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Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)

DigiTrad:
BLACK IS THE COLOR OF MY TRUE LOVE'S HAIR (1)
BONNY FARDAY
DOWN IN YON FORREST
I LEARNED ABOUT HORSES FROM HER
LASS FROM THE LOW COUNTRY
THE SMART SCHOOLBOY
VENEZUELA (PASS AWAY TIME IN)


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(origins) Origin: Venezuela (John Jacob Niles) (17)
John Jacob Niles authenticity? (95)
John Jacob Niles on WFDU-FM (17)
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Lyr Req/Add: He Hey! Why Do We Pay? (J J Niles) (7)
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Lyr Req: I Wonder as I Wander (John Jacob Niles) (24)
John Jacob Niles recordings (4)
Lyr Req: Go Way From My Window (7)
Lyr/Chords Req: So We'll Go No More A-Roving (19)
Lyr Req: I Wonder As I Wander (13)
Proselytizing (55)
Lyr/Tune Add: The Deceived Girl -Child9 (1)
Lyr Add: The Smart Schoolboy (Child #3) (1)
Lyr Req: Venezuela (John Jacob Niles) (6)


In Mudcat MIDIs:
Earl Marshall (in DT as Queen Eleanor's Confession)
Queen Eleanor's Confession


Abby Sale 12 Nov 01 - 09:13 AM
Susan of DT 12 Nov 01 - 09:22 AM
GUEST,DMcG 12 Nov 01 - 09:31 AM
John Hindsill 12 Nov 01 - 09:45 AM
MMario 12 Nov 01 - 10:21 AM
Bat Goddess 12 Nov 01 - 10:30 AM
GUEST,MCP 12 Nov 01 - 11:07 AM
Susan of DT 12 Nov 01 - 11:29 AM
GUEST,JohnB 12 Nov 01 - 12:39 PM
Malcolm Douglas 12 Nov 01 - 01:17 PM
Mrrzy 12 Nov 01 - 01:21 PM
Herga Kitty 12 Nov 01 - 02:56 PM
Abby Sale 12 Nov 01 - 03:57 PM
GUEST,MCP 12 Nov 01 - 05:11 PM
Joe_F 12 Nov 01 - 05:44 PM
Barbara 13 Nov 01 - 08:04 AM
Mrrzy 13 Nov 01 - 01:19 PM
Joe Offer 13 Nov 01 - 03:29 PM
Joe Offer 13 Nov 01 - 04:21 PM
MMario 13 Nov 01 - 04:56 PM
Joe Offer 13 Nov 01 - 05:04 PM
Abby Sale 17 Nov 01 - 07:22 PM
Bernard 29 Jul 04 - 08:14 AM
Bernard 09 Aug 04 - 05:35 PM
PennyBlack 02 Mar 05 - 02:15 PM
Bernard 02 Mar 05 - 05:43 PM
chico 18 May 05 - 05:41 PM
MGM·Lion 26 Apr 15 - 02:28 AM
Susan of DT 26 Apr 15 - 07:59 AM
Jim Carroll 26 Apr 15 - 09:42 AM
GUEST,Anne Neilson 26 Apr 15 - 11:32 AM
Mrrzy 26 Apr 15 - 12:33 PM
Jim Carroll 26 Apr 15 - 12:34 PM
GUEST 26 Apr 15 - 03:03 PM
Jim Carroll 26 Apr 15 - 03:16 PM
GUEST,# 26 Apr 15 - 03:22 PM
GUEST,# 26 Apr 15 - 03:38 PM
Anglo 27 Apr 15 - 12:29 AM
Jim Carroll 27 Apr 15 - 04:15 AM
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Subject: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Abby Sale
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 09:13 AM

Would any happen to have a tune for "Queen Eleanor's Confession" (Child #156)? I have it sung by MacColl on Blood and Roses and I think that's the same (and only) tune in Bronson. But it's a weird tune and not all that pleasant. Or even appropriate; although that's really a judgement thing.

