BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Musket
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 01:56 PM

Just in case those talking about what an independent Scotland would look like...

It would look like Narnia because like Narnia, it doesn't exist. We voted to retain the union. I tried to look for advantages of independence before casting my vote and couldn't think of a single one.

Not one.

Irrelevant now.

I look to those working in the Scottish parliament concentrating on what they can achieve here on earth, given the constitutional makeup. Rather than what they could do if only the people hadn't told them to Fuck Off last year.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 02:58 PM

So that wardrobe I go through at Gretna isn't real? :-)

I presume this is the Scottish Musket who is either a doctor or is married to a doctor BTW? Some people cannot seem to see the difference or even suggest that all Muskets are the same. Probably in the same way they think all Chinese look the same or all Jews are money lenders...

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,achmelvich
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 03:13 PM

musket - would it not be something of an advantage for the scots if they weren't permanently ruled by a load of privileged eejits who have a very different set of priorities to theirs?

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 04:44 PM

What would SNP demand in return?
Nothing of benefit to UK obviously.

Scotland is the UK just as much as Hertfordshire is the UK. As is the Westcountry, Wales and Northern Ireland. Politicians fighting their own corners is the inevitable consequence of our horribly south-east-centric way of running the country. Boris fights his corner very well for London, right? Do you think he does it with altruistic intention for the rest of the UK? If it's OK for Boris, why isn't it OK for Alex?

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: akenaton
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 05:20 PM

Because the SNP are dedicated to making Scotland an independent country,....a sovereign nation....splitting the UK.

That is "telling it like it is".

I wish them well in their endeavours.

Our politicians will do anything within reason to achieve their goal, just as UK politicians do to save their jobs and their privilege, so stop whining that it is "just not fair" again.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 06:15 PM

I'm sure the Welsh Nats would love Wales to be independent. I'm sure Sinn Fein would love to have a united and independent Ireland. There are Cornish nationalists round here who are quite popular. All these, and the SNP, do not get their way because we have a democracy. If you don't get your way in a democracy (I never get my way - for 36 years I've lived either in an ultra-safe Tory seat or a Tory-LibDem marginal) you still have every right to continue to fight your corner and make your argument without the risk of your supporters being disadvantaged. This current theme of Scotland deserving to be shat on because they nearly (but not quite) voted for independence is arrant nonsense. We'll leave collective punishment to the Israeli regime, shall we?

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 06:33 PM

Whatever hsppened to DevoMax?

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Teribus
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 09:09 PM

Moderators could you give me some explanation why when asked a specific question on this forum I am not allowed to respond?

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 09:11 PM

Don't worry, mate, it happens to us all. It just isn't really our gig, I guess.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Teribus
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 09:17 PM

"Steve Shaw - 26 Mar 15 - 06:15 PM

Israel has got what to do with this topic?

A political party whose core policy is to break up the United Kingdom cannot under any guise under heaven EVER claim that it will seriously act in the best interests of the United Kingdom - if they claim to do so they are lying.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Musket
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 02:42 AM

Achmelvich. What makes you think a a Westminster government or a Holyrood government would or could be any different to each other?

I reckon you have been reading too many newspapers. You vote. You get the government.

Akenaton appears unable to distinguish between Nationalist and Nation. The constitution of SNP is for Scottish decisions for Scotland, preferably through independence but also through devolution if that remains the will of the people.

It is why they can still run the Parish pump and carry on as a party post referendum.

Dave. Correct. Your mate is, I believe, in bed with lurgy at present. Although I did see a post on a music thread that could only be him.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Allan Conn
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 02:54 AM

The SNP have been in gvt in Scotland for almost two whole terms now and according to all the polls are on track for another landslide victory - in a voting system designed to make it hard to get big majorities - and of course the Scottish parliament is now itself a core institution of the UK. If the SNP are trusted by enough of the electorate to run that UK institution then why on earth would they not be trusted to have 5% or 6% or so of the seats in another UK institution?

