BS: Views from Canada

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:24 AM

Interesting, Charmion. If selected, hopefully, he performs well, to calm current concerns.

I suspect many Canadians, though certainly not all, have the similar feelings, last Guest.

While the last government seemed obsessed with questionable pre-emptive bomb dropping strategy - they seemed to have "shallow thinking" when it came to domestic defense. For example, while there was a lot of talk about the Northern priority, it was not evident in defense nor science. Building naval ships for northern defense with little, if any, ice breaking capacity seems like poor strategy to me. Added to this, is a deminished northern science capacity, as most Coast Guard ships, with formerly excellent science focused capacity, are now ancient. The same goes for what I see as minimal Canadian air defense capacity in the North.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,John from Kemsing
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:20 AM

This is excellent news. I hear one of his first tasks is to repeal the law whereby visiting people can be deported for helping their wife-to-be with a few D.I.Y. jobs around the home!

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,John from Kemsing
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 10:16 AM

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 09:04 AM

Let's just hope that he shifts the CF's role back to it's traditional one of peacekeeping which is more in tune with Canada's reputation as a kinder, gentler and less belligerent nation.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Charmion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:57 AM

Further to my last:

Ken Hansen, the analyst quoted in the article linked to above, focuses on then LGen Leslie's 2011 recommendations for CF Transformation. At the time, he was working with government priorities and planning assumptions that included drastic budget cuts in the Army and Navy to accommodate -- among other things -- the procurement of new ships for the Navy and the Coast Guard as well as the F-35 for the Air Force. After Afghanistan, we were supposed to do fewer (and cheaper) overseas deployments -- remember the peace dividend? We were supposed to get one of those. Didn't happen.

Four years is a long time in politics and staff planning. After securing the leadership of the Liberal Party, Justin Trudeau recruited Mr Leslie as his military advisor. I would bet money that if he had the CF Transformation task today, knowing what he knows about the new government's priorities, Mr Leslie's recommendations would look quite different.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Charmion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:44 AM

Ed T., I agree that Mr Leslie comes with more baggage than any other freshman MP we have ever seen in our lifetime. He comes from an Artillery family and he served in the Royal Regiment until he reached the rank of Colonel; further, his (extensive) experience of joint operations never included maritime task forces. On the other hand, his entire military career was spent in the unified Canadian Forces, which have consistently pursued "jointness" over more than 30 years, so he's not blind to the needs of the non-pongo services -- or of the industries and regions supporting them.

More than that, Mr Leslie is very, very smart -- intelligent enough to avoid appointments for which he is not well prepared.

Full disclosure -- I am slightly acquainted with the guy, and I have a brother who knows him very well.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:32 AM

From Halifax Chronicle Herald:

Today's editorial cartoon 

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:26 AM

Oops, nit=not:(

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:25 AM

Nit everyone embraces the idea that Mr. Leslie would be a positive pick. This is a concern for some in Atlantic Canada, where the navy and ship building is important, and wherec the Libs got hefty vote support.


Leslie bad news? 

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Charmion
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 08:12 AM

Justin Trudeau is the first "son of" to reach such high office at the federal level in Canada, but not the only interesting scion in the new Liberal government. Ottawa-Kanata, the riding next over from us, elected one Andrew Leslie, late Lieutenant-General and Commander of the Canadian Army; Mr Leslie is the grandson not only of General Andrew McNaughton, Commander of First Canadian Army from 1940 to 1944, but also the Honorable Brooke Claxton, Minister of National Health and Welfare under Mackenzie King and Minister of National Defence under Louis St. Laurent. Much is hoped for and expected of Mr Leslie.

Meanwhile, I'm sure I'm not alone in the hope that Justin Trudeau is more like Pitt the Younger than he is like George Dubya Bush.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Mr Red
Date: 23 Oct 15 - 04:16 AM

I can't help noticing that there is a big measure of dynasty creeping in, or never went away in the world as a whole. Bush, Clinton etc.
You see it in sport, particularly where huge amounts of money are needed like motor sport.
On the positive side you can see that a powerful charismatic parent would imbue all sorts of respect and education on an offspring. And maybe a bit of genetics.
If it works don't change it, the names that is!