It's a very intriguing song one hears about and discusses but never hears sung.

If you can point me to an online example or e-mailable tunefile I'd be most appreciative.

Click for Lyrics in Digital Tradition


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Susan of DT
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 09:22 AM

It's also recorded by Hermes Nye on Early English Ballads and by the Exiles on Hale and Hanged, both old vinyl. I don't remember hearing it on any of my new CDs of ballad singers, but I'll check and post again if I find it.


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: GUEST,DMcG
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 09:31 AM

It's also on Folk Songs of Old England by Tim Hart and Maddy Prior circa 1965! I believe it has been re-issued on CD


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: John Hindsill
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 09:45 AM

Chad Mitchell Trio, "Reflections", Mercury SR6/MG2 20891 contains a very singable version of the song. As the album is from the mid 1960s, it may be hard to find. Don't know if it is on a CD reissue. Also may have undergone a 'folk process' from the original.


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: MMario
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 10:21 AM

I can post the bronson one - probably tonight.


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 10:30 AM

I've been hearing Jay Smith, former owner of The Press Room in Portsmouth, NH, sing it for over 20 years -- the tune he uses is the same as the Tim Hart / Maddy Prior recording (I'm not sure I've heard the MacColl version) and is the only tune I've ever heard connected with it.

Bat Goddess


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Subject: Tune Add: QUEEN ELEANOR'S CONFESSION
From: GUEST,MCP
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 11:07 AM

Abby - this is how it is usually sung (in the folk clubs) in the UK (not so commonly heard these days either). You'll see the tune is essentially the same as the Motherwell tune, and despite 'Motherwell notes that "in singing, the last two lines of each stanza are repeated"', I've never heard it sung that way here.

Mick

(spelling modernised)

Queen/ El-ean-or was a/ si-ck w-o-man
And/ sick just li-ke to/ die
And/ she has sent for two/ fri-ars of France
To/ come to her speed-i-ly//


X: 1
T:QUEEN ELEANOR'S CONFESSION
M:C|
L:1/4
K:G
D|G D G D/D/|G/A/ B/c/ d> B|
c d e/d/ c |B2 z A|G F E F/G/|
A F/E/ D> D|G G/G/ A F| G2 Z |]


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Susan of DT
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 11:29 AM

No, it is not on any of my ballad CDs.


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: GUEST,JohnB
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 12:39 PM

I have not heard the MacColl version. I use the Tim Hart and Maddy Prior tune, I have heard another version by a Sussex (I think) group, which is a very similar tune, words have slight differences. JohnB


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 01:17 PM

The tune in Chappell's Popular Music of the Olden Time is also pretty much the same as the Motherwell tune; apparently a tune was given in Keith's Last Leaves of Traditional Ballads, but that was with a text from Bell Robertson, who didn't sing, so I'm guessing that was the Motherwell one as well (haven't seen it, mind).  Looks like there is only one basic tune for it, and it just varies a little from singer to singer.


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Mrrzy
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 01:21 PM

I have it by Cynthia Gooding on either The Queen of Hearts (I think yes) or Faithful Lovers and Other Phenomena (I think not). Not very melodious, almost a "talking blues" kind of thing, close to spoken. I can't post the tune, but I can sing it...


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 02:56 PM

The first person I heard sing it, round about 1970, was Rosie Hardman, from Manchester. I used to sing it too. I've probably got the notation wrong, but I just played it on the piano as

D G D/G D/GABc/d B/ c d/e dc/b ba/ G F#/E F#G/AGF#E/D D G G/A GF#/G

Kitty


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Abby Sale
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 03:57 PM

Thanks All. Unless someone can find an online example, I guess the only known tune is the Motherwell as printed in Bronson.

Susan: I'd like to hear that one but oh well.

DMcG: Yes, the Hart/Prior is on CD and I've already ordered it from that nutso Camsco outfit.

