BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Dec 15 - 03:04 PM

Any deaths because of this law yet?

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Stu
Date: 05 Jun 14 - 03:16 PM

"We here envy your right to defend yourselves against intruders/criminals/assailants"

Do we fuck as like. It's far better if no-one is armed than everyone. I love the US but they're completely bonkers when it comes to guns.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 05 Jun 14 - 01:03 PM

Bubblyrat you are being stupid. Knives make it easier to kill people than it is with no weapons. Guns make it easier to kill more people than knives do.

This is why the UK has not had a gun massacre in a school since Dunblane (after which the restrictions on guns to which you refer were introduced).

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Janie
Date: 05 Jun 14 - 12:26 AM

Sorry Mods. In a weak moment I thought I'd get a little buzz from the "aroma" of stirring sh*t.

Not cool.

When you stumble across this, please delete this and my previous post.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Janie
Date: 05 Jun 14 - 12:13 AM

Trying to connect the dots.

Bad gun laws.

Corrupt politicians.

Sawzaw's posts.

Got it! Sh*t is sh*t. It stinks.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: bubblyrat
Date: 04 Jun 14 - 08:28 AM

I don't really see how it makes any difference . OK, nobody should be allowed to take a LOADED weapon into a bar; IF there was an argument or a "scene" where violence was threatened , one or other would have to LOAD his weapon first, at which point he could be disarmed and overpowered. Simples.
      However, here in Great Britain ,absolutely NOBODY AT ALL is allowed to have ,possess or own ANY kind of pistol,revolver,semi-automatic or even a SINGLE SHOT MUZZLE - LOADING DUELLING PISTOL ( except criminals , of course !!) . Rifles for hunting are not encouraged ; if you CAN get a permit,the bolt ("they " do not like automatics !) MUST be kept in a different gun-safe than the gun (likewise the ammunition) .Shotguns are OK, but they don't like autos or pumps ,which are only allowed to be 3-shot .SO -we have the most restrictive gun laws in the world (except for criminals, of course,to whom these laws don't apply !) and yet the murder rate is RISING , the most common weapon being a knife . SO ; gun legislation doesn't work !!!!! We here envy your right to defend yourselves against intruders/criminals/assailants ; in the UK sadly, it is a SERiOUS OFFENCE to injure such a person,EVEN IF THEY ARE TRYING TO KILL YOU !!! So think yourselves LUCKY !!

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Greg F.
Date: 04 Jun 14 - 08:24 AM

No, ShitHEAD. I hope you recognize yourself, Sawz.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: GUEST,Sawzaw
Date: 04 Jun 14 - 02:53 AM

Shithole? 

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 30 Jul 13 - 09:01 PM

Q - the right has stolen from the people. The effort needed to redress that is not to make nice, but to fight back.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Jul 13 - 12:11 PM

There are also quite a few here who refuse to accept the truth when it is served up on a silver platter... It's one thing to have a debate (discussion) with someone who is operating with facts and a rational mind but quite another to try to have a debate (discussion) with people who don't do facts and are delusional...

Yeah, I get torqued up here now and then but I do live in a fact based world and am fully capable of rational thoughts...

I don't care if someone disagrees with me if they use facts... If they don't then they are going to either be ignored, such as "--", or called out...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Big Mick
Date: 30 Jul 13 - 12:51 AM

You ever wonder why so many rarely post here any more? It is often because self serving know it all, belittling comments when one disagrees make decent debate impossible. I think that has been identified well in these last posts. Back to my cave.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Janie
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 08:20 PM

That is where the strong libertarian card comes into play, Kevin.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Greg F.
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 08:00 PM

So Woody Woodpecker is your role model?

Puerile jackass. Grow up. You know better, don't you?

And you still haven't provided any evidence to support your several libels & slanders.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 07:41 PM

I do have some appreciation of how entrenched the concept of states rights is (though I find it hard to undestand how it works when it comes to a federal ban on recreational drugs) - but the issue I touched on is different.

