliza - PM
Date: 14 Jan 12 - 12:03 PM

Stringsinger, it isn't snobbery to prefer one version of a song to another. My pupils adored singing "We are walking in the light of God", but when I compare their delivery to that of an African choir, I find the latter extremely moving and mysteriously evocative. Does that make me a snob?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 15 Jan 12 - 02:51 PM

Suddenly I am the song's biggest fan. It can live on my side of the barricade.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 15 Jan 12 - 03:52 PM

Stringsinger, thank you for explaining this to me, (and I agree the song is asking for compassion). Any singer IMO can interpret a folksong in his/her own style and should not be criticised in a snobbish way. The essence of all this seems to me to be 'How 'authentic' should a version of a song be? How does one style become 'better' than another? Does having a preference denigrate the song?' With my pupils, I was glad enough to get them singing, and to have them learn some wonderful traditional stuff. I didn't judge their singing, but it just made me giggle at times, their little innocent faces singing about bottles of rum! I hate snobbery and hope that no-one could accuse me of it.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Joybell
Date: 15 Jan 12 - 06:23 PM

I agree Al. My thoughts too. Well said Jack.
I remember the first time I was called a "tree-hugger". Now that's a good idea, I thought, must try that.
Crowhugger Ah! so young. :-)
Joy

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Charley Noble
Date: 16 Jan 12 - 10:55 AM

Here's a footnote for this remark posted above:

"Porgy and Bess by George and Ira Gershin (sic) (from a novel by someone whose name I can't remember)."

The original play was simply titled Porgy and was written by DuBose and Dorothy Heyward, produced on Broadway from 1927-1931 and ran for 367 performances. The play itself was based on a novel written by DuBose Heyward in 1924. The Gershwin production included totally different songs and line changes, and for some period of time was the focus of a lawsuit between the Heywards and the Gershwins.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 16 Jan 12 - 11:53 AM

Hugging trees is definitely a great thing to do. I figure even the tree probably likes it. As for those who are too full of themselves or too inhibited to deign to ever hug a tree...may they stew in their own cynical juice! ;-)

Kumbaya is indeed a song about compassion. When sung sincerely and with real feeling it can be quite powerful. When sung superficially just by rote it can be annoying. That's the case with a great many songs. You have to give a song 100% to get the most out of it, and that takes concentration and dedication.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Elmore
Date: 16 Jan 12 - 03:52 PM

Since the right wing began using at as a symbol for compromise, I haven't heard it played. Think I'll go down cellar, and see if I can find a version or two in my cd collection.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Ebor_Fiddler
Date: 16 Jan 12 - 04:08 PM

I'm quite happy to dislike hearing this song. It simply needs a long rest, so people can forget it. It can then be recovered and hopefully appreciated for itself rather than what it may or may not politically represent!

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 16 Jan 12 - 04:24 PM

Digression-
The summary of the history of Porgy and Bess is incomplete and partially misleading. Summary-

Porgy, a novel by DuBose Heyward.
Read by George Gershwin in 1926, and a collaboration suggested.
Gershwin had other irons in the fire and Heyward and his wife created a Broadway production, Porgy, a play with incorporated spirituals, 1927. It ran for 367 performances.

Gershwin and Heyward signed a contract in 1933 (with Theater Guild) to write an opera.
George Gershwin and Heyward went to a Carolina coastal island (near Charleston), where Gershwin wrote part of the opera. Most of the work was done in New York.
Dubose Heyward wrote the libretto and most of the song lyrics, including Summertime.
Ira Gershwin added songs, including It Ain't Necessarily So.
The opera was produced in New York in 1935.
The complete production (almost 4 hours) is available on three discs. It was thought to be too long to hold the interest of a general audience, although the original production ran some 120 performances. The more recent Glyndebourne production of the complete opera was a success.

A shortened version (1942) was popular, and toured. Another production was mounted in 1952. In 1976, a Houston Opera production restored the full score, and this also was produced at Glyndebourne in 1986 (excellent! A good DVD). The Metropolital Opera production was mounted in 1985 (some cuts).

Disagreement (mostly because of Theater Guild involvement) led to legal shifting of some revenues between the Gershwin and Heyward estates, but the Gershwin-Heyward estates hold copyrights, and any revisions or changes must by Okeyed by them.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Charley Noble
Date: 16 Jan 12 - 04:56 PM

Q-

Thanks for adding interesting details of the evolution of Porgy to Porgy & Bess. I didn't realize that Gershwin was involved as early as 1926. I also didn't realize that Heyward composed most of the song lyrics to Porgy & Bess.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Mark Ross
Date: 17 Jan 12 - 03:10 PM

As to KUMBAYA, I remember hearing a story about people st a festival standing in a circle singing it, taking turns, and when it came to Bob Gibson he started, "Someone's kidding, Lord......."



