BS: Stating the bloody obvious!

Subject: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 20 May 12 - 04:32 AM

"the right measures are not the same for each of us".
This is part of the statement issued after the G8 summit at Camp David.
To me it is so obvious that it doesn't need to be said.
However the ethos of the EEC is a total denial of this all too obvious truism.
A united Europe with a fiscal union and common rules will never work.
How does a fisheries policy affect Poland? How does an agricultural policy affect a country without arable land?
How can a country where wine, olive, oil, fuel, and everyday comestibles are within the reach of a wage of about £50 a week, form an alliance with a country where the costs are based on an average income of £300 a week?
This in effect is what the EEC has tried to do, and it has given the rich countries cheap food, and the poor countries expensive food.
The one thing it hasn't done is produce equality, one of the avowed aims of this bureaucracy heavy alliance.

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: Will Fly
Date: 20 May 12 - 05:34 AM

I find it ironic, John, that the world appears to be crammed with financial, political and economic wizards who debate, meet at conferences, discuss policy and - finally - make decisions in their infinite wisdom which seem to have no effect on actual events.

Why, they probably even make them worse!

As we say, they couldn't organise a piss-up in a brewery.

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:02 AM

I do wish that Cameron would give us the opportunity to vote for our removal from the EEC. It doesn't seem to have done the ordinary people much good, but no doubt it has vastly benefitted the financiers and business moguls to get their snouts in the Great Trough over there. Culturally, 'Europe' can never be cohesive. It's far too complex and varied, as you say, agriculturally, industrially, historically. There are also too many aggressively chauvinistic leaders who can never agree because naturally each is rooting for his/her own country's interests (and of course, their own private gains). On a small scale, (in my personal experience) committees are tricky and seldom achieve a good outcome unless all the members are basically of one mind. On a large scale, where entire nations are involved, it can only be a total disaster.

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:08 AM

Nobody ever joined the EEC for what they could put into it!

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: banjoman
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:09 AM

The sooner we get out the better. In my opinion the Germans and the French are trying to acheive by political pressure what neither could acheive by military means over hundreds of years - Domination of the European continent.
It took a lot of wars to stop them and I pray it wont come to that again.

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:14 AM

John, at one level I agree. But for all to benefit there must be some 'putting into it', and none of them are willing to do just that.

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:18 AM

The vast difference between the poor and the rich countries ensures that ultimately only the rich benefit.

Here in the UK we have a country being governed by the rich for the rich, and as someone pointed out to me about The Queens Speech, a woman in a million pound hat lecturing us on being frugal, yer got to laugh.

Dave H

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:22 AM

The European Union has meant that neither I nor my son, unlike my dad, grandad and great uncles, has been forcibly (or duped into being) put on the front line in battle. It might well be a crock of shite at the moment, with rigid leaders wallowing in a self-interested mindset, but that much at least is well worth dwelling on for a minute.

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:27 AM

I always felt that at the beginning Ireland benefitted very much from being in the EEC, and grew economically a great deal, being eligible for all sorts of agricultural goodies. Now of course, they're floundering, but they did become quite prosperous from it all.

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:52 AM

Good point Steve Shaw. What has whupped the Soviet Union was the fact that their people looked at the deal we were getting, and they wanted MacDonalds and Nissan cars not - five year plans, bread queues, Lada cars. And they want in....and for that they are willing to stop sending their citizens to the Gulag. All kinds of shitty little dictatorships are willing to swap being nasty tyrants for a bit of affluence. Its a great incentive.

Put the utter stupidity of the fishery policy against the fact that none of our generation or the generation after have had to go through the shit our parents and grandparents did, in the two world wars last century.

The EEC is a pain in the balls run by the second raters in field that has Cameron as our number one. Nuff said! Hardly anyone votes in Euro elections - so we've got some real dogs running the show.

however as an alternative to the next great conflagration - its a no brainer.

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: Leadfingers
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:56 AM

The Conservatives Conned us right from the start ! The Referendum set up by Grocer Heath was wether to be in a European Common Market . The European State was NEVER mentioned then , but has been an underlying basis for nearly evrything the the EEC has done since then .

Subject: RE: BS: Stating the bloody obvious!
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 20 May 12 - 06:58 AM

It's the bloody euro innit. The whole setup was contrived to benefit a powerhouse economy with a huge manufacturing/export base: Germany. When times are good, fine. When times get hard, wealthy Germany wants to remain immune, but they signed up just like everyone else did. It's incumbent on them, having taken the lion's share of the benefits, to do the lion's share of the baling out. Their present austerity policy is a threat to democracy all over Europe as poorer nations lose control over their own affairs. When things go horribly wrong, and you can't devalue, the abyss threatens.