 sj |
||
|
||
BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate
|
|
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: michaelr Date: 21 Nov 12 - 06:34 PM The time has come to say fair's fair To pay the rent, to pay our share The time has come, a fact's a fact It belongs to them, let's give it back Midnight Oil, "Beds are Burning" |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Allan Conn Date: 21 Nov 12 - 06:13 PM "It was my understanding that Scotland wanted to be separate from England in the way Canada or Mexico are separate from the United States." Some Scots want to be seperate but it is a massive jump to suggest that the country as a whole wants to be. I support independence myself but it is a debate within Scotland and it is a debate about how to best go forward - within the union or outwith the union. And it is a civilised debate with no need to demonise others despite the kind of nonsense you can find on some internet sites. The problem for the SNP is that most Scots don't appear to support independence at the moment. It has been higher and has been lower at periods but support for independence tends to be around 30% or so. Bigger numbers lean towards devo-max (ie more devolution within the union) but that is unlikely to be on the referendum at this point. Whatever happens the losing campaign will accept the democratic choice of the Scottish electorate. You get the tiny loony minority posting on youtube Braveheart videos etc but for the vast bulk of Scots it is just a democratic debate which isn't even that heated. It is our own choice though. No-one else is trying to force us to stay in the union and no-one else needs to come and free us. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Charmion Date: 21 Nov 12 - 06:10 PM Goodness me. What a paragon of virtue. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 21 Nov 12 - 06:04 PM See? Means well indeed. Poor, poor, pitiful Liz! Ain't nobody in this wide, wide world that cares more, does more, or suffers more, or is worth more than Sufferin' Liz The Paragon. Gimmie a 'fecking' (thanks, Liz) break. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Lizzie Cornish 1 Date: 21 Nov 12 - 05:58 PM How about Reconcilliation Day? Don't forget about me...... Thank you, Stringsinger.... Maggie, does it *ever* occur to you that I should NOT be having to take up the cause of the Native Americans in the first place, because YOU folks should have taken it up centuries/decades back??????? You wanna take up the cause of the Gypsies over here? Be my guest! I tried to raise hell over Dale Farm and got EXACTLY the same reaction from some folks over here, getting banned off the page of the Council who evicted them and banned from contacting the racist bastard of a councillor who drove their eviction through, costing the tax payer a bloody fortune and breaking up families...Most of the Travellers/Gypsies in this country are treated like scum, being pushed off the road more and more, into houses, into 'good little lives' like the rest of the 'good little citizens' becoming just as controlled as the rest of us. I don't tell YOU who to fight for, what or who to get passionately angry over, so please, don't patronize me for being ragingly angry at the shite going down here! IF I'm making some of you feel awkward....GOOD!!!!!!! And what TRULY fecks me off is that the Native Americans are trying to offer that Hand of Reconcilliation out but does The Good Ol' White Man want to take it? Nope! Most of the time, he's too busy stuffing fecking turkey down his throat to even THINK that his Thanksgiving Celebration is built on Genocide, on a Holocaust which was written out of the history books until recently, on a Secret Squirrel Mass Murder and Raping of an entire Culture! You tell me that you have exams in this and that to do with Native American history, yet here you are telling me to basically shut up, go away and talk about something else??????? Well, FECK THAT, Maggie!!! *******IF******* you TRULY cared then you'd be standing RIGHT BESIDE ME, throwing your hands up with absolute glee that The Message was finally get out!! Yet you choose to try and silence me?????????????????????????????? Feck fecking Degrees and Examinations in this and that, for I pour my heart and soul into what I believe, what I have studied, discovered, been so APPALLED to discover!! And as to the person who yet again has chosen to call me by a name which he has no right to call me by, just wait and see what Paul McCartney may soon be doing for Leonard Peltier! And nope, you ain't gonna find out anything more until I know if Paul is going to stick to his word, but his manager has sent