Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafemuddy

Post to this Thread - Printer Friendly - Home
Page: [1] [2] [3]


BS: Refugees and asylum seekers

Raggytash 31 Dec 18 - 11:34 AM
Iains 31 Dec 18 - 11:47 AM
Iains 31 Dec 18 - 12:19 PM
Jim Carroll 31 Dec 18 - 01:02 PM
Jim Carroll 31 Dec 18 - 01:48 PM
Jim Carroll 31 Dec 18 - 01:56 PM
David Carter (UK) 31 Dec 18 - 02:09 PM
DMcG 31 Dec 18 - 02:18 PM
DMcG 31 Dec 18 - 02:18 PM
The Sandman 31 Dec 18 - 02:19 PM
Iains 31 Dec 18 - 02:34 PM
David Carter (UK) 31 Dec 18 - 02:52 PM
Senoufou 31 Dec 18 - 03:03 PM
The Sandman 31 Dec 18 - 03:10 PM
DMcG 31 Dec 18 - 03:33 PM
Iains 31 Dec 18 - 03:33 PM
David Carter (UK) 31 Dec 18 - 03:41 PM
Senoufou 31 Dec 18 - 03:59 PM
Iains 31 Dec 18 - 04:04 PM
Jos 31 Dec 18 - 05:12 PM
David Carter (UK) 31 Dec 18 - 05:17 PM
Senoufou 31 Dec 18 - 05:35 PM
Jos 31 Dec 18 - 05:39 PM
Senoufou 31 Dec 18 - 05:51 PM
David Carter (UK) 31 Dec 18 - 06:06 PM
Senoufou 31 Dec 18 - 07:02 PM
Iains 01 Jan 19 - 03:50 AM
Iains 01 Jan 19 - 04:15 AM
Dave Hanson 01 Jan 19 - 05:21 AM
The Sandman 01 Jan 19 - 05:32 AM
Iains 01 Jan 19 - 05:48 AM
The Sandman 01 Jan 19 - 07:03 AM
Jos 01 Jan 19 - 07:14 AM
KarenH 01 Jan 19 - 07:30 AM
Senoufou 01 Jan 19 - 08:36 AM
Iains 04 Jan 19 - 10:34 AM
Senoufou 04 Jan 19 - 12:30 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Jan 19 - 12:37 PM
Iains 04 Jan 19 - 01:00 PM
Senoufou 04 Jan 19 - 01:06 PM
Jim Carroll 04 Jan 19 - 01:15 PM
Iains 05 Jan 19 - 12:24 PM
David Carter (UK) 05 Jan 19 - 12:29 PM
Jim Carroll 05 Jan 19 - 03:13 PM
The Sandman 05 Jan 19 - 03:42 PM
Mossback 05 Jan 19 - 03:46 PM
Iains 05 Jan 19 - 06:32 PM
Jim Carroll 06 Jan 19 - 03:24 AM
Jim Carroll 06 Jan 19 - 03:53 AM
Iains 06 Jan 19 - 05:16 AM

Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:









Subject: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Raggytash
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 11:34 AM

Here you go, you can continue your discussions here to your hearts content


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 11:47 AM

Well done Raggy!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 12:19 PM

An interesting take on the origin of the causes of recent waves of migration. It will never appear in the mainstream media. It probably contains afew nuggets of truth. Well worth following to the end.
Thought provoking if nothing else. Follow the money! follow the oil!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHsfc49Y_Fk


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Brexit #2
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 01:02 PM

I posted this before and will do so again
Brexit and refugees are0 INSEPARABLY INTERLINKED
To attempt to keep them a part is censorship
Jim Carroll


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Brexit #2
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 01:48 PM

A minister has just linked refugees to Brexit by saying the it is Political pressure, not security, that is forcing them to act
Can't say clearer than that
Jim Carroll


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Brexit #2
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 01:56 PM

NOT GUIDO I'M AFRAID
Jim Carroll


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 02:09 PM

I actually agree to a large extent with what that guy is saying Iains. However, two things, first the refugees arriving in the last month are mostly from Iran not Syria, and second that as I argued on the other thread, the problem would go away if we didn't try to keep them out. They will contribute in many ways to our economy and our society.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: DMcG
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 02:18 PM

Apparently two border patrol vessels are being moved as part of the response. I am aware of radar and suchlike, but am not convinced two ships will have any practical effect. But is seems as doing something...


