BS: Anyone defend US gun law?

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 04:53 AM

Unbelievable?

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: GUEST,gillymor
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 09:39 AM

For the record Thomas Jefferson did not author the 2nd amendment. He advocated for a bill of rights but was not present at the Constitutional Convention as he was out of the country as the U.S. Minister to France. James Madison and possibly George Mason are thought to be the main writers of the 2nd.

Jefferson did argue that constitutions and laws should expire after 19 years and that each succeeding generation should write their own according to their own circumstances:

" Every constitution, then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of nineteen years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, and not of right. It may be said, that the succeeding generation exercising, in fact, the power of repeal, this leaves them as free as if the constitution or law had been expressly limited to nineteen years only. In the first place, this objection admits the right, in proposing an equivalent. But the power of repeal is not an equivalent. It might be, indeed, if every form of government were so perfectly contrived, that the will of the majority could always be obtained, fairly and without impediment. But this is true of no form. The people cannot assemble themselves; their representation is unequal and vicious. Various checks are opposed to every legislative proposition. Factions get possession of the public councils, bribery corrupts them, personal interests lead them astray from the general interests of their constituents; and other impediments arise, so as to prove to every practical man, that a law of limited duration is much more manageable than one which needs a repeal." --Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, 1789. ME 7:459, Papers 15:396

If Jefferson were around today he certainly would have seen our "enslavement to previous generations" in the 2nd amendment.

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: GUEST,SOL
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 01:57 PM

Am I correct in saying the margin of votes in a presidential election is held by the gun lobby and also the religious belt?
If so, it seems evidently clear why these two factions are woo-ed (and never challenged) by the candidates of all parties.

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: olddude
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 02:43 PM

Read Jefferson quote on guns you can Google it then say that again about what he would do

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: pdq
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 02:54 PM

Thomas Jefferson's quotes on gun ownership:


Jefferson QUOTE-1

"In a nation governed by the people themselves, the possession of arms to defend their nation against usurpers within and without was deemed absolutely necessary."



Jefferson QUOTE-2

"This right is protected by the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution."

Jefferson on Politics & Government: Civil Rights



Jefferson QUOTE-3

A gun was an everyday implement in early American society, and Jefferson recommended its use.

Jefferson on Politics & Government: Civil Rights



Jefferson QUOTE-4

"I advise the gun"

--Thomas Jefferson to Peter Carr, 1785. ME 5:85, Papers 8:407



Jefferson QUOTE-5

"I advise the gun. . . . it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind."

--Thomas Jefferson to Peter Carr, 1785. ME 5:85, Papers 8:407



Jefferson QUOTE-6

" . . . all power is inherent in the people; that... it is their right . . . to be at all times armed."

--Thomas Jefferson to John Cartwright, 1824. ME 16:45



Jefferson QUOTE-7

" . . . all power is inherent in the people; that... it is their . . . duty to be at all times armed."

--Thomas Jefferson to John Cartwright, 1824. ME 16:45



Jefferson QUOTE-8

"One loves [includes himself] to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them."

--Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796. ME 9:341



Jefferson QUOTE-9

"Let your gun, therefore, be the constant companion of your walks."

--Thomas Jefferson to Peter Carr, 1785. ME 5:85, Papers 8:407



Jefferson QUOTE-10

"The constitutions of most of our States assert that all power is inherent in the people; that... it is their right and duty to be at all times armed."

--Thomas Jefferson to John Cartwright, 1824. ME 16:45



Jefferson QUOTE-11

"A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball, and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun, therefore, be the constant companion of your walks."

--Thomas Jefferson to Peter Carr, 1785. ME 5:85, Papers 8:407

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: olddude
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 02:56 PM

Reminds me any got a rear sight for an s+with. 44mag. Took the scope off and lost the sights dang

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Greg F.
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 02:59 PM

Uh Hunh, PeeDee. Now can we talk about the 21st Century & situations that never would have occurred to the ol' red-headed bastard?

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: GUEST,gillymor
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 03:05 PM

It will probably never sink in to you guys that Jefferson lived in a frontier nation where guns were quite necessary to existence. As exemplified in the passage I quoted below he was not so obtuse as to believe that an anachronistic law would be still be relevant 225 years later.

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 03:47 PM

You can't educate pork.
Or dinosaurs.

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: olddude
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 06:35 PM

Frontier days less than 7 people a year shot today more than that a week in one city

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 17 Oct 14 - 07:22 PM

Jefferson lived in a frontier nation where guns were quite necessary to existence

You didn't have any more need for a gun in New York or Philadelphia in 1790 than you do now.

Of course Jefferson's generation only had to deal with bears, wolves, escaping slaves, Canadians and pro-British traitors. Obviously if he'd known about the risk posed to America by feminist media theorists he'd have written pipe bombs into the Constitution.

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Bill D
Date: 18 Oct 14 - 12:50 PM

What is beyond sad is that because of the open carry laws and refusal by the authorities to provide security, 'they' were able to stop her from speaking with only a threat.

Thomas Jefferson and, I'd bet, all of the Founders, would have been appalled at this use of the 2nd Amendment. That idea of revisiting all the relevant laws every 19 years is sounding better & better.

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Musket
Date: 18 Oct 14 - 01:59 PM

Keep banging the rocks together guys..

🔫💵

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: olddude
Date: 18 Oct 14 - 06:51 PM

Musket Lol yes an endless circle jerk

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: olddude
Date: 18 Oct 14 - 06:53 PM

We go round and round my friend no one will budge an endless circle jerk

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: olddude
Date: 18 Oct 14 - 09:31 PM

Me too, but you gotta see the watch Mahlon made for me. It is awesome Greg

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Bill D
Date: 19 Oct 14 - 09:58 AM

Gee, Musket... that's really helpful. Thank you so much for your deep insight.

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Musket
Date: 19 Oct 14 - 11:21 AM

Any time Bill. Any time.

😸

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: GUEST,Rahere
Date: 20 Oct 14 - 04:36 AM

You're getting the point, Olddude: the NRA is by far a bigger threat in quantifiable terms to the US than al-Qaida and IS combined.

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Bill D
Date: 20 Oct 14 - 11:07 AM

Musket...the rocks I've been banging are disturbing my neighbor, and he's threatening to shoot me. May I throw them at him? I do want to follow the right procedures.

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: olddude
Date: 20 Oct 14 - 11:53 AM

You guys are making progress on me. Yesterday I was carrying a colt. 380 instead of a glock. It is much smaller caliber so little steps at a time and some day I may be down to a ball bat

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Musket
Date: 20 Oct 14 - 12:11 PM

The snag is Bill, throwing rocks evolves into designing guns.

Basically, you're all fucked.

The trick is to evolve to the stage where throwing rocks or playing with bang bangs isn't your initial solution to the neighbour's reaction.

Not hard. Even the Germans got there eventually...

Subject: RE: BS: Anyone defend US gun law?
From: Bill D
Date: 20 Oct 14 - 12:35 PM

I once suggested tongue-in-cheek to a self-described mercenary that we settle wars by issuing bags of marshmallows and you were 'out' after so many white spots on your uniform. He replied: "Yeah.... that might work for awhile. Then some bastard like me would come along and put a rock in each one... and off we'd go again!"