a message to the person I wrote the letter to Paul for...and we are both *staggered* by his reply... So shove that where the sun don't shine...and don't forget about those who truly built your country, when you sit down tomorrow..for in THEIR hands the Rivers, Land, Mountains and all Species were Respected and Mother Earth was doing superbly well.. I'll leave you with Marlon speaking one helluva lot of truth... Marlon Brando speaks out |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Stilly River Sage Date: 21 Nov 12 - 05:25 PM Allan, I was looking at the distinction between nations, not states. It was my understanding that Scotland wanted to be separate from England in the way Canada or Mexico are separate from the United States. Not the way California is a different entity than Texas but both as part of the United States. I haven't looked closely into the matter, however. I'm content to let the bunch of you sort it out yourselves. Wouldn't it be silly of me to make a big stink about your politics from here, based upon the oddball snippets I could find if I googled a few keywords to do with Scotland and freedom. SRS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Dave the Gnome Date: 21 Nov 12 - 04:56 PM Mmmmmm - Goblin. When we was first wed me and Mrs G used to love Goblin Puds. Yes, and sorry, USers if that has a different meaning there but at least it gives you a laugh:-) Anyway - The one in the link looks quite posh. The 1973 version was in a little cylindrical tin which you pierced and could boil in the pan! Yummy with chips, peas, gravy, bread and butter and a cup of tea. Now THERE'S a thanksgiving dinner that no-one can complain about! Except Goblins... Gnomeson #3 has also recently discovered Goblin burgers in gravy in a tin. Fabulous heated through in a saucepan and served on a crusty roll (No, that isn't sexual either. Stop it at once!) Jamie Oliver eat your heart out :-) DtG |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: gnu Date: 21 Nov 12 - 04:34 PM Whole lot a gobblin goin on. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 21 Nov 12 - 04:27 PM S'ok, Bruce - those are obviously Pakistani turkeys. Or maybe insurgent turkeys. Or maybe Socialist Obama turkeys. Or.... |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 21 Nov 12 - 04:23 PM Leave it to Lincoln, who didn't respect Native Americans, to proclaim this holiday on a certain date. Despite some very stiff competition, that has to be the most idiotic & ignorant thing I've seen posted here in quite a while. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Richard Bridge Date: 21 Nov 12 - 04:15 PM The relative positions of (a) the English (b) the Scottish (c) the Welsh and (d) (some of) the Irish can be debated at length. There can be no real doubt that both Romany and non-Romany travellers are much oppressed in the UK and both parts of Ireland - and indeed in large parts of Europe. The UK has done its level best to disadvantage those here (and those who wish to come here) from its former colonies. Only this week the courts have poured further vilification on those who legally represent immigrants about to be deported. I was picked on by a judge for objecting to his discrimination against a barrister of Pakistani origin whom I had instructed. I won, but at some cost. But some people are beyond rational discussion. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: GUEST,999 Date: 21 Nov 12 - 04:12 PM As things modernize . . . |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Henry Krinkle Date: 21 Nov 12 - 03:53 PM Hi Charmion. =(:-( D) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 21 Nov 12 - 03:49 PM Giving Thanks is common to all cultures. Psalm 100 (by David circa 1000 BC) Make a joyful noise unto the Lord, all ye lands. Serve the Lord with gladness: come before his presence with singing. Know ye that the Lord is God. It is He that hath made us, and not we ourselves. We are his people, and the sheep of his pasture. Enter into his gates with thanksgiving, and into his courts with praise. Be thankful unto him, and bless his name. For the Lord is good. His mercy is everlasting. And His truth endureth to all generations. (KJV) Quran 2:172 (Mohammad circa 610) O you who believe, eat from the good things we provided for you, and be thankful to GOD,if you do worship Him alone. --Sebastian, Twelfth Night, Act 3, scene 3 (Shakespeare circa 1601) "I can no other answer make but thanks, And thanks, and ever thanks..." Geshe Langri Tangpa (1054-1123), student of Drom Tonpa, a chief student of Atisha Whenever I meet a person of bad nature. Who is overwhelmed by negative energy and intense suffering, I will hold such a rare one dear, As if I had found a precious treasure. Sincerely thankful this season, Gargoyle Happiness is a choice. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Charmion Date: 21 Nov 12 - 03:45 PM The United States has been horribly oppressed by Britain? Really? That's news to me. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: kendall Date: 21 Nov 12 - 03:04 PM Lincoln was one of the greatest men in our history. By the way, who said one must STUFF themselves with turkey? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Henry Krinkle Date: 21 Nov 12 - 03:00 PM We only want to help. We've been horribly oppressed by the British too. =(:-( )) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Allan Conn Date: 21 Nov 12 - 02:56 PM "or work to free the Scots" I wish someone would free me from all these people who seem to think we need freeing! Again in what way are we not free? We form part of a union with the English, Welsh and Northern Irish. We are free in the same way that Californians or Texans are in that they are part of a union too. In fact it could be argued that we are more free than Americans as it is recognised here that if a majority of people living in Scotland decide that we should leave the said union then we have the right to leave. I understand that principle isn't quite as clear cut as far as US states are concerned though corret me if I'm wrong! The comparing of Scots and Native Americans is really silly. Over the past 20 years especially Scots have had an influence on the UK govt way in excess of what they should have had per head of population. The first Blair govt in particular was completely dominated by Scots. Whatever else she has said or done the idea that Lizzy should work to help free the Scots is absolutely ludicrous. The Scots will decide their own future and are not in need of anyone else coming along to free us. Jeez!!! |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Henry Krinkle Date: 21 Nov 12 - 02:47 PM Lincoln was a bastard. =(:-( )) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Stringsinger Date: 21 Nov 12 - 02:37 PM Lizzie, you don't make me uncomfortable because you are speaking the truth. Thanksgiving has a religious slant to it. Why not be thankful all year around? The idea of stuffing yourself with turkey and all the other unhealthy ingredients for a dinner is repulsive to me. How does this indicate any kind of reasonable "thanksgiving"? It's the worst kind of conspicuous consumption. The White Man has appropriated much from Native Americans while enslaving them; the history is there. Agriculture is a big one. The Iroquois Longhouse is another, a form of real democracy in action. Leave it to Lincoln, who didn't respect Native Americans, to proclaim this holiday on a certain date. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Dave the Gnome Date: 21 Nov 12 - 02:32 PM Well said, Stilly, but there are a couple of things that need putting strait. Firstly - as said before - the Scots are free, as are the Irish as are the Welsh. They have been free in the sense you mean for a long time. The oppressed peoples of the British empire are, as you so astutely point out, the ex-colonials who now work for a pittance in sweat shops. Unfortunately the first colony of the British Empire was England :-( It was never a racial thing. It was all to do with class and the Victorians, who underlined and emboldened the word with a vengance, surpressed those who could not fight back mercilessly. I mentioned in another thread the starving mill workers of Lancashire who refused to work with Southern US cotton in support of the Union and anti-slavery. There were also the pit workers who went on strike for 10% and were thrown out of their jobs. No, not a 10% rise - They wanted to limit their pay CUT to 10% as opposed to the 25% the owners got. I can link as many instances as Liz can if you so desire but that seems to be such a stupid thing to do. All these people were surpressed but, unfortunately, they do not have the romantic kudos of the 'Noble Savage'. Their is still a class war going on. There is still oppression and the sort of class wars that went on then. To an ardent royalist such as Liz however this cannot possibly be the truth. It is much easier to believe that the white man stole from the redskin than it is to believe that her precious nobility are the very ones who set ordinary working men against each other in an endevour to create more wealth. If anyone needs to apologise it is the royals. Not your very admirable, to me anyway, president. Cheers DtG |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Charmion Date: 21 Nov 12 - 02:07 PM I still don't understand how the fate of the American Indian Movement makes a lie of my Mohawk neighbours' Thanksgiving dinner. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 21 Nov 12 - 01:57 PM Well, I certainly don't know that she "means well" at all. Appears more like she means to tell everyone how absolutely wonderful she is for messing about with her myriad cyber-"causes" of which her pet Indians are only one of more than a dozen, and show the rest of us lesser beings the way and the light - while looking down her nose at us. In addition, she wants us all to realize what a martyr she is to those "causes" she electronically espouses and types and clicks and "friends" her fingers to the bone for - poor, pitiful Liz! - likely suffering from a Munchausen Syndrome-like affliction directed at herself. I'd be interested in any hard evidence that she actually "means well". |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 21 Nov 12 - 01:02 PM By the way, Liz - you don't have MY permission to call me "Greg". |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Stilly River Sage Date: 21 Nov 12 - 12:51 PM Lizzie, I've ignored this thread till now. I know you mean well, but you conflate so many different groups and issues into these topics that you shoot yourself in the foot. When you're visiting these US sites online you get a partial view of a lot of topics, like looking through a keyhole, and they aren't all weighted equally. For those of us who live here it is a lot of work telling the parties apart - for someone an ocean away the nuances are surely lost in translation. Wesley S posted " I'll remain helping via the internet, thanks.." What he said. Lizzie, I know you mean well, but you don't seem to be able to filter all of it, you absorb all of this stuff, add a dose of passion, then dump it all into a Mudcat thread and verbally bludgeon the descendants of people who set a lot of this in motion. There are many of us who are fully aware of how things stand and have acted in our own way to offer help. If that information isn't shared here with you it's is because you will always find it wanting and be critical of anything short of all white faces abandoning the continent. So no one who is seriously interested in these themes is going to talk much about this on your threads. Like Wesley said, look around the UK and find one of your own messes to clean up. Aren't there downtrodden people in the UK where you can focus your attention and perhaps actually make a difference? All of the strife you cause at Mudcat as you chastise everyone here is hypocritical. You complain we haven't corrected our indigenous social ills - why not lobby on behalf of UK Travelers, or work to free the Scots. Do good works on behalf of the immigrants from former British colonies who live in slums across the UK. Is Wales lobbying for freedom? Surely there is something closer to home you can turn your energy and attention to? SRS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 21 Nov 12 - 09:45 AM Keep tap-dancing, Liz - those are mouse-clicks, and fake "friends", not people. Guess you just can't produce what was requested, which comes as absolutely no surprise. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: GUEST,kendall Date: 21 Nov 12 - 08:55 AM There are plenty of brown sandwiches to go around. The big devour the small, the rich devour the poor and the strong devour the weak. It has always been so and always will. Not that anyone cares, but "Decimate" came from the emperor Caligula. When one of his legions refused to obey an order he had every 10th man killed. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Lizzie Cornish 1 Date: 21 Nov 12 - 05:30 AM It's quite easy to locate the names of the Native Americans on my page, because...they have Native Americans names, for the most part.... Doh! You wanna do it, then go ahead and do it, but you do it yourself, mate...You'll have to 'friend' them first as FB has it set so that any message sent by a non-friend goes into an inbox named 'other' which most folks don't know about. Some people have it fixed so that anyone can write on their wall though, so you could also try that way... And WHAT '14 carat bullshit' are you talking about? I gave you the details above. It's not my fault you choose not to take any notice, probably because you're severely pissed off with the fact that I'm honest and have told you to go right ahead.. You could also write to those behind the official Leonard Peltier page too...Again, you'll find it online... You having Jerk Soup for Thanksgiving, at all, Greg? And again, don't call me Liz. You don't have my permission and therefore every time you choose to do so from now on just accentuates what a prat you are. Only a very, very few people in my life, those whom I respect and care about deeply call me Liz. Trust me, you are *not* one of them. Thank you And hey, it's *almost* Thanksgiving! The National Day of Mourning: 'We Are Not Vanishing - We Are Not Conquered' |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 20 Nov 12 - 05:52 PM No, Liz, thats not what I asked for, that's just more of your self-serving, tap-dancing BS. Give me the names and contact info as I asked - Or admit that what you're pushing is 14 Karat Bullshit. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: GUEST,Allan Conn Date: 20 Nov 12 - 05:29 PM "We think of Scotland and Ireland, Canada and Australia, New Zealand as being crushed under the iron high heels of Queen Lizzie." Whether Scotland remains in the Union or not and whether it retains the monarchy or not are actually two seperate issues. The shared monarchy comes about from the Union of the Crowns in 1603 when James VI of Scotland inherited the English and Irish thrones on the death of Elizabeth I of England. The United Kingdom of Great Britain came about in 1707 a century later when both the Scottish and English (Wales was legally regarded as part of England at that time)kingdoms were wound up and a new united kingdom called Great Britain was formed. The current Scottish SNP govt wish to dissolve the 1707 Union of the Parliaments but they are not actually a Republican party. If they secured a YES vote in the referendum the Queen would remain as Head of State in Scotland. Some people in North America (and I apologise to most who probably are sensible enough) have some funny ideas as to the internal politics in GB. There is a debate over which is the best way for Scotland to proceed. As part of the UK within the EU or as an independent and seperate state within the EU - but nobody is suppressing us and we don't need to be freed! |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Lizzie Cornish 1 Date: 20 Nov 12 - 05:27 PM Real, Greg...contact 'em if you so wish. Some 'Facts' to put in the Thanksgiving Crackers |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Dave the Gnome Date: 20 Nov 12 - 04:35 PM Henry - my eyes are opened. Well done :-) I also add find it is intiguing that Facebook is the spawn of Satan when used against certain parties. Yet, when used by those same parties for their own ends, it seems to be the saviour of the universe. Ah well. Such is life. Once more I quote the famous Lewis Carroll line 'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, 'it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.' From this conversation between Alice and Himpty Dumpy. How like a lot of these threads it seems to be :-) DtG |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 20 Nov 12 - 03:10 PM Greg, take a look on my Facebook page, you'll find a whole lotta people there.... That's your fake cyber-buddies, Liz - lets see some real live humans & I'll contact 'em, OK? OK? I'm waiting........ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Don Firth Date: 20 Nov 12 - 02:47 PM Lizzie is screaming so loud that I can't really hear what she's saying. . . . and that yappy little dog that keeps following her around. . . . Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Henry Krinkle Date: 20 Nov 12 - 02:03 PM Shameful!!! =(:-( )) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Lizzie Cornish 1 Date: 20 Nov 12 - 01:55 PM Oh..and I should add that poor Jean Seberg was on the FBI's list not just because she fell in love with a Black Panther, but because she also stood beside many of the Movements the FBI loathed, being a kind and sweet woman who stood beside those who were struggling in America.. The FBI should be disbanded, as should the BIA. You'll find many links here, on the lefthand side, as well as the radio interview that NPR did about this 'covert genocide' still going on today. NPR Radio and Internet link to their Native American Foster Care Story |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Henry Krinkle Date: 20 Nov 12 - 01:52 PM Tell them! You make me proud!!! =(:-( )) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Lizzie Cornish 1 Date: 20 Nov 12 - 01:45 PM >>>The British have a history of telling people (other than them) in places they've colonized how to live and behave.* Lizzie is just continuing the tradition. I just don't think she will ever figure it out.