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BS: For my Cyberstalker
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Subject: For my Cyberstalker From: mousethief Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:16 AM As many of you know, somebody has been cyberstalking me since at least April, popping up in threads where I post and calling me a racist, mostly. For reasons I won't go into, I'm going to say it's a "her". I've written her a couple of songs. If you can't beat 'em, mock 'em. "The deville, that prowde spirite, cannot stand to be mocked" --Donne
Hit and Run
Chorus
My momma done told me when I was just little, Repeat Chorus
Responsible discussion's too bloody much work Repeat Chorus
Disagree with a black and I'll call you a "racist." Repeat Chorus Copyright (C) 2001 by Alex Riggle. All Rights Reserved.
Cyberstalker
I'm being harassed by a cyberstalker
Cos if I ever have my doubts
Did it take long to find me I'm being harassed by a cyberstalker (etc.) Copyright ©2001 Alex Riggle. All Rights Reserved.
Don't Let Me Down Don't Let Me Down(4x)
I'm being stalked for the first time Copyright ©2001 Alex Riggle. All Rights Reserved.
More to come, as necessary. Thanks, stalker! Now I know that somebody out there cares that I'm here! Alex |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Helen Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:18 AM Well done, mousethief! A neat twist in your mousey-tail. Helen P.S. I, for one, love ya! |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: John P Date: 15 Aug 01 - 08:23 AM Alex, As someone who spent years being cyberstalked, I can sympathize with you. It's no fun to be constantly accused of untrue things -- there is always the question of whether to engage and feed the asshole's vanity or stay silent and let the lie go unchallenged. This is the real power of the cyberstalker. You are, in some ways, damned it you do and damned if you don't. Fortunately, people like this quickly demonstrate to everyone what jerks they are, so folks stop taking them seriously about anything. But with enough perserverance they can eventually insert their untruths into the collective unconscious, so they need to get publicly swatted down from time to time. I hope to see you next week. John |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Jon Freeman Date: 15 Aug 01 - 08:41 AM Hadn't noticed Alex but I don't read that many threads and have no reason not to believe you. I was witness to some of what John P reffered to and I appreciate the awkward if not impossible situation the vicitm is in. It's not a lot but you have both my support (not that there's anything I can do on a practical level) and sympathy. Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: SharonA Date: 15 Aug 01 - 08:46 AM Well done, Alex! Skewer on, good sir. Here's to ridiculing the ridiculous!!! SharonA |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Mary in Kentucky Date: 15 Aug 01 - 08:53 AM Alex, my empathy too. As one of Helen's links last year noted, these sickies often persist for ten years or so. Follow your instincts, don't try to understand it all. And be careful in the 3D world. Document events but don't let it control your life. There are legal protections, but usually it never comes to that, besides, I found that most stalkers don't have the intelligence or the "connections" to really carry out their threats. Unfortunately, they just shift their attentions to someone else when they get bored with you. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: SINSULL Date: 15 Aug 01 - 10:59 AM Alex, It is an ugly business. Unfortunately, stalkers feed on your reactions. Maybe next time, try a simple "I refuse to respond to this and ask that everyone else ignore it too". Cut it off. Dismiss it as the nonsense it is. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Mudcatter Date: 15 Aug 01 - 11:38 AM Or just simply ignore it, period. Alex, I'm not sure what's been going on with you, but someone posting nasty things about you in Mudcat threads, hardly defines you as being 'stalked' Not sure why you started this thread |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST Date: 15 Aug 01 - 11:39 AM Have you done any research on what your options are? I'm not familiar enough with the circumstances to know whether the poster in question's behavior would be considered stalking, or harrassment. But there are options available to you if you trace the IP, report user's behavior to their ISP, and urge their provider to rattle their users chains at the least, or possibly get their account yanked?
