What are the oldest surviving tunes?

Subject: RE: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: Amos
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 04:00 PM

LOL, Frank!


A

Subject: RE: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: Frank Maher
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 03:39 PM

Sensational new discoveries have been made at an archaeological dig at the site of a Roman army camp near Hadrian's Wall. When the legions were evacuated, orders were sent out to destroy all valuable military records. However, in the far-flung camps, lazy army bureaucrats simply pitched all the files into the nearest bog. Now archaeologists are recovering all the records, preserved in the highly tannic bog water.


Among the latest discoveries is what appears to be a Latin translation of a Pictish folk-song. No doubt the lonely legionaries on sentry duty on the wall heard the melodic strains drifting on the wind from the Pictish encampments to the north. Roman soldiers must have learned this traditional Pictish melody, which is the earliest folksong recorded in the British Isles.


Of particular interest is the chorus of syllabic vocables, remarkably similar to the Gaelic walking song which is not found in written records until almost 1000 years later. In fact, a remarkable similar chorus of vocables: I\ aigh i\ aigh o\ can be found in a walking song from Skye, "Tha baile aig sean-Mhac a' Domhnuill", in the Frances Tolmie collection.


Following is a transcription of the original manuscript:


Senex Macdonaldus habebat fundum, EIEIO
Et in ille fundum habebat porces, EIEIO
Cum oink oink hic, oink oink hoc
Oink hic, oink hoc, ubique oink oink
Senex Macdonaldus habebat fundum, EIEIO


Senex Macdonaldus habebat fundum, EIEIO
Et in ille fundum habebat boves, EIEIO
Cum moo moo hic, moo moo hoc
Moo hic, moo hoc, ubique moo moo
Senex Macdonaldus habebat fundum, EIEIO


Senex Macdonaldus habebat fundum, EIEIO
Et in ille fundum habebat oves, EIEIO
Cum baa baa hic, baa baa hoc
Baa hic, baa hoc, ubique baa baa
Senex Macdonaldus habebat fundum, EIEIO


Senex Macdonaldus habebat fundum, EIEIO
Et in ille fundum habebat anates, EIEIO
Cum quack quack hic, quack quack hoc
Quack hic, quack hoc, ubique quack quack
Senex Macdonaldus habebat fundum, EIEIO

Subject: RE: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: Amos
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 01:48 PM

My Love is Like a Red Red Rose
Greensleeves
Waly Waly (Water is Wide, etc.)
Soldier's Joy

are among the longest-surviving tunes in the English lexicon.

A

Subject: RE: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: Wesley S
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 01:19 PM

There was a thread at one time here at the Mudcat concerning the song "The Water Is Wide". My recollection is that it went back many hundreds of years. Possibly the 1600's ? But don't quote me on that.

Reguardless it would be interesting to hear the original melody as sung in those times to see if it would bear any resemblence to melody we know today.

Subject: RE: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 12:01 PM

Farts

Subject: RE: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 11:40 AM

My guess is the onomatopaeic or imitative snippets that exist inside many tunes (can't reproduce well here, but the oooo-ooo-oo sound the wind makes, mmmmmm sound babies make, and things like cuckoo! etc.)

Subject: RE: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: GUEST,Farmer Giles
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 11:07 AM

the vocal noises I make when trying to encourage
a constipated motion to pass through my haemorroids

are probably quite accurately reminiscent
of earliest mans first concious musical utterances

Subject: RE: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 11:01 AM

I believe what is currently considered to be the oldest known musical notation is a clay tablet dated between 1450 BC and 1200 BC.

website with some interesting information

Subject: RE: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: GUEST,Mrr
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 10:55 AM

My guess would either be a lullaby or the Na-na-na-na-naaa-na that kids sing to each other in all cultures - and are still singing deep into the future according to Star Trek...

Subject: What are the oldest surviving tunes?
From: Torctgyd
Date: 14 Jan 05 - 10:40 AM

What surviving tunes are the oldest, and how old are they. I presume most of the oldest will be early church music. The oldest, English, tune or song I can think of is Summer Is A Coming In which I think is about 750 years old. What others are still out there? Which is the oldest? How far back in time can we reasonably push the date for the oldest tune? Are there Jewish, Hindu, Buddist or other religious songs/tunes/chant that have survived for millenia?