Secondly as to portrayal I am sorry but the weekly absurdity of Question Time panels was at it again last night. The female Tory politician on the panel again said that the idea that smaller parties may have any say was "incredibly frightening". Again it was aimed at Jim Murphy of Labour and the idea that a Labour gvt may work to some degree with the SNP.

Then Janet Street Porter said "people in England, without wanting to sound xenophobic, find all this talk of Plaid Cymru and deals very worrying"

Well sorry Janet but whatever way you dress it that does sound a tad kind of xenophobic and to the Tory woman if some people in England are really "frightened" of the SNP then it is only because Tory politicians keep telling them they have something to be "frightened" about. You are using language in a way to try and alarm people.

Now I know voters of a certain persuasion can be worried or frightened about other parties. I have various English Tory voting relatives who worry about Ed Miliband and his party. But this is different in language. The people who are claimed to be frightened or worried are "the English in general" whilst the demons on the door step are the SNP and Welsh Nationalists. It is a drip drip demonising of the non-English parties in a bid to try and scare English voters away from voting Labour which is all the more absurd when there is just as much a chance of the Tories coming to some accord with UKIP who seem to be riddled with racists, xenophobes, homophobes and misogynists. A much scarier prospect than either of the non English nationalist parties. And doubly absurd because sheer demographics ensure that the vast bulk of seats at Westminster are taken up by MPs from English constituencies. They will always have overall control of the house.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Musket
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 03:26 AM

It is odd. UKIP of course give the impression of a protest vote and their policies do not stand scrutiny at any level, not matter how much you try to see what they could actually offer. They seem to offer lala land for bigots and racists but there you go.

SNP however are just the Labour Party without the Westminster whip. The origins of a party committed to independence, let's face it, could be on the left or right, socialist or capitalist in outlook. But in order to win votes you need to display policies. Hence a liberal outlook built on equality and social infrastructure. They obviously know the minds of Scots, even if they did get the mood wrong when it came to what they reckon is their fundamental reason for existing. I'm still chuckling over it.

The clever trick being that people like me could easily like what they aim to do day to day whilst those who want independence at any cost also vote for them even though SNP politicians would find their views abhorrent.

Good example here on Mudcat by the way.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Allan Conn
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 03:49 AM

I agree Musket the idea that because a party's ideals are a certain way then all those who vote for them feel that way is way off.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Teribus
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 04:01 AM

"The SNP have been in gvt in Scotland for almost two whole terms now and according to all the polls are on track for another landslide victory"

And they have achieved what Allan?

Health Service in chaos

Education in chaos right across the board

Police Service shambolic

Since losing the independence referendum they chatter on about more powers, what for? As the Government of Scotland, they have steadfastly refused to use the powers they currently have to alleviate what they perceive as being Scottish problems, preferring instead to sit back watch the "train-wreck" as their own populist policies create more shortages and then blame Westminster.

Personally as a Scot, I would actually prefer it if they shut the Scottish Parliament down, that of course isn't going to happen, but it would save billions - in reality it only ever was a totally unnecessary additional tier of Government created by Nu-Liebour to provide jobs for the boys and increase the number of places at the trough for a bunch of third raters. Like their White Paper this current SNP Government and any other is not fit for purpose.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Howard Jones
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 04:38 AM

Whenever a single party cannot obtain a majority then minority parties will carry influence out of all proportion to numbers who voted for them. That is dangerous enough, in that there is a risk of the will of a minority overturning the that of the majority, but it is something we have to live with.

At least most of the minority parties, be it the Lib Dems, the Greens, UKIP etc claim to have the interests of the whole of the UK at heart. The difference with the SNP (and to a lesser extent Plaid Cymru) is that they do not.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: akenaton
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 04:57 AM

I'm sorry to disagree Mr T, but devolution was dreamt up, not as jobs for incompetent Scottish politicials, but to head off the real and present danger (in the late 70s) of Scottish independence.
A tactic, just like the Westminster coalition of "left and right", who made the vow of "Devo Max Max" during the late referendum and on which they have since reneged.

