banjo

Subject: banjo
From: GUEST,terry
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 12:53 AM

lets talk banjo! Jokes about same are welcome. Terrt

Subject: RE: banjo
From: old head
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 06:17 AM

how do you know when a bango has perfect pitch? when it goes down the toilet bowl,it doesn't touch the sides. by the way,i play a 5 string.

Subject: RE: banjo
From:
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 07:25 AM

Five stringers are rare here in Australia, but one sees four stringed banjos. I am not ready to start learning to play one. I am spread too thin as it is; but for some future time, is it impractical to add a five-string neck to a four-string body? (Don't ask me where I will find the five-string neck.)

Murray

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 08:07 AM

murray, conversions from one neck to another are fairly common. If you found a 4 string with a good pot, it could even be worthwhile considering finding a luthier who could make and fit a 5 string neck.

Jon

Subject: RE: banjo
From: black walnut
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 08:08 AM

Oh, no. Not another thread about banjos.

~b.w.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: zander (inactive)
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 09:47 AM

Barney McKenna is so good he can make a tenor banjo sound like a musical instrument. Blessings, Dave

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 10:46 AM

Heard some good old time banjo at Brasstown N.C. last nite. Also (earlier) heard Betty Smith sing. A pretty good night! What banjo styles are you all playing and what songs are you working on? My wife and I are working on "Devil Take The Farmer" & "Long Hard Road" this week.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 11:18 AM

That's me chip a as guest. Tried to reset my cookies twice to no avail. anyone know what i'm doing wrong?

Thanks, Chip

Subject: RE: banjo
From: chip a
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 11:59 AM

That's better! Some beautiful old pots out there with 4 string handles on them. Conversions are common. Mudcatters---do most of you play old time styles or bluegrass?

chip

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 01:38 PM

I don't know chip, I play Irish style tenor.

Jon

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 01:57 PM

Of course we have to leave a few tenors unconverted for Jon. Jon, don't want you to start buying up old five strings and putting tenor necks on them. By the way, I've heard that the rod of Aaron was actually a discarded tenor banjo neck although I have no proof of this and it may not be true.

Chip

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 02:04 PM

Chip I play old-time style. I play on a Bart Reiter tubaphone and I have a Goodtime that I use for travelling.
I was studying under Rick Fielding for about 1 1/2 years and then went to see Chris Coole because I wanted to focus soley on old-time tunes. Currently I am picking up whatever I can from Dwight Diller who teaches West Virginia old time tunes from the Pocahontas County. I am listening to music of Edden Hammons, Tommy Jarrell and whatever old-time recordings I can find of that area.
I've only been playing the banjo for about 2 years so I am not sure where my focus will settle but for now I sure do enjoy the old-time music and learning how to back up a fiddler.

Bonnie

Subject: RE: banjo
From: chip a
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 02:16 PM

Bonnie I have a Bart Reiter with a Bacon tone ring. I have a couple of Dwight's tapes which I enjoy. I play a two finger style but I find I can use a lot of calwhammer stuff. I just have to do it sort of upside down! I hadn't played with others for years 'till I got married again. My wife is a guitar picker and whistler so we're working on stuff together. I love the fiddle tunes and ballads. She's getting me to play some newer stuff. Doc Watson is a banjo hero of mine. Looking forward to going to Clifftop for the first time this summer!

Chip

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Cap't Bob
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 02:32 PM

For years I only had one banjo, a Vega with the extra long neck (Pete Seeger style). Somehow my life felt incomplete even with all the other instruments around the house. Then I got a chance to buy an old Vega 4 string for $125. It was then I discovered that a person really needs at least two banjo's. The four string is great for Celtic tunes and tunes of the ragtime era. The five string is great for Old Timey music, frailing, drop thumb frailing, clawhammer, melodic style and blue grass picking. My advice would be to get one of each as it takes too long to change necks, strings, especially during a 45 minute set. Better yet would be to have three banjo's with a third being the regular short neck 5 string mainly for blue grass. Well, er... let's see .. possibly a fourth five string banjo would be nice have around especially if you are plan to use modal tunings (you wouldn't have to continually change tunings).