I am sure someone with more relevant experience than me can explain how two ships will significantly improve the ability to monitor the entire channel and if needs be the North Sea.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: DMcG
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 02:18 PM

... Is seen as doing something ...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: The Sandman
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 02:19 PM

Yes, we do not know what proprtion of migrants want to be in the uk permanently ,it was suggested by someone on radio 4 tonight[ he had a conection with the UN=, that some mat only wish to be in the uk for 3 or six months[before returning home] , perhaps he suggested they could be allowed to work for three or six months doing agricultural casual work, before they returned home if that was their wish., performing those casual jobs, like fruit picking, that travellers used to do


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 02:34 PM

David Carter As I keep saying the UN has very carefully defined what a refugee is and what their status is as protected persons. I can be fairly sure that those attempting illegal entry to the UK do not have papers.
As I said on the other thread in response to I believe a comment by Karen:
"Article 31 of the 1951 Refugee Convention prohibits states from penalising a refugee for illegal entry when the purpose of their entry is to claim asylum."

Superseded in the EU by the Dublin Convention 15th June 1990.
"The Dublin Regulation (Regulation No. 604/2013; sometimes the Dublin III Regulation; previously the Dublin II Regulation and Dublin Convention) is a European Union (EU) law that determines which EU Member State is responsible for the examination of an application for asylum, submitted by persons seeking international protection under the Geneva Convention and the EU Qualification Directive, within the European Union. It is the cornerstone of the Dublin System, which consists of the Dublin Regulation and the EURODAC Regulation, which establishes a Europe-wide fingerprinting database for unauthorised entrants to the EU. The Dublin Regulation aims to "determine rapidly the Member State responsible [for an asylum claim]" and provides for the transfer of an asylum seeker to that Member State. Usually, the responsible Member State will be the state through which the asylum seeker first entered the EU."

The French are in defiance of this law by allowing persons of unknown status to set sail from their shores. They are reneging on their responsibilities. If they dealt with it there would not be a problem.
Or is Macron more concerned with his own political future than potentially, if not actually, being responsible for drownings in the Channel?

There is of course the other underlying reality of globalism and it's agenda
Destroy Family
Destroy neighbourhood
Destroy Nationality
= Destroy cohesion! amplify by uncontrolled immigration.
This takes us way beyond the wildest nightmares of Orwell and Huxley,
and precisely where do you think it ends up for you the individual, especially as a non productive drone within society?

Away with the fairies in a dystopian alternative reality or is this the end game? Think about it!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 02:52 PM

It leaves you aspiring to be something more than an unproductive drone.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Senoufou
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 03:03 PM

My first worry is the immense danger of these poor folk drowning in this busy shipping thoroughfare. Their 'boats' are usually hardly seaworthy. They must be absolutely terrified.
And children are sometimes among the groups.
Also, they could die of exposure/hypothermia out on the sea at this time of year.
I feel we should be patrolling the Channel in order to save lives, which is more important then 'keeping them out'.

However, in my husband's case, it took two long years of jumping through every possible immigration hoop in order for him to be granted a marriage visa. It cost literally thousands including an Appeal in London. Then Further Leave to Remain and Indefinite Leave To Remain, followed by Citizenship after the Life In The UK test.
I'd feel slightly bitter if just anyone could swan into our country with ease.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: The Sandman
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 03:10 PM

But they cannot swim into the country at ease


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: DMcG
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 03:33 PM

In fact, if they could get into the country easily, there would be no need to risk their lives at sea. Putting it the other way, the risks they are prepared to take is a measure of how difficult it is to get in.

I sympathise with your husband's difficulties, Sen. My daughter in law is in the same situation.,there is a good argument to make that the financial barriers are a contributor to the reasons why people arrive illegally and keep off the records.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 03:33 PM

It leaves you aspiring to be something more than an unproductive drone

Well yes that would be the reaction of most.
But a recent report " suggests that up to 30% of UK jobs could potentially be at high risk of automation by the early 2030s, lower than the US (38%) or Germany (35%), but higher than Japan (21%).• The risks appear highest in sectors such as transportation and storage(56%), manufacturing (46%)and wholesale and retail (44%),but lower in sectors like health and social work (17%).• For individual workers, the key
differentiating factor is education.For those with just GCSE-level
education or lower, the estimated potential risk of automation is as
high as 46% in the UK, but this falls to only around 12% for those with
undergraduate degrees or higher."
being a drone will be a permanent way of life for many.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 03:41 PM

Well its clear from that what the solution is Iains. Individuals have to engage with the education system.