John: The "Reflections" one is the only one listed at Jane Keefer's good index. But it doesn't seem available

MMario: Thanks for the offer, anyway - I've got Bronson, though. Xeroxed the whole thing.

Mrrzy: Gooding was good. Perhaps we could link with AIM or Paltalk & you'd sing it? That would be an excellent use of those programs. I am "Abby Sale Inc." (but not by choice.)

GUEST,MCP & Herga: Yes, those seem essentially the same as Bronson & McColl. Now I know.

Malcolm: Yes. I guess that's it.

MacColl's rendition is a bit odder since he sings with a young Kirsty MacColl. Seems it was one of her favorite songs when she was age 9 & MacColl thought it only fair to include her.

Thank again.


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: GUEST,MCP
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 05:11 PM

Malcolm - I haven't got the Last Leaves, but you are probably correct about the tune. The Bell Robertson text is published as #208 in Vol 2 of the Greig-Duncan Folk Song Collection (ed Shuldham-Shaw & Lyle) without tune. (Notes say that the 2 texts given were collated for Last Leaves)

Mick


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Joe_F
Date: 12 Nov 01 - 05:44 PM

I stole the tune from MacColl's version in order to be able to sing "The Ballad of Minepit Shaw" by Kipling. It goes pretty well.


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Barbara
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 08:04 AM

Abby, if you want a tape of the Mitchell Trio version, I could post it to you, or I could transcribe it in Mudcat code, or a MIDI, if you're willing to wait a couple weeks (I'm costuming Beauty and the Beast at the moment).
Blessings,
Barbara


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Mrrzy
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 01:19 PM

If I could connect to paltalk - and get a mike that WORKS - I'd do it...


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 03:29 PM

The Hart/Prior recording uses the tune posted above by Mick MCP. Abby says that one matches Bronson and MacColl. I'll make a Noteworthy Composer file of that and submit it to the Digital Tradition. Barbara, is the Mitchell Trio tune different?
I think I'll post the entry from the Traditional Ballad Index, which lists several sources for the tune, including Niles. It will be interesting to see what Niles did with it.
-Joe Offer-

Queen Eleanor's Confession [Child 156]

DESCRIPTION: Queen Eleanor, dying, calls for two friars. King Henry decides to substitute himself and Earl Marshal. Eleanor confesses to many sins against Henry, often with the Earl. Henry reveals himself and wishes that he could tell the world what Eleanor said
AUTHOR: unknown
EARLIEST DATE: 1723
KEYWORDS: trick humorous royalty disease clergy
HISTORICAL REFERENCES:
1189 - Death of Henry II
1204 - Death of Eleanor of Aquitaine
FOUND IN: Britain(Scotland(Aber),England(Lond))
REFERENCES (8 citations):
Child 156, "Queen Eleanor's Confession" (7 texts)
Bronson 156, "Queen Eleanor's Confession" (1 version)
Percy/Wheatley II, pp. 164-168, "Queen Eleanor's Confession" (1 text)
Leach, pp. 431-433, "Queen Eleanor's Confession" (1 text)
PBB 72, "Queen Elenor's Confession" (1 text)
Niles 48, "Queen Eleanor's Confession" (1 text, 1 tune)
BBI, ZN2274, "Queen Elenor was a sick Woman"
DT 156, QECONFES

CROSS-REFERENCES:
cf. "Rosamund Clifford" (subject)
ALTERNATE TITLES:
The Dying Queen
Notes: The element of fiction in this ballad is immense. Note the following:
* Eleanor of Aquitaine (1122-1204) outlived Henry Plantagenet (1133-1189) by fifteen years.
* Neither Earl Marshal nor King Henry took Queen Eleanor's maidenhead; she had previously been married to, and had two daughters by, Louis VII of France.
* Eleanor could hardly have poisoned Henry's mistress Rosamund Clifford; by the time Henry discovered Rosamund, he had placed Eleanor under house arrest.
If one moves the story to the time of Henry III (reigned 1216-1272), who married Eleanor of Provence, we should note that by the time the third Henry grew up, the Marshal earldom was extinct - RBW
File: C156

Go to the Ballad Search form
Go to the Ballad Index Instructions

The Ballad Index Copyright 2000 by Robert B. Waltz and David G. Engle.


