BS: A Prayerful Inauguration

Subject: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: wysiwyg
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 12:33 PM

I think there aren't very many people here who aren't aware of my faith. But this time I want to the the FIRST one to say, I found the constantly and overtly "Christian" tone of the whole exercise offensively excessive, denominationally skewed, and foolhardy in the extreme. I can't believe they did it! "Christian"??? As Jesus said to at least one fool, "I never knew ye," GWB.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 12:58 PM

Appropriate prayers for the occasion "Lord preserve us" and "Good Lord deliver us..."

Thank God we don't have that rubbish with Prime Ministers here.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 01:05 PM

We just have a rubbish Prime Minister, who leads Her Majesties Goverment, when she happens to be the head of the Church. And going back to Victoria, we've had non Christian PMs. no wonder people get confused....

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: M.Ted
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 01:17 PM

If it's any consolation to you, Susan, they don't mean a word of it---

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 01:19 PM

I definitely meant the ones in my post.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Wesley S
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 01:24 PM

This is a good time to remember one of my favorite passages of scripture :

"And this too shall pass"

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 01:30 PM

But when it "passes", we may have lost so very much by then that the American Constitution will resemble only "Lord Of The Flies".

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Wesley S
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 01:35 PM

Don't worry Art. I'm not saying we should roll over and give up. But he can have hope that this will last only four years.

"Take it easy but take it"

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Teresa
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 01:36 PM

I couldn't watch more than a couple minutes; I felt literally physically ill.

It isn't surprising, though. I think Bush truly believes all this stuff, in a born-again sort of way.

Teresa

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: just john
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 01:50 PM

To steal directly from alt.slack, in a post titled "Bush's Inaugural Bible":

"I say it will be hollowed out and contain bearer bonds, a derringer, an inflatable midget with a real orifice and a flask of PGA."


(I suspect "PGA" means Pure Grain Alcohol.)

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Amos
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 01:53 PM

I found it stomach turning as well; the announcer who introduced the hymn right after W's airy-fairy speech, "God of our Fathers", could not have been more challenging and assertive about it.   The progress of civilization has been set back, the barbarians are in the Rotunda, and that's about the story for today.

A

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:15 PM

Proselytising,patronising,frighteningly naive and proto-fascist.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:15 PM

It looked to me like the coronation of a Latin American dictator. No one lining the streets, the armored limosines, the military...

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:20 PM

You know, Hitler was way more popular with the home constituency that this guy is. Bush is obviously not handling his PR quite right...he is going to need very good security around him, in my opinion.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Teresa
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:20 PM

Chilling assessment, Guest. Have to agree.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:27 PM

"God of our Fathers"? Would that have been Kipling's Recessional? In which case the verse

"Far-called our navies melt away;
On dune and headland sinks the fire;
Lo, all our pomp of yesterday
Is one with Nineveh and Tyre!
Judge of the Nations, spare us yet,
Lest we forget - lest we forget."

would be well worth pondering.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Once Famous
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:27 PM

A very nice inauguration.

I enjoyed hearing it on the radio.

I felt fine while you were ill.

Can I recommend you take a maalox?

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Teresa
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:47 PM

Odd thing, but as soon as I turned the TV and radio off, it went away.

Teresa

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Once Famous
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:48 PM

But he is still president.

He was elected by a majority of American voters.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Big Mick
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:48 PM

Martin, when someone you loves ends up fighting for their lives in one of the countries that Bush feels compelled to "liberate", I will remind you of this. The speech will cause a massive response from around the world. GWB pretty well told everyone that if they don't have an American style democracy they will be a target. I expect that he will alienate the few allies we have in that part of the world, such as Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, to run for cover. I think he believes his rhetoric, and that scares the hell out of me.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Teresa
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:52 PM

Of course, we know that Saudi Arabia will be the exception that proves the rule. W. has too many irons in the fire with those folks.

Teresa

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Amos
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:53 PM

There's no question that he believes his own rhetoric. It is why he fabricates so much so readily -- he is out of touch with reality fundamentally. Dangerous dude.

A

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: just john
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:58 PM

If I were a better songwriter, I'd try to pen a catchy "When Do We Start Bombing China?"

After all, that nation fills all the stated causes for US liberation: Ws of MD, killing their own people, tyranny ...

Okay, they do have a functioning navy, air force and space program, but if we only applied our stated principles on states that were obviously weaker than we are, we'd have to be a bunch of hypocritical bullies.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Once Famous
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 02:58 PM

Big Mick, I already have a nephew doing so.

i'm proud of him.

Now what do you want to pretend that you know next?

That Saudi Arabia is such a great friend of America?