That was that a doctrine that there is an absolute constitutional ban on any federal regulation of the right to bear arms is completely irreconcilable with any kind of federal restriction on the kind of arms that can be borne.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Janie
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 07:28 PM

What I should have said is I wish the two of you, Greg F and Bobert, 99% of the time in the same camp I am in, would examine the way you communicate on this forum. And obviously, I should do the same.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 07:21 PM

So Woody Woodpecker is your role model?

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Greg F.
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 07:03 PM

Yeah, Bill, well I may be a pain in the ass- but that doesn't make me wrong.

Woody was a pain on the ass, too.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 01:28 PM

and Greg... even though I agree with your basic moral stands and political views.. YOU have bad manners. I think I said about the same thing several years ago.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 01:25 PM

Well, Q... if more & more of the good guys surrender, it will mean...ummm...yeah... you know. I hate to see bad manners drive away so many. I ain't goin' nowhere, but I can only type so fast.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Greg F.
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 01:22 PM

Greg F is a perfect example of one who uses bait and deny tactics, and removes phrases from context.

Q - please supply some evidence to support this outrageous charge.

Because you choose to read into my posts things that I do not say, that is not MY fault, sir, but YOURS.

Blaming the victim, as it were - similar to you blaming Martin, perhaps?

And rather than back up your accusations or provide evidence, you take your ball and go home.

Fascinating.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 12:37 PM

Greg F is a perfect example of one who uses bait and deny tactics, and removes phrases from context.

I will no longer post in below the line (below the belt) threads. The 3-4 who have no respect for facts or the opinions and sensibilities of others have flushed discussions here into a stinking cesspool. Wading through the sewage is not worth it.
Whether I will continue to contribute to lyrics or musical discussion, I have not yet decided.

Mudcat lacks any attempt at consistent rules of posting or behavior. It is a grave fault.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bobert
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 10:08 AM

You are preaching to the choir, Janie...

I know all to well that there is no monolithic white population in the South... Heck, coming from a family with a long history in the struggle for civil rights, I am proof of it...

But with an 800% increase in white supremacist groups (Southern Poverty Law Center stat) since Obama was elected it isn't unfair to examine the fact that more and more white people, mostly in the South, have taken a major step backwards... To deny that is to deny our rights as civilized people to bring this to the attention of the general population in the hopes that some will go, "Sheet fire, we ***do*** have a major problem brewing here..."...

That's exactly what the "Moral Mondays" have been about...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Greg F.
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 09:59 AM

There is no monolithic "White" south.

No shit. I never said there was.

the reactionary legislation on a number of issues that have been passed by the NC legislature in the past 6 months are not measures that are exclusive to the south.

No shit. I never said they were.

Janie, I ask you to examine your thought processes; particularly your propensity for junmping to conclusions and putting words in other people's mouths.

Q seems to have many of the same problems, plus he is in denial about the persistent racism in the U.S. - North AND South.

As for North Carolina, McCrory, Art Pope, and the rest of the mad dog TeaPublicans have been screwing things up at a rate that far surpasses any of the rest of the states. I did look at your podcast, but after the first few minutes of talking heads not saying much of anything I couldn't see wasting another 30 minutes.

You might benefit from looking at http://www.southernstudies.org/ , and at http://www.ncjustice.org/ and Googling "Barbara Parramore".

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 09:06 AM

Kevin... because the Constitution is pretty vague in its short sentence, it is interpreted by various state courts in various ways. Some of us think the short sentence should ONLY be seen as allowing citizens to 'bear arms' ONLY when acting AS a militia... but.....

It is difficult for those on the other side of the pond to realize just how strong the idea of 'states rights' is embedded in the culture here... especially in the South. Do you have many major areas where Suffolk can pass laws totally different from Kent? We have this in alcohol laws, abortion laws, voting laws, tax laws.... and the gun laws.