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Subject: Lyr/Tune Add: THE DYING QUEEN (Niles)^^
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 04:21 PM

Here's the version from John Jacob Niles. I haven't found any others from American sources, and I guess Niles isn't considered a credible source. Still, it's interesting, and the tune is quite different.
-Joe Offer-

THE DYING QUEEN
(trad/John Jacob Niles)

1. The Queen is sick, and she will die,
Fa-la-le-la, fa-la-le-lu,
The Queen is sick, and she will die,
Send her two preachers speed-ee-lie,
Fa-la-le-la, fa-la-le-lu.

2. The King was one, the Captain `tother,
Fa-la-le-la, fa-la-le-lu,
The King was one, the Captain `tother,
My firstest child was got by another,
Fa-la-le-la, fa-la-le-lu.

3. My daughters were not Henry's get,
Their beauty you could not forget.

4. My second son, I liked him least,
He looks like one who is this priest.

5. I carried pizen in a bag
To pizen them as did me bad.

6. I pizened that fair Price-ee-mond.
She bare the King two little sons.

7. The King took off his preacher's gown
And gave the Captain many a frown.

8. The Queen made moan and died in baid,
She shrieked and cried she was betrayed.


Source: "The Ballad Book of John Jacob Niles"
Niles says he collected this song from an informant near Murphy, North Carolina. The informant asked that her name not be mentioned.

See Child #156 (Queen Eleanor's Confession)

filename[ QECONFE2^^

I goofed. this is not the Niles tune. See below.


MIDI file: QECONFES.MID

Timebase: 192

TimeSig: 2/2 24 8
Key: G
Tempo: 180 (333333 microsec/crotchet)
Text: Produced by AbcMus 1.1
Name: Queen Eleanor's Confession
Start
0576 1 62 064 0192 0 62 000 0000 1 67 064 0192 0 67 000 0000 1 62 064 0192 0 62 000 0000 1 67 064 0192 0 67 000 0000 1 62 064 0096 0 62 000 0000 1 62 064 0096 0 62 000 0000 1 67 064 0096 0 67 000 0000 1 69 064 0096 0 69 000 0000 1 71 064 0096 0 71 000 0000 1 72 064 0096 0 72 000 0000 1 74 064 0288 0 74 000 0000 1 71 064 0096 0 71 000 0000 1 72 064 0192 0 72 000 0000 1 74 064 0192 0 74 000 0000 1 76 064 0096 0 76 000 0000 1 74 064 0096 0 74 000 0000 1 72 064 0192 0 72 000 0000 1 71 064 0384 0 71 000 0192 1 69 064 0192 0 69 000 0000 1 67 064 0192 0 67 000 0000 1 66 064 0192 0 66 000 0000 1 64 064 0192 0 64 000 0000 1 66 064 0096 0 66 000 0000 1 67 064 0096 0 67 000 0000 1 69 064 0192 0 69 000 0000 1 66 064 0096 0 66 000 0000 1 64 064 0096 0 64 000 0000 1 62 064 0288 0 62 000 0000 1 62 064 0096 0 62 000 0000 1 67 064 0192 0 67 000 0000 1 67 064 0096 0 67 000 0000 1 67 064 0096 0 67 000 0000 1 69 064 0192 0 69 000 0000 1 66 064 0192 0 66 000 0000 1 67 064 0384 0 67 000
End

This program is worth the effort of learning it.