<<< Seems I've stirred up a White Thanksgiving Hornet's Nest, huh? Jeri, read my earlier posts. I'm all for the British government apologizing for what our Sociopathic forefathers did... I guess you guys will take solace from the fact that America issued an apology to the Native Americans, whilst completely ignoring the fact that most people aren't even AWARE this was done. This being because the bastards who issued it, Obama included, hid it amongst a whole pile of inconsequential shit they issued....Of course,they're shit-scared of having to give back much of the land they stole and put right the Treatries that have been dishonoured in every way... Greg, take a look on my Facebook page, you'll find a whole lotta people there.... Gargoyle, well, I never knew you were an FBI arse-licker until this day. I've 'spoken' with Trimbach and his buddy Ed Woods, and their 'groupie' Looking Back Woman who promotes theh Trimbach Boysies book on her vast and numerous websites...If you look deeper you'll find Denise Pictou Maloney (Anna Mae's daughter) and the dreaded Paul (spit) Demain linked in with them too. They do EVERYTHING they can to implode AIM from the inside out..and I'd imagine that Woods and Trimbach are sitting back laughing their racist little heads off in absolute glee. I suggest you find out the REAL truth about Leonard...and if you think he had a fair trial, then you take my breath away. You do KNOW about Myrtle Poor Bear's testimony,do you? You do KNOW the FBI threatened to remove her children unless she said what they wanted, that they also threatened and coerced other witnesses into making false statements, withheld evidence which would have proved Leonard's innocence, resited the trial to a town known for it's racist views towards Native Americans and hauled an 'FBI friendly' judge out of retirement for his trial, amongst a whole pile of other shite? Do you know the FBI, to this day, still have around 100,000 documents pertaining to Leonard and his trial which they REFUSE to release, even though they now come under the Freedom of Information Act.... You'll also find the 'mother fucker begging for his life' and 'gun in her mouth' story come from the gang mentioned above.. Please, at least do me the honour of finding out BOTH sides of The Truth here and figuring out that the FBI were after Leonard and the main leaders of AIM long before the shooting happened.... Read M Weslely Swearingen's (ex-FBI agent)book 'FBI Secrets - An Agent's Expose' and hear him say how agents were told to arrest the leaders of AIM on ANYTHING they could make stick, no matter how small..and to keep arresting them, over and over, until no court in the land would grant bail..! J Edgar Hoover was the most unpleasant, lying, cheating, criminal, racist and fascist bastard going and he created a bureau of like-wise people. Wes Swearingen left because he could no longer stand what they were doing as agents.... Read up about Jean Seberg and how their COINTELPRO neutralizing tactics led to her suicide. You'll even find their memos about her online, where they say to basically take her down, simply because she DARED to fall in love with one of the guys from The Black Panthers, becoming pregnant by him..and they trashed her, EVERYWHERE! Read up about Elmer Geronimo Pratt and how he too was kept in prison for almost 30 years, and how the SAME Bastard Agent who framed Elmer was put in charge of Leonard's case!! Then realize that almost EVERY bad word you read about Leonard Peltier, on the internet, comes from the bastards you choose to support, who have many sites, in many names, who FLOOD Youtube with nasty, twisted videos and cover Youtube pages in their sick comments... Read up how they took out full page adverts to neutralize Leonard yet AGAIN when Clinton almost pardoned him, threatening to go on a country-wide strike and cause chaos...until Clinton backed down... And THEN, ASK YOURSELF ***WHY*** THE FBI ARE SO SHIT SCARED OF LEONARD BEING SET FREE! It ain't rocket science. And I apologise to some posters above, for I hadn't realized that Thanksgiving Day is a time to crack jokes about Native Americans...not that I'd do that ever, but it seems that some do.. And now, I'm off to read 'Ojibwa Warrior' and get the story of Dennis Banks 'out there' a litte more... Oh, and of course, Pete Seeger, bless him, has given his blessing to the new film about Leonard 'Wind Chases The Sun' becoming part of the advertising campaign for it, urging people to help set Leonard free.... Enjoy your turkey...and don't forget to add a large helping of Genocide Jelly to your plates to make it slip down a little easier... |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Henry Krinkle Date: 20 Nov 12 - 01:35 PM Stupid is a little harsh. Unenlightened? Ignorant? Irony? Yes. =(:-( D) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Dave the Gnome Date: 20 Nov 12 - 01:31 