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: gnu
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 08:46 PM

Gretsky... fuck Gretsky. I thought the world of him as an athlete but.... why am I typing any more words?

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 08:35 PM

In Canada, red is liberal and blue is conservative. Other parties have different colours (because it's Canada, after all), for instance, the Greens are green.

I doubt that the implications of the demographics are lost on the Republican number-crunchers here, but I also doubt that they can convince the powers-that-be. I really want to see the age, income, and education levels!

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 08:27 PM

Maybe Gretsky was hit with a puck to the head?
The Great obe

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 08:19 PM

So am I right to understand that Canadians follow the European convention on the political meaning of Red and Blue rather than that of their neighbours to the south?

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 06:13 PM

"The swath of red ridings that propelled Justin Trudeau to a thunderous Liberal victory Monday boasts more newcomers as a percentage of the population than any other party's territory."


Federal election surprises 

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: gnu
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 04:54 PM

Ya might hafta be on Facebook to get that one... it's brilliant.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: gnu
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 04:52 PM

Hahahhaaa! All of this must be driving Evil Stevil nuts. Let's see if this works... https://www.facebook.com/drigcanada/photos/a.787962457989564.1073741828.787938944658582/924347107684431/?type=3&fref=nf

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 04:12 PM

Trudeau, not a stick in the mud. His Dad would be proud.


Top that, world leaders 

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 12:38 PM

Much easier to watch than Harper singing.


Fancy Dancing 

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,#
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 12:20 PM

Thank you, gnu. My laugh for the day. Much appreciated.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: gnu
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 11:38 AM

BTW... some very insightful and knowledgeable posts.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: gnu
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 11:36 AM

Last Episode of 24 Seven

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,#
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 09:01 AM

Needed changes to Bill C-51 will be addressed quickly also.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Charmion
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 08:28 AM

Here in Ottawa, the civil service is cautiously optimistic about its current efforts to negotiate a new contract with Treasury Board. One of the Liberals' last overt campaign actions before the vote was an open letter to the Public Service of Canada promising a newly respectful attitude from the Prime Minister's Office and the return of professional independence for everybody but especially for scientists.

Oh yeah, and Statistics Canada will start doing the long-form census again.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 08:21 AM

Glad to see that my initial reaction of it being a good thing was right! Not often that happens :-)

Cheers all.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 22 Oct 15 - 08:15 AM

Trudeau indicated he would make changes to C-51 and here you go.


Changes to Anti Terror law 

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Rapparee
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 10:20 PM

A visit from Santa in the North?

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,#
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 09:04 PM

No Conservatives got in in Newfoundland and Labrador, Nova Scotia, New Brunswick, PEI, Nunavut, Northwest Territories or Yukon. It was a great day for this country.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 08:44 PM

I note Trudeau said he wants to dump your first past the post, and bring in something fairer. On the popular vote this time thasuggests the Liberals and the NDP would need to get into bed together, and also that the Conservatives aren't too likely to get back in a hurry.

Pleased to see no Conservatives got in in Newfoundland!

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 07:36 PM

On the NDP party:

""What is the point of a social democratic party that is afraid of democratic socialism? What is the point of running as faux Liberals when the real Liberals are already there?

What is the point of being in politics if you never have a chance of forming government?

Yet if a left-wing party's only chance at power is to move rightward, why bother?""




Toronto Star 

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 07:05 PM

"The Trudeau government has its clear priorities, many of them embarrassingly more progressive than the NDP's platform. The NDP caucus can hardly oppose any of them, but nor can it expect the Government to pay attention to NDP overtures. Why should they? To fight the dreaded Harperman, the Liberals, and specifically their leader, received nothing but abuse during the campaign, often gratuitously personal and always strategically dubious. The Liberals will hardly be grateful for NDP advice about the right way to run Canada."

A good day for Canada, an awful one for NDP

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,#
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 05:54 PM

"Harper was not the mentorship type."