Cap't Bob

Subject: RE: banjo
From: chip a
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 02:36 PM

let's see, that would be about a half dozen five strings just for the more common tunings. Then what about the four string? Do you guys re-tune for different songs?

Chip

Subject: RE: banjo
From: catspaw49
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 02:48 PM

For Terry.....here's one of the previous joke threads and there are quite a few others......Banjo Jokes-Let the Duelling Begin

Spaw

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Cap't Bob
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 03:11 PM

chip a ~~~~ actually there are two tunings used on the tenor banjo. NORMAL TUNING is C,G,D,A and IRISH TUNING is G,D,A,E NOTE: If you are going to use IRISH TUNING you can not use regular 4 string banjo strings. You have to get heavier gauge strings and tune the banjo lower. I sort of get around this by using NORMAL TUNING and if I play Celtic tunes I put a capo on the 2 fret and do most of the picking on the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th strings. This works out quite nicely for the keys of D,A,&G. Oh well if you all ready have a half doz. banjo's whats one more.

Cap't Bob

Subject: RE: banjo
From: chip a
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 04:38 PM

Thanks Cap't Bob, maybe my next banjo will be a tenor. I'll look into listening to some music. By the way, my grandfather was called Cap. Brings back memories. He's been gone since the early sixties. And I've been away from the coast since the early seventies.

Chip

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 04:55 PM

I play clawhammer style, mainly for singing-with purposes. I'm not sure that what I play, either as instrumental or singing-accompaniment, is really what I'd call "old-time", although that's what I'm nearest to.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 05:54 PM

I would very much like to get anyone's tips onaccompanying fiddle tunes on the 5-string banjo, if anyone has the time, please.

A joke I heard Bill Keith tell :

"How do you tell the difference between a trampoline and a banjo??

People take their shoes off when they dance on a trampoline"

Cheers,

beach

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Cap't Bob
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 06:31 PM

For Irish picking on the 4 string banjo I would suggest listening to Seamus Egan (he plays all instuments very well). You can check out his banjo at:

http://www.hevanet.com/segan/

There are some rather short audio clips at this web site.

Cap't Bob

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 07 Apr 01 - 08:11 PM

Just got back from a session here where I got to have a go on a Paragon - not tried one before - sounded great and it was muted with a cloth inside!

Jon

Subject: RE: banjo
From:
Date: 08 Apr 01 - 05:37 AM

This is a good thread with lots of info. I am glad it didn't just stick with jokes.

Thanks for the answers to my question.

Murray

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Roll&Go-C
Date: 08 Apr 01 - 01:42 PM

Just had the pleasure of sharing the Roseville Fair Parody with some soulful people at the Mocha Folk Cafe last night. You know, the parody where you do two verses in normal fashion and then she catches her true love holding hands with some flooziama, and the chorus runs:

And his head went right through the middle of the banjo,
She left them both well beyond repair,
And the people all said "That's the way to treat a banjo!"
She cracked his skull with a rosewood chair!

What joy to share!

Subject: RE: banjo
From: JedMarum
Date: 08 Apr 01 - 02:25 PM

I have been learning banjo, at my band's expense now for over a year. I love it. Even though I am a much beter guitar player then I am a banjo player, I just can't get enough banjo playing! Who wouldda think it? I am amazed at the differences between the instruments, and not just the obvious mechanics. And I amazed at the versatilty of the banjo. I use a long neck, open back Vega (a new one, from Deering) and it is a beautiful instrument. I use a bastardized three/four finger Scrugs style - but do a lot of brushing and half frailing stuff, too. We play primarily Celtic music, but have a distinct Blue Grass flavor. I have refrained (so far) from learning the claw hammer and/or frailing styles. I intend to move that way, but really want to develop my three and four fingered picking and left hand work before I work on some new stuff. Truth is; I LOVE IT! It's easy for me to sit down and practice thinking I'll work on some banjo parts for an hour or so - but it's always hard for me NOT to spend two or more. The damn thing's just hard to put down!

