BS: How d'ye spell noone?

Subject: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 12 May 04 - 11:09 PM

I've noticed a number of threads recently in which the term 'Noone' is used.

I guess the posters mean 'no one' or not anyone.

Is there a proper way to spell 'noone' as in the precedent of 'anyone'?

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Blackcatter
Date: 12 May 04 - 11:25 PM

I spell it "12 pm."

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Cluin
Date: 13 May 04 - 02:34 AM

Wasn't he the singer from Herman's Hermits?

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: mouldy
Date: 13 May 04 - 02:44 AM

You were right with no one, Mr H! The only other way is no-one, and according to my dictionary, both are correct.

And yes, noone WAS the lead singer of Herman's Hermits!

Andrea

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 13 May 04 - 03:49 AM

Naebuddy ataw.
JGM

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 13 May 04 - 05:32 AM

I never use it in writing. "Nobody" works as well and I know how to spell it.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 13 May 04 - 06:25 AM

And I thought no-one....sorry no one would know. Both those ways are grammatically correct. Be Blessed.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 May 04 - 09:04 AM

No won? No 'un. NWN.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: GUEST
Date: 13 May 04 - 09:19 AM

I either hyphanate or seperate

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Allan C.
Date: 13 May 04 - 09:28 AM

Depending upon my mood, I will sometimes use "none" in place of "no one". It sounds somewhat archaic (from Middle English) and yet it seems to me to be a natural way to express it; i.e., "None shall ever know." The dictionary supports its current use in this way.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: JennyO
Date: 13 May 04 - 09:48 AM

"know one" as in "it takes one to know one", and it does too (or is that two?) :-)

I think noone is one of those words that looks weirder the longer you look at it. Some words start sounding weird the more you say them. Try "giraffe".

Surprised jOhn hasn't checked in here yet to say this is music site not speling site.....

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Don Firth
Date: 13 May 04 - 11:41 AM

Umpteen dictionaries and style manuals all say that "no one" is two words, not one, and no hyphen is needed. Simple.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 13 May 04 - 11:57 AM

it doesent matter how you spell it, this is music site, not spelling site.

john

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: JennyO
Date: 13 May 04 - 12:03 PM

Thankyou jOhn. It's nice to know that some things can be counted on - all's right with the world!

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 13 May 04 - 12:07 PM

As Gary Cooper said to the lead singer of Herman' Hermits, "Hi, Noone."

Seamus

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 13 May 04 - 12:08 PM

No one. No hyphen.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Amos
Date: 13 May 04 - 02:05 PM

I learned to spell it with a hyphen when meaning "no person", and without when meaning "no single ...".

However, I don't mind abandoning the hyphen as it seems to be the preferred spelling to leave it out.

A

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 13 May 04 - 02:11 PM

If you take hyphens seriously, you shall surely go mad." Winston Churchill

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 13 May 04 - 03:20 PM

I've always written it "noone". The spell checker always tells me it's wrong. So do the dictionaries.

More significantly, Fowler in Modern Engish Usage also agrees with splitting the word. However his reasoning is that spelling it as one word would result in a "natural tendency to pronounce noone" - and that seems very questionable reasoning indeed, because I doubt if anyone ever would actually do that (except when it's a surname); and the normal way to write "everyone", "someone" and "anyone" is as one word.

So I'll probably continue to use "noone", which has been used by many perfectly respectable writers. It just looks right, to me.

I imagine people called Noone must get get a bit irritated with being teased about it. But then "Nemo" is a very popular character these days.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 13 May 04 - 03:22 PM

I've always written it "noone". The spell checker always tells me it's wrong. So do the dictionaries.

More significantly, Fowler in Modern Engish Usage also agrees with splitting the word. However his reasoning is that spelling it as one word would result in a "natural tendency to pronounce noone noon" - and that seems very questionable reasoning indeed, because I doubt if anyone ever would actually do that (except when it's a surname); and the normal way to write "everyone", "someone" and "anyone" is as one word.

So I'll probably continue to use "noone", which has been used by many perfectly respectable writers. It just looks right, to me.

I imagine people called Noone must get get a bit irritated with being teased about it. But then "Nemo" is a very popular character these days.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 14 May 04 - 05:06 AM

But Nemo is a clown fish - not the singer from Herman's Hermits.
Quack!
GtD.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 14 May 04 - 09:33 AM

Bee-dubya-ell, I like your approach best. Just use "nobody" instead. That way we can move on and start making music.

For the same reason, I never use "comprise." Too much trouble.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 14 May 04 - 10:44 AM

Churchill *was* mad.

Spelling is an agreed convention - if you want to make strange personal decisions, fine - but you've effectively left the "common good"!

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 May 04 - 11:03 AM

Me and Shakespeare (and Jane Austen).

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Peace
Date: 14 May 04 - 05:46 PM

Daniel Bo-one?