Sen, I sympathise with your problems, but not your reaction. In your position I would rail against the British state for having made your life so difficult. Not encourage it to make life equally difficult for others.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Senoufou
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 03:59 PM

It's just that I don't think letting them all in without let or hindrance would be viable. It would certainly stop these dangerous attempts to cross the Channel, but if our doors were wide open to all (a nice thought but we'd be inundated) our resources would be absolutely overstretched and our society infrastructure would crumble.

The whole point of the Home Office's stringency was to ensure my husband would not be a burden on the UK State. They were very exercised to verify that I had sufficient financial resources to keep him, a property above a certain value and that he was not just some chancer using me to gain entry. (Our entire relationship history was put under the microscope!)

His brother is a 'sans papiers' dodging about in Paris in the St Denis area. A visitor's visa was obtained for him by a local Mayor in Ivory Coast, and he overstayed. He's now working illegally, and lives among a huge herd of other African 'sans papiers'. He has no health care available and is very vulnerable to exploitation.

I can't see a solution to this problem.
Please don't anyone think I have no sympathy with these poor folk. They are merely seeking a better life. But our country is small and we can't just let everybody in with no controls at all.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 04:04 PM

Individuals have to engage with the education system.
That is a bit of a simplistic response. Engagement with the educational system does not guarantee a successful outcome. Ability, like IQ is variable across a population. Not everyone is suited to a degree course,yet there is a disdain for equally essential vocational or technical courses. In an urban society manual dexterity and skill is required along with more "bookish" occupations. Also it is unreasonable to expect pensioners to seek employment. This was an attitude that supposedly had its day with the demise of the workhouse.
    Interesting that the rise of Iranian exiles is a recent occurrence.
The most likely explanation is not religious or LGT intolerance but the result of Trump's economic sanctions.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Jos
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 05:12 PM

Do any of you know what kind of questions are asked in the 'Life in the UK' test? I have a feeling that although I have lived in England for most of my life I might not be able to answer the questions (in which case, maybe I should be deported).


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 05:17 PM

Our country is not that small. There are many areas desperate for more working age people.


Iains, I am not proposing that pensioners should be seeking employment. I would rather that immigrants were allowed in to do the jobs that pensioners would otherwise be asked to do. And where have I expressed disdain for vocational skills, which are taught by our education system?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Senoufou
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 05:35 PM

When my husband did the test there were 1000 questions from which the computer selected 24 at random. My husband got all the books and a disk and studied hard to learn as many as possible.
Despite having an MA, I couldn't do many of them.
I've just opened one of his study books and here's a selection:-

In which year did married women get the right to divorce their husband?
Jewish people came to Britain from Poland, Ukraine and Belarus to escape racist attacks from 1830-1850, 1880-1910, 1910-1920 or 1930-1945?
The number of children and young people up to the age of 19 is 13 million, 14 million, 15 million or 16 million?
In the UK, a judge decides whether someone is guilty or innocent. True or false?
What percentage of the UK population live in England?

You had to get 18 out of 24 to pass, but weren't told your score!
He failed the first time, but passed on his second attempt.
I believe they've reviewed the Test now and it's slightly different.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Jos
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 05:39 PM

Judging by those questions, I should definitely be deported.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Senoufou
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 05:51 PM

Same here Jos. I'd never have passed the thing.
He worked diligently just to memorise the answers, as he couldn't read or understand much English.
I imagine myself trying to do the equivalent in blooming Malinke.
He's very intelligent though and somehow got through.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 06:06 PM

Those are not things that people know. Its just a memory test. In all of those questions you could just replace the UK by France (and England by some defined region) and you would have the same chance.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Senoufou
Date: 31 Dec 18 - 07:02 PM

Exactly David. There were even some 'trick' questions. One I remember was about the 'UK football team' which of course doesn't exist.

I got the impression that the Home Office was merely trying to limit the numbers getting Citizenship.

I had to pay £1,400 for the Appeal through an Immigration Advisory Service, which was granted. The Judge said a 'simple error' had been made. But I was never reimbursed.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 01 Jan 19 - 03:50 AM

Some interesting figures
https://www.migrationwatchuk.org/key-topics/illegal-immigration


https://www.indexmundi.com/map/?t=0&v=21000&r=eu&l=en

"By its nature, illegal immigration is very difficult to measure. First, the Census does not record the immigration status of respondents and, in any case, most illegal immigrants would be very unlikely to respond. Moreover, in 1998 the then Labour government ended the system of exit checks on non-EU migrants which meant that for nearly 20 years, until their reinstatement in April 2015, it has been impossible to determine who is still in the country."

