Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: The DeanMeister
Date: 10 May 04 - 11:18 AM

Wonder if it's the same troll that made a complete bollocks-up of the Punch the Horse threads? Bloody nuisance.

Keep at it, jOhn.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Skipjack K8
Date: 10 May 04 - 11:20 AM

All this talk of tits and knockers is making me come over unnecessary.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Sir Roger de Beverley
Date: 10 May 04 - 11:26 AM

At least you haven't been accused of playing with yourself (I do hope he meant by my myself)

R

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 10 May 04 - 11:26 AM

jOhn, you might have three from Gainsborough on 3rd June if I can cadge a lift wi' t'other two (who, if I'm not mistaken, are my usual partners in crime). Hope to see you then.
Johnny :0)

And ignore that soprano castrato GUEST. If he had any balls at all he'd identify his miserable self. It takes a flamer to know one.
J :0)

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Rasener
Date: 10 May 04 - 11:29 AM

Strollin'
Just make sure they let you through the blockade coming home. You musn't miss Bill and Dave :-)

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Nick
Date: 10 May 04 - 02:59 PM

Keep going if it gives you and others pleasure, you're bound to get times when it doesn't work but the good times (hopefully) should outweigh the bad. From other threads here it suggests that you have had some good evenings - that alone suggests that it is worth persevering.

I hope the following is of some use, I hope it is not too long.

In September 2002 four of us started music on a Wednesday night in our local pub in North Yorkshire - I'm not sure if it's a folk club or not. The village is tiny (20-30 houses) and the pub relies on people travelling to it. Since then we have had music every week apart from one week when the snow was too bad to get to the pub and even then the one player who lives in the village played some music with the landlord. There are rarely less than ten of us and rarely more than 20 but it merrily goes on week by week with a nucleus of the same people and others coming and going. When we started we guessed that we might manage to keep it going perhaps once a month for a short while - the reality has been very different.

It was advertised early on once in the Easingwold advertiser (a VERY local paper) but apart from that has relied on word of mouth and being found by people. A high percentage of those who come once come again with varying degrees of regularity but the nucleus come, I think, because it has become a genuine highlight of the week. Just about everyone who comes plays or sings, though at least half of us have never done anything quite like this before and I doubt would have previously gone and performed at a folk club. It is very inclusive and encourages everyone to have a go if they want to and over time I think a number of us have been surprised to find ourselves doing things I doubt we would have done a year ago (eg I never thought I would sing in public!). We start at about 8.30 to 9 and we get thrown out when the landlord wants to close (which is of course bang on closing time *cough*) but I can rarely think of an evening when we haven't wished for the evening to extend for just one more song - perhaps that's what makes us come back the next week. As it can take the best part of an hour sometimes to go round the group and sing another song (you can feel a hint of tension on multi-versed songs sometimes) we have not really felt the need to advertise or push for lots more people, though everyone who does find us is always welcome, and new people always seem to make us improve or try a little harder.

We have had three outside artists over the eighteen months - Last Nights Fun to a packed pub, Marie Little and Dylanesque (a Dylan tribute band who wrote a very nice reaction to the audience on their web site after they played (!) Dylanesque Web site down in the bottom corner - I thought the band rather than the audience usually got reviewed) but mostly it has relied and thrived upon the fact that we really enjoy ourselves and want to do it, and everything else is a bonus on top.

Each week we wonder who or what will turn up and generally get pleasantly surprised that it just keeps on rolling. These days we would probably just play anyway even if there were two or three of us.

We are a mixed bunch with a range of musical tastes but we seem to tolerate each others tastes and encourage each to perform and contribute - four are unaccompanied, traditional Cecil Sharp/Copper family/Watersons type folk fans, one sings his own songs, a fiddle player (sorry violinist who is growing into a fiddle player much to his pleasure!) with some jigs and reels, a Tom Lehrer fan with a taste for the macabre, a touch of James Taylor here, a bit of everyone singing favourite Fairport things and a little jazz occasionally. Some would stand up and sing anywhere in front of anyone with minimal nerves, some of us find it much harder. Are we any good? It varies - but doesn't seem to matter too much or stop us encouraging each other. Definitely half of us have grown much better over the time, some would easily hold a spot at any folk club I have been to and one who comes occasionally has played at a festival or two. What is great is that all these abilities and tastes can co-exist.