Allan, of course you are correct that all parties have supporters and members of different social persuasions, but you aught to be a bit more careful in who YOU perceive to be bigoted.

I have pointed out that on one policy UKIP have been proved to be correct, that unregulated immigration from the EU is a disaster for the UK in social terms(lack of infrastructure etc), and in political terms, as it has led to our own young people being deemed "uncompetitive" and forced to endure a life of absolute despair, a feeling of worthlessness, and in many cases abject poverty.

No one blames the immigrants for this, to them the UK is a honey pot and most of them see working here as the best way of supporting their families......our young folk would have absolutely nothing to gain by moving to Rumania hence the analogy of the sloping playing field.
Our government, Scottish or UK must take it on board that our young people who are presently parked on benefits which are unable to sustain them in any sort of meaningful life, must be taken into the work force and given a purpose, a means of contributing to a society which they see as working in their interests, not the interests of Capital.

This may mean a lowering of living standards for some of us...and looking at some UK members of this forum, that would not be a bad idea :0), but there is really no alternative, Blair's remarks about immigration and global competitiveness are now seen as a cynical and short term ploy, typical of the man who was nothing but an opportunist.
While we remain in the EU, we will never be able to be really independent, or have the ability to act in the best interests of our people
You seem to be in favour of Independence, as I am, but is it not about time we threw away all the fairy tale ideologies and started looking at the realities?

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 05:09 AM

Falls for the Daily Heil scare stories hook line and sinker then goes on about other people looking at realities. You couldn't make it up...

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: akenaton
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 05:29 AM

Allan, I forgot to mention, but have been a self employed builder and slater in Argyll for over fifty years....I don't live in a bubble, I have had literally thousands of customers and friends locally in that time, I know how most of them think and in rural Scotland most are very socially conservative....we ignore that at our peril as the defeat in the late referendum has shown.

If you think that opposition to some "liberal" social policies is bigotry, then the new Scotland will have a high representation.
If we are to become a free country, intelligent people like you need to stop demonising fellow Scots for their social views.....we must not allow the media to dictate what sort of society we construct.

All that said as a member of the Communist Party for 40 years and the SNP for the last 16. If we are to move forward as a Nation, we must be aware of the strengths AND WEAKNESSES of our political ideology.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 05:43 AM

..we must not allow the media to dictate what sort of society we construct.

Says the man who spouts the media lies that suit his agenda best.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: akenaton
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 05:46 AM

As I mentioned further up the thread Labour have much more in common with; and more to gain from a coalition with the Tories, than they have in any attachment to the SNP.


But THAT would be giving the GAME away, wouldn't it. :0)

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Musket
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 08:17 AM

Funny. I have been living near to Akenaton for a few years now and can state with relief that I have never come across anybody here who shares his outlook. My husband and I have integrated well into the local community and fail to recognise his take on a community he lives in but obviously doesn't understand or seem to be part of.

Fascinating.

There again, Scotland voted for a future he seems to think we don't want. No matter. He is irrelevant.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Teribus
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 08:37 AM

"Few years" versus someone born, raised, schooled and worked there over the course of a lifetime - I think I'd put my money on the local man to know the score far better than any "incomer".

IIRC correctly Ake, Allan is from around Kelso down in the Borders, so the two communities (i.e. his and yours) are not so different.

On this and I dare say a number of other issues Akenaton and I are at opposite ends of the spectrum, he is perfectly entitled to his opinion on any subject under the sun and I am entitled to mine, we can state them freely and without rancor and without haking personal attacks as Christmas puts it.

Off to Google "haking" see you in a week.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 09:22 AM

Teribus burbling on about HE disapproves of personal attacks is hilarious. More, please!