I wonder why supermarkets provide for a much larger population in the UK than the official figures suggest?
Answer: "In political terms, standing behind these figures would be to toss a hand grenade into a vat of gasoline. People would be hounded out of a job for scaremongering."

The Office for National Statistics' figures, published last week, predict a population of 75 million by 2051. It's an honest estimate but horribly wide of the mark because number counting doesn't work effectively. If you want to know how many there are of us, ask a food firm. (and some would suggest even their figures are conservative)
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/comment/city-eye-facts-on-a-plate-our-population-is-at-least-77-million-5328454.html


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 01 Jan 19 - 04:15 AM

I shouldoint out the UN estimate of UK population now is 66.2 million.
The Independant article above is from 28 October 2007.
No doubt there is a "D" notice on the latest supermarket projections!

No wonder our infrastructure is creaking and wages are depressed.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 01 Jan 19 - 05:21 AM

I was always under the impression that international law stated that asylum seekers/refugees should settle in the FIRST FRIENDLY COUNTRY they entered, but they all seem to be heading for the UK.

Dave H


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: The Sandman
Date: 01 Jan 19 - 05:32 AM

lets get this in perspective, the numbers are relatively small.
"No wonder our infrastructure is creaking and wages are depressed"
if rees mogg gets his way, wages will be depressed even further, imo he wants to abolish the minimium wage and depress wages so that employers can make more profit., these are his objections to the eu, the fact that there are such things as min wage and specified working conditions.imo
Denis skinners opposotion to europe is based on different criteria


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 01 Jan 19 - 05:48 AM

Dave Hansen."asylum seekers/refugees should settle in the FIRST FRIENDLY COUNTRY they entered"

Not true on several grounds:
They are asylum seekers until registered as refugees. Intheory they should seek asylum in the country of first landfall. If they keep travelling after registration they would become economic migrants in my book.
The Dublin agreement slightly modified the UN agreement on refugees, as far as the EU is concerned.
Keeping track of asylum seekers/economic migrants/refugees is hampered if they make landfall within the Schengen area. Britain has never given u total control of her borders. The only un monitored border within the UK is between Northern Ireland and the republic. ID is required for air and ferry traffic between the two.
   The real solution is to stop the great game of rape and pillage of natural resources by western regimes and the bear baiting to the north.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: The Sandman
Date: 01 Jan 19 - 07:03 AM

id is also required between uk and rep of ireland.
the infrastructure creaking?
ok lets deal with this, the infra structure of the railways is creaking because it has been privatised, the infra structure of the NHS MWHICH EMPLOYS APPROX 1.3 MILLION PEOPLE relies upon a workforce that includes a lot of immigrants.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Jos
Date: 01 Jan 19 - 07:14 AM

Judging by the efforts being made to keep the migrants out, the UK is NOT a friendly country, but still they keep trying. For a few, the reason they want to come here is to join their relatives who are already here.
I suspect that for most, it is because they have learnt a little English, and some are fluent English-speakers, whereas their knowledge of Greek, Italian, Spanish or French is limited or non-existent.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: KarenH
Date: 01 Jan 19 - 07:30 AM

Testing is big business, the tests will have been designed probably by someone also involved in training people to answer it. Money money money


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Senoufou
Date: 01 Jan 19 - 08:36 AM

It costs £50 to take the test. Only one lady was in the test centre to invigilate. I think the computer is programmed to 'mark' the answers, because the lady told my husband immediately whether he'd passed or not.
The aids to learning for the test were quite expensive (disk and several books) I'm not sure if there are lessons one can attend in person to help with the learning. As I'm a teacher, I found it fairly easy to 'train' my husband, but he did most of it himself.

We saw a Ghanaian couple in the test centre (whose native language is English) and the wife failed. She told me afterwards she couldn't understand the questions, poor soul.

I see that several more 'boat people' were found shivering on the shore of Kent at 8am yesterday. Local residents were very concerned (a child of about ten was among them) and rushed out with blankets and hot drinks.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 04 Jan 19 - 10:34 AM

The PTB might finally use the Dublin Agreement to repatriate channel migrants back to France.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6557281/Channel-migrants-sent-straight-France-claim-asylum.html


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Senoufou
Date: 04 Jan 19 - 12:30 PM

I reckon that's the best thing Iains. The article says the French would agree, as it would eventually deter more migrants from coming into France as a stepping stone to UK.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Jan 19 - 12:37 PM

as it would eventually deter more migrants from coming into France as a stepping stone to UK."
Not you too Sen ?
Shame on you ?
You need to remember that people like Iains would not stop at just keeping them out- they'd send them all back to where they come from if they could
You need tyo read up more about the Tommy Robinson syndrome
Jim


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 04 Jan 19 - 01:00 PM

You need to remember that people like Iains would not stop at just keeping them out- they'd send them all back to where they come from if they could
You need tyo read up more about the Tommy Robinson syndrome

As Martin said to his man!