To download the latest version of MIDItext and get instructions on how to use it click here

ABC format:

X:1
T:Queen Eleanor's Confession
M:2/2
Q:1/4=180
K:G
D8|G2D2G2DD|GABcd3B|c2d2edc2|B6A2|G2F2E2FG|
A2FED3D|G2GGA2F2|G4||


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Subject: RE: 'Queen Eleanor's Confession' (156) tune
From: MMario
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 04:56 PM

Niles appears to be the same as bronson tunewise...


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Subject: Tune Add: THE DYING QUEEN
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Nov 01 - 05:04 PM

That's because I got 'em mixed up, MMario. I'll post the real one in a few minutes.
-Joe Offer, sheepishly-

This is the Niles tune.

MIDI file: QECONFE2.MID

Timebase: 192

Name: The Dying Queen
Text: By Niles No. 48
Key: G
TimeSig: 2/4 24 8
Tempo: 063 (952380 microsec/crotchet)
Start
0288 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 74 110 0094 0 74 000 0002 1 74 110 0094 0 74 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 76 110 0094 0 76 000 0002 1 74 110 0094 0 74 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 74 110 0094 0 74 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 72 110 0094 0 72 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 74 110 0094 0 74 000 0002 1 74 110 0094 0 74 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 76 110 0094 0 76 000 0002 1 74 110 0094 0 74 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 67 110 0094 0 67 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 72 110 0094 0 72 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 71 110 0094 0 71 000 0002 1 67 110 0094 0 67 000 0002 1 69 110 0094 0 69 000 0002 1 66 110 0094 0 66 000 0002 1 64 110 0094 0 64 000
End

This program is worth the effort of learning it.

To download the latest version of MIDItext and get instructions on how to use it click here

ABC format:

X:1
T:The Dying Queen
M:2/4
Q:1/4=63
K:G
B8|B2A2A2A2|B2d2d2B2|e2d2B2A2|B2d2A2B2|c2B2A2A2|
B2d2d2B2|e2d2B2A2|B2G2A2B2|c2A2B2G2|A2F2E2||


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Subject: Tune Add: QUEEN ELEANOR'S CONFESSION
From: Abby Sale
Date: 17 Nov 01 - 07:22 PM

GUEST,MCP: Last Leaves is a wonderful book and I recommend it. But only if you can get it cheap. As a practical matter it's superceeded since Greig~Duncan includes everything in Last Leaves.

Barbara: Thanks, I'd much like to hear it. Any time you get around to it is jes' fine.

Joe: All true. Thanks for the Niles version. I didn't think to look there.

Here'e the version exactly as in Bronson. I think it sounds the same as you've given but it looks different when you Draw it.
X: 1
T:Queen Eleanor's Confession (#156) (Bronson)
M:C|
L:1/8
Q:140
K:G
D2| G2 D2 G2 DD| G>AB>c d2 B2|
c2 d2 e>d c>B| A4 z2 D2| G2 GF E2 FG|
A2 F2 D2 D>D| G2 GG A2 D2| G4 z2 ||


And, Camsco just delivered the cited Hart/Prior CD today and yes, it is the same tune but I like the way she does it best. Now I just have to learn it.

Thanks again, All. Good song, I think.


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Subject: Rosie Hardman recording?
From: Bernard
Date: 29 Jul 04 - 08:14 AM

Rosie Hardman used to do this song in the late 1960's, and would dearly love to find a recording of her singing it.

She didn't record it in a studio, so she is hoping that someone, somewhere, has a private recording of it in any condition that she could take a copy of, please? It's not for commercial purposes... she is sixty next year, and hasn't toured for over twelve years due to ill health.


She has recently released a CD of records that she made privately, engineered by Bill Leader, at Cecil Sharp House in 1973 with Ian Hunt and a few others, and the album is called 'The Lost Leader'. Dave Bulmer couldn't get his hands on it, because the original tapes belong to Rosie!!

There are eleven tracks:

  • Latin Lady
  • David
  • The Picture On Her Wall
  • How Simple Were Our Pleasures
  • How Bright The Morning
  • In Another Year
  • Somerset Monday
  • Court of the Queen
  • City Ways
  • Sad Eyed Lady Katherine (of the Woodbine Grove)
  • Marazion Sands

Only available direct from Rosie!


