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Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson

DigiTrad:
HOUSE CARPENTER
THE DEMON LOVER
THE HOUSE CARPENTER (II)


Related threads:
Lyr Req: Demon Lover in New England? (182)
(origins) Origins: Question about a verse in 'Daemon Lover' (8)
Joe Rae's Daemon Lover (4)
(origins) Origin: House Carpenter (27)
Lyr Req: House Carpenter (#243 - Jean Ritchie) (17)
Pentangle's House Carpenter (8)
Lyr Req: cyril tawney's carpenter's wife (#243) (18)


Roberto 29 Apr 04 - 04:10 AM
Malcolm Douglas 29 Apr 04 - 12:21 PM
GUEST,MMario 29 Apr 04 - 12:29 PM
GUEST,MMario 29 Apr 04 - 12:45 PM
Malcolm Douglas 29 Apr 04 - 12:48 PM
GUEST,MMario 29 Apr 04 - 12:55 PM
masato sakurai 29 Apr 04 - 12:58 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 29 Apr 04 - 03:31 PM
Malcolm Douglas 29 Apr 04 - 03:40 PM
GUEST, NOMADman 29 Apr 04 - 07:44 PM
Roberto 30 Apr 04 - 11:32 AM
MMario 30 Apr 04 - 11:36 AM
Roberto 01 May 04 - 04:48 AM
GUEST,socratesthekid 02 Feb 08 - 12:22 AM
masato sakurai 02 Feb 08 - 02:32 AM
GUEST,Blueuke08 25 Feb 10 - 11:54 AM
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Subject: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: Roberto
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 04:10 AM

I'd like to get the text of the ballad number 243 in Child in the versions recorded by PEARL JACOBS BORUSKY, Wisconsin, 1940 (Well Met, My Old True Love) and by CLAY WALTERS, Kentucky, 1937 (The Ship Carpenter). They should be both on Bronson's collection. By the way, is Bronson's collection available at the moment, and at what cost? Thanks. Roberto


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 12:21 PM

Both are in Bronson, but I don't have that bit at the moment and need to spend some more time at the photocopier. Original editions are prohibitively expensive nowadays, though you can get "print on demand" copies at a more sensible (though still not small) price. There is to be a reissue on CDROM, perhaps at the end of this year; but the Child CDROM from the same publisher appeared a year behind schedule, so I'm not holding my breath, and continue with photocopying trips to the library.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 12:29 PM

Bronson 243.88 is fro Mrs. M. G. Jacobs of Bryant Wisc - "learned from her mother" - it that the one you want?
"Well Met, Well Met, My Old True Love


Clay Walters did two versions it seems - Bronson has them as 243.13 and 243.78

Which did you want?


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE SHIP CARPENTER
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 12:45 PM

okay - it appears Bronson 243.78 should be one of the one's you want at least...

THE SHIP CARPENTER
Sung by clay Walters, Salyersville, Ky 1937

Collected by Alan and Elizabeth Lomax

Well me, well met, my one true love
Long I've been searching for thee
I've been all across the salt roaring sea
And it's all for the sake of thee.

Ph, I could have married the king's daughter fair
She all the same would have had me
But I refused that rich crown of gold
And it's all for the sake of thee

If you could have married the king's duaghter dear
I'm sure that you are to blame
For I wouldn't have my husband to hear tell of thee
For ten thousand pounds of gold.

Oh, I am married to a ship carpenter
And a ship carmenter I obey
And by him I have a little son
Or I would go along with thee.

What have you to maintain me on?
Is it houses, land, gold, and fee?
I've senven loaded ships a-sailing on the sea
Besides the one that brought me to land

She picked up her baby all in her arms
And kissed it sweetlie embraced
and laid it down on a soft bed of down
and bid it go to sleep

As they walked down by the seashore
The water it set running so bold
The sides was lined with silver so bright
And the top was the purest of gold.

As they sailed all on the sea
The music did seem so sweet
She thought of her babe she had left behind
And set herself down to weep.

are you weeping for my gold, said he?
Are you weeping for fee?
Or are you weeping for some other man
That you love far better than me?

I'm not a-weeping for your gold
Neither am I a-weeping for fee
But I'm weeping to return to dry land again
My poor little babe to see.

If you had ten thousand pounds of gold
And would give it all unto me
You never should return to dry land again
Your babe you never will see

What hills, what hills, my own true love,
That look so white like snow?
It's the hills of Heaven, my own true love
Where all righteous people go.