We have few rules and the only problem I can think of - apart from a bit of tension with a few of the users of the pub about 9 months ago who seemed determined to show how much noise they could make in the main bar on a Wednesday (now no longer a problem) - was the mandolin/banjo player whose idea of tastefully joining in was to play a different tune in a different tempo in a different key (ideally about one and a quarter semitones from the key the other performer was playing in). Hide like a rhinoceros as well, but there you go.

I think overall we know what we set out to achieve, which is to enjoy ourselves, to hopefully improve and to try and make a range of music which gives pleasure to ourselves the performers and (secondarily) to anyone else who wants to listen. Mostly those who come, come to participate.

The pub is a lovely pub, it has a great landlord and a pint of bitter is £1.22 (though the last is just icing on the cake). We are not attempting to be like the Black Swan in York which has an excellent Folk Club with artists like Bob Fox, Roy Bailey, Dick Gaughan appearing - we raise four own money within the pub to pay for the few outside artists we have had so it is not too practical to fund as we do not charge for anything we have put on outside of raffle/bucket.

It's strength is that it is friendly, welcoming and relaxing to come and play and be. For my part it is a highlight to the middle of the week and a great thing to look forward to. Sometimes when I have thought that it was getting a bit samey or 'flat' and that we ought to broaden it someone turns up out of the blue or that certain magic thing happens and makes for an evening that keeps me smiling through Thursday (as an aside if you could bottle it and sell it at will, god, how rich would I be? LOL)

I'll give you a few of my thoughts and memories as I sit here which make the (minimal) organisation and the (very minimal) stress of wondering whether people will come worthwhile -

* A totally spontaneous reggae/calypso version of the Wild Rover to the tune of the Banana Boat song
* About 7+ hours of music on New Years eve
* The look of pleasure on the violinist's face on his first convincing 'squawk'
* Nice harmonies and a full sound of people enjoying singing
* The applause when one of us who finds it harder to perform does something which comes out half decent
* The surprise at finding an incredibly able whistle player who no-one even knew played
* The joy when someone totally new visits, plays and then comes back having enjoyed the welcome and the evening
* Occasionally having two or three people as an audience who enjoy themselves and stay AND come back

If you get anything like the above from what you have set out to do then it's got to be worthwhile keeping it going. Hopefully you may sense from this post that I get a lot of fun out it personally.

Best of luck - if you are ever over these parts get in touch and you would always be welcome, as would anyone.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Nick
Date: 11 May 04 - 11:37 AM

Whoops, have I walked into another wind up thread?

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: el ted
Date: 11 May 04 - 11:44 AM

Nick,
    No, this isn't a wind up. No one has replied because we are all still reading through your enormous post.
                         cheers
                     flamenco, the true path,
                      el ted

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Sweetfia
Date: 11 May 04 - 02:10 PM

Well, that 'speed reading' course I did back at school came into use.

Well said tho' Nick, definately some sound advise there.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: greg stephens
Date: 11 May 04 - 02:34 PM

Nick_: thanks for the inspiring account of your pub nights. Sounds just the sort of place I like going to. And I bet you sing really long songs too!

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Nick
Date: 11 May 04 - 02:54 PM

No. Short. (Brevity = future watchword.)

Come visit next time you are wandering.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST
Date: 11 May 04 - 03:03 PM

in a word, yes it is rubbish.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: s6k
Date: 11 May 04 - 05:55 PM

in a word, muppet

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: breezy
Date: 11 May 04 - 07:39 PM

where's Easingwold then?

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Nick
Date: 11 May 04 - 07:51 PM

About 10 miles north of York. The pub itself is in a tiny village called Farlington. As long as you don't all come and overwhelm it in one go (lol) there are details at the beginnings of a website I will one day get round to doing at Blacksmiths Arms and there are a few pictures from a couple of weeks ago (hopefully no-one minds being seen) at Pic1, Pic2, Pic3, Pic4. Quality of pix poor as trying out a camera and they are fairly compressed.