I suppose with all the support the mods give Carroll the chances of having his last post deleted are remote.

Congratulations on allowing him to constantly insult everyone he wishes to and on deleting any responses pointing out his obvious deficiencies.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Senoufou
Date: 04 Jan 19 - 01:06 PM

I don't 'need to read up more about the Tommy Robinson syndrome' at all Jim, thank you. I know all about the despicable chap.
A woman married to a black Muslim W African immigrant would hardly be involved with such rampant racist misanthropy.

Any genuine asylum seeker would be quite all right settling in France, and I suspect there are numbers who are just economic migrants taking a chance on being settled here in UK.

None of that means I'm not in favour of improving their lives 'where they come from' but that is an enormous task. My sister and I have been improving the lives of my numerous Ivorian in-laws for years. Setting them up in small businesses, paying for medical treatment, installing sanitation, sending regular financial support.

Even in Cote d'Ivoire, a francophone old French colony, my husband's mates talk of nothing else but somehow getting to UK, not France. His brother, the 'sans papiers' in Paris, would like to continue his travels to our shores, but hasn't the money to pay a trafficker.

Any person wishing to apply for work here could be accepted on a registered basis for a limited period, using the requisite formal application. We do need all types of workers (NHS, agriculture and so on) But droves of unverified people creeping in without health checks or monitoring is a disaster waiting to happen.

My husband for example had to have all sorts of health checks to obtain his Visa (current TB X-ray renewed every six months, full medical examination) His sister has just recovered from active TB, the treatment of which we paid for. Imagine the strain on the NHS if large numbers of ill migrants filled the hospitals to overflowing.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 04 Jan 19 - 01:15 PM

!A woman married to a black Muslim W African immigrant would hardly be involved with such rampant racist misanthropy."
It was this that leapt to mind when you posted Sen
Personally I see little difference between Tommy Robinson and those who would refuse refugees asylum - it boils down to the same thing
These people are fleeing wars brought about by Western greed - it's the first time in my long life that I have ever encountered the policy of turning away refugees it makes me ashamed of the country I was born in
It's not a matter of helping them to improve their lives back home - these are war zones they will be returned to if everybody adopts the policy the British Government has

One thing that has largely avoided a major racism problem in Ireland is that, as a emigrating race, they have adopted the mindset of "There, but for the grace of god"
I really don't think we have anything more to say to each other on this
A piece of adise regarding your fellow "keep them outer"
Tale a long spoon to that particular dinner party
Sadly
Jim


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 05 Jan 19 - 12:24 PM

Personally I see little difference between Tommy Robinson and those who would refuse refugees asylum - it boils down to the same thing
Yet again you demonstrate quite clearly you do not have the faintest idea of what you are on about and spout rubbish.

States have been granting protection to individuals and groups fleeing persecution for centuries; however, the modern refugee regime is largely the product of the second half of the twentieth century. Like international human rights law, modern refugee law has its origins in the aftermath of World War II as well as the refugee crises of the interwar years that preceded it. Article 14(1) of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (UDHR), which was adopted in 1948, guarantees the right to seek and enjoy asylum in other countries. Subsequent regional human rights instruments have elaborated on this right, guaranteeing the “right to seek and be granted asylum in a foreign territory, in accordance with the legislation of the state and international conventions.” American Convention on Human Rights, art. 22(7); African [Banjul] Charter on Human and Peoples’ Rights, art. 12(3).

The controlling international convention on refugee law is the 1951 Convention relating to the Status of Refugees (1951 Convention) and its 1967 Optional Protocol relating to the Status of Refugees (1967 Optional Protocol).