What hills, what hills, my own true love,
that look so dark and low?
It's the hills of Hell, my own true love
where you and I must go.

Straight news, straight news to the ship carpenter
Staright news come back to the land
The ship that his own dear wifee sailed in
Went sinking to the sand.

Sailors may be the worst of men
That lead poor women astray
The sailor has ruined the ship carpenter
By deluding his poor wife away.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 12:48 PM

Mrs Pearl Jacobs Borusky (Wisconsin), Bronson III p.103 (Bronson doesn't index variant numbers, and Roud doesn't include III and IV yet).

Also transcribed in Harry B Peters, Folksongs out of Wisconsin, 1977, 109-110.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 12:55 PM

sorry - don't have that one.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: masato sakurai
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 12:58 PM

Both are on Child Ballads Traditional in the United States (II), edited by Bertrand H. Bronson (Library of Congress AAFS L58) [LP].


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Subject: Lyr Add: WELL MET, WELL MET, MY OLD TRUE LOVE
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 03:31 PM

Seems to be this one, Mrs. M. G. Jacobs, Wisc., 13 verses, 243, 88.

"WELL MET, WELL MET, MY OLD TRUE LOVE"

Well met, well met, my old true love,
Well met, well met, said he.
I have just returned from the salt, salt sea;
And 'twas all for the sake of thee,
And 'twas all for the sake of thee.

I once could have married a king's daughter fair,
And she would have married me.
But I refused that rich crown of gold,
And it's all for the sake of thee.

If you could have married a king's daughter fair
I'm sure you're much to blame,
For I am married to a house carpenter,
And I think he's a fine young man.

If you'll forsake your house carpenter
And go along with me,
I will take you where the grass grows green,
{On the banks of the Sweet Willee}
{On the banks of the Sweet Liberty.}

If I forsake my house carpenter
And go along with thee,
What have you got for my support,
And to keep me from slavery?

I have six ships sailing on the sea,
The seventh one at land,
And if you'll come and go with me
They shall be at your command.

She took her babe into her arms
And gave it kisses three,
Saying, Stay at home, my pretty little babe
For to keep your father company.

She dressed herself in rich array
To exceed all others in the town,
And as she walked the streets around
She shone like a glittering crown.

They had not been on board more than two weeks,
I'm sure it was not three,
Until she began to weep
And she wept most bitterly.

Are you weeping for your houses and your land,
Or are you weeping for your store,
Or are you weeping for your house carpenter
You never shall see any more?

I'm not weeping for my house nor my land,
Nor I'm not weeping for my store,
But I'm weeping for my pretty little babe
I never shall see any more.

They had not been on board more than three weeks,
It was not four I'm sure,
Until at length the ship sprung a leak,
And she sank to arise no more.

A curse, a curse to all sea men!
A curse to a sailor's life!
For they have robbed me of my house carpenter
And taken away my life.

Good riddance, I say.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 03:40 PM

Interesting; but not the text Roberto was looking for. See my earlier note; MMario has the abridged edition and mis-identified the singer.


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Subject: Lyr Add: WELL MET, MY OLD TRUE LOVE
From: GUEST, NOMADman
Date: 29 Apr 04 - 07:44 PM

Bronson's Text #103, titled "WELL MET, MY OLD TRUE LOVE" sung by Mrs. Pearl Jacobs Borusky, Antigo, Wisc., 1940, collected by Robert F. Draves - from Bronson Vol. 3, p 476.

Well met, well met, my old true love
Well met, well met said he
I have just returned from the salt, salt sea
And it's all for the sake of thee.
And it's all for the sake of thee.

I once could have married a king's daughter fair
And she would have married me
But I refused that rich crown of gold
And it's all for the sake of thee.
And it's all for the sake of thee.

If you could have married a king's daughter fair
I'm sure you are much to blame
For I am married to a house carpenter
And I think he's a fine young man.
And I think he's a fine young man.

If you'll forsake your house carpenter
And go along with me
I will take you where the grass grows green
On the banks of the sweet Willie.
On the banks of the sweet Willie.

If I forsake my house carpenter
And go along with thee
What have you got for my support
And to keep me from slavery?
And to keep me from slavery?

I have six ships upon the sea
And the seventh one at the land
And if you come and go with me
They shall be at your command.
They shall be at your command.

She took her babe into her arms
And gave it kisses three
Saying, stay at home my pretty little babe
To keep your father company.
To keep your father company.