Not really an unashamed plug as I don't think we'd cope with loads of visitors in one go!

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: JennyO
Date: 11 May 04 - 10:56 PM

Love that last picture, Nick. With that lighting, it is sort of a work of art. And everybody looks so blissed out in that one.

Jenny

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: el ted
Date: 12 May 04 - 03:38 AM

Hey nick, your spot looks well worth a visit, useful plug that my man.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Nick
Date: 12 May 04 - 04:27 AM

Oh dear, guilty of thread banditry.

I'll check with the landlord tonight that he is ok with me promoting things a bit and start a separate thread to 'get us on the map' and leave this one alone. Sorry jOhn :(

(El Ted - (noticing the flamenco reference earlier) You're not the guy who played some flamenco stuff at the Globe at Guisborough? If so I much enjoyed your playing. If not, perhaps it's a pleasure to come!)

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST,KJ
Date: 12 May 04 - 04:31 AM

Hooray! CT

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Beardy
Date: 12 May 04 - 04:35 AM

s6k I think you're being unfair to muppet. He would use his ID and not post anonymously.

Perhaps you should use other 6 letter words. Leslie Grantham has a useful vocabulary. Wanker is quite good.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: s6k
Date: 12 May 04 - 05:47 AM

i didnt know there was a catter called muppet!

in that case i change my one word to TOSSER!

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST,Jane.
Date: 12 May 04 - 06:28 AM

From what I've read about this venture it seems to be an empty room where people can come and perform if they have nothing else to do, no resident singers or musicians, no guest artists, nothing to attract an audience at all, apart from the small circle of people who inhabit the various Hull threads on this forum, who also don't seem to be regular visitors. I think a folk club is more than that, sorry to be critical. Breezy seems to have the right idea, and Nick's session looks very inviting.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Sweetfia
Date: 12 May 04 - 06:30 AM

Nick, El Ted is the guy who goes round playin Flameno at folk clubs...sorry, it's my fault, i don't mean to bring him he just toddles along...!

(hehehe *bgrin*)

Oh, and I noticied my spelling mistake earlier; it should read advice, not advise! (Yes I know it's not a spelling site but I just had to correct it!)

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: el ted
Date: 12 May 04 - 07:08 AM

yo nick, yes, that was me at The Globe.Cheers.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: greg stephens
Date: 12 May 04 - 08:09 AM

"empty room where people can come and perform if they've nothing else to do". Sounds like a reasonable working definition of a folk club to me. All I can say is, the club under discussion was a place I went to one night in April when I had nothing else to do, and I had a lovely evening. Thanks especially to the singing of Sweetfia and the playing of el ted, who have contributed here.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: el ted
Date: 12 May 04 - 08:26 AM

Bloody ell I'm blushing!

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Pied Piper
Date: 12 May 04 - 08:35 AM

I think what the club needs is a regular performance of jOhn's jiggling.
PP

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Sttaw Legend
Date: 12 May 04 - 08:42 AM

El Ted and Sweetpea otherwise known as "Mick Tomlinson Experience" a pleasure to listen to. Good luck Ted with your sponsorship deal recently won from nail varnish distributor Estee Lauder.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: s6k
Date: 12 May 04 - 09:09 AM

always knew he was a fairy.. ;)

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Nick
Date: 12 May 04 - 09:28 AM

>>... it seems to be an empty room where people can come and perform ... no resident singers or musicians, no guest artists, nothing to attract an audience at all, apart from the small circle ... I think a folk club is more than that, sorry to be critical. Breezy seems to have the right idea, and Nick's session looks very inviting.

It was why I posted originally. Just because I believe there IS room for a range of different sorts of venue. I think we are probably a folk club in our pub but not a Folk-Club-with-capital-letters like Breezy's Folk Club or the Black Swan in York etc etc. We have no resident singers, no guest artists... just us. But one looks very inviting and one doesn't?

