Tech: piercing radio blast aimed towards leenia

Subject: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: leeneia
Date: 15 Jun 19 - 10:08 PM

I use my IBM computer to edit music. On my desk is a small QWERTY keyboard and a small MIDI controller. The MIDI controller looks like a small electronic keyboard, and it's made by Reveal. It's quite a few years old. I love it, because the size is so convenient. These MIDI keyboards aren't made any more, so I don't want to ditch this one until it's truly a goner.

Something, somewhere is sending out loud, ugly blasts of sound into the air and into my MIDI projects. I'll be working along, making sheet music, and suddenly mad sets of quarter notes, some remarkably low, all decked out with an ugly mix of flats and sharps, will be heard in the room and will appear in the sheet music. Afterwards, the keyboard may not work right, and I have to turn it off and let it rest a bit. Bad sign!

Noteworthy Composer doesn't have to be on; it can happen in the middle of word processing. It can happen when nobody's using the oomputer at all. It happened this afternoon, and there were no trucks that we could hear, no airplanes, no construction where radios might be in use. Sure, there are radios all around - hospitals, fire department come to mind - but those radios go all the time, and the blasts of sound only occur 1-3 times a day.

The label on the back of the MIDI controller says "This device must accept any interference received, including interferences that may cause undesired operation." However, I have been using these keyboards for years (15 maybe or 20) and these loud noises have never occurred before.   

Any ideas?

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 15 Jun 19 - 11:07 PM

Electronic components can deteriorate over 15 to 20 years..

Get a new improved modern midi controller...

There are plenty available at affordable prices...

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 16 Jun 19 - 12:53 AM

The best MIDI keyboard 2019

..other best of lists are available...

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: leeneia
Date: 17 Jun 19 - 12:48 AM

Thanks for the link. My present keyboard spans four octaves because it has buttons that raise or lower the pitch. They don't mention anything like that on the page.

Do you own that keyboard, PFR? How big a range does it have?

Your answer while practical, doesn't address the mystery of what's going on, and I would like to know that.

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 17 Jun 19 - 03:38 AM

Obviously some electronic parts are malfunctioning, either in your MIDI keyboard or in your computer. To make sure, you can try the keyboard on another computer.

First aid: apply a vaccuum cleaner to the slots. Second: unplug, open the device and brush the dust off everything.

If you need a MIDI keyboard only for input to NWC, it can be much cheaper than the one PFR recommends.

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: BobL
Date: 17 Jun 19 - 03:48 AM

Leenia, I'm a bit confused. Do I gather that you're getting electrical interference that betrays its presence by noises from the radio? And does the interference affect the computer itself when you're not running Noteworthy?

What PFR didn't say is that electronic gear nowadays is a lot more interference-resistant than it used to be: in Europe we have a whole load of new standards for electrical stuff, aimed among other things at producing less interference and tolerating more, compliance being shown by the CE mark. The tests for these can be pretty demanding. Across the Pond there's the FCC Declaration of Conformity but I don't know how that compares.

I'd guess your interference is coming from something nearby that's used only occasionally. Welding set or big power tool perhaps, or maybe central heating / aircon starting up. I'm reminded of a story I heard ages ago, about a computer bureau whose machines all suddenly failed at about the same time every day. They couldn't find the reason, and eventually just had to suspend all work as the critical time approached, restarting after the glitch. Then someone noticed it happened just when the street lights went on....

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 17 Jun 19 - 07:13 AM

I've a variety of midi keyboards and controllers picked up in sales over recent years.
They include either full sized or minikeys.
More expensive keyboards than mine have higher quality weighted keys
which real piano players prefer.

My most recent keyboards are 25 or 49 notes.
My only 65 note is over 15 years old.
88 notes are available at a price for pros.

Most youg musicians are loooking for cheaper compact 25 keys for portability.
They are usually equipped with octave up and down buttons.
These tend to be USB only,having no traditional midi inputs and outputs.
If you want proper traditional midi ins and out you pay more.
Even then the sockets might be mini or even tiny headphone socket sized
needing adapters.
You'll find that since USB became the predominent standard for connecting midi equipment to computers,
that the newer products aren't as well equipped with midi options as older gear from the 1990s.
The computer has become the essential hub for controlling midi connections via software.
The stadard setup is for a USB keyboard controller that plugs directly into a computer to control sequencer DAW software,
or a midi socket keyboard that connects to a USB audio and midi interface - like the popular focusrite and steinberg entry level boxes.

A little googling for products in your price range suiting your requirements
and you'll be ok.
.. and that's what some of us mudcatters are here for - to help as best we can...

At the moment I have a brand new discontinued Novation Launchkey 25 still in the box waiting to be tested.
The newer Mark 2 version is one of the most popular beginner's keyboards.
This is a basic option cheaper USB only keyboard with controller knobs and pads.
I have a more expensive Korg Taktile USB keyboard controller which also has proper midi sockets..

I'll be honest, most of my newer aquisitions over the last few years are bought at good prices in sales,
but still remain in boxes untested since my mum's dementia took over my life..