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: Bernard
Date: 09 Aug 04 - 05:35 PM

Look here!!


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: PennyBlack
Date: 02 Mar 05 - 02:15 PM

Copy Post from the FydleFolkForum - UK


Hello everyone!

This is just to let everyone know that, following the successful release of 'Eagle Over Blue Mountain' on CD at Xmas, we've just released the second of my Plant Life albums - 'Stopped in My Tracks'.

If anyone is interested please visit my site Here - and check out the Music/News section for details.

Whilst posting - thanks to all my pals from the Folk Scene who sent good wishes for my 60th (grooooooooooan... doesn't time FLY? ) last weekend.

Love from Rosie


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: Bernard
Date: 02 Mar 05 - 05:43 PM

Definitely worth the money!! I've got all three of Rosie's CDs - and am eagerly awaiting the next!!

The clicky seems to have disappeared, so here it is...!


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #1
From: chico
Date: 18 May 05 - 05:41 PM

G                            (D)          C          D
QUEEN ELENOR was a sick woman, and afraid that she should dye;
          G            Am                      G               D    G
Then she sent for two fryars of France, for to speak with them speedily.
The King calld down his nobles all, by one, by two, and by three,
And sent away for Earl Martial, for to speak with him speedily.

When that he came before the King, he fell on his bended knee;
A boon, a boon! our gracious king, that you sent so hastily.'
'I'll pawn my living and my lands, my septer and my crown,
That whatever Queen Elenor says, I will not write it down.

'Do you put on one fryar's coat, and I'll put on another,
And we will to Queen Elenor go, one fryar like another.'
Thus both attired then they go; when they came to Whitehall,
The bells they did ring, and the quiristers sing, and the torches did light them all.

When that they came before the Queen, they fell on their bended knee:
'A boon, a boon! our gracious queen, that you sent so hastily.'
'Are you two fryars of France?' she said, 'which I suppose you be;
But if you are two English fryars, then hanged you shall be.'

'We are two fryars of France,' they said, 'As you suppose we be;
We have not been at any mass since we came from the sea.'
'The first vile thing that ere I did I will to you unfold;
Earl Martial had my maidenhead, underneath this cloath of gold.'

'That is a vile sin,' then said the king, 'God may forgive it thee!'
'Amen! Amen!' quoth Earl Martial, with a heavy heart then spoke he.
'The next vile thing that ere I did, to you I'll not deny;
I made a box of poyson strong, to poyson King Henry.'

'That is a vile sin,' then said the King, 'God may forgive it thee!'
'Amen! Amen!' quoth Earl Martial, 'and I wish it so may be.'
'The next vile thing that ere I did to you I will discover;
I poysoned Fair Rosamond, all in fair Woodstock bower.'

'That is a vile sin,' then said the King, 'God may forgive it thee!'
'Amen! Amen!' quoth Earl Martial, 'and I wish it so may be.'
'Do you see yonders little boy, a tossing of that ball?
That is Earl Martial['s] eldest son, and I love him the best of all.

'Do you see yonders little boy, a catching of the ball?
That is King Henry's son,' she said, 'and I love him the worst of all.
'His head is like unto a bull, his nose is like a boar;'
'No matter for that,' King Henry said, 'I love him the better therefore.'