The problem that this thread illustrates is our bad luck in having the census that is mandated every 10 years happen just when many states voted in a bunch of Republicans... who then redrew voting districts in ways that allowed them to pack the legislatures with Tea Party conservatives, whether or not they actually had a statewide consensus. They are now using this to change laws to ensure that it will be difficult to vote them out again.
Remember when Saddam ruled Iraq with a minority party? We are seeing folks try to emulate the basics of that technique. Kinda scary.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Jul 13 - 08:01 AM

One thing that puzzles me is that if it is unconstitutional for your government to regulate bearing of arms, how can this be recnciled with any kind of limitations on what kind of arms can be borne, since by definition such restrictions are a form of regulation. Grenades, rocket launchers...

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Janie
Date: 28 Jul 13 - 09:14 PM

Not yet, Kevin.

I agree with Q.

Greg F., I ask you to examine your thought processes. Your statement suggests you are as inclined to stereotyping as are those you castigate. Bobert, I wish you would do the same. There is no monolithic "White" south. And the reactionary legislation on a number of issues that have been passed by the NC legislature in the past 6 months are not measures that are exclusive to the south.

I'm guessing neither of you have taken the 30 minutes to listen to the podcast I recommended. I take no offense at that. I understand and accept that my voice is not very important or listened to on Mudcat, and certainly not very exciting. But Q is a respected and thoughtful voice. Please open your minds and consider what he is saying. He is not speaking from a political perspective, but from a sociological perspective and from a place of care and concern.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Greg F.
Date: 28 Jul 13 - 09:04 PM

Or are you just happy to see me?

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Jul 13 - 08:47 PM

Is it OK to have a grenade in your pocket?

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Jul 13 - 03:24 PM

Yeah. Gerrymandering processes are outdated.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bobert
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 08:32 PM

In the last election here in NC the Dems won the popular vote statewide for our 13 House of Representative seats yet were awarded only 4 of the 13 seats???

Something seriously messed up here...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Greg F.
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 08:25 PM

Throwing mud at the South doesn't help.

Tain't mud, Q - its fact, whether you like it or not.

vide the overturning of the voting rights act by an activist, right-wing TeaPublican court.

This ain't a rural/urban thing, amigo. This is disenrfranchising minority voters, plain & simple.

The new Jim Crow in the age of "colorblindness".

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 06:50 PM

Throwing mud at the South doesn't help.

Look at the maps of vote distribution in much of the Midwest and west and the same pattern of urban vs. small town-rural division is apparent.

The voting system is designed to prevent one segment of the population from overwhelming the other, hence it may seem that too much weight is given to the small town-rural segment by the county divisions in electing representatives to the state legislatures.

To heal the schism will require the efforts of both parties.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Greg F.
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 03:54 PM

Bobert: The pendulum will shift.

You bet, Elmore - even furthetr to the right. Before long, NC will be back to 1830.

The rst of the Republican South will follow.

Bumber Sticker: pictute of Abe Lincoln. Text: "Its my party, and I'll cry if I want to."

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Janie
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 03:22 PM

Well said, Q.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Elmore
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 02:45 PM

Bobert: The pendulum will shift. (just not in my congressional district)

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bobert
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 01:27 PM

I don't tell the farmer what and when to plant... I don't want him telling me how to manage a city...

That's what it comes down to... The ignorant rural people seem to know what it takes to run cities??? Go figure???

Might of fact, they are so sure that can better run cities that they are in the process of trying to steal the Charlotte airport, which BTW is on land owned by Charlotte, was built by Charlotte and is the 6th busiest airport in the world... Wonder how that has come about if Charlotte doesn't know how to run an airport??? BTW, the Republican answer to why they think the deserve to steal our property is, "Because we can"... They really haven't given an answer other than to say, "We can do better"... Oh??? Like how??? Tear up the runways and plant corn???