She's 87, as fit as a fiddle and probably has years left in her...

But I still can't resit sales bargains to cheer myself up,
and prepare for a time when music becomed my main preoccupation again...

I'm currently finally getting around to making time to upgrade my laptop
and fill it with VST software instruments and samples
I have some very convincingly lifelike classic instruments installed.
The reed and pipe organs are superb..

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: leeneia
Date: 17 Jun 19 - 01:00 PM

Thanks for all the info. Bob, I never thought of an electrical source for the sound. It could be somebody's a/c turning on.

At present, a MIDI cable connects to my soundcard. I play music into the soundcard, and Noteworthy Composer collects from the soundcard and turns it into sheet music. If I bought a modern keyboard with a USB, the MIDI signals would just flow into the back of my computer, then drop, useless, to the floor.

Going to a shop and getting a whole new set-up would involve mucho dinero and some hassle as I deal with techs who have no idea what MIDI is or what I do with it. (been there, fought that)

Grishka suggests vacuuming the slots. There are no slots, just openings for plugs. I thought vacuums were anathema around computers.

What do you think of that idea of taking the controller apart and brushing dust out?
==============
Everybody's remarks are making it clear that this is not really something to worry about. It's just a fluke of aging equipment vs a changing environment. I've already called my computer security co. and made sure it's not a virus or a trojan.

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 17 Jun 19 - 01:40 PM

Affordable USB keyboards from reliable brand names plug into the computer's USB slot,
and are often automatically recognised by music making software.
Literally plug and play..

If not then you may need to look in settings and manually click to select the keyboard.

OR you may need to install a specific supplied driver [on disc or download from the manufacturer]
to connect the physical Keyboard to the music software.

These keyboards also usually come supplied with very useful free software bundles..

None of this should be dauntingly off putting...

We're here to answer questions if we can...

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 17 Jun 19 - 01:43 PM

There's always ebay if you want to replace ancient equipment with cheap working identical replacements..

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 17 Jun 19 - 03:51 PM

Leeneia,

vaccuming an unplugged computer or other electronic device is unlikely to do any harm to it.

A MIDI controller sends MIDI data (not "music") to a MIDI interface. The latter can be realized by a "classical" MIDI plug or via USB. Either will work if the socket exists and is recognized by the OS (using specific "driver" software if needed). In case of USB ("U" for "Universal"), any version of Windows, Mac or Linux from this millennium does the job without problem, "plug-and-play". NWC may need a hint, typically something like a menu item "Options->MIDI Input->[x]USB".

Your controller seems to send unwanted MIDI note messages spontaneously, which result in "noise" from your computer loudspeakers because your OS is configured to turn any incoming MIDI data into reality (i.e. sound) immediately, besides sending it to MIDI software if "listening".

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Jun 19 - 10:00 PM

I'm sure Leeneia would know if there had been a recent spillage but it sounds like the sort of thing that can happen as dribbles of liquid seep their way onto contacts. With that sort of event, chances of repair/drying out are probably a bit hit and miss.

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: leeneia
Date: 18 Jun 19 - 12:41 AM

Hello, Guest. Have no fear. We never allow any liquid near the computer desk.

I think I'll take the cover off the controller and dust it. There could be some fermatas tangled up in the components.

I checked my electric bill; my surge protection is still in place.

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: olddude
Date: 20 Jun 19 - 05:46 PM

Is your screen saver and sounds all disabled?

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: leeneia
Date: 21 Jun 19 - 02:29 PM

No, everything seems fine once the ugly notes stop playing.

Yesterday I was editing a minuet, and something new appeared - a lone, super-high note way above the staff. Maybe a finch with a radio unit on its back flew over because someone was tracking finch migration.

A friend of mine who is a computer whiz will be coming over to check things out.

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed to'rds leenia
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Feb 20 - 04:57 PM

Here's some cheaper options!

https://keyboardkraze.com/best-midi-keyboard-controllers-for-beginners/

I've actually used a few from this list haha. The author is also a pretty well known musician.

Smaller 25 Key Controllers

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed towards leenia
From: Joe G
Date: 07 Feb 20 - 08:20 PM

What pfr says - get a modern USB based keyboard - problem solved hopefully :-)

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed towards leenia
From: leeneia
Date: 08 Feb 20 - 10:50 AM

I didn't want to, of course, but I replaced the controller with another one exactly like it, and the problem went away. It must have been dirt or something corroded in the first controller.

Since then Microsoft has stopped supporting Windows 7. Computers are so reasonable now that we bought a new one to get on the Internet with Windows 10, and we kept the old one, with its old Noteworthy, its old controller, and its large collection of saved NWC and MIDI files. The old one has been detached from the Internet.

The two monitors are side by side, and it's fun to play a video with Windows 10 and simply switch to the old computer to transcribe a song or lyrics.

Subject: RE: Tech: piercing radio blast aimed towards leenia
From: Joe G
Date: 08 Feb 20 - 12:18 PM

Glad you've got sorted!