I compliment you on a masterpiece of understatement, Ed.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 04:42 PM

""Trudeau will have an uphill battle and will need the support of the NDP to keep the Conservatives in check""

I suspect with a majority, not much help is needed. Opposition parties, including the NDP, will likely be more of a thorn to Trudeau, especially since they are smarting from their "perceived" throne being stolen. The conservatives will likely be busy licking their wounds and "finding themselves", since they were led by a "one man show", and are feebly prepared for a change in leadership. Harper was not the mentorship type.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,#
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 01:53 PM

http://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?dir=par&document=index&lang=e§ion=pol

That is an Elections Canada link and it enumerates the 23 parties that ran in this election. The Bridge Party (note that their official title is 'The Bridge Party of Canada') ran only one candidate, so Rap's hope was doomed from the get-go.

From Macleans Magazine here is the party-list and the number of candidates they ran this election:

Number of party candidates
Alliance of the North: 1

Animal Alliance Environment Voters Party of Canada: 8

Bloc Quebecois: 78

Canada Party: 1

Canadian Action Party: 3

Christian Heritage Party of Canada: 30

Communist Party of Canada: 26

Conservative Party of Canada: 338

Democratic Advancement Party of Canada: 4

Forces et Democratie: 17

Green Party of Canada: 336

Independent: 74

Liberal Party of Canada: 338

Libertarian Party of Canada: 72

Marijuana Party: 8

Marxist-Leninist Party of Canada: 70

New Democratic Party: 338

No Affiliation: 6

Party for Accountability, Competency and Transparency: 1

Pirate Party of Canada: 5

Progressive Canadian Party: 8

Rhinoceros Party: 27

Seniors Party of Canada: 1

The Bridge Party of Canada: 1

United Party of Canada: 1

That is the most current info I could conveniently locate. I think the Greens ran a full slate (meaning one candidate in each riding, so their number on that list should (I think) read 338. However, I was wrong once before in 1967, so please excuse me if I have screwed up.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 12:04 PM

""NDP supporters who were afraid that the Cons might survive for another term, and anything but conservative (ABC) had become a rallying cry. The collateral damage was a thrashing of the NDP which lost many very very good parliamentarians""

Soft Liberals voting NDP, because of a lack of interest in the previous Liberal leader in the previous federal election is one reason why the NDP became the official opposition last time.. Unfortunately for the NDP, they erroneously began to believe the larger number of votes they received at this point indicated strong NDP support in Ontario and Quebec. This aloofness was indicated by Mulcair's odd election proclamation that the NDP only needed 35 seats to defeat Harper. Wishful thinking, versus reality, can lead to big surprises.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Rapparee
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 10:39 AM

If I may paraphrase Yeats:

For Trudeau may keep faith
For all that is done and said.

Trudeau will have an uphill battle and will need the support of the NDP to keep the Conservatives in check, as I understand that they do have things in common. So do the Greens; I can't speak to the BQ. Working together and compromise will be the order of the day. I am a bit sorry that The Bridge Party didn't win any seats -- I had hoped for them to win four.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Mooh
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 10:35 AM

Absolutely delighted that Harper is history. Can't fathom who would vote for his party and what it stands for.

Not so sure about Trudeau as PM but no matter he's certain to be leagues better than Harper.

Had hoped for an NDP majority or at least official opposition. Very disappointed that they got so few seats.

I understand what happened. The Cons voted in droves in an act of paranoid self-preservation of their bigoted hatred and ignorant and extremely narrow social, national, and world view. The Liberals smelled blood in the water and voted in droves in a sense of renewed hope and optimism, aided by a large percentage of (otherwise) NDP supporters who were afraid that the Cons might survive for another term, and anything but conservative (ABC) had become a rallying cry. The collateral damage was a thrashing of the NDP which lost many very very good parliamentarians. As for the Block, I'm surprised they're still living the dream (or fantasy) and now that their leader lost his own seat, it questions the viability of the party, again. The Greens, god bless their idealistic souls, kept their leader's seat and she's a wonderful parliamentarian who I hope will be consulted by the ruling party often on matters green.

As I understand it from folks kind of "in the know", the new PM is already being pestered by pleas to undo the Harper damage. I hope he heeds those pleas, but it will take years to do the repairs.

Peace, Mooh.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Greg F.
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 10:08 AM

Is sanity breaking out in North America?

Not South of the Saint Lawrence River & the Great Lakes, more's the pity.

Congratulations, Canada!