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Raedwulf
Date: 14 May 04 - 05:48 PM

In Shakespeare's time there was no agreed convention on spelling (& anyway he was an illetterate (sic) peasant who couldn't have etcetera...). You're just strange, Kevin (not that I'm on your case, or anything, tonight...).

I go with Amos (even though he's decidedly strange too) as far as "no-one" is "not anyone", & "no one" is "no single". Your caveat doesn't work, because none of your examples cover the negative - 'anyone' may be one word; 'not anyone' isn't, nor is no-one. There is possibly an argument that no-one ought to be spelt no'one on account of all the missed letters, but people are confused enough already & even I'm not that "wantonly cruel"! ;)

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 May 04 - 08:11 PM

There's the analogy with nobody, anybody, somebody.

I think the dictionaries have it wrong, and noone should be recognised as a variant spelling rather than a mis-spelling. (Or should that be misspelling? And are they variant spellings or...)

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 15 May 04 - 05:50 PM

Heh, good point, McGrath!

But spelling properly is a useful convention - it makes communication clear - or as clear as communication can ever be.

Amos, I know what you're saying, but "no one" is correct, or was when I learned to spell; it may well have changed by now. English spelling isn't logical - you only have to look at the fact that all possessive *nouns* use apostrophes, and no possessive *pronouns* do to realise that.

But even though it's illogical, its conventions are useful for reasonably clear communication.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Blackcatter
Date: 15 May 04 - 06:22 PM

Well I was wondering if this was the first time that Peter Noone had made it into the discussion around here. Of couse, this isn't his first time - looking him up results in 8 netions in 4 different threads, which, while rather limited, is probably much more than the resto of his bandmates.

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 May 04 - 09:06 PM

Considering the way people can screw up the pronunciation of words they read, even though the words may be ones they hear all the time (failure to connect the written words with the words they hear), it strikes me that "noone" would be very easy to get confused about in terms of both meaning and pronunciation. With "no one," the meaning is clear and the pronunciation is obvious. Dictionaries often disagree about a lot of words and word combinations, but I've checked half a dozen different dictionaries I have on my shelves, some on the internet, and several style manuals, and I find no disagreement among them. As far as I can see, spelling it any way but "no one" is merely asking for confusion.

One may set great store by free-flowing creativity and keeping one's psyche unbridled by custom or convention, but when it comes to writing with the intention of making one's ideas clear and understandable, using standard, agreed-upon spellings helps to avoid possible confusion.

I stick to the conventions, not because I lack creativity, but because I want what I write to be read and understood. Being "creative" about superficialities can be costly. I know a couple of writers whose writing is excellent and highly publishable, but they don't get published because they have some half-assed idea that having to type their stuff up in standard manuscript form somehow infringes on their artist integrity. I've talked to editors who, when they see a manuscript that is not in standard manuscript format and/or is filled with misspellings or unconventional spellings, figure that the person submitting it is a rank amateur and is going to have to be coached a lot (for which, the editor simply doesn't have time), or is one of those "artistic integrity" types and are going to be difficult to deal with. They know they may be missing a potential Hemingway (they also know that there is a damned small chance of that, however), but they send it back with a rejection slip, unread. They get dozens of easy to read manuscripts from seasoned writers, and when a new name shows up and the manuscript shows that the writer at least knows how to format it properly, they wind up on the "to read" stack. It's like the difference between wearing a suit to a job interview, or slouching in wearing jeans and a sweatshirt.

I'm sure as heck no Hemingway, but I do manage to sell a few things now and then.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 16 May 04 - 12:46 AM

Well, I suppose if you were going to spell it in one word, it would be noöne, but I usually take the safe way out and spell it nobody.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: GUEST
Date: 17 May 04 - 12:26 AM

As they say on some of the newsgroups, people who use 'noone' alot are a bunch of loosers. Three common mistakes in one sentence there! I hate misspelled words, and the people who use them always bother me. It's 'no one' (alternately, 'no-one'), and 'a lot,' not 'alot' ('alot' is a real word, the basis of 'allotment,' but it isn't what you mean by 'a lot,' get it?). And, of course, 'looser' is not 'loser,' as I'm sure you know.

Now, if only I could have all the people who write 'it's' when they mean 'its' exiled to Siberia, I would be happier. Unfortunately, Siberia would soon become the most densely-populated country in the world, and would go to war with Alaska, China, and Russia just to get the resources the overcrowding would require.

Bob Clayton

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 17 May 04 - 06:00 AM

So ultimately, NOONE has the correct version?

Subject: RE: BS: How d'ye spell noone?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 May 04 - 06:14 AM

Anyone ever met someone who pronounced "noone" as "noon" just because they came across it written that way? I suppose you might get a non-English speaker who had never met the word - but if they can work out that "one" isn't pronounced the way it looks like it should be from the spelling (ie, to sound like "own"), they are most of the way there anyway.