I may never be as good on banjo as I am on guitar - but who cares? I'm just having a great time!

Subject: RE: banjo
From: wdyat12
Date: 08 Apr 01 - 04:34 PM

Roll&Go-C,

You were Great last night at the Mocha Cafe and your rendition of Roseville Fair Parody really kept them laughing. Nice to meet you in person. You can really play that instument from Hell. I also liked your duet with Naemanson. Doesn't he have a great voice? Maggie and I had a real good time listening to all the talented amatures and professionals that played and sang last night at the Open Mike session. We were quite impressed.

wdyat12

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Rollo
Date: 08 Apr 01 - 04:34 PM

Our technician gets on my nerves with his rapidly-repeated joke about our percussion-instrument... I solemny vow, when I should break my banjo one day, it will be on his head... that is, if our guitar player will not wear it as a necklace before him.

Oh why, why, why all this hate against this poor little fruit of an innocent tambourine raptured by a luthieran bastard?

Subject: RE: banjo
From: wdyat12
Date: 08 Apr 01 - 04:55 PM

I have a lot of respect and envy for any banjo player who can keep the banjo in tune throughout one whole tune. I have a Vega tenor banjo that just wont stay in tune, so I never really learned to play it well. I would do OK in a Chinese orchestra. Is there anything I can do to keep those pegs from slipping, besides super-glueing them so they stay put? I tried bow rosin.

wdyat12

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Cap't Bob
Date: 08 Apr 01 - 05:31 PM

wdyat12

On my Vega long neck 5 string I replaced the pegs with guitar tuners and they work just great. I noticed that Tommy Maken made the same switch probably for the same reason.

Oh and by the way during the winter I get most of my hot water from a loop of stainless steel placed right in the fire box of my furnace. On my old wood furnace I had a 35 ft. coil of copper tubing that laid on top and outside of the fire box. Both of these were/are connected to an old 80 gal hot water tank that is set on end right next to the furnace. The difference in density between hot and cold water kept the water circulating in the tank. The output of this tank is fed into the electric tank. With just my wife and I (rarely happens ~ seems we always have a grand kid living with us) we can turn off the electric tank. If you would like I could send you a picture of the setup.

Cap't Bob

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Butch
Date: 08 Apr 01 - 10:56 PM

Are there no stroke or minstrel style players in Mudcat land?

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Roll&Go-C
Date: 09 Apr 01 - 09:27 AM

Thanks, Wdyat12, for the complement; banjo players don't get a lot of those, so when we do we cherish them.

I'm assuming your tenor banjo has friction pegs and unless you are playing tunes with some kind of re-enactment band I would go along with the recommendation to replace them with tasteful geared ones. Tuning is hard enough as it is.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Butch
Date: 09 Apr 01 - 10:17 AM

What would you reenact with a tenor banjo?

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Roll&Go-C
Date: 09 Apr 01 - 10:32 AM

Butch, you're probably right that tenor banjos were more a development of the 1920's. However, the 4-string or plectrum banjos were around for much of the 19th century, more common in minstral bands than 5-string banjos. There's many a civil war group photo with banjo players prominantly featured. Are you seriously concerned?

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 09 Apr 01 - 10:47 AM

Interesting, Rool&Go-C, I was under the impression that the plectrum banjo came into being somewhere around 1900 but I could be miles out.

I think 1920's is a little bit late for the tenor banjo. The dates I have seen vary a bit but I think we are looking more at 1910-1915.

Whatever, while I am here, I will add my vote to fitting tasteful geared pegs.