Germany the country that first opened the floodgates is now offering bribes to send immigrants home.


https://nationalpost.com/news/world/germany-entices-illegal-migrants-to-leave-with-bribes-free-rent-for-a-year-at-home


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 05 Jan 19 - 12:29 PM

I agree with Jim here. Personally I have no problem with anyone who comes to this country as a refugee, or even an economic migrant, who works hard, makes a life for themselves, improves their own situation and the economy and society of the country. Be it as a worker, business owner, scientist, artist or olympic gold medallist. I do have a problem with anybody who wants to keep them out.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 05 Jan 19 - 03:13 PM

"Yet again you demonstrate quite clearly you do not have the faintest idea of what you are on about and spout rubbish."
And yet again, by your abusive behaviour indicates that you have no answer to the point I made nor do you intend to seek out one
Today's totally unprecedented refugee crisis over-rides any text book solution
Rather than attempting to hhelp the situation, our establishment Johnnies add to it massively by supporting the regimes that are driving out millions of their subjects
You - of all people, are the last to heed on teh question of race - you are an example of it in action with your persistent uncontrollable (apparently) outburst of racist expletives - not forgetting your passing around the "free Tommy Robinson petition
I firmly believe that racism is a product of stupidity and ignorance Ind I could point to someone who racially who regularly racially abuses someone who shares his cultural background, colour and national identity
Sort of standing in front of a mirror and hurling abuse at yourself   
You really couldn't make it up now, could you ?

MUST HAVE GONE TO THIS SCHOOL
Jim Carroll


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: The Sandman
Date: 05 Jan 19 - 03:42 PM

How about some compassion, now about putting oneself in the position of refugees


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Mossback
Date: 05 Jan 19 - 03:46 PM

I suppose with all the support the mods give Carroll...

Jaysus, give it a rest! Poor poor pitiful you.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 05 Jan 19 - 06:32 PM

your persistent uncontrollable (apparently) outburst of racist expletives - not forgetting your passing around the "free Tommy Robinson petition.
Oh yes? when was that laddie? Care to offer some proof or are your delusions taking over again?

You seem unable to comprehend the difference between asylum seeker,illegal immigrant and refugee. This has all been explained in great detail several times recently in other threads that you have posted on. The terms are very precise, have specific meanings and relate directly to what treatment those particular categories are entitled to under international law. If you cannot be bothered to learn the not so subtle differences there is no point in you posting on the subject,because your posting are both provocative and largely erroneous.
The treatment of persons seeking refugee status is clearly defined in
The 1951 Refugee Convention. Ratified? by 145 State parties, it defines the term ‘refugee’ and outlines the rights of the displaced, as well as the legal obligations of States to protect them. It was further modified by the 1967 protocol and further by Reservations and declarations to the 1967 Protocol Relating to the Status of Refugees
1 Apr 2011.

Rather than attempting to hhelp the situation, our establishment Johnnies add to it massively by supporting the regimes that are driving out millions of their subjects

I think your knowledge of recent history is woefully deficient.
The largest source of displaced people are Syrians. Assad is not driving them out, the reverse is true. The coalition are bombing shit out of them and supporting terrorist groups and the partisan white helmets.
Our establishment johnnies supporting the Assad regime?
I think not!


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Jan 19 - 03:24 AM

You are what you are and the fact that you do what you do do from the cover of anonymity (the literary equivalent of robes and pointy hoods - sort of special creepy) underlines that
Happy to reemphasise that on occasion, but I think we're finished here
Go burn your cross on somebody else's garden
Over and out

"How about some compassion, now about putting oneself in the position of refugees"
Absolutely Dick
Jim Carroll


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 06 Jan 19 - 03:53 AM

Definition of "Refugee" (The Oxford English Reference Dictionary)
A person taking refuge, especially in a foreign country, from war, persecution or natural disaster.

Asylum
A place offering protection r ssafety
Jim Carroll


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: BS: Refugees and asylum seekers
From: Iains
Date: 06 Jan 19 - 05:16 AM

Making a complete fool of yourself so resorting to insults again. To Accuse me of being a member of the klu klus klan is a bit of a step too far, even for your continual inanities. It is like dealing with a fractious child. Still waiting for you to justify your insults!
Do your delusions still insist the UK is supporting the Assad regime?
I see you have made no response to that piece of your idiocy.

No one is interested in your definition of refugee and asylum. The words are   clearly defined in International law, and that dictates the treatment of a refugee, not your erroneous opinions on the subject.

Below an EU interpretation. I suggest you study the definitions carefully, you may learn something.

https://epthinktank.eu/2015/10/27/refugee-status-under-international-law/


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate
Next Page

 


You must be a member to post in non-music threads. Join here.


You must be a member to post in non-music threads. Join here.



Mudcat time: 23 February 4:01 PM EST

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 1998 by the Mudcat Café Music Foundation, Inc. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.