We are very happy as we are as we have no urge to be a major folk venue - it is not feasible and nor would any of us involved relish the work involved. There is no illusion that people SHOULD like it or come or support it, people come because they want to.

As I said in the 12 volume version above it is very doubtful that at least 50% of us here would have thought of going and performing at a Folk Club. Listen - yes, perform - no. So we have created something that very much satisfies our needs and that is probably why it works and keeps going. It is also part of the fun that some us have now started considering venturing out a little further and seeing if we could play outside of our cosy safe shell! (Not got far yet. Far too uncomfortable/shy at Guisborough but we may try on May 22 either at the folk day in the Black Swan in York or may even get to the Yorkshire gathering) It is a bonus that (rarely) people come and listen, but then it's not what it was set up for.

If you have a 'small circle of people' that's a good start. But if you want to create a Folk Club like the ones praised regularly in Mudcat I wish you luck - I would guess you are looking at a considerable expenditure of time and effort way out of line with anything I personally could envisage taking on.

But at 8.30 tonight in Farlington it will just be an empty room. And either it will be busy or not... *shrug*

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST,Jim Murray.
Date: 12 May 04 - 11:29 AM

When three people turn up to a FOLK CLUB, John's definition, not mine, which has been running for nine months, in a city we are constantly told is a hotbed of folk music, then something is wrong.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Nick
Date: 12 May 04 - 11:51 AM

True... but, if you're an optimist you at least believe there's hope! There could be less than three.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 12 May 04 - 04:55 PM

'constantly told is a hotbed of folk music' - who said that then? I think you are misconstruing. There are a lot of 'catters in the area, and a lot of them are singers and/or musicians. There are two very successful traditional folk clubs in the area, who attract large crowds.

Some of us aren't really folk club people, but prefer sessions. I support jOhn's efforts at the Marlborough because he's a good mate, but if it became another successful folk club with guests and floorspots I'd probably stop going. But then he wouldn't need me anyway.

I suppose because there is plenty going on in the area (although not necessarily within the city itself) it's proving difficult to get another venue up and running.

The monthly Black Boy session is this Sunday at 2pm. This session has been in danger of stopping but Maggie and I have asked for it to be continued. So see you there lads and lasses for songs and tunes and everything else.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: el ted
Date: 13 May 04 - 03:35 AM

Les,
   Where is The Black Boy? Is it on the old high street? We could pop along to that one quite easily.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST,Hugh Jampton
Date: 13 May 04 - 04:38 AM

Les,
    Why would you stop going to the club if it booked guest singers and musicians who are superb artists in their field? There is so much to learn and enjoy and it can also be an inspiration for your own performance.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST,Greg Willis
Date: 13 May 04 - 07:19 AM

Trolls and flamers feed off the posts of those who attack them. There's an awful lot of troll food on this site, so you've only got yourselves to blame for their increasing numbers by providing a troll banquet. Don't feed them and they'll go elsewhere for sustenance.

I've noticed that John from Hull's posts seem to attract a lot of derogatory comments from 'GUESTS'. Some of you obviously know him personally, and are quick to come to the defence of a friend, which is admirable, but surely even you as his friends can see how some his posts are open to ridicule and so become a troll magnet. Anyone who starts a thread called 'Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?' should realise they are not going to get entirely serious responces. A site that allows people to post as anonymous guests is open to abuse even more than most, so members just have to ignore trolls and flamers as much as possible, and accept that John's posts are likely to get many abusive 'GUEST' replies. I've also noticed that derisive comments directed at John from guests seem to upset John's friends much more than they upset John himself. Perhaps it's best left to John to reply to his critics. This way there would be a lot less trolling.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST,Jesus Martini
Date: 13 May 04 - 07:27 AM

We had 11 people at the Farlington Folk Club last night and it was very pleasant.

Sometimes we get people coming from as far away as Halifax - Hull is nearer than that so why not come and join us one evening - Wednesdays 8.30 for 9.00 pm or whenever?

