Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 21 Sep 04 - 10:35 AM The Wild Rover as we know it today started out as an English broadside song of the early 19th (just possibly late 18th) century; this however was a re-write, much shortened, of an earlier song by Thomas Lanfiere. Lanfiere wrote a whole series of sermonising tavern or "goodfellows" songs in the latter part of the 17th century, contemporary with the Brooksby song mentioned above (some were published by Brooksby). I don't know if he wrote The Alewife's Invitation, but it belongs to the same genre and employs some of the same commonplaces. Bruce Olson and Jack Campin both quoted references to The Good Fellow's Resolution at various times in usenet discussions, which I later followed up. The Bodleian doesn't have a copy of this one, but it is transcribed in Roxburghe Ballads. Thomas Lanfiere's song is of 13 stanzas. I quote verses 1, 8 and 9, which are the core of the 19th century broadside re-writes. The Good Fellow's Resolution; Or, The Bad Husband's return from his Folly Being a Caveat for all Spend-Thrifts to beware of the Main Chance. By T[homas] Lanfiere. I have been a bad Husband this full fifteen year, And have spent many pounds in good ale and strong beer: I have Ranted in Ale-houses day after day, And wasted my time and my Money away: But now I'le beware, and have a great care, Lest at the last Poverty falls to my share: For now I will lay up my Money in store, And I never will play the bad Husband ne more. * * * I went to an Hostiss where I us'd to resort, And I made her believe that money was short; I askt her to trust me, but she answered "Nay, Enough of such Guests I can have every day." Then quoth she, "Pray, forbear, there's no staying here, Except you have money, you shall have no beer." But now... I pull'd out a handful of Money straightway, And shew'd it unto her, to hear what she'd say; Quoth she, "You shall have Beer and ale of the best, You are kindly welcome, I did but speak in jest." "O no, no," said I, "your words I defie, I'le see you hang'd ere with you I'le spend a penny." But now... * * * Printed for F. Coles, T. Vere, J. Wright, J. Clarke, W. Thackeray, and T. Passinger. J W Ebsworth (ed), Roxburghe Ballads, Hertford: The Ballad Society, vol VI 1889, 342-345. Roxburghe Collection II 200; Jersey Collection II 269. Printed before the end of 1682, when Vere's name ceases to appear. The tune specified, The Plow-man's Honour made known, seems to be lost. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: pavane Date: 21 Sep 04 - 02:37 PM The Alewives invitation is to the tune Digby's Farewell - is that known? It was 'printed for P Brooksby, at the Golden Ball' Clearly, The Good Fellow's Resolution is closer to the Wild Rover, and yes, the style of The Alewives Invitation' does look similar. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Malcolm Douglas Date: 21 Sep 04 - 04:45 PM Digby's Farewell is a bit of a complicated issue. Simpson prints three tunes which may not actually be related to each other: I'll have to come back to that later on when I have a bit more time. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: GUEST Date: 01 Sep 10 - 04:56 PM A Welshman recently told me (Aug 2010) that the words of The Wild Rover, as performed by, The Dubliner's, were written by the Grandmother of the famous Cla |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: IanC Date: 03 Dec 10 - 06:54 AM A Welshman might have told you this, but I think it is fairly common knowledge that The Dubliners got their version from "The Singing Island" eds. MacColl/Seeger (1960). The version in there was, in turn, collected from Sam Larner, Norfolk fisherman, in 1959. :-) Ian |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Albatross Date: 30 Dec 11 - 09:15 AM I remember Ewan MacColl saying that he first sung his newly written Shoals of Herring to Sam Larner in Great Yarmouth to hear his opinion about it. ewan said the greatest accolade that he could have got was when Sam smiled and said: "Oive known that song all me loife....." |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Albatross Date: 30 Dec 11 - 09:19 AM PS Ewan said that in about 1983 in Luton Folk Club. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Jack Campin Date: 30 Dec 11 - 10:42 AM None of the "Digby's Farewell" tunes are anything like the modern "Wild Rover". Nor are any of them very interesting. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: False Lankum Date: 04 Nov 20 - 05:21 AM I've been working on a 3-part podcast looking at the history of the Wild Rover. Here is the first part https://soundcloud.com/firedrawnear/the-wild-rover-part-i All the best, Ian |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Steve Gardham Date: 04 Nov 20 - 09:33 AM And brilliant it is, Ian. Great stuff. Well worth a listen, all. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Steve Gardham Date: 04 Nov 20 - 09:48 AM Re Digby's Farewell of which the modern day version is Roud 466, Laws K17 'The Lover's lament for her Sailor': at the prompting of posts above I looked at the chorus and format. Both songs have the same rhythm and rhyme scheme and....well, here is the first verse and the chorus just for comparison...look carefully at the chorus! As I was a walking down by the sea shore, The winds and the waves and the billows did roar, I heard a shrill voice make a sorrowful sound, 'Twas the wind and the waves and the waters around. Crying 'Oh my love's gone, he's the lad I adore, And I never, no never shall see him no more. Whilst the tunes are pretty different the last line of the chorus certainly sounds the same in some versions. Both songs date back to the 17th century and one could easily have influenced the other during those centuries in between. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Steve Gardham Date: 04 Nov 20 - 10:07 AM What I should add is that version of the chorus didn't appear until about 1800 which presents the possibility that the song being often in print from about 1670 onwards, whoever rewrote the song about 1800 perhaps set it to one of the Wild Rover tunes. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: The Sandman Date: 04 Nov 20 - 10:43 AM perhaps |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Brian Peters Date: 23 Aug 21 - 07:05 AM I'll be giving an illustrated talk on 'The Wild Rover' as part of Whitby Folk Week's virtual festival. It's at 11.00 am tomorrow, Tuesday August 24th, and it's a Zoom event so you'll need to register. I'll be showing images of several broadside copies, playing recordings and plenty more besides. Register here. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: The Sandman Date: 24 Aug 21 - 04:21 AM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=904_N_Y0zh0 SeanCannon |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Richard Mellish Date: 24 Aug 21 - 08:30 AM That was well worth watching. Thank you, Brian. Will the recording be made available? |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: The Sandman Date: 24 Aug 21 - 10:42 AM great version from Sean |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: The Sandman Date: 24 Aug 21 - 11:52 AM well done, Brian |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: MudGuard Date: 24 Aug 21 - 03:03 PM The "Wild Rover" tune became quite popular in Germany in 1985, when the German duo Klaus & Klaus used a nonsense text and performed it as "An der Nordseeküste". Damals vor unendlich langer Zeit Da machten wir Friesen am Wasser uns breit. Die Jahre vergingen wie Saus und wie Braus Aber breit seh'n wir Friesen auch heute noch aus. Refrain: An der Nordseeküste am plattdeutschen Strand Sind die Fische im Wasser und selten an Land. An der Nordseeküste am plattdeutschen Strand Sind die Fische im Wasser und selten an Land. Nach Flut kommt die Ebbe Nach Ebbe die Flut Die Deiche Sie halten mal schlecht und mal gut. Die Dänen Sie wandern am Strand hin und her Von Grönland nach Flandern jedenfalls ungefähr. Die Seehunde singen ein Klagelied Weil sie nicht mit dem Schwanz wedeln können, so'n Schiet. Die Schafe Sie blöken wie blöd' auf dem Deich Und mit schwarzgrünen Kugeln garnier'n sie ihn gleich. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A (very rough) translation (without the attempt to make the lines fit the tune, far less attempting to rhyme): Once upon an endless time ago the Friesians spread wide on the edge of the water The years went by in high speed but the Friesians look wide even today Refrain: On the coast of the North Sea, on the Low-German strand. the fish are in the water, and rarely on land. On the coast of the North Sea, on the Low-German strand the fish are in the water, and rarely on land. After flood comes lowtide, after lowtide the flood, the dikes hold it back, sometimes badly, sometimes well. The Danes hike along the beach hither and thither, from Greenland to Flanders, at least roughly. The seals sing a lament, cause they can't wiggle their tails, such a shit ... The sheep bleat like crazy on the dike, and decorate it with black-green marbles. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: RTim Date: 24 Aug 21 - 05:42 PM I believe there was a Folk Festival somewhere in the UK where there was an annual competition to sing The Wild Rover to other tunes than the one normally used...Can anyone confirm this..?? Tim Radford (who prefers the Hampshire version from Whitchurch that Brian Peters sings!!) |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Tattie Bogle Date: 24 Aug 21 - 06:07 PM Brian's presentation today during the Whitby@Home festival was excellent and mentioned many of the versions given in the thread above and more. It was a recorded Zoom session, so I hope it gets transferred to YouTube so that more people can see it. |
Subject: RE: Origins of The Wild Rover From: Brian Peters Date: 26 Aug 21 - 03:27 PM I'll let you all know when it becomes available on YouTube - I've been promised it will happen. |
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