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: GUEST,Mrr
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 03:08 PM

Thanks, Susan, yes, it was repulsive.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: GUEST,Clint Keller
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 03:11 PM

Well. Martin, as I wrote to Doug yesterday, speakiing of GW's 'mandate' --

Nixon won an election or two. So did Warren Harding. And U S Grant. Huey Long. That dead guy in Missouri that beat Ashcroft. Winning an election doesn't mean you're smart, honest or competent or even alive; it just means you can win elections sometimes.

clint

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Teresa
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 03:11 PM

Saudi Arabia Wins Dismissal From Sept. 11 Lawsuits

I get the feeling there's a lot more to this stuff than meets the eye.

Teresa

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Big Mick
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 03:16 PM

I am sure you are justified in your pride, Martin. I have several kin, and children of friends, who are over there. I am proud that they choose to serve ideals. For what it is worth, many German soldiers felt the same way as they served their Nazi masters. I am not proud of this man's agenda, nor of his methods of achieving it.

And for what it's worth, Martin, you can stop the misdirection tactics. You always hide your lack of intellectual depth in your attack tactics.

I sincerely hope your nephew makes it home.
Mick

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Once Famous
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 04:00 PM

He's back soon, big Mick.

And comparing what's going on today to Nazism is just plain foolish and actually quite ignorant.

I don't hide anything, Big Mick. Quite frankly, I don't really consider you to be much of an intellectual either.

Your comparison of America to Nazism which has to include the holocaust, is like talking apples and cheeseburgers.

Preachy, preachy.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: just john
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 04:07 PM

Now I'm hungry for apples AND cheeseburgers, you rat.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: robomatic
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 04:09 PM

1) I noticed that W did include OT, NT, and a reference to the Koran, if no quote. wonder how much his right wing constituency liked that?

2) Choice of "God of Our Fathers" to play sounded triumphalist, a sour note in the proceedings.

3) But anyway, they've got ME praying!

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 04:23 PM

Repeat after me: sanctimonious*

*holier-than-thou: excessively or hypocritically pious; "a sickening sanctimonious smile"

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 04:23 PM

Big Mick pointed out that there have been occasions when decent soldiers have fought in unjust wars for unworthy leaders, and have believed they were doing the right thing, and he used Nazi Germany as a dramatic example of this, and one which noone can dispute. That is not to equate Bush's America and Hitler's Germany, or say that they are similar in all ways, and to pretend that it is is a dishonest way of arguing.

There are quite a lot of things that hippopotamuses have in common with other mammals, such as squirrels, but pointing out that does not imply that hippopotamuses burry nuts in the ground and scamper around the treetops.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Once Famous
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 04:27 PM

Nice backpeddling for big Mick, McGrath.

I think he did equate it, as others have here, also.

Yes, but female hippos and female squirrels each have tits, I would think.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Amos
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 04:59 PM

I disagree, Martin; I think the parallels are telling. I think those who are not sensitive to the parallels are candidates for serious reality-adjustments in due course. I hope it doesn't come to that, I am just concerned that the trends are creeping that way.

A

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 04:59 PM

Nipples, actually...

It is not necessary to have another Holocaust in order to have fascism. There have been a great many fascist regimes other than Hitler's. Only Hitler's can claim the specific crime of "the Holocaust". I believe that Bush is indeed establishing a fascist regime, and it does not require a re-enactment of the Holocaust in order to meet the basic requirements of fascism.

Key elements of fascism:

- usurpation of power by demagoguery and fear tactics, if not outright force.

- denial of normal civil rights for various people deemed to be enemies of the regime or subversives

- frequent use of outright lies in order to get people to support illegal and unwise actions at home and abroad

- a fascination with the uses of military and police power to solve most "problems"

- consolidation of power in the hands of a "leader" who is surrounded by a small group of yes-men/women

- intimidation or control of the media

- placing control of the government in the hands of a small, generally rich elite (big business people, usually...military people sometimes)

- illegal, usually unprovoked attacks on other countries for gain of strategic resources, territory, or anything else deemed to be of value to the ruling elite

- the illusion that one is "saving the World" for a better way of life...in the material sense, the spiritual sense, the social sense.

- the illusion that one has "God" (or Truth) on one's side

- the encouragement of ultra-patriotism to the point of zenophobia

- the creation of "war heroes" to pump up morale at home

- the demonization of the "enemy" as inhuman, fanatical, beyond reasoning with, etc...(which is a rather good description of the fascist government itself!)

- the conceit that one's one society is composed of the finest people on the surface of the Earth, and the finest social system, of course...

Bush's government meets most of the above criteria. So too the governments of Adolf Hitler, Mussolini, Joe Stalin, Mao Tse-Tung and his successors, Idi Amin, Ariel Sharon, Muammar Ghadaffi, Saddam Hussein, Ayatollah Kohmeini, and any number of other fascists, both capitalist and socialist fascists.