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Walking Eagle Date: 15 Aug 01 - 12:06 PM My support as well. This ol' Cherokee woman could give you a few conjures if you want. Nah, you did the best conjurin' with your songs. let me know and I'll set the 'little people of the mountain,' to work! (;>) |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: gnu Date: 15 Aug 01 - 12:21 PM Are they.. him.. her.. it.. still at it ? I recall a thread in which you were called racist, repleat with a half-quote, taken out of context... refuted by myself, if I recall correctly, repleat with full quote and context. I hope I'm not next on this slimeball's shitlist. It's easy to say "ignore", but when someone does what that OOB (Offspring Ofa Bitch - have to be PC, you know) did, you have no choice but to respond because some people actually take at face value what is said/written or, at least, have a doubt about character. That defamation can hurt present and future discussion, let alone respect... which Alex deserves for his many intelligent posts. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: SharonA Date: 15 Aug 01 - 12:23 PM Even if the harrasser's account is yanked, I'm sure (s)he would find other ways to get on-line and continue the harrassment (talk about your negative energy! This person needs to take up knitting, or something, to burn up all that angst in a more constructive way). I got a private message from Joe Offer last week (while I was on vacation), and I'm guessing that some other people got the same message too, requesting that I/we NOT discuss in threads the METHODS that flamers use to do their dirty work (the technical stuff, that Joe tries to undo) and especially the methods that Joe and the joeclones use to combat the flamers (that flamers then read on the threads, and find ways to work around in order to carry on their "mission"). So, please, let's also be very careful when we start talking publicly about "options" we ourselves can employ to combat the flamers. I suggest what Joe suggested to me: communicate ANY suggestions of courses of action VIA PRIVATE MESSAGE. Remember that all public threads are there for ANYONE to read. Not to be paranoid er nuthin'... but if I were a knight, I wouldn't say anything about the chinks in my armor, nor about my battle strategy & tactics, within hearing range of the guy I was jousting with. SharonA |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST Date: 15 Aug 01 - 12:49 PM With all due respect SharonA, I too read the thread with the admonitions from Joe Offer not to discuss the sites technical vulnerabilities in the forum. Which seemed like a pretty ludicrous suggestion coming from a site maintainer on the internet, but there you have it. The instance you mention didn't have anything to do with flaming, AFAIR. It was, rather, to do with the tired old saw, member identities. Apparently, some think it takes Bill Gates' minions to figure out anyone with a mind to can log-in with member's handles/names by using the guest option and "misspelling" the name by transposing two letters. Duh. As to the sugggestions made above by guest 11:39 a.m. there are pretty standardized procedures for dealing with internet harrassment and stalking, but in my opinion, and apparently that of some others here, this instance doesn't come very close to meeting the criteria of either. Not to say that even paranoids don't have enemies, just that I don't think there is much of a case to be made for harrassment, much less stalking. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Peg Date: 15 Aug 01 - 12:53 PM I have to agree with whoever asked, why start this thread and call it something like this? Wy is it STALKING when someone simply responds to threads you post in? That's the internet, dude. Better get used to it. To call this sort of thing "stalking" is to belittle the experiences of those who have genuinely been stalked in, you know, real life. IMHO, anyway. peg
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Jack the Sailor Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:00 PM Gosh GUEST, You just called Sharon and Joe Offer stupid, and you called Alex paranoid. In just a few lines you have managed to be rude, condesending, insulting and arrogant. Small wonder you do not use a handle. I hope you are not one of those GUEST's who complains "cliques" and about his/her treatment by Mudcat regulars. If you are, perhaps we have found the reason. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:10 PM Well said, Peg Alex isn't being stalked. He's behaving like a 5 year old running to his mom: "Johnny said nasty things about me, booh hoo hoo" His parodies aren't very good either Grow up, Alex |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:16 PM and admit that you sometimes piss people of with your obnoxious / uninformed posts I read mudcat a lot, you are about the only person who annoys me The fact that someone is pissed enough to send nasty messages does not suprise me |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:38 PM Alex-I don't know if you are being stalked or not, most people on this thread think you are. In that case you have my sympathy, I recently had sme weirdo plauging me with silnt phone calls, I was not frightened, but it was bloody annoying.Maybe you could speak to Joe Offer about this, I heard he was an FBI investigator, I am sure he will know what to do.take care.john |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: SharonA Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:44 PM Thanks, Jack. With all "due" respect, GUEST (post of 15-Aug-01, 12:49 pm), you'll notice that I had mentioned a Private Message that I had received from Joe, not anything he'd posted to a thread. Also, I didn't "mention" a specific "instance" of flaming. Duh, indeed. How interesting that you assumed that I was talking about posting as a GUEST and misspelling a member's name afterward. I wasn't. However, I do consider that to be one form of flaming. SharonA |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Denise:^) Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:45 PM Please note, folks--Alex didn't say "stalking," but "CYBER-stalking," and that makes all the difference! Since a stalker is one who follows you around, tracking, pestering and even threatening you, it goes to follow that a cyberstalker would follow you on the 'net, in much the same way. I think mousethief has hit the nail dead-on! |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Dorothy Parker's Evil Twin Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:47 PM Oh yes, please do call in the FBI. That way we kind find out if the cyberstalker is dead, or if my watch just stopped. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Clinton Hammond Date: 15 Aug 01 - 01:56 PM Peg's got it nailed right on the head! and Guest, if Jack is the only one here who pisses you off, then I'm not dong my job right! |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Denise:^) Date: 15 Aug 01 - 02:01 PM Sorry, Clinton--you're wrong. Just because you walk down a public street, other people don't have the right to follow you everywhere. Just because you park in a public lot, others don't have the right to leave notes on your windshield. Just because you post on a website doesn't give others the right to follow your every post with slander or name-calling. Whether you can stop them or not does not change the nature of what they've done. Wrong is wrong. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Jack the Sailor Date: 15 Aug 01 - 02:35 PM Clinton, I think GUEST was referring to Alex. GUEST seems to have trouble with names. It seems that GUEST 15-Aug-01 - 01:16 PM AND GUEST 15-Aug-01 - 01:10 PM AND GUEST 15-Aug-01 - 12:49 PM Are just here to insult people. I hope he/she/it/they take(s) this opportunity to learn from this and work on His/her/it's/their manners.
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Dorothy Parker's Evil Twin Date: 15 Aug 01 - 02:46 PM Yachtman Jack, Martyrdom covers a multitude of sins. Why not offer yourself to the cause? |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Don Firth Date: 15 Aug 01 - 02:47 PM It isn't a matter of manners. It's diarrhea of the keyboard and constipation of the brain. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Dorothy Parker's Evil Twin Date: 15 Aug 01 - 02:53 PM Donnie Boy, It is the dull man who is always sure, and the sure man who is always dull. I can tell you are that certain type of man, and a man of certainty. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Gareth Date: 15 Aug 01 - 02:53 PM GUEST,Dorothy Parker's Evil Twin Dorothy Parker had the merit of being witty. Gareth |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Clinton Hammond Date: 15 Aug 01 - 02:53 PM I am not wrong... it's a matter of opinion... so stuff yers! it's the internet.. you don't wanna get called nasty names, don't post on it.. because some people out here have nothing better to do... I'm not saying it's right.. I'm saying there's NOTHING at all you can do about it... calling it "CyberSTALKING" is as Peg put it, belittling... |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Denise:^) Date: 15 Aug 01 - 02:57 PM Sorry again, Clinton--you're *still* wrong. (and you can be rude to me if you want, I can take it; I teach first grade...) "it's the internet..." Just because you walk down a public street, other people don't have the right to follow you everywhere. Just because you park in a public lot, others don't have the right to leave notes on your windshield. Just because you post on a website doesn't give others the right to follow your every post with slander or name-calling. "I'm saying there's NOTHING at all you can do about it..." Whether you can stop them or not does not change the nature of what they've done. Wrong is wrong. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Dorothy's twin again Date: 15 Aug 01 - 03:01 PM Toothful Gareth, I have never known anyone worth a damn who wasn't irascible. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Don Firth Date: 15 Aug 01 - 03:02 PM Glad you liked it, Dottie-poo. I thought it was pretty good. Stay loose, now. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Jack the Sailor Date: 15 Aug 01 - 03:10 PM Dorothy Parker's Evil Twin That's a clever handle. I have sins, I'm not a martyr. I am asking GUEST to stop insulting people. If I do something which bothers you please feel free to ask me to stop. Perhaps GUEST didn't realize GUEST was being rude. I have said my piece on this topic. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Clinton Hammond Date: 15 Aug 01 - 03:18 PM I didn't say it was right did I?!?!? For a tacher, your comprehension skills sure make me wonder... |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Whoever Date: 15 Aug 01 - 03:23 PM Jack the Sailor, You've only been here a couple of months, but I think that you're a bit nieve. Perhaps telling someone that they're being a bit of an 'ass' in starting such a thread is 'rude' but it also has some truth to it I have never met Mousethief, but I find his comments on this forum often quite annoying. That's my opinion, not mindless rudeness Whoever |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Dorothy's Ghost Date: 15 Aug 01 - 03:34 PM Public opinion, a vulgar, impertinent, anonymous tyrant who deliberately makes life unpleasant for anyone who is not content to be a polite bore. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Jack the Sailor Date: 15 Aug 01 - 03:46 PM I didn't say the bad manners were mindless. The rudeness is a little easier to take when there is a name attached. Anon insults are like grafitti on a bathroom wall. This is hardly constructive criticsm. and admit that you sometimes piss people of with your obnoxious / uninformed posts I read mudcat a lot, you are about the only person who annoys me Does his mother wear army boots as well?
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: SharonA Date: 15 Aug 01 - 04:03 PM Annoyance is in the eye of the annoyed (or in the throat of the adenoid!). What annoys me is incorrect spelling ("nieve", "tacher"). However, if I were to spend my time following chronic misspellers around the website and not only correcting all of their mistakes but berating them, insulting them and submitting posts with excruciatingly correct spelling under membership names similar to theirs, my behavior would be not only annoying but also QUITE rude; I would be more than a BIT of an ass, wouldn't I? |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Dorothy Parker's Evil Twin Date: 15 Aug 01 - 04:10 PM SharonA, Funny, I heard you were more than an BIT of an ass too... |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Whoever Date: 15 Aug 01 - 04:42 PM Sharon, 'nieve' was spelt correctly - you obviously don't know the word that I was using - I suggest looking it up |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Jenny the T Date: 15 Aug 01 - 04:44 PM My oh my, Isn't this an entertaining demonstration of Elementary Trolling Techniques? By all means, continue responding to GUEST, or Dorothy Parker's Mentally Disabled Neighbor, or whatever they choose to call themselves next. That always gets trolls to shut up, right? This nitwit is a shameful waste of what could otherwise be perfectly good dog food. Responding to 'em just lets them waste bandwidth, too. JtT |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: GUEST,Speedy Gonzales Date: 15 Aug 01 - 05:01 PM In describing himself on this and other websites, including his own, Alex/mousethief stresses that he is a "white" male. Sometimes, he makes remarks about Blacks or Jews that can be taken as racist or anti-Semitic. Sometimes, when that happens, someone will remind us that Alex/mousethief is the only Mudcatter who stresses his race. Then, whenever that happens, Alex/mousethief starts another thread about himself so that his buddies can tell him what a wonderful paragon of brotherhood he is. Some critical messages on Mudcat can hardly be described as stalking. Get real Alex/mousethief.