The King pulld of his fryar's coat, and appeard all in red;
She shriekd and she cry'd, she wrong her hands, and said she was betrayd.
The King lookd over his left shoulder, and a grim look looked he,
And said,Earl Martial, but for my oath, then hanged shouldst thou be.
____________
Collected by Motherwell in 1827.
Eleanor of Aquitaine was a colorful character, but these accusations are unlikely to be true. She was not a virgin when she came to Henry she was the mother of a daughter by her first husband, the King of France. The noble lady would be Rosamund Clifford, a long time mistress of Henry.
Child #156

Notes: The element of fiction in this ballad is immense. Note the following:
* Eleanor of Aquitaine (1122-1204) outlived Henry Plantagenet (1133-1189) by fifteen years.
* Neither Earl Marshal nor King Henry took Queen Eleanor's maidenhead; she had previously been married to, and had two daughters by, Louis VII of France.
* Eleanor could hardly have poisoned Henry's mistress Rosamund Clifford; by the time Henry discovered Rosamund, he had placed Eleanor under house arrest.
If one moves the story to the time of Henry III (reigned 1216-1272), who married Eleanor of Provence, we should note that by the time the third Henry grew up, the Marshal earldom was extinct - RBW


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 02:28 AM

Just came across thi v old thread. If anyone still interested 10 years later, you will find it on my YouTube channel

http://www.youtube.com/user/mgmyer

I got my tune [similar but not identical to the Tim Hart-Maddy Prior version] from Sandy Paton when he was over here in UK in 1958. I think he said he had it from Cynthia Gooding, but I regret I have never managed to hear her version. My words are collated from different versions, but I think I have kept the story coherent.

A somewhat pompous judge at a festival competition where I sang it once criticised me for appearing to think it was a funny song. Isn't it?

≈M≈


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: Susan of DT
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 07:59 AM

Here is a link to the Child Ballad Project, which lists "all" known recordings of each Child Ballad, compiled originally by Elizabeth Anderson, with the help of lots of people, including several mud catters. Here site went down, but is mirrored by Van Dijk, which is still available: Child Ballad Project

You can look up Queen Eleanor's Confession and other Child Ballads in this wonderful resource.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 09:42 AM

Finest rendition of this in my opinion was Gordon McCulloch's on the Topic Record 'The Hale and the Hanged.
Skilfully sung, unobtrusively accompanied - the understated humour still makes it for me
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: GUEST,Anne Neilson
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 11:32 AM

Sleeve notes to The Hale and the Hanged by the Exiles (Enoch Kent, Gordon McCulloch and Bobby Campbell) say that the available tune wasn't attractive to Gordon, so it was set to a tune made by Bobby -- which had also been used for the song The Fairfield Apprentice.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: Mrrzy
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 12:33 PM

The Cynthia Gooding version is also referred to in this thread...


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 12:34 PM

Forgotten about that Anne - Bobby was a very talented musician and a great loss
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 03:03 PM

I'd love to hear Gordon McCulloch's version, but until I find someone with the old LP (which I don't know at all) I probably won't.

As an addendum to the earlier discussion of the tune(s) - the MacColl tune is quite different from Cynthia Gooding's. I asked Peggy about it once, and she didn't really remember it. She said that Ewan probably wrote it.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 03:16 PM

"I'd love to hear Gordon McCulloch's version, "
Enjoy
HALE AND THE HANGED
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: GUEST,#
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 03:22 PM

O, ye of little faith . . .

http://www.christiebooks.com/ChristieBooksWP/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/07%20Exiles%20-%20Queen%20Eleanors%20Confession.mp3


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: GUEST,#
Date: 26 Apr 15 - 03:38 PM

Sorry, Jim. Cross posted.


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: Anglo
Date: 27 Apr 15 - 12:29 AM

Thank you very much Jim - apologies for being unlogged earlier, but I'm the one who wanted to hear it. Gordon uses the first part of the tune only - at least as I know the tune, from Archie.

John Roberts


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Subject: RE: Tune Req: Queen Eleanor's Confession (Child #156)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 27 Apr 15 - 04:15 AM

Whatever the historical veracity of the story, it remains one of my all-time favourite humourous ballads (along with The Duke of Athol's Nurse') - ballad-humour at its very best.
I'm sure you know the film on the relationship between Henry and Eleanor, 'The Lion in Winter' - worth a look if you already haven't - works as a handy visual-image-prompter for the singing of the ballad - for me anyway.
Jim Carroll


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