I should like to revisit the sentiment of the opening post, and agree with it. The UK is politically very heterogeneous. I sometimes think that the Scots-bashers look at the map, see the narrow bit that delineates Scotland from England, and see no need for any further evidence than that with which to cement their prejudice. As this is a democracy, it doesn't matter who you voted for or what party you're in once the government is up and running. I EXPECT my local MPs to fight the Westcountry's corner. It's healthy that the Welsh Nats fight theirs. Whilst I don't care much for the unionists in the Six Counties, they and Sinn Fein have every right to fight for their local interests, civilly one hopes. I should like to see a lot more of this regionalism, actually, and we shouldn't forget that the reason we have it is that the country has been governed south-east-centrically since time immemorial. In none of these cases does advocacy of your local region make you less a member of this democracy. The SNP put up a stout, DEMOCRATIC fight for independence, and they lost, and, as far as I can see, they are still complying with the democratic norms of the whole nation. Actually, the referendum campaign has been widely lauded for being one of the best ever for engaging the public and apprising them of the issues. The turnout was good evidence for that. The best national example of good democracy in action in recent decades, I'd suggest. Naturally, there's a lot of political big talk going around before the election and the SNP have rolled up their sleeves as eagerly as anyone. But, before we get carried away with talk of their wielding the power, making Ed their poodle, etc., let's not forget two things: once the results are in, realpolitik takes over and all that's gone before is just fluff; and we've been here before, with a tawdry rump of LibDems, on the back of a fall in their vote, keeping one of the nastiest Tory governments of all time in power. I doubt whether the SNP could get anywhere near being as bad as that.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Musket
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 10:59 AM

A big difference between having a view and lying about sections of society in order to demonise them. My Mum doesn't understand the attraction of people of the same sex either, and I don't see the sexual attraction of women but most of us don't see barriers in that. It is weak disturbed people who point out reasons not to see others as equal.

A bit like your odious remarks regarding British Muslims or Akenaton's slur on gays, travellers, female members of the armed forces etc etc.

From your hilarious comments about the area I live in, at what point, (three more years? Fifty years?) will our neighbours suddenly start hating us then?

Stupid fool 😹😹😹

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: akenaton
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 12:24 PM

No one hates you dear boy, it's all in your head.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: akenaton
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 12:33 PM

"Anyone who thinks they can get inside the head of a Gael in "ten minutes", is seriously mistaken."   (Ake...Mudcat 2015) :0)

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 01:32 PM

Ake, It is obvious that English is not your first language but you really need to learn what quote marks are for. "ten minutes" makes no sense whatsoever. Dear boy.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,achmelvich
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 02:08 PM

musket - i thought you lived down south somewhere and just had a few holiday homes in scotland. a bit like an absentee landlord then. not surprising if one of your multiple personalities isn't too keen on scots running their own show. sorry if i got this wrong - but i do find it a bit confusing to work out where you are (all) coming from.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 02:49 PM

Like I explained before, achmelvich, there are no multiple personalities with Musket. There are 3 separate people posting with the same name. Rather like three different people in the pub with the same name. in my case I always say we are the posh submarine commanders. "Dave, Dave, Dave" :-) The original Musket (Ian) is poorly I think. This one is, I think, the doctor in Scotland. The third is, I believe, his wife, who, annoyingly for Ake, is a man.

Have I got that right Muskets?

Multiple personalities are when you get one person posting under different names. Rather like some of our guests on here do.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,zero rimsky-korsakov
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 03:38 PM

thanks dtg. that explains a lot - it is a bit confusing and boring and i lose the will to try and follow it all- and nothing - why do people want to pretend to be yet another grumpy old bloke or be 2/3 versions of one grumpy old bloke?

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 05:00 PM

there are no multiple personalities with Musket. There are 3 separate people posting with the same name.

Does anyone actually believe this?

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 05:10 PM

Does anyone actually believe this?