Jon

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Roll&Go-C
Date: 09 Apr 01 - 11:23 AM

The 1920's were more the hey-day of the tenor banjos, as used in the jazz bands; Seeger suggests they got their start in the earlier ragtime era. I got my first Thoroughbred S.S. Stewart banjo from a 1920's banjo man back in 1964; he had no use for 5-string banjos and was willing to reduce his clutter for $55. I'm no longer sure where I ran my reference to 4-string plectrum banjos.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 09 Apr 01 - 12:16 PM

Sounds like a good buy! My main tenor banjo is a modern one, a 17 fret Kildare (one of Sully's range).

Jon

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Roll&Go-C
Date: 09 Apr 01 - 12:48 PM

Oh, here's a great word of advice from the reprint of the 1985 S.S.Stewart's Banjo Catalogue:

If you must use your banjo as a snow shovel, do so!
Only don't wonder if it sounds dull afterwards.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Roll&Go-C
Date: 09 Apr 01 - 12:49 PM

Make that the "1895" catalogue reprint...

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Cap't Bob
Date: 09 Apr 01 - 07:04 PM

Anyone interested in Fairbanke/Vega Tubaphone etc. would probably enjoy the following website:

http://devellis.home.mindspring.com/instr/vegano.htm

Some interesting history and photos featuring both five string and tenor banjos.

Cap't Bob

Subject: RE: banjo
From: wdyat12
Date: 10 Apr 01 - 04:29 AM

Thank you three Cap't Bob, Roll&Go-C, and Jon,

I will repeg my tenor banjo with geared tuning pegs. Playing in Chinese Operas is out of fashion now anyway. I want to learn this "Devil's instrument" in the worst way.

Soul on Alert,

wdyat12

Subject: RE: banjo
From: CRANKY YANKEE
Date: 10 Apr 01 - 06:21 AM

I learned to clawhammer a 5-string in about 5 minutes. Tom Paley taught me to the tune, "Johnny Booker". I'm really lucky in that I know a few famous banjo pickers.For versatility, you must place Roger Sprung at the top of the list. He breathes, eats and drinks banjo, that is when he's not adopting korean orphans. Roger does the usual hilbilly styles, 3-finger (scruggs) clawhammer, frail etc. But, he also does some Mozart, wagner and other classical composers. His "Maple Leaf Rag" by Scott Joplin is dynamite. I spent a lot of my adult life in the USAF. In between enlistments Roger and I worked together on the Boardwalk in Coney Island, (Brooklyn, NY.) I was just going to write that I couldn't remember the name of the place, but, I just remembered it. It was "The Shamrock" More recently , 1967,68,69 & 70, at the "Black Pearl Tavern" here in Newport, Rhode Island. They quit having entertainment when ownership changed hands. We still work together from time to time. We do "Mozart's Sonata in C" and Wagner's "Under the Double Eagle" with guitar and banjo. I also play different styles. Bluegrass and Clawhammer, of course but I have my own techniques that don't fit into anyone elses "categories". Paul Geremia, the blues man, also lives in Newport and we're old friends since before he started playing guitar. He called me up one day, all excited, and said that he'd found a couple of "Uncle Dave Macon"'s records where he sounded like a ragtime piano (stride piano), "The Wreck of the Tennessee Gravy Train" and "Between heaven and earth", and that I should try to learn this technique. I have these recordings on tape and lp. So, I worked out a method of three finger picking and strumming (everything "down") where I pick individual strings with a thumb pick and strum with the index and second fingernils. Imagine Three finger , Scruggs type rhythm with the backs of your fingers and a thin thumbpick. It doesn't, however' go continuously like scruggs picking, but does go in groups like stride piano. Oh, Hell, it does sound like the two records I've just mentioned. A couple of days later Paul called me up and said to forget it because what he'd heard was actually TWO banjos. Sam MaGee was playing rhythm on a six string (guitar banjo) and Uncle Dave was simply two finger picking the melody. Every now and then at one of my gigs or his we do "The Wreck of the Tenessee Gravy Train" and Paul introduces it calling it "Jody's schizophrenic banjo". His hard-core blues fans look listen with a blank look on their collective faces

