BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?

Subject: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Joybell
Date: 30 Sep 03 - 11:44 PM

I am sure I'm a Curmudgeon but what is the female equivalent do you think? And what about Old Fart. Seems a bit indelicate for a lady.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Amergin
Date: 30 Sep 03 - 11:48 PM

ah gee...yet another asinine thread...what quality.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Amos
Date: 30 Sep 03 - 11:54 PM

Ahem...Amergin, be a gent, would you, and recall your own offenses in this department over the years? Jeeze...

You may style yourself as you wish, Joybell -- it is perfectly ok to be a curmudgeon if you're bound to act curmudgeonly. But if you prefer, call yourself shrewish, hard-nosed, sharp-tongued, ball-busting and related issues, ill-tempered, foul-mouthed, baggish or vixen-like or trampesque, if it pleases. Only you can say which of these fit your inner self best!!! :>)

A

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Joybell
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 12:03 AM

Thanks Amos, but no I favour something a bit more, well grumpy, but not loud-mouthed. Trampesque is nice. Perhaps Curmudgeonne? I haven't found my inner self yet but I'm sure it's in here somewhere.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Amergin
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 02:17 AM

ah yes....all the asinine threads like my opa dying....oma leaving the house she shared with him for 27 years....or about depression...and medications...and my songs and parodies (not that anyone noticed them)...no worries...you'll never see such asinine crap out of me again...

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 03:10 AM

Til the next posting anyway Amergin! Sometimes asinine is the only way you can express something that affects you deeply.

I have hopes of becoming a curmudgeonne, but there was a term in use in the UK for a while when a programme called 'Waiting for God' was on TV. There was a character in it called Diana Trent who was more curmudgeonly than even Spaw and Clinton. Grumpy old ladies were becoming known as 'Old Trents' rather than old trouts. I want to be a 'Trent' when I get old.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 03:49 AM

Hey! Persons of the feminine gender have been gradually taking over alll the former male preserves. If they take away our "grumpy old men" privileges as well, where will it end? They'll be wanting to take over the tv remote control next, or wanting their own garden sheds,or model train sets...

RtS
(Fully paid up grumpy old fart, veteran curmudgeon and part-time miserable old git)

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Joybell
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 07:15 AM

Thanks Liz, And don't worry Roger I'm really quite happy to take on a new name and leave curmudgeon alone. I just noticed that it was the curmudgeons that I seem to like and agree with. If I bring my own train and the refreshments, and my own much-loved preserved male old git, can I still play?

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Amos
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 09:15 AM

Amergin:

Don't play the victim with me. I have sympathized with you during your hard times, but the asininities I was referring to were the posts where you pretended to be other than you are, asserting that you were a lesbian, for example. I am sorry for your struggles, but you can still tend to your manners.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: artbrooks
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 09:48 AM

I think I'd vote for them both being gender-specific...at least, no gentleman would use either term to refer to a lady!

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 10:34 AM

Nothing in the dictionary about curmudgeon being any more gender specific than grouch. And I'm pretty sure the term does get applied to woemn, especially in the adjectival form, as in "curmudgeonly behaviour".

"Old Fart" - I think in practice that does seem to be men only. I'd hate to speculate why. But why do we never hear about Young Farts?

Anyway Amergin is clearly in a curmudgeonly mood today.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Amos
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 10:47 AM

Well, Amergin is a young fart, and he will get over it. HE was mugged early in life by a passing testosterone molecule. But we love him anyway...

A

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: GUEST,pdc
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 10:53 AM

I think the feminine equivalent may be "crone," but we've taken that word and turned it into meaning "wise old woman." So turn "curmudgeon" if you can. Don't know what you can do with "old fart," however.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 10:54 AM

nasty old wench works for me

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 01:14 PM

You've obviously met my life partner!

Giok [AKA Victor Meldrew]

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: GUEST,pdc
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 02:36 PM

Hey, it's a dirty job, but somebody has to keep curmudgeonly old farts in line, and nasty old wenches are the only ones who can.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: mack/misophist
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 02:38 PM

Just be thankful you're not Jewish. You'd never make it as an 'alter kocker'.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 06:50 PM

But where does anyone get the idea that "curmudgeon" is men only?

This is a bit like saying "why can't we have a special word for women who play the banjo,? Because everyone knows that when you say "banjo player" you must be talking about a man." Just ain't so.