In the absence of evidence to the contrary, yes, I do.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: TheSnail
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 05:32 PM

Sorry. Above anonymous GUEST was me unlike other anonymous GUESTs who, I suspect, are all further manifestations of Musket.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 05:36 PM

You suspect wrong.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: TheSnail
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 05:45 PM

In the absence of evidence to the contrary...

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: akenaton
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 06:18 PM

:0)

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 06:23 PM

For the record:

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Mar 15 - 06:15 PM

"We'll leave collective punishment to the Israeli regime, shall we?"


I'm keeping track.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 06:51 PM

Of what? You're barking mad.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 15 - 07:05 PM

Sorry. Above anonymous GUEST was me unlike other anonymous GUESTs who, I suspect, are all further manifestations of Musket.

Well, the latest GUEST post count is 105,726. So tell us where, in that avalanche, Musket's guest posts begin. When contemplating his total number of posts, don't forget to add the thousands of posts actually posted under the Musket soubriquet. It's perfectly obvious to all that the recent anonymous guest posts can't all, or nearly all, or anything like nearly all, be by Musket. More likely, I'd suggest, it's none at all, unless he's done a few in a moment or two of levity. It is not his style. Whilst they don't have to, the moderators will be able to confirm that, I'm sure. Ŵe get more than enough unsupportable assertions around here without your adding to the sorry roster.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Bert
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 12:37 AM

...ye have to love them...

You are supposed to love everyone until they prove themselves unworthy of your love.

As for The Scots, they have a special place in my heart. When I was a boilermaker apprentice, my mentor was a dour Scot, with whom none of the other apprentices would work.

He seemed a bit fierce at first, but it was my job to learn from him. He was a really good craftsman and I learned an awful lot.

I learned a lot more about him the day that his canary died, and he came to work, almost in tears.

A great man and a great teacher and a great friend, I really missed him when he finally left.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Musket
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 02:34 AM

Wow. Anyone would think I crave attention. Or Musket does. Maybe Musket.

Had someone who understands why we do it wanting to join us recently. It's daft enough an idea as it is without anyone else joining in.

Just to repeat. The original Musket (me) got a little bit pissed off with certain people using the weak bully tactic of bringing up irrelevance in order to make your view look stupid. Two very good friends from our days together working around Sheffield and going round the folk clubs thought it would be fun to confuse the bastards by them not knowing which Musket it is.

To be fair, where one of us wants to give a very personal view, we say who it is, or in Martyn's case, post as some bloke in Scotland. I occasionally put Ian at the end and Nick makes it obvious by references to living in London, whereas I am in "The Isle" and Martyn is in Inveraray.

It does make it difficult to abuse the person posting and what made us finally do it was the strange spectacle of Keith A Hole of Hertford googling something, not what we put but something about one of us as people and as his search was flawed, questioned what we put.

Wow... These people, who don't know debate yet hate being exposed for their views actually exist. And whilst the buggers post here, we will ensure the view not the person is paramount by making it difficult for bullies with no respectable view to offer.

Mind you, nobody is perfect. I think Bryan leaves a snaily slime when he posts which makes me as bad. There again, thinking on, he casts doubt on anything I post so he obviously has nothing objective to offer.

Achmelvich. You displayed my point perfectly. Why would you confuse someone who states they live in Scotland for someone who doesn't? Especially when they state they live there? I do own a few properties north of the border but you just made it obvious you factored that into your contributions.

No need to be confused dear chap. Just start addressing what you read rather than what you prejudge.

Don't get like Terribulus who couldn't help pointing out Musket was gay when it had no bearing on his contribution to that thread and the Musket posting wasn't gay anyway.

You see, bigotry can't help revealing itself.

And it stinks anyway.

(I'm OK Dave. Musket was a week out when he said I had man flu. I was laid up with lurgy but fighting fit now.)

Oh. It is usually me in the music threads and only I open pm messages.

Now!

Scotland..