What I'm trying to say (aside from bragging) is, "Don't restrict yourselves to one style" If you do, you're missing a lot of fun and musical enjoyment. Never mind the categories, just play the damned thing.
If you play the guitar in the keys of g and c, You should have no trouble with minors, sevenths etc. Start enjoying this great enjoyable insrument. (use a capo & re tune the 5th string accordingly) stick a carpet tack just behind the 4th fret on the fifth string. tuck the 5th string under the tack if you have to have the 5th string higher than "A"

Did someone say "Traditional Irish music on the banjo?" GREAT This is called the "Folk Process" don't let anyone categorize you. When I recorded "Farewell to Tarwaithe" I caught all kinds of flak from Folk Music Purists (Folk Music Fascists) They insisted tht I "Shouldn't use guitar 5=string banjo, steel guitar and bass because it's a Scottish Folk Song and Scots didn't have these instruments when the song was first written". W E L L T H E Y D O NOW, besides, it's now an Americn Folk Song as Well because I'm singing it and I'm American.
Jody Gibson.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 10 Apr 01 - 06:45 AM

Cranky Yankee, it has sometimes caused me great amusement in sessions to hear an ignorant "purist" moan about an unusual instrument for a session (let's say clarinet for example) being out of place as it isn't traditional - and I think to myself, "well my tenor banjo is 20th century, the Irish Bazouki is even more recent...".

My attitude is, "if it fits, it is fine!". This is not to say that there isn't also a place for trying to keep music to instruments used in a certain period of time though.

Capt bob, thanks for reminding me of that site, I like it.

Jon

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Butch
Date: 10 Apr 01 - 07:07 PM

In answer to your question about my concern with reenacting I have to say yes.... I am concerned.

First let me say that I am a purist but only in a historical context. I have a problem when players go to a historic site and say " This is what it sounded like" but their instrumentation, playing style and music are all wrong. This is different from a bar or music house where the music is represented not as a reenactment but rather a living musical form.

For historical purposes, only five and six string, gut strung fretless banjos should be used for musical historical interpretation before 1865 and after 1850. Those with six strings should have a short chanter like the five strings. Plectrum banjos came after 1880. Also only stroke or minstrel style playing should be used for this type of work. If I see one more Civil War player with a 1910 plectrum playing Stephen Foster and telling his buddies that " this is just how it sounded during the war" I think I will explode. Why not either :1 do it right or 2 do it in a non-educational setting.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 10 Apr 01 - 11:23 PM

Ladies and gentlemen of the banjo persuasion, you owe it to yourselves to check out Chris Grotewohl. He finger picks Celtic music on a five-string, and you'd swear it was the best tenor-banjo player you ever heard! Spot on triplets, double-stops - the lot! I don't know how to do the blue clicky, but you can get his CDs here. http:bluegrassbanjo.org/chrisg.html, or: www.celticmusic.com/chrisg/. Have I ever lied to you before?

All the best,

Seamus

---

Links made clickable - JoeClone

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 10 Apr 01 - 11:35 PM

Seamus, he is one of only 2 who I have heard pull that off and I agree in as much as I would swear he was playing tenor (not sure about the best Irish style I've ever heard - which is of course subjective - although he is up there abouts).

Jon

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 11 Apr 01 - 07:21 PM

JoeClone, thanks for the clicky. Jon, you're right - it is subjective. Barney McKenna, Mick Moloney, Seamus Egan, Peter Fitzgerald, Pat Cavanagh - each has his adherents. (I'm a Barney man myself.) But I had the pleasure of jamming with Chris at the NTIF last year, and I was astounded at what he was doing on the banjo, and it was in standard 5-string Bluegrass tuning, too. He also has a custom-made instrument that's a bouzouki with a five-string neck, on which he also plays Celtic tunes. A certifiable musical wizard IMO. I gotta go bring my Weymann tenor in for some minor repairs. See ya.

Seamus

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 11 Apr 01 - 09:58 PM

Well, Barney is my hero (if I believed in hero's that is). I've never realy been able to work out what he has (apart from being the one whose playing really got me interested in tb) but I love it - guess there is no point in thinking further. I also have a Johnstons tape, love the Trip To Durrow and 9Pts of Roguery...