What you had in the case of the Iraq war was a fascist superpower(USA), assisted by a fascist major power (UK), attacking a fascist minor power (Iraq), which had formerly been a servant of the aforesaid fascist superpower (USA), but later fell out of favour, having failed to knock off a neighboring fascist minor power (Iran).

One thing no fascist power can really tolerate for long is a competing fascist power...they see their own unholy image reflected in the other, and yearn to destroy it.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Big Mick
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:05 PM

Martin, to use terms that you clearly understand, I don't give a fuck that you think I am a lightweight. My record speaks for itself, as does yours.

As McGrath pointed out, and were you a discerning intellect (which clearly you are not), you would have noted that the comparison was designed to show that good people fight for incorrect causes. It was clearly not to compare the country that I fought for, and was wounded for, to Nazi Germany. But I am afraid that you lack the depth to be able to grasp the fine points of that.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:08 PM

Male sqirrels and male hippos have tits as well. Just not functional.

That goes for Adolf Hitler and George Bush as well, but it doesn't imply   that they are identical in other respects.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:11 PM

No, they have NIPPLES! :-) Bush isn't chubby enough to be accused of having "tits", in my opinion.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Peace
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:14 PM

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Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Bill D
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:16 PM

I take it no one is particularly surprised that they were even more overtly narrow, fundimentalist and "denominationally skewed" 'Christian' than before?

I don't know how to approach it all....fundamentalist, narrow-minded Muslims are controlling issues in parts of the world, and having Christians with the same general "we are right and everyone else is wrong" attitude running THIS country seems like a recipe for a train wreck.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:21 PM

(^o) (^o)

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Once Famous
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:23 PM

big Mick, obviously you are angry because your points are just not clearly made, though you think they are. Do you want a top hat and cane for your Nazi tap dance?

And what record are you referring to? One on Capitol, Columbia, or Decca?

Amos, it just your shorts that are creeping, not the trends. Unless, of course you think your creeping shorts are trendy.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:24 PM

Fascism always seeks to divide (and conquer). The best way to divide is to push people's identities into extreme opposite positions, and then set them against one another. Fascism is a $ySStem that MUST always have an enemy, in order to justify its high military spending and need for war. When the Cold War ended, a new international enemy had to be found. So...the "Muslim fanatic", a vital former US ally in the breaking up of the Soviet Empire, became the new enemy of choice in Washington, and that suited Israel's desires to a "T". It was an enemy perfectly calculated to strike fear in the hearts of Americans, and encourage them to assist in the building of an authoritarian regime on a world crusade in search of OIL...and WAR. They who live by military spending must always have either a war...or the imminent threat of one. Otherwise, they stand to lose their favoured position. The best war is one that never really ends, for such people.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:25 PM

WHOA! Impressive pecs there, Stilly...

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Bobert
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:26 PM

I didn't hear the speech, WYSusan, but I can purdy much tell ya what he said: absolutely nuthin' beyond alot of liberty, freedom and God... But really nuthin'...I'm sure it was just a big ol' PR speech, with buzz words that had be tested on a test audience... Liberty and freedcom swwm to be the Bushites favorites. They haven't a clue what these words mean but sure know that if they use them enough with their other lies then folks seem to believe the lies.

I suspect we'll also be hearing a lot more "personal responsibility" and "personal ownership" tied to libert, freedom and God over the next year as the neocons work as hard as they can to get folks to nod in approval of getting a good ol' fashion screwing from Biss Hog over privitatizing Social Security which has been one of Boss Hog's most hated programs foing back over 6 decades...

Yeah, they're going to pull out all the buzz words to garnish their BIG LIE about Social Security, and invading Iran and Syria...

Repulsive but worse than that, a sad commentary on the intellegence of the average American...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Peace
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:27 PM

ιȫ²¿ÔÚ·¿ég¡£

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:31 PM

Brucie, wenn Sie tuender nicht Anschlag, daß ich eine Gruppe der Angriff Hamster zu Alberta schicken werde. Sie finden Sie. Sie werden zum Tod abgenagt. Betrachten Sie Ihre Vorgehensweise sorgfältig.

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Big Mick
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:33 PM

Attaboy Martin. When all else fails, just try to shift and see if you can upset someone. Same tactic you have used from the beginning. When you don't understand, or have no arguments, attack.

You are so easy.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: A Prayerful Inauguration
From: Big Mick
Date: 20 Jan 05 - 05:43 PM

Damn, Maggie!!! I love that!!   What's yer sign?

:^)

All the best,

Mick