PM We think of Scotland and Ireland, Canada and Australia, New Zealand as being crushed under the iron high heels of Queen Lizzie. Who are 'we', Henry. Not one person I know from the US is that stupid. Where are you from? I think you just will never appreciate the number of things wrong with that statement. Unless you are reffering to another Queen Lizzie by any chance..? In which case I bow to your heightened sense of irony :-) Cheers DtG |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Henry Krinkle Date: 20 Nov 12 - 01:26 PM We think of Scotland and Ireland, Canada and Australia, New Zealand as being crushed under the iron high heels of Queen Lizzie. Glad to think things ain't so bad after all. =(:-( )) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Henry Krinkle Date: 20 Nov 12 - 01:22 PM You run a very close second, Greg. =(:-( )) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: GUEST,mg Date: 20 Nov 12 - 01:20 PM I do...they lined up soldiers and shot every 10th one. Anyway, I would love to see the date for Thanksgiving changed and perhaps change the focus a bit. More around end of October...could occasionally ocnflict with Halloween though if you weren't careful. Don't want them on the same day. Lizzie, please PM me. I want to get the lullaby CD to Lakota children. mg |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 20 Nov 12 - 01:05 PM That's the stupidest thing I ever heard. =(:-( 0) Guess ya ain't been listening to yerself, then, Krunkle. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: GUEST,Allan Conn Date: 20 Nov 12 - 12:56 PM "You people need to free Scotland and Ireland. England needs to quit meddling." Scotland is free! In what way are we not? The debate over Scotland's future is basicall an internal debate within Scotland. The people of Scotland will decide whether they remain within the union or leave it. Either way it is a free choice. You seem to suggest that it is the English who would decide whether we should or shouldn't be in the union. Catch up. They don't get a vote on the issue unless they physically live in Scotland. One could argue that the unionist majority in Northern Ireland is a gerrymandered majority but again things have moved on. Referendums in Northern Ireland and the Republic backed (overwhelmingly the case in the Republic) the idea that what happens to Northern Ireland status is up to the people of Northern Ireland and no-one else. Why the need to blame the English for everything? Incidentally I would also use that argument in defence of Americans. It is absurd to castigate modern Americans for what the Pilgrim Fathers did or didn't do :-) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Henry Krinkle Date: 20 Nov 12 - 12:45 PM That's the stupidest thing I ever heard. =(:-( 0) |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: *#1 PEASANT* Date: 20 Nov 12 - 12:33 PM Get over it! native Americans took the land from the earth mother, plants and animals etc.... then they started to kill and eat then started pollution We can thank the native americans for beginning the polution of the new world then they went about taking land from each other before any european got there! Sinnerss all just have thanksgiving that we survived! Conrad |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 20 Nov 12 - 11:23 AM Leonard Peltier, convicted in the 1975 execution-style murders of FBI Agents Ron Williams and Jack Coler. Peltier was sentenced to two consecutive life sentences, plus seven years for his armed escape in 1979. Leonard Peltier Should Never Receive a Presidential Pardon Peltier was fairly tried and fairly convicted. This is the conclusion of every federal judge who's reviewed the case. Bragging about killing Ron Williams, Peltier's exact words: "The motherfu—er was begging for his life but I shot him anyway". The agents were killed with a high velocity, small caliber weapon fired at point blank range. Williams attempted to shield his face from the blast with his right hand, turning his head slightly to the right. The murderer placed the barrel of his gun against Williams' hand and fired. The bullet ripped through Williams' hand, into his face, and carried away the back of his head. He was killed instantly. The murderer shot Coler, who was unconscious, across the top of the head. The bullet carried away a part of his forehead at the hairline. The shot was not fatal, however. The murderer then lowered his rifle a few inches and shot Coler through the jaw. The shell exploded inside his head, killing him instantly. He fled to the Rosebud Reservation. Peltier had reason to believe that the agents were looking for him, rather than Jimmy Eagle. He