Here's a player I've only heard once - on "Fiddle Sticks - II), John Carty playing The Heathery Breeze and Finbar Dwyers... I love it - really should find more of him.

Jon

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 05:18 PM

Jon, IMO, Barney sounds human- he doesn't sound like a triplet machine. Will try to find some John Carty stuff. Thanks for the tip.

Seamus

Subject: RE: banjo
From: JedMarum
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 05:37 PM

CRANKY YANKEE I agree that 5 string banjo, even played 'merican style works well for Irish and Scot folk songs and tunes. I have seen a few 5 string players playing tunes in the trad styles, as Seamus is pointing out ... in fact, I watched a real wiz at the NTIF fest Seamus is talking about. I saw him warming up in the musician's area with two other players.

For me learning banjo is less about the picking methods then it is about the way a banjo is used ... it is, in some ways, a lot like a lead guitar player in a rock or country band - notes, fills, solos - but it is also a major component of the rhythym. Screw up on guitar, and you can slide, screw up on banjo and everyone knows it, especially if the error is a timing error.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 08:04 PM

A well-respected banjoist/music-store-operator posted this on a distribution list today. Too good not to pass on.

I had a customer this morning who was looking at banjos, and commenting on how hard it is to find a place that stocks them. He allowed as how he had been in a local guitar store (the owner's a good friend), and asked about banjos. They told him: "We don't carry them, because if we did, banjo players would come in the store."

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: banjo
From: JedMarum
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 10:12 PM

LOL, Dave. Thanks!

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,beachcombers
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 04:23 PM

Cheesses, What is it about me? I've tried several times to whip up a discussion about the playing of Irish traditional music on the 5-string banjo (yes - I failed miserably to get an even passable jig doing my three finger job) and no-one bothered, or maybe just one, was it you Bernard? I tried the clicks that Seamus Kennedy supplied but neither was available and... now I've had my Mudcat membership withdrawn... again."Life gets tedious.... don't it?" beach

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 04:36 PM

Beachcomber, the links were my fault and I have fixed that. There still is a problem with the second link - I can't find the page. The main site is http://www.celticmusic.com/home.shtml. You maybe able to find it from there.

To restore your membership, you need to go to membership and restet your cookie. Further information can be found in the FAQ. If things still don't work, place a post to the Help Forum.

As for playing Jigs, 5 string, 3 finger style, I remember a thread on it but I couldn't contribute any information on how to go about it.

Jon

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Cap't Bob
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 08:03 PM

Beachcomber ~ If you are using the bluegrass style of picking you may have some problems locating traditional tunes that would fit 3 finger bluegrass style. I have heard bluegrass bands play "Red Haired Boy" which is basically the same tune as "Little Beggerman".

If you play the melodic style 5 string banjo there is a book by Harold Streeter "IRISH JIGS for melodic style 5 string banjo. It is a bit of a work out unless you are pretty good at tablature. The book I have was published by MUSICPRINT CORPORATION ~ Lewalt Publishing Co., l980.

Another book that has a few Irish tunes is "MELODIC BANJO" by Toni Trischka. This book was published by Oak Publications, cl976.

I play a few Irish tunes on the 5 string using clawhammer and the melodic style picking. They are a lot of fun once you get them worked up.

Cap't Bob

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Luke
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 08:29 PM

I have heard that the string on the banjo that was added last was the lowest string the C or D depending on the tuning you use for home base. The african instrument which the banjo came from was one which specifially had that high rhythm string thang going on. It was the white folks who felt the need to civilize it and tune it like a viola. Which is where the tenor is located traditionally. This would naturally make it easier to find music to read. But I always love what "Pete" said in his book. " There ain't no notes to a banjo, you just play it".

The banjo is a wonder and a real good m usical partner. Theres always so much music ther to surprize and delight you. And, you can play it laying down.