No shortage of female curmudgeons, out in the big world, and here on the Mudcat.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Joybell
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 07:08 PM

What a wonderful gathering of friends, old farts young farts.
Giok will I meet you and your life-partner at the Maldon Folk Festival, here in Australia? I seem to remember you are going to be in the area.
I do like Wench and something attached that means grumpy but lovable and wise. Thank you for welcoming me into the world of Curmudgeoness. I never seriously considered Old Fart, me being a lady and all.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 07:21 PM

Drifting slightly - it always seems strange that the term "bastard" in its demotic sense never seems to be applied to women. For example noone ever seems to refer to Maggie Thatcher as a bastard.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Amos
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 07:31 PM

It's an option that gets overridden by a stronger meme, Kevin -- the bitch meme.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 07:37 PM

That's what I don't like about it. I don't like the word, and it introduces an element of sexism into what should be straightforward vituperation. I feel bitch is a word that can only be used fairly by women.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Joybell
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 07:38 PM

Oh now Mc Grath, I am on solid ground. I was born in the proper old city of Melbourne in 1945 into a menage a trios ( I never can remember how to spell it) My mother, my father and his wife brought me up. I was told I was blessed with TWO mothers. I was named JOY because that's what I was told I was - their JOY.   It does make me an Old Bastard. So there you go. Old Bastard Wench. Lovable Old Bastard Wench.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: GUEST,ozmacca
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 09:01 PM

Hmmm... How about Fartess as a general feminine term? Fartessa for those aspiring to delusions of superiority? Fartiste for those with performing skills? Fartelle for the single? Fartame for the married? And as for a feminine version of Curmudgeon, how about Bitchmurgeon?

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: GUEST,pdc
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 09:05 PM

For a while, when I had a certain (ahem) bit of tummy trouble, I was known around the house as La Grande Farteuse.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Amos
Date: 01 Oct 03 - 10:00 PM

Let's be gallant and call them Les Belles Peteuses Sans Merci.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Joybell
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 06:26 AM

Fartess is very grand sounding. I like all of those. Thanks ozmacca.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 10:13 AM

Our language needs a term like "curmudgeon" to refer to crabby, grumpy, crusty old men specifically because not all old men become crabby, grumpy and crusty. They are the exceptions.

There is no need for a female counterpart to "curmudgeon" because all old women do become crabby, grumpy and crusty. All that's needed is a word for the exceptional woman who somehow remains sweet, kind and endearing as she ages. "Mom" seems to work quite well.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Amos
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 10:45 AM

Beedubya, if I didn't know you, I'd expect you to wake up dead tomorrow. Bled to death from holes poked into his cheeks by a sharp tongue...very sad.

LOL!!!


A

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 10:45 AM

Actually we went around and around on this once, and we came up with a number of options. As I recall, Battle-Axe and Girlmudgeon were popular. At our house, I'm the Geekess or Geezerette.

And boys, boys, boys-- PMs for admonishments, please, not thread posts! (I should have PMed you that myself). :~)

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 11:12 AM

I'd change two words in Bee-dubya-ell's second sentence, so it reads:

"...not all old men become crabby, grumpy and crusty. There are exceptions."

And once again, this has never been a word applied exclusively to male curmudgeons. Just check in any decent dictionary.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 01:19 PM

Will look forward to proving my curmudgeonly credentials when I get to Maldon Joybell. Not long now, take-off on 14th arrival in Melbourne 16th, getting quite excited. Something's running down my leg; I hope it's sweat.
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: GUEST,Kim C no cookie
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 02:37 PM

I like the expression Old Bat, and use it to refer to myself often, now that I am over 35. People argue with me about it, but sometimes I do feel like an Old Bat.

Victor Meldrew! I love that show. One of my favorite episodes is when they get stuck in the traffic jam. My PBS station just aired it last weekend.

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 03:30 PM

Another one, "Strong-Minded Woman." That's one I hear in the farm-country community where we live.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 03:53 PM

Old Trout is another...

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: Don Firth
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 04:22 PM

Curmugeonette? Well . . . maybe. Nah! But then again. . . .

Actually, I go along with Liz the Squeak. "Old Trent." Lord, but Diana Trent was a nasty old broad, but she was delightfully outrageous in her nastiness and she was right on point most of the time. The world really needs more Diana Trents.

Quotes from Diana Trent:--

"Ha haha! What a wonderful day! Violence! Excitement! Blood all over the carpet! And a moral victory to boot! Haha! What are we going to do now?!"   

"Let's take our clothes off and walk naked down the beach carrying placards saying 'Look, young people! We are your future!'"

Scroll down and try some of the sound clips

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Curmudgeon and Old Fart Gender-spefic?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 02 Oct 03 - 04:39 PM

Old Bat is what I call my Mother, and that's being kind too!!
Giok