Mark Ross

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 12:03 AM

Anything can sound limp and uninspiring if you repeatedly have a large number of not terribly focused people stand around and sing it vaguely and with little comprehension and merely because they figure maybe they ought to because it's expected in their peer group and they want to fit in. It becomes limp and uninspiring. Specially if it becomes a standardized social ritual. Trust me. Anything.

I don't care if it's Hamlet's Soliloquy, the Lord's Prayer, Kumbaya, or the most brilliant prose or poem ever written or whatever the heck it is. The above procedure will eventually make it seem trivial and will eventually ruin it.

You have to be there at the very beginning of something to get the magic in it. You must be there when it first happens. It's like that with social revolutions too...

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 01:09 AM

Or to use a common expression: "familiarity breeds contempt"

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 04:15 AM

well said - LH.

So many people despise the original way of singing folksongs in the way that they first heard them, themselves. Theres altogether too much music for musicians.

You don't need to be able to play the guitar like Bert Jansch or Martin Carthy to sing folksongs and inspire others (no disrespect to Matin or the memory of Bert intended). There was a time when we had wonderful minstrels in the folk clubs like Noel Murphy.

People seem to think that because a song can be played with two or three chords or even unaccompanied, that there is no skill involved in the performance of it. Just the brass balls to stand up and do it. In fact having the bottle to get up, is just the start of when you should start learning the skills of minstrelsy, projection and performance.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 07:26 AM

For example, Gregorian Chant. It's based on only a few notes and sung 'plain' (not in two or three parts) Yet it takes a long time for the monks or nuns to perfect it, and it is absoultely mind-blowing.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,999
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 08:13 AM

'"Porgy and Bess by George and Ira Gershin (sic) (from a novel by someone whose name I can't remember)."'

Porgy by Dubose Heyward or DuBose Heyward.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,999
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 10:46 AM

From

http://www.alphadictionary.com/articles/english_grammar_style/kumbaya.html

"Kumbaya, my Lord" was first recored by an out-of-work English professor, Robert Winslow Gordon, in 1927. Gordon went on a search for black spirituals and recorded a song "Come by Here, My Lord", sung by H. Wylie. The song was sung in Gullah on the islands of South Carolina between Charleston and Beaufort. Gullah is the creole language featured in the Uncle Remus series of Joel Chandler Harris and the Walt Disney production of "Song of the South." "Kum by here, my Lord" in Gullah is "Kum by (h)yuh, my lawd" (see our Gullah dictionary).
American missionaries took the song to Angola after its publication in the 1930s, where its origins were forgotten. In the late 1950s the song was rediscovered in Angola and returned to North American where it swept the campfire circuit as a beautiful and mysterious religious lyric. That is why the song is associated with Angola in many current printed versions.
In the US, however, the song was associated with Boy Scouts, Girl Scouts, and other campers sitting around a campfire in perfect harmony. The picture of a warm, cozy community without conflict associated itself with the song and especially that foreign-sounding word in its title, kumbaya. Since the word had no actual meaning in English, cynics eventually converted this harmless connotation into the actual English definition of the word. That definition now seems to be "naive, unrealistic optimism".

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 10:57 AM

A cynic is a person who attempts to enlarge himself by belittling someone (or something) else.

He's also a person who "knows the price of everything, and the value of nothing".

In the Winnie-the-Pooh books, the character Eeyore was the resident cynic....and my! wasn't he fun to have around? ;-D

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: GUEST,999
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 11:05 AM

Q, I missed your post about Porgy. Therefore, sorry about my post of

18 Jan 12 - 08:13 AM

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 01:40 PM

My dogs got no nose....

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: goatfell
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 01:59 PM

it is only a song

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 06:35 PM

No you got it wrong

I say: My dogs got no nose....
You ask: How does he smell?
And I say: Awful.....!

Should we try again?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Jan 12 - 09:26 PM

NO   more war.

Boycott Kumbaya!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Buy no ingredients or products containing Kumbian ingredients.

They are said to be dealing blood diamonds with their neighbor to the west Zimbabwe, who in turn are supporting war with Fubarbia via Christian child soldier troops under little hawks like Louis Raparree, Generalamos Donuel and Baskeetall Jones.


If you do Kumbian ingredients, be sure to use a wooden spoon and stir slowly, mix with plenty of water and pan for diamonds with raking light.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk music attacked! War on Kumbaya!
From: goatfell
Date: 19 Jan 12 - 07:34 AM

why get angry over a song?