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Jack the Sailor Date: 15 Aug 01 - 05:32 PM From Webster's On line... in the interest of providing education where it is needed. The word you've entered isn't in the dictionary. Click on a spelling suggestion below or try again using the Dictionary search box to the right. Suggestions for nieve: 1. naive 2. nave 3. naive 4. knave 5. neve 6. nov 7. nav 8. Nev 9. Nov 10. niece 11. knives I believe the word you wanted was naive. I am starting to believe that I've been a naive knave staring at my nave. I'd like to be a nov writing about Nev in Nov. and describe skis cutting the neve like knives.
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: gnu Date: 15 Aug 01 - 07:37 PM As for being Alex's buddy, I am nobody's buddy. I am only interested in truth and discussion. Which is why this thread is dead as far as I am concerned. I said above that sometimes you can't ignore what's said about you... I was wrong... this only gets worse, as witnessed above. So I'm going to leave. See ya when you have something constructive to say. PS Speedy... racist and hate-mongerer are equal in my books. I have not read ALL of Alex's posts, but, from what I have read over the past six months, I do not believe he is racist, but I have my doubts about you. appalledgnu |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: SharonA Date: 15 Aug 01 - 07:44 PM Thanks again, Jack! Brilliant use of the language, too: a veritable nave rave!! Next, you should write a clerestory. ;^) And yes, "GUEST,Dorothy Parker's Evil Twin", I suppose I am more than a bit of an ass sometimes; I don't mean to be. That's quite different from working at it diligently. Jenny the T is right. Enough wasted words falling on deaf ears! 'Bye, now! |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Jon Freeman Date: 15 Aug 01 - 08:00 PM gnu, I'm assuming Alex is in a simlar situation to the one John P was in and I'm not really sure what the answer is in terms of ignoring or posting. This type of cyberstalker does present a different problem to the troll. The troll tries to stir up problems and if ignored goes away. The cyberstalker sticks with the victim and may as Alex has suggested constantly tell lies to insult the character of the person - in this case, it appears that the stalker will have it that Alex is a racist. In a closed community, matters are probably easier as eventually, everyone will realise the truth but in open environments such as this, there are are always newcommers who don't know the score and I would guess this adds a lot of reason for the victim to feel a need to challenge the accusations which will not go away. Referring back to John P, I was new at the time and it took me some time to understand what was going on (my first lesson in newsgroups). As it turned out, I ended up with a lot of respect for the way John P handled a situation and learned what the other party was like. I doubt that would have been the case if he always remained silent. It really is a tough situation. Jon |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Jeri Date: 15 Aug 01 - 08:21 PM Whoever said "You've only been here a couple of months, but I think that you're a bit nieve" "Nieve" is an archaic word meaning fist or hand. So if whoever said it, they may have meant that she's only been here for a short while but she sounds like a bit of an old hand. Well, actually what it translates to is she's only been here a short while, but she's a bit hand. If this is some weird combination of Scots and archaic English it may make sense. If whoever meant Sharon is a hand that is bitten, it's a bit weirdness. |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Thomas the Rhymer Date: 15 Aug 01 - 08:56 PM I'd love to have more simpathy, For those in cyber-slandery, And though there is this empathy, It borders nearby pandery... For cyber-space is not quite real, Unless were talking surveillance This cyber-slander can but appeal To dark right agents' prevailents... But as one who's been taken down, From lying stalkers,...to bad renoun, Turn your to self in cyber town, with arm and heart and brain And like the Mary Ellen Carter, RISE AGAIN. ttr |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: Clinton Hammond Date: 15 Aug 01 - 09:15 PM I'm a troll man... Do do do, Do-do do-do I'm a TROOOOOL man... ;-) |
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Subject: RE: BS: For my Cyberstalker From: catspaw49 Date: 15 Aug 01 - 09:23 PM Well CH, that was really cute and THOMAS.....WHAT A JOB!! Congrats to you both.......but, uh, neither of you used the word nieve so I'll have to deduct a tenth of a point. Spaw |