She dressed herself in rich array
To exceed all others in the town
And as she walked the streets around
She shone like a glittering crown.
She shone like a glittering crown.

They had not been on board more than two weeks
I'm sure it was not three
Until one day she began to weep
And she wept most bitterly.
And she wept most bitterly.

O are you weeping for your houses or your land?
Or are you weeping for your store?
Or are you weeping for your house carpenter
You never shall see any more?
That you never shall see any more?

I'm not weeping for my houses or my land
Nor I'm not weeping for my store
But I am weeping for my pretty little babe
I never shall see any more.
I never shall see any more.

They had not been on board more than three weeks
It was not four, I am sure
Until at length the ship sprung a leak
And she sunk to arise no more.
And she sunk to arise no more.

A curse, a curse to all seamen
And a curse to a sailor's wife
For they have robbed me of my house carpenter
And have taken away my life.
And have taken away my life.

Regards,
John


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: Roberto
Date: 30 Apr 04 - 11:32 AM

Thank you all very very much. Just a little problem in the 6th stanza of Clay Walters' version that MMario put on the thread: "And kissed it sweelie embraced" (?). Thank you again. R


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: MMario
Date: 30 Apr 04 - 11:36 AM

sorry - should be "sweetlie"


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE HOUSE CARPENTER (from Daithi Sproule)
From: Roberto
Date: 01 May 04 - 04:48 AM

Daithi Sproule's recording of Child #243 based on Pearl Jacobs Borusky's version.


THE HOUSE CARPENTER
Daithi Sproule (with Liz Carroll, fiddle), A Heart Made of Glass, Green Linnet GLCD 1123, 1993.

Well met, well met, my old true love
Well met, well met - cried he
I have just returned from the salt, salt sea
And it's all for the sake of thee
And it's all for the sake of thee

Well, I could have married a king's daughter fair
I'm sure she'd have married me
But I refused her rich crown of gold
And it's all for the sake of thee
And it's all for the sake of thee

Well, if you could have married a king's daughter fair
I'm sure you are to blame
For I am married to a house carpenter
And I think he's a fine young man
And I think he's a fine young man

Well, if I should forsake my house carpenter
And go along with thee
What have you got for my support
To keep me from slavery?
To keep me from slavery?

I have six ships upon the sea
And the seventh one nigh to land
And if you come and go with me
They would all be at your command
They would all be at your command

So she's dressed herself in such rich attire
To exceed all others in the town
And as she walked the streets around
She shone like some glittering crown
She shone like some glittering crown

Then she's taken her baby in her arms
And given him kisses three
Saying - Stay at home my pretty little babe
And keep your daddy company
And keep your daddy company

They had not been on board but just two weeks
I'm sure it was not three
Until this lady she began for to weep
And she wept most bitterly
And she wept most bitterly

Well, are you weeping for your house or your land?
Or are you weeping for your store?
Or are you weeping for your house carpenter
That you never shall see any more?
That you never shall see any more?

No, I'm not weeping for my house nor my land
Nor I'm not weeping for my store
But I am weeping for my pretty little babe
That I never shall see any more
That I never shall see any more

They had not been on board but just three weeks
It was not four, I am sure
Until at last the ship sprung a leak
And it sunk to arise no more
And it sunk to arise no more

A curse, a curse to all seamen
And a curse to a sailor's life
You have taken from me my pretty little babe
And now you have taken my life
And now you have taken my life


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: GUEST,socratesthekid
Date: 02 Feb 08 - 12:22 AM

Just as a point of curiosity... Anyone know what "the sweet willie" is? I've also heard of the line being "sunny Italy" or "Shores of Italy"

Just curious as to the mutation of it


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: masato sakurai
Date: 02 Feb 08 - 02:32 AM

Liner notes with transcriptions in Child Ballads Traditional in the United States, edited by B.H. Bronson, are at Voices from the Dust Bowl: The Charles L. Todd and Robert Sonkin Migrant Worker Collection, 1940-1941. Page images are combined with those of Anglo-American Shanties, Lyric Songs, Dance Tunes and Spirituals. See pp. 4-23.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Child 243 on Bronson
From: GUEST,Blueuke08
Date: 25 Feb 10 - 11:54 AM

I just heard a variant on this on Pop Wagner's show.
Played with autoharp accompaniment. Album Inside Dave N. Ronk.
Some of the verses are left out or differently arranged.
FYI, sweet Willie drowned on the dewey dens of the Yarrow in another song. I think he may have ended up in here by folk accident.


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