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 12:47 PM

Like many states, the divide between the urban and small-town and rural vote is strong. In the 2012 NC House elections, four Democrats and nine Republicans were elected. In the vote for president, Obama had 49.9 and McCain 49.5 percent. In the state itself, 77 Republicans and 43 Democrats were elected to the state House of Representatives. The state Senate is Republican dominated.

The Supreme Court in a 5-4 vote disabled the Voting Rights Act by removing enforcement provisions

Because of county vote distribution, the Republicans are easily elected to the State House and can get their bills passed. The small-town and rural voters are happy and urban citizens are the losers.

I have no opinion as to how the split between the two groups of voters can be healed. but it is dangerous and both sides must find a way to cooperate in order to have a healthy country.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bobert
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 10:01 AM

In this morning's "Charlotte Observer" the governor is reported of boasting of getting 20 outta 22 of his right winged bills thru the statehouse...

Winners: ALEC, NRA, Tea Party

Losers: Women, schools, the environment, Charlotte (for voting Dem they are having their airport stolen), the working poor who will pay more regressive taxes, NC's colleges, black voters, college student voters, Democrats, etc...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Elmore
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 09:55 AM

I have to cross the state line from Georgia to NC to buy hard liquor at the ABC store. Should I be frightened? The town looks okay, but one never knows.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: gnu
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 05:46 AM

"ready, fire, aim." I LOVE it! I shall use it. Fits perfectly in something I am writing. Sounds like there may be a song in it too.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Janie
Date: 27 Jul 13 - 01:56 AM

Fellow residents of NC, take a listen to the podcast of Frank Stasio's "State of Things" for today, July, 26 for an excellent discussion of what the hell has happened in NC. State of Things podcast July 26, 2013

It is beyond it simply being Republicans in power, Bobert. What we have is an executive and legislative branch with little experience with governance at the State level.

I am reeling at the damage that has been wrought. I fear we are in for 10 years of this as the result of the most recent gerrymandering. I'd like to lay all the blame on the Republicans for that, but NC has often been labeled the most gerrymandered State in the Union for many years.

One of the pundits on today's show characterized the actions of the legislature, as "ready, fire, aim."

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Rapparee
Date: 26 Jul 13 - 09:29 PM

We had a long, long discussion at Library Board meetings in Kentucky (Cincinnati metro area) about permitting concealed weapons in the building. Finally, one of the Board members pointed out that unless we wanted to be cops and search everyone who came in we had no way of knowing if someone had a concealed weapon. And if they expose it, then it's no longer concealed.

Sawed-off shotguns are illegal in the US under Federal law, as I'm certain they are in Scotland. He should have shoved it down the front of his pants so when it went off he couldn't reproduce.

Anyone who carries a "Rambo" knife knows nothing about using one for work or otherwise. If it's illegal the cops should deal with it, if they don't they're failing in their duty to the public.

I might well carry a knife AND a gun -- up in the hills around here, where the critters ain't tame and 99% of whom run from you anyway. The gun is to frighten them, not to hurt them unless I have no other choice, but I've found that most animals will run from a gunshot. Them that don't, well, I don't think even a .700 H&H Express would deter them from having me for lunch. I might as well cover myself with mayonnaise, because I can't afford or would buy something like a that.

As for my knife, well, I have a Buck General I bought back in '68 to kill people -- I haven't yet and don't plan on it. It's in a sheath with a full-flap top so it would be hard to pull out quickly. It IS useful for splitting campfire wood when you use the knife as a wedge and another piece of wood as a mallet though. Only thing I ever bought with a possibly homicidal intent, but my NG unit had just been activated and we somehow KNEW we were going to 'Nam. Wouldn't buy it now, but I'm not about to get rid of it as there are too many memories tied up in it of camping and things.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 26 Jul 13 - 01:40 PM

In more than one western state, some women carry a small handgun in their purse. I have seen this in Texas and New Mexico and know that the practice exists in some Rocky Mt. states besides NM.

