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BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq
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Subject: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 24 Sep 02 - 08:11 PM Salaa'm Aleikum. It is possible you may wonder about the people over here in the United States of America and what they could possibly be thinking, and what they might want from you and for you. I do not represent any of the people here officially, but I think many of them will have similar feelings to these. I view the current developments between our nations with great concern, for I fear a great wrongness is being built by our leaders, yours and mine alike. If it is allowed to go on, there is a great risk that lives will be ruined. Some will be ruined by death, some by loss, some by the guilt of having violated the most basic commandments of Allah not to destroy fellow humans. It is written in the Qu'uran: "You shall not kill any person - for God has made life sacred - except in the course of justice. If one is killed unjustly, then we give his heir authority to enforce justice. Thus, he shall not exceed the limits in avenging the murder, he will be helped."(17:33). In the Christian's book it is also written: "Thou shalt not kill". The Buddha has likewise spoken on the sacredness of life, that it must not be taken. These things are very much on our minds over here. Aside from that, our minds are on our children, that we can help them leasrn and grow strong and learn to live happy and productive lives, and be of value to others. Our minds are on our husbands and wives, that we can support them in their lives and keep them well. Our minds are on our parents, that we can bring them satisfaction and spare them pain. Our minds are on our various duties, that we can do them well. We worry about the animals and plants around us. We think about time, and love, and worry about our own health, and whether we are well respected, and whether we deserve to be. All these are things that are on our minds, and I suppose that to some degree, your own minds travel on similar roads, seeking to reduce pain among those you love and find ways for them to live well. What do we here in the United States want of you? Seek right actions that will expand peace, not fear; seek to live in the world through wise thought and compassionate speech, not by violence; seek to build, and grow, and sell to others what is valuable to them. What do we want for you? We wish for you to have a free voice, to speak your own mind openly amongst your own kind and among nations without hindrance. We want, for you, a world where dialogue, commerce, the sharing of ideas, help, and the discovery of common goals can be pursued without fear. We want, for you, a world where you can prosper in harmony, raise your children safely, learn and teach, sing and pray and marry without threat, according to the best wisdom you can find. And from you, we wish only the very same things. We hold no ill-will toward any man or woman who wants these things, or who wishes them for others. We seek to help make them possible. However, this desire of ours is not working out well, because of those who promote fear, anger, and stupidity. People in this country promote fear and anger about your country, and people in your country promote fear and anger against ours. The promotion of fear and anger between peoples is itself stupid, and it brings about stupidity, and it blinds those who could otherwise be thoughtful and intelligent and well-spoken. We believe that this practice should end, and we would like to believe that you, too, can see plainly that the promotion of fear and hatred is destructive to both those who do it and those who receive it. So if you will do what you can to put an end to these false pictures of what your fellow-humans are like, we will also. I cannot speak for my official government, or for yours, of course. But I know I can speak for many. Help us, however you can, from wherever you are. We will do likewise in kind. Amos |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: michaelr Date: 24 Sep 02 - 08:34 PM Hear, hear! Well put, Amos. Now let's print up a few million flyers and drop them over Iraq! Oh waidaminnet... they've got that no-flyer zone... Cheers, Michael |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: khandu Date: 24 Sep 02 - 08:37 PM Yes. Amen. khandu |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Little Hawk Date: 24 Sep 02 - 09:15 PM You have spoken for reasonable people everywhere, Amos. Reasonable people do not launch wars, they find common ground to stand upon, and they share the bounty of life and of love with their fellow living beings. I wonder if any Iraquis will get to read your letter? I add my support from Canada. - LH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 25 Sep 02 - 01:04 AM Well, LH, thanks. thought you could start a chain letter out of it and it would find its way over there through one of the local cells, ya know... :>) A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Don Firth Date: 25 Sep 02 - 02:31 AM Well said. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: GUEST,alex Date: 25 Sep 02 - 02:39 AM Well said Amos, now if only Blair, Bush and a few others would agree..... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Teribus Date: 25 Sep 02 - 03:04 AM Very well said! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: GUEST,Boab Date: 25 Sep 02 - 04:23 AM Amos----no-one has ever put it better. It is my opinion that more than one widely read newspaper ---in the UK at least, and probably in the Americas----would be glad to print it, verbatim. Get the real truth out there! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: GUEST,Bullfrog Jones (on the road) Date: 25 Sep 02 - 05:14 AM Agreed -- try taking it to the next level, Amos. You never know! BJ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: BanjoRay Date: 25 Sep 02 - 05:34 AM If Bush ever got to read that, it wouldn't affect him. The only way to get through to him would be to roll it up and shove it up his arse. Cheers |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: alanabit Date: 25 Sep 02 - 07:54 AM Just adding my voice to the chorus which agrees with every word written above. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: sian, west wales Date: 25 Sep 02 - 09:00 AM Send it to the papers, Amos. It needs a wider readership. Best I've read on the subject so far ... sian |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Bobert Date: 25 Sep 02 - 10:01 AM Heck, lets print up about 200 million copies and just drop them on the US. Thanks, Amos, and I hope that some Iraqi reads it and gets it out in his or her country as well. Don't hate, Communicate... Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 25 Sep 02 - 10:04 AM Well, its freely offered, should anyone wish to use it, copy it, or send it to anyone. I have sent it to a few friends; bread upon the waters. Now p'raps we have to wait for the ducks to start nibbling. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Mark Clark Date: 25 Sep 02 - 10:47 AM Thanks, Amos. That goes for me as well. - Mark |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 25 Sep 02 - 01:26 PM I am touched by all the kind remarks. Many thanks. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: RichM Date: 25 Sep 02 - 01:35 PM Anyone in Iraq trying to do what this well-intentioned posting proposes, would end up in prison or worse. Dictators do not tolerate any opposition that threatens their power.
To assume that dialogue with Iraqis is all that is needed, is in my opinion, naive. It's time for western nations to realize that blaming ourselves for all the world's ill isn't realistic, or productive in finding a solution. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: alanabit Date: 25 Sep 02 - 02:24 PM While I have to grant you that there is some truth in your first sentence Rich, I think it is equally naive to assume that the CIA, FBI and other Western "intelligence" agencies are exclusively defenders of freedom and democracy. Anyone with first hand experience of the Prevention of Terrorism Act, The Official Secrets act and The Criminal Justice Act in Britain is unlikely to be convinced that arbitrary imprisonment is the exclusive tool of Middle East dictatorships. While I will concede that retribution for opposition to a government is less dangerous (usually) in the US or Britain, does not that very fact impose more of a responsibility upon us to try and prevent a bloody, cruel, dangerous and unjust war? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Bobert Date: 25 Sep 02 - 02:40 PM And then RichM woke up... The fact that the US has a big appitite for others resources has to be looked at in trying to find solutions to the world's problems. No, we can't go on just consuming and consuming with little or no regard to our neighbors, or even going so far as to placing the blame at their feet. That's as bad as the judge letting the rapist off because the victim looked good. I know you are gonna go to your grave, RichM. thinking that the US can somehow continue to steal and bully folks but it can't. And Americans are going to have to face up to it, sooner or later. It's really pretty simple. Your turn. Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Bobert Date: 25 Sep 02 - 02:42 PM And then RichM woke up... The fact that the US has a big appitite for others resources has to be looked at in trying to find solutions to the world's problems. No, we can't go on just consuming and consuming with little or no regard to our neighbors, or even going so far as to placing the blame at their feet. That's as bad as the judge letting the rapist off because the victim looked good. I know you are gonna go to your grave, RichM. thinking that the US can somehow continue to steal and bully folks but it can't. And Americans are going to have to face up to it, sooner or later. It's really pretty simple. Your turn. Bobert |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 25 Sep 02 - 02:43 PM Rich: I proposed no course of action; simply a different set of ideas about who we are vis-a-vis the ordinary citizens of Iraq (or anywhere else). Ideas like this, which contain more truth than is offered by a totalitarian regime, can become very dangerous weapons in their own right. Witness the role of samizdat in the eventual collapse of the U.S.S.R. In fact, such ideas may be the only weapons available to the ordinary man and woman in Iraq. I certainly do not believe that they freely choose to live under a blindly dictatorial system, do you? A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Mountain Dog Date: 25 Sep 02 - 05:59 PM Well done, Amos. I will pass this along to friends and groups of like-hearted people with whom we are connected. Thank you for taking a stand for peace and understanding. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: DougR Date: 25 Sep 02 - 06:22 PM Amos: I've read your message through several times. I think you have expressed yourself very well, but I'm not sure what you feel, were the Iraqi people ALLOWED to read it, they could do about it. They have little control over their own destiny. Are you suggesting civil war? If so, would that not be promoting what you write that you are against? War? If you are trying to get across to the people of Iraq that a number of people in the United States do not support the President's view, why not just say it? Dear Iraqi People: A large number of my fellow citizens do not agree with what our president is proposing to do to Iraq. Amos Am I missing something here? DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 25 Sep 02 - 06:32 PM Yes, Doug, you are. The power of an idea. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 25 Sep 02 - 06:48 PM From another correspondent who received a copy of the letter at the top of this thread: Thank you for the letter. It truly captures my feelings. War is something that should not be an option in this "advanced" time in history. I feel there is entirely too much ego at work on both sides of the ocean. Jr. Bush trying to clear the family name and be "the man". S. Hussein trying to be the macho man just the same. Are they really any different from one another? I don't know. They're both power-mongers. Maybe they're trying to over-compensate for something that is lacking. Why not just buy a red corvette? Spaw, could you offer an opinion on this? A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Deda Date: 25 Sep 02 - 07:48 PM Amos, it's a great letter and I hope it is disseminated as widely as ever can be. I am concerned that many, many people in Iraq are lacking essentials like potable water and enough food and any barest excuse for medical care -- and it is easier for them to blame their poverty and want on the sanctions and the US gov't than on their own leader, who (A) doesn't care if they live or die, and (B) could cheerfully kill them off for speaking out against him, and (C) is the subject of an endless and ubiquitous series of messages, posters, etc., telling them how wonderful he is. They are in a very tough place, it seems to me, and I can't imagine what options they have. Ideas are indeed very powerful things and I will try to imagine the ideas in your letter winning out over Saddam's maniacal ideas. In the very long run, I have complete faith in the force of positive and loving ideas, but in the short run, bullets have a helluva lot of force, too -- and these people are suffering at the very bottom of Maslow's hierarchy of needs. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 25 Sep 02 - 08:39 PM Maybe we should chip in and buy Saddam a red corvette? A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: GUEST,mg Date: 25 Sep 02 - 09:13 PM I think these notions about Bush getting into this because of the family name etc. are just plain nuts. I think he sees a real threat, and a real people being oppressed and is ready to go where angels fear to tread. I can't say what he should do. I do not believe this is politically motivated. We're damned if we do and damned if we don't. I can see good outcomes either way and really bad ones. Whatever happens I hope it is quick and releases the Iraqui people from their despot and their consequent lives of desparation. Here is my letter: Dear Iraqi people: I hope we don't end up over there, but if we do, trust me, your lives will be much better in the long run. The short run might not be pleasant, but you will be under no more military law than is necessary to control the area and preserve the rights and lives of minority citizens. Cooperation with Allied troops will be in your best interest. mg |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 26 Sep 02 - 09:59 AM I am sure he sees a "real" threat, mg, but I am not sure the threat he sees is the threat that is actually there. I concur with your desires for Iraqi people. I like your letter -- more of a postcard, really. Lets run off a couple of million of 'em. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 26 Sep 02 - 04:07 PM Renew!! A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Gareth Date: 26 Sep 02 - 06:39 PM Amos - a good letter - and one that deserves wider reading - I fear it will not be read in Iraq. Gareth |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Kaleea Date: 27 Sep 02 - 03:36 AM It has always seemed sad to me that politicians declare war & it is the people who have to die. Then after a while, no one really knows what they are fighting & dying for. Land? Oil? Freedom? The people who fight, get wounded & die are not free. They are battle scarred, or dead. The people who do not fight but get caught in the cross-fire are not free. I recall seeing films & reading books as a kid where it was not the people who fought & died. There was that old time way of settling disputes when the leaders of the "opposing" groups had to "duke it out!" The guy who won got to be the leader of everybody. If the winner was a bad guy who was mean to everyone, then some one would step up to challenge the leader & "duke it out" & eventually a better leader would spring forth. Of course, this is fiction. We all know that leaders never actually participate in battles. Where would they plug in the jacuzzi on the battlefield? What if the leader didn't have time to go workout & happened to be a foo-foo? Then, of course, the media which can easily be controlled by a dictator can tell whatever fiction about "righteous indignation, & righteous wars" as desired to get the people angry at the evil foreigners. If the foreigners have killed, then "an eye for an eye & a tooth for a tooth." Thus it goes until an eye for an eye & another eye for another eye until all are blind & cannot see. Scriptures can be interpreted in any way which is desired to prove one's wrongdoings as being righteous. Too bad all those "righteous" dictators & politicians don't practice "right use-ness!" Then when all the scriptures of all the major religions would be read, we might actually remember that we are all human, with the same basic needs & the same basic hopes & dreams for the future of our families, & our childrens' children. Sometimes I wonder what all the peace marches & sit-ins for peace were really all about. Has everyone forgotten? What is peace nowadays but the brief spaces between wars. Perhaps if enough of us refuse to participate in hating other people, right in our own little neighborhoods, then maybe some folks would take that with them to other neighborhoods. Then maybe some folks would refuse to hate others in their own little neighborhoods back home in "the old country." Then maybe . . . Shalom. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Lanfranc Date: 27 Sep 02 - 04:06 AM Even that great war leader, Winston Churchill, conceded that "Jaw, Jaw" is better than "War, War". "Imagine there's no Country, I wonder if we can. Nothing to live or die for, a brotherhood of Man. Imagine all the people living life in peace...." This is a time for us "dreamers" to make our voices heard. Well said, Amos. Named for a prophet, to what extent are you without honour in your own country? Pax vobiscum Alan |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: DougR Date: 27 Sep 02 - 03:07 PM Amos: I mulled your reply to my post over for a few days. "The Power of an Idea." That would indicate to me that you are suggesting to the people of Iraq that freedom might be possible for them if they grasp the moment? If so, would there be a way from them to achieve it without Civil War? Or maybe you are suggesting a huge public protest without going to war? The type of protest that is currently taking place in Washington, D. C., for example. If they followed either course of action, what do you think would be Saddam's reaction to either? I hope you don't feel I am being negative about the letter which so many others are enthusiastic about. In spirit of that statement, I'd like to make a suggestion for exposure that you may, or may not have thought about. Write your state senators and representatives and ask them to have it read on the floor of the Senate or House of Representatives. If that is not possible, perhaps one of them would at least have it entered in the Congressional Record. Just a suggestion. DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 27 Sep 02 - 04:41 PM Thanks, Doug! Interesting idea! My turn to mull, one, two three.... :>) Thanks. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 28 Sep 02 - 09:39 AM From another friend: I couldn't agree more. For me, when I read Orwell back in high school and college, he was giving me fanciful stories like all the other science fiction I filled my head with back then. Now it amazes me as to how prophetic he was. Is this doublethink? 1. Iraq is a dangerous nation with weapons of mass destruction. 2. A military attack on Iraq for "regime change" could be accomplished quickly. Now think both thoughts and do not let your head spin. You're doing very well. Peace, Paul |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull Date: 18 Mar 03 - 04:14 AM refresh, in a few days time british and american soldiers are going to invade your country, be assured that most brits are against this war, all i can do, is apologise on behalf of my country for this.stay safe.john |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: DougR Date: 18 Mar 03 - 12:32 PM And, in the event the invading armies are greeted as liberating heros, John, how then would you address the Iraqi people? DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 18 Mar 03 - 12:56 PM I kinda think you're right there, Doug -- there is a strong element of anti-Saddam sentiment in the South (Shi'ite), a strong elemnt of anti-Sadaam sentiment in the northern Kurdish enclaves, and a strong sense of being strong-armed into amenable silence in a lot of other parts, i imagine; when the threat of torture, rape and "disappearance" is alleviated it will be interesting to see what the voiced opinions of Iraqis are. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: GUEST Date: 18 Mar 03 - 01:06 PM Nice letter - nice statement. PS - Find a hole in the ground as you will need it soon. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 18 Mar 03 - 10:36 PM Guest: Five bucks says I will not. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Boab Date: 19 Mar 03 - 02:45 AM Within the next few weeks [days?]"weapons of mass destruction" will be "found" in Iraq. Probably southern Iraq, as one of today's headlines spoke of "chemical weapons being moved south towards the Kuwaiti border" by Saddam's men. How absolutely blind and stupid those weapons inspectors must have been! Or perhaps much of the world at large can have the "stupid " label applied. Could we please have the inspectors back into Iraq so that the chemical weapons of mass destruction can be immediately checked for Iraqi fingerprints? Yes---such weapons WILL be found. If they are not, the credibilty of certain world [mis]leaders will be forever in question! Watch this space! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: DougR Date: 19 Mar 03 - 03:13 PM So Boab, are you intimating that the only biological or chemical weapons that will be found in Iraq will be those "planted" by the U. S., Great Britain, and the thirty some odd nations that form the coalition of the willing? I will,indeed, as you invite us to, watch the space. DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Willie-O Date: 19 Mar 03 - 03:23 PM Thirty some odd is a good way of putting it...sure is heartwarming to have Estonia and Eritrea there in spirit. And the manufacturing of evidence to suit the purposes of the winning side is not what you'd call a far-fetched idea...something about babies and incubators comes to mind. Willie-O |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: GUEST Date: 19 Mar 03 - 03:30 PM "PS - Find a hole in the ground as you will need it soon." Amos - my lack of clarity is often tasked - I meant the above statement to be a Post Script to your original letter - not to you. My apologies if it was harmful to you - |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: Amos Date: 19 Mar 03 - 03:58 PM No fears, Guest. I seem to be completely unharmed. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Open Letter to the People of Iraq From: GUEST Date: 19 Mar 03 - 11:28 PM Good - I meant you none - |