Luke

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Butch
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 11:04 PM

I'm afraid that the banjo information that has been passed down in respects to tuning and the origins of the 5 string are a bit ... well.... wrong.

The five string banjo can be found as early as 1790 and in the hands of black players, not white. The most likely African banjo ancester is the akonting, which has three strings (one noted and two drone) . Four strings seems to be the most comon way of finding early banjo images (pre- 1810) but these are mostly in the three long, one short, configuration.

The five string dessign we see today may have come from white players like Joel Sweeney, but more likely he did not invent or add the fifth string at all, he simply made that design famous. As far as early tuning went, that fouth string is tuned all the way down to a G. In the later tunings (1858 - 1880's) it would be an A. The viola tuning was not used until tenor banjos -which were not invented until 1914. The original (or at lewast oldest known tuning) was A F# D G D.

Subject: RE: banjo
From:
Date: 14 Apr 01 - 05:01 PM

With reference to tuners - I play a Windsor 5-string which is about 100 years old, and a short-scale tenor from the 30's and gave up the unequal struggle with friction pegs some time ago. However, if you have a nice old instrument, don't forget that you can still get hold of vintage Grover and other geared tuners relatively easily - it's largely a matter of finding a tuner with the right size body to fit the space available, and the modern ones do tend to be a bit chunky. If you need vintage bits in the UK, try Andy Perkins at Faversham, Kent. Keep well, Chris Nixon

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Rex
Date: 14 Apr 01 - 06:54 PM

On the subject of early banjos, where can you get a look at one? Pictures or otherwise? I've seen many paintings but I'm not satisfied with trusting the painter's accuracy or willing to assume they were musicians themselves. What I would like to see is some detailed image of a banjo prior to say, 1850 as photos of post 1850 banjos are aplenty. I know, photography was just developling at the time. And before anyone says it, I've been all through the fine books: "Ring the Banjar", "That Half Barbaric Twang" and "America's Instrument, the Banjo in the 19th Century", as well as piles of 19th century sheet music covers. Anyone know of any other source of pre 1850 banjos?

Rex

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Butch
Date: 14 Apr 01 - 11:12 PM

I have photos of @ 40 early banjos in my collection. These are photos I took of existing banjos. Also, the Harvard Theater Collection have many that were not printed in "America's Instrument" as does Jim Bollman.

In addition to photos, I keep detailed construction data, material lists and measurements. All are available in my shop by appointment. I hope to add another 20 instruments this year.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,JO
Date: 15 Apr 01 - 02:47 PM

Need some help to find lyrics and music for 4 string banjo. Interestesd in folk music.

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 15 Apr 01 - 11:14 PM

Here is an address where Chris Grotewohl can be reached. Chris Grotewohl, 5th String Music, 5049 Parish, Roeland Park, KS 66205 USA. [e-mail]. His 5-string wizardry with Celtic music is incredible.

All the best.

Seamus

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,Rex at work
Date: 16 Apr 01 - 07:57 AM

Say Butch, interesting info you offer. How may I find out more?

Rex

Subject: RE: banjo
From: Butch
Date: 16 Apr 01 - 09:09 AM

You can e-mail me at work [e-mail] or at my other work [e-mail] and I will pass on the phone #'s via e-mail. Thanks for your Interest!

Subject: RE: banjo
From: GUEST,beachcomber
Date: 16 Apr 01 - 04:16 PM

Thanks Jon, will get around to refixing my membership eventually. Some one mentioned GROVER tuning pegs in the discussion. I have a grover banjo (5-string) which I purchased in a back lane in deepest north London some 15 to 18 years ago . Did I buy a well regarded make? it cost something in the region of £300 if my memory serves me correctly. Yes I also have a book of tablature of Irish stuff by Jimmy Kelly (came with a small cassette) which is incorrect in many of its tunes, due to misprints I believe, but is nevertheless quite good. Kelly is , with Martin Cooney from co Kildare, one of the two best banjo exponents I've heard over here in Ireland.