Jesus Martini

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: el ted
Date: 13 May 04 - 08:31 AM

I am tempted to pop up one week jesus, but when I looked Farlington up on my AA map it said " Danger Cannibal country"

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST,Jesus Martini
Date: 13 May 04 - 08:45 AM

El Ted

Just make sure you come to the right Farlington. There is one near Portsmouth which is where some foreign truck drivers think they are when they visit us.

But it sounds like you have got the right one!

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 13 May 04 - 09:05 AM

Hugh - don't get me wrong, it's just that I'm not much of a 'sit and listener', I'm much happier as a 'joiner-in'. It took me years to discover that. I was a regular 'sit and listener' at Folk Union One at the Bluebell in Hull, although there would usually be lots of chorus stuff to join in with. As for my own performance, well almost anything could improve that. Also, since taking early retirement, I have to choose my nights out quite carefully. Hasn't live music got expensive?

El Ted - yes it's the one in High Street, the quite famous one with the lovely room at the front with the great acoustics. If you come, I'll let you play with my bouzouki!

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Sweetfia
Date: 13 May 04 - 09:06 AM

Don't tell him that Les...he'll want to buy one!

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST,Simon Oakes.
Date: 13 May 04 - 08:58 PM

John from Hull has contributed more abusive comments on this site than most, little wonder he attracts trolls.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: harpmaker
Date: 13 May 04 - 09:27 PM

Quote; Nil Bastardo Carborundum. Thanks Jenny!

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: el ted
Date: 14 May 04 - 10:09 AM

I will be down to tickle your bouzouki Les. I have permission to leave the housework till monday, so I will see you in Black Boy 2ish, are you coming tots?

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: The Unicorn Man
Date: 17 May 04 - 06:23 AM

For god sake don't listern to Breezy, if you do what he says the grass roots folk won't beable to bloom and you will only have a false club that will only turn out for big names. Unless you have Breezys (how can I put it) negotiating skills, this could cost a packet, and also how then will we get the folkies for the future when all the big and old names have retired? We have Sing a Rounds every two weeks, and have built up over two years decent and loyal players, to keep the interest up we then offer a half hour spot to people who want to do more, and then we also have Saturday Night Charity Mic Nights with a big band, support acts and of course floorspots. We have other things planed as well. And any way I thought you Hullies we're well up for folk, we at The Bull in Barton le Clay Beds, want to come up in the Autumn to see you, and the Hummber Bridge. Any ideas of where to go?

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: The Unicorn Man
Date: 17 May 04 - 06:29 AM

And See the sea.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: Rasener
Date: 17 May 04 - 06:43 AM

Martin
There is room for both.
Market Rasen Folk Club is a bit like Breezy's style.
However, there are so many other clubs in the 30 mile radius who do singaround or sessions.
I personally think that we compliment each other.
The beauty is that if somebody has got to the level where they are confident to sing in front of an audience then they have that chance at my club.
I have normally about 9 artists playing on the night. Whilst there are bound to be adverse comments from people who do not like my style of club, I can honestly say that the comments I get from singers and audience are only positive.
At the end of the day, we are all putting lots of hours in FOC, to promote Folk Music.
Les

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST,Sooz(at work)
Date: 17 May 04 - 07:44 AM

Room for both indeed.
You'd like our club in Gainsborough Martin - 14 performers turned up on Friday and we had a great evening!

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: GUEST
Date: 17 May 04 - 07:53 AM

This is true, we even had a very happy two hours in a pub in Baldock at The Baldock Festival on Saturday where Morris Men and session people played and then we sung and then they played we sung, etc and both lots enjoyed it, we kind of took over the pub. And when we had fininshed one man was sad cos he enjoyed it so much. Mind you I like all the diffrent types of folk anyway, so I could not lose, but not everyone does. I also like Breezy and his funny ways, I was just saying if ALL clubs were like his, no one would be looking after the grass roots folk, which we ALL need to do,to keep it going. And to give Breezy his due he does run a Spotlight Club for the lesser know people as well.

Subject: RE: Is Hull Folk Club Rubbish?
From: el ted
Date: 17 May 04 - 08:20 AM

Post no100!!!!!!!!!!!!! I thank you, my work here is done.