stipulated at trial that there was an arrest warrant outstanding, charging him with attempted murder. Upon his arrest in Canada months later for the murders of the agents, Peltier remarked that the two agents were shot when they came to arrest him. After a twenty-five day trial, Peltier was convicted by a jury of both counts of first-degree murder. * Milwaukee, Wisconsin Incident At the trial, the parties stipulated to the following facts: On November 22, 1972, Peltier was charged with attempted murder in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. He was arrested, pleaded not guilty, and was released on bond. On July 29, 1974, he failed to appear for trial on the charge, his bond was forfeited, and a bench warrant was issued for his arrest. Peltier was aware of the outstanding arrest warrant for attempted murder * On November 14, 1975, Oregon State Police stopped two vehicles near Ontario, Oregon: a motor home and a Plymouth station wagon. Peltier was one of the occupants of the motor home, and fled the scene, turning to fire at the state trooper. Upon searching both vehicles, Oregon authorities recovered from the motor home Special Agent Coler's revolver in a paper bag bearing Peltier's thumbprint, and from the station wagon several shell casings that had been fired from Coler's revolver. Peltier fled the scene, turning to fire at the arresting officer, the government introduced testimony that the following items were recovered upon a search of the vehicle: i. fourteen firearms, eight of which had obliterated serial numbers, and numerous boxes of shells; nine hand grenades and Finally, and most important, evidence linking Peltier to the murders was discovered upon a search of the vehicle from which he fled. The presence in the motor home of Agent Coler's revolver, in a bag having Peltier's thumbprint on it, w * On September 5, 1975, F.B.I. agents went to the Rosebud Indian Reservation, located about 180 miles east of the Pine Ridge Reservation, to arrest five persons charged with assault with a deadly weapon. While conducting a search incident to the arrest of several persons, 11 they recovered Special Agent Williams' .357 service revolver and several rifles linked ballistically to the case. Testimony revealed that the following items were found: a. seven firearms, several of which had obliterated serial numbers (the serial numbers on Special Agent Williams' service revolver and on Ex. 29-A, the M-1 .30 caliber Gerand rifle which Butler carried on the day of the murders were obliterated); b. a knapsack full of dynamite and hand grenades; c. a suitcase full of blasting caps; d. a bag containing spent rounds and live ammunition for various calibers; e. walkie-talkie radios. * On February 7, 1976, Peltier was arrested in Canada. The arresting officer testified that at the time of his arrest, Peltier had in his possession the .3030 rifle stolen in Oregon, other property stolen from the Oregon ranch house, two pistols, and an M-1 semiautomatic rifle. From a letter by Former FBI Agent in Charge - Joseph H. Trimbach dated December 3, 2009 July 27, 2009 - there was a parole hearing. The parole board found him to be undeserving, defiant, and completely without remorse. Like every judge who has reviewed the Peltier murder case, the board saw through his phony cloak of victimhood. Peltier was fairly tried and fairly convicted. This is the conclusion of every federal judge who's reviewed the case. Since his conviction in 1977, the evidence against Peltier has been repeatedly confirmed, expanded, and corroborated. There are other murders in which he may have been involved. In one of these cases, Peltier interrogated a young woman, Anna Mae Aquash, by putting a loaded gun in her mouth. People who have been fooled by the Peltier propaganda machine need to educate themselves on the facts: United States Court Sincerely, Gargoyle Our own little tastey pastey is wanting to stir up violence. What happened to the Rosebud sacred lands fundraising? I encourage you to read A.I.M. - American Indian Mafia. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Dave the Gnome Date: 20 Nov 12 - 11:20 AM Does decadent mean you only have 10 teeth then? DtG |
|
Subject: RE: BS: US Thanksgiving--Debate From: Greg F. Date: 20 Nov 12 - 10:12 AM Hey, Liz- tell ya what. Why don't you give me the names and contact information for a dozen or so of your Native American close pals on Pine Ridge & Rosebud and maybe the same number from the Cheyenne & Crow Reservations and throw in another dozen of the Zuni and Apache and I'll contact them all and ask them how much they appreciate your help and post the answers here verbatim? Whaddaya say? |