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,#
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 09:38 AM

meself, when Trudeau found out that Dan Gagnier had written the letter he let Gagnier (campaign co-chair) go. I expect Trudeau would have fired him had Gagnier not left of his own accord. Certainly that broke no laws but ti wasn't a good thing either. At the least it was morally reprehensible.

In Trudeau's defence, I don't think he knew. Trudeau has kept himself out of the Energy East thing. He is on the record as saying how inappropriate it was and beyond that I don't know what more he could have done.

We have not had a single one of the main parties get through the past decade without someone--make that many someones--getting caught breaking the law. I liken the situation to Michael Sona's actions in the robocall scandal. I don't think Harper knew that was happening.

What I do know is that for the first time in nine years and eight months I don't wake up each day wondering how much more of our democracy will get "thrown under the bus" to consolidate our government's grip on the law and the CPC's stranglehold on power. I too am sick of the plots and schemes that have been blatantly thrown in the face of Canadians and about how little we have been able to do to change that. I expected a minority Liberal government--indeed hoped for one. When the count came in at 184 seats I felt like Christmas had come early. Besides, I made a deal with god close to a year ago--and I am an atheist, but I was grasping at straws--that if Harper and the CPC lost this election I would go to church once a month. (Previously I went no more frequently than a few times per decade, and then only for hatched, matched or dispatched ceremonies.) I will spend the next few days looking for loopholes, but I don't think I have a way out. I can live with that. There are enough churches in the area that I won't get stuck with any one group of the faithful nor they with me.

Best wishes to you.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Charmion
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 09:28 AM

Meself, if you read to the end of the article, you might have learned that the campaign co-chair guy resigned when his lobbying efforts were made public, indicating that the Liberals consider such double-timing to be non-kosher.

Let's hope that trend continues.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 08:56 AM

The NDP lost my vote when Mulcair, pandering to Quebec separatists, went against the ruling of the supreme court by saying his government would accept a vote of 50% plus 1 to separate.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,gillymor
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 08:06 AM

Is sanity breaking out in North America? Let's hope it's contagious?

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 07:14 AM

Trudeau has plenty of talented folks to choose from on hisvteam. I am happy May was elected, as she presents a different perspective on many fronts. However, she is an unpredictable "loose cannon", and, as such, could do more harm than good on a number of fronts.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: meself
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 01:26 AM

Am I the only one aware of this: "one of Trudeau's campaign co-chairs ... sent an email to an oil company on how to lobby in favour of the Energy East pipeline" (Ottawa Citizen)? To me, this says something about who he has around him. No "big corporate contacts"?!

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST,ollaimh
Date: 21 Oct 15 - 12:22 AM

again trudeau ran a decant and principled campaign, and was positive in the face of personal attacks from both harper and mulcair. mulcair was a one time Margaret supporter when a cabinet minister in quebec, a real political opportunist. harper is an evil racist and oild industry hack who would sell out the country to make one more nickel for his oil industry backers. the alberta oil run conservatives ruined alberta--never collecting world level royalities, and never saving them, and creating the toxic wasteland of the north. and they tried to do that for all of Canada.

so we are free of this scheming evil man. the worst of racist Christianity and the toxic oil and military industries.

trudeau faces challenges, but I doubt he will lie cheat and bribe to get through like harper did.

so we are free at last!!

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: gnu
Date: 20 Oct 15 - 10:23 PM

BTW... Elizabeth May would be my choice for PM if such a choice was available. I wanted NDP with Mulcair as PM but let's hope Trudeau does BETTER in future. Just thank goodness Harper is gone and hope Parliament returns to the institution it was meant to be instead of omnibus bills and no debate. (Mulcair shot himself in the foot when he said he would get rid of the Senate. He knew it will never happen and it was just a bullshit move to try to get votes... twit.)

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: gnu
Date: 20 Oct 15 - 10:06 PM

Great n depth commentary!

#... "I hope Trudeau offers the Environment portfolio to Elizabeth May." I wish he w/could but she is anti-pipeline and he is pro... do you think they can compromise in some way?

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Oct 15 - 09:21 PM

Fun fact: The prime minister of Canada's mother is the same age as Hilary Clinton.

Subject: RE: BS: Views from Canada
From: Ed T
Date: 20 Oct 15 - 08:08 PM

Last Guest was me. With a name like Butts, you have to be tough:)

on Trudeau and Butts