Be extra careful when you attempt a pick-up in a bar.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: gnu
Date: 26 Jul 13 - 01:18 PM

A couple of years ago, I was in a grocery store (nb.ca) and I saw a guy with a shaved head, weird beard, piercings, spider web tattoo on his head and neck, big black army boots... you get the pic. Then, I saw the knife. One a them there Rambo killin knives. I saw the manager and pointed out the knife and said, "That is illegal and "someone" should call the cops. You gotta cell phone on yer belt." He shrugged. I went to the pay phone and dialed 911 and told the Yella Stripes. They wanted my name and... and... and... I said, "It's illegal and offensive. You have the info." and I hung up. When I left 30 minutes later, still no RCMP. Still pisses me off.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Jack Campin
Date: 26 Jul 13 - 12:23 PM

if someone is carrying any concealed weapon, how would you know?

We had a case here in Scotland a few years ago where somebody put a sawn-off shotgun down his pants before going into a bar. He managed to shoot himself in the thigh and nearly died of blood loss.

Memo to self: when going debt collecting wear a kilt.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bobert
Date: 26 Jul 13 - 11:38 AM

We had a rash of small-dick-big-gun wackos infest restaurants back in Virginia after Virginia passed a law allowing them to be carried in places that sold alcohol...

Yup, the small-dick-big-gun wackos would assemble like some posse and then about 10 of them would come in with their heat right there in holsters... I recall being in one of those restaurants when they showed up... My son was about 2 years old and, frankly, it took my appetite away... I asked the manager if he was okay with them being in there... He said he wished they hadn't come in but unless the owner of the joint put up a "no guns" sign that there was nothing he could do... He was very apologetic to me as well as other folks who complained...

I asked that he box up our food and bring us a check... Many other patrons did the same...

This is just boorish, redneckism at its worse... I mean, it's like me going into your house and taking a big steaming dump in the middle of your living room... What is wrong with these people other than they have small dicks???

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Rapparee
Date: 26 Jul 13 - 10:20 AM

I've seen exactly ONE person with a gun in a bar in Idaho -- unloaded, showing it off at a meeting of the local Cowboy Action Shooters groups. Nice -- old ivory grips, completely (and well!) engraved, with the engraving highlighted with gold. I'm pretty certain that it was also silver plated. He'd inherited it from his grandfather and wanted to show it off before he put it away in a safe deposit box at the bank. (It was an original Colt SAA, made long before the ban on the ivory trade.)

That's not to say that people haven't. After all, if someone is carrying any concealed weapon, how would you know?

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: Bobert
Date: 26 Jul 13 - 08:53 AM

Yeah, up until 2 years ago North Carolina was the face of the New South... Then "Citizens United" allowed for outside, secret money to come into the state and the Koch brothers, who don't live here and don't own anything here, poured millions into North Carolina to buy the General Assembly and the Governor...

BTW, the above list of right wing legislation by no means is a complete list...

Charlotte has been punished for voting Democratic... It's neighboring representatives pushed thru legislation that would out right steal Charlotte's airport, which is a hub for US Air... Yup, the legislation called for the airport to be taken away from Charlotte and placed under an authority with 7 members, only 2 from Charlotte... The bill also said that the profits from the airport could be taken by surrounding counties???

This went straight to court and the Republicans knew what they had done was illegal so they hastily put together another bill last night the creates an airport authority with 13 memebers with Charlotte having 7 members...

No matter??? It's still theft of Charlotte's #1 resource...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: GUEST,Arkie
Date: 26 Jul 13 - 08:38 AM

I grew up in Virginia in a county that bordered North Carolina, had relatives there, spent three years in graduate school there and worked there during the summers. At that time, I thought North Carolina to be one of the south's most progressive states. But that was 50 years ago. Sad to see what has happened in that beautiful state with such wonderful people. Guess there are some who figure they have keep pace with South Carolina.

Subject: RE: BS: Concealed Guns Okay'd in NC Bars...
From: gnu
Date: 26 Jul 13 - 06:07 AM

Disgusting... on everything Bobert listed. Talk about yer lack of morals.