I am more concerned with my bricks and mortar rather than the people. So long as they look after my holiday lets and keep opening stonking restaurant in Edinburgh, the rest of the place can do what it wants.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,achmelvich
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 02:35 AM

given the demise of the 'bit bland on here now' thread and the current theme of this one (yes, it's all about muskets again) how long before this one goes the same way? if anyone can steer this back towards the subject, i'd be grateful . i can't be bothered and may just take a break and read somethings more interesting

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 03:54 AM

achmelvich, for what it is worth, yes you are right and we need to get back to the topic, but...

(Didn't you know there was one of them coming!)

It was YOU who first brought up Musket's whereabouts (I explained) and it was Snail who first accused the three of them of being one person. I know you haven't accused then of anything but to blame them for thread closures is a bit unfair. In my opinion that is.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 03:56 AM

and, BTW, I predicted the demise of the 'bland' thread at the third post to the thread. It was obvious from the outset where it would go and had nothing at all to do with anyone at that point.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: akenaton
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 03:59 AM

"Just to repeat. The original Musket (me) got a little bit pissed off with certain people using the weak bully tactic of bringing up irrelevance in order to make your view look stupid."

This appears to be some sort of explanation for "Team Musket....the romantic comedy."

Well I have no idea who is posting it or what it means and I think it is simply a load of fibs.
What is wrong with being honest with the membership and putting your views as yourself.....its not possible to have a reasonable debate with three or four people using the same log in name, there are obviously going to be differences of opinion or nuance between you.

It simply confuses the debate and almost always derails it causing the moderators to pull down the shutters.
This is IMO the reason for the tactic, you have no reasonable response to offer on some subjects, so rather than see them discussed you try to wreck the thread.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: Musket
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 04:50 AM

I wreck bigotry.

I stand proud of the fact.

If more people did so, the world would be better for it.

Your views are your own and you are welcome to them. Your demonising of others however is not a view. It is incitement to hatred. I don't like seeing criminals on Mudcat and will always say so.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Allan Conn
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 05:00 AM

Ake you claimed I called you a bigot! What I said was that just because a certain party has certain ideals it does not mean everyone who votes for them shares these ideals. The SNP have continually called for more immigration into Scotland. Not everyone who votes for them agrees with that. People don't think on block like that and that is the same for every party

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: akenaton
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 05:11 AM

OK, those are your views and you are entitled to them, but what bearing does that have on the behaviour of "Team Musket" and the confusion it spreads on this forum.
Your attempted explanation above does not make sense.

This is not a forum for children's games, there are numerous serious subjects which the membership like to discuss. We all like to give our views just as you have done above, but we usually do it honestly and in good faith.
Politics and social issues are of great interest to a majority of the membership....I have learned a lot from people with a different view, but to learn from them, they must be allowed to make their point freely. Silencing others is the first step to Fascism.

Subject: RE: BS: scots - ye have to love them eh?
From: GUEST,Allan Conn
Date: 28 Mar 15 - 05:21 AM

And as to Teribus we seem to completely disagree over politics. He is obviously very anti-SNP and independence so it must be galling when you see the No side win (even if it was narrowly) the referendum only to see support for the Nats, Greens etc blossom even further. He would even like to see the end of the devolved Scottish parliament. So he may be in step with a narrow majority as far as independence goes - but he is way out of step with the vast bulk of Scots as far as devolution goes. But I totally agree with him totally in that we can discuss these without personal attacks.

To give people down south an idea of what it was like in my household during the referendum. I am not a member of any party, and have never been a member of any party but yes I did help support the Yes campaign to some modest exent. Mostly in providing music at rallies etc along with other local folk musicians who were almost to a person Yes supporters too. At the same time my English born wife was not only a supporter of Better Together but she actively worked, and still does, for the local Tory Party. We didn't fall out.....and households like that existed all over Scotland. Despite the odd bit of egg throwing and some eejits from both sides spouting hate onine it was in general a flowering of democracy where vast numbers of people were engaged with the issues. No-one needs to fall out over it.