BS: You can kill someone

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 09:23 AM

Right, thanks Rich. I have ascertained the filter through which you view the world.
I'm bored now and will go and play with someone else

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Feb 05 - 07:05 PM

No Guest, you have not got this right. Re-do from start

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Feb 05 - 01:48 AM

Thanks Richard

So if ive gott this right. Everything he says is lies and in the case ov ommissions, every time e doesnt say something, e is also lying.


worraguy

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 12 Feb 05 - 04:41 AM

It is certainly misleading to imply that he can determine the law: the courts do that. All he can do is to express his understanding of the court decisions - in which respect his view is no more necessarily correct than that of any other competent barrister.

It is also misleading by omission to fail to clarify that the right to use reasonable force against a bigger or stronger opponent is only the right to be beaten to a pulp.

Thus the right to defend one's own property becomes, in the end, only a right for the strong.

The proper purpose of the law is not to defend the strong against the weak.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Feb 05 - 06:09 AM

Wos e lying wen e said that Rich?

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 10 Feb 05 - 05:16 PM

Not exactly. Tony B Liar said we all misunderstood the law so he would get a memo sent out explaining it all. Which he did. Which does not change the law. So what if he's wrong (or we don't like the explanation)?

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Feb 05 - 09:31 AM

ehm Richard,

Did Tony say they change the law?

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 06:45 PM

The events described below are true.

A relative of an acquaintance of mine has been arrested for murder this week. Someone burgled his house. He hit him, and then kept on hitting and kicking him until he was sure the burglar would not get up again and re-attack. The burglar died.

Two thoughts for Tony B Liar. First, pamphlets (not even setting out your wishful thinking) do not change the law. Second, how is a little householder safe if a big burglar might get up again?

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: skipy
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 05:11 PM

Blissfully,
My first post about using a fire extinguisher means the use of non lethal force or in fact non harming force is my first choice, I have no desire to wound or kill these bits of scum, just to drive them out!
Skipy.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Blissfully Ignorant
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 04:31 PM

Phone an ambulance? You never know, they might be concussed...takes them away anyhoo....

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: skipy
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 04:29 PM

They wake up again! & the police may still be 20 mins, 1 hour, 3 days away!
What do you do? tie them up & keep knocking them out!
Them you will appear in court & lose!
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Blissfully Ignorant
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 04:09 PM

Well, it'd be a lot more sensible to knock someone out...render them incapable of harming you without actually killing them.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: skipy
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 04:07 PM

Yes as long as the action is carried out while they are still a threat to you or yours.
You cannot do it during a retreat or with putting any form of planning into it. (well thats how I read it)
I spent 25 years in the Royal Air Force & the rules of combat where never really 100% clear on the subject of intruders etc.
You where never sure if put in the position to shoot within for instance the boundries of a U/K Station if the system would protect you or "bang you up"!

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Blissfully Ignorant
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 03:59 PM

Are you alllowed to knock someone out, or break their leg, or something?

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: skipy
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 03:57 PM

The fact that these items are now so cheap means that they sell for less in the local pub, problem with that is that your local junkie needs to steal even more items to meet the cost of his/her habit.

Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 03:46 PM

Tellies are getting so big they aren't really too portable. DVDs are so cheap they aren't really worth knocking off these days. People have credit cards instead of cash.

I suspect that opportunistic housebreaking isn't such a profitable business these days.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: skipy
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 03:30 PM

Here in the u/k we can't keep guns around the house unless locked in the correct style of locker, unloaded etc.

So what makes a useful weapon to keep upstairs incase of a night visitor?

A kitchen knife? no thats premeditaed!

My choice is a CO2 fire extinguisher, a blast of freezing co2 into the face is quite disturbing & disorientating, also the empty cylinder is heavy when used offensively & will ward off a baseball bat or similar. a very good close combat weapon to defend the top of the stairs.
Best of all it is sensible to keep one upsatirs in the event of having to get the children out if there is a fire at night m'lud!
You can follow up with a powder ex. This will clog the eyes & as the victim runs away will leave a trail & contaminate the car/his house etc. useful for the forensic boys & witnesses.

If they come to steal your video player, dvd machine etc. then the best bet is to offer to carry the items to their car, after all you get new for old & nobody gets hurt!

Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: GUEST,Laurie Love Bird
Date: 08 Feb 05 - 10:42 AM

Don't have to be weirdos, just be in your house

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: LadyJean
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 10:53 PM

I was walking home by myself one night. Not smart, but I do it. A strange man approached me and began a conversation. When he grabbed the hem of my dress I knew he wan't anyone I wanted to deal with. I kept him in front of me and swore like five fraternity boys. He raped someone else that night.
I'm putting extra locks on my doors, because like every woman who lives alone I'm a wee bit paranoid that some weirdo will get into my house some noight, like those kids with the machete. I'd have to carry a gun with me all the time, to be protected, or have one in every room. Having a gun by my bed will not help me if I'm in the kitchen when some weirdo breaks in.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Rapparee
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 09:34 PM

Diana, no.

The last time I felt in fear for my life was in Southern France, in the Basque country. I felt somewhat threatened twice in Ireland -- once in Cork and once in Dublin -- when the Irish Army suddenly appeared on the street in full combat gear (they were moving bank funds). I felt threatened in New York City last October -- but because of the City Fathers' early 20th Century paranoia about emigrants with guns there are very strict laws there about weapons, ANY weapon.

There are bars here were I could go to feel threatened, but anyone who deliberately walks into danger gets what they deserve.

1. The only time my home has been broken into my wife and I were upstairs preparing for bed. The crime was over in seconds; a gun wouldn't have either helped or hindered because it was over too quickly. I never considered getting one.

2. Dead wrong. My friend Mary screamed and was thrown into a bathroom (where she locked the door). The invader left, but not immediately; he took a television with him.

3. Statistics don't bear this out, at least in the US, although it's been said so often it's usually considered to be true. If it were true, given the number of firearms available in the US alone we'd be wading in blood. We're not; firearms "accidents" (there is no such thing!) are so infrequent that they make the news.

4. Again, no. Not if you're trained in its use. If you aren't so trained and won't take the time to become well-versed in the use of weapon (or anything else for that matter) you shouldn't have it, much less try to use it.

5. Heck yes! There are far, far more cars than burglars so statistically you're correct. And it's not the burglars that bother me -- it's the thugs who invade homes. Like the party of four teenagers who were arrested last week out on the Shoshone-Bannock Reservation. White kids, 14, 14, 16 and 15, who'd knock on a door and when the homeowner opened it, slash them with a machete -- no theft, just random, ugly violence. A true burglar is a sneak and a coward; a home invading thug is a violent menace. As I've said before, I'll help you carry the stuff you're stealing from me to your car. I can replace it. I can't replace either my life or the life of my wife, and I won't help anyone take either one of those.

I quite agree with you about the media. I wish it would STOP making it look like violence is the solution to everything. It's not.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Midchuck
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 09:07 PM

I live in Vermont, the only state in the US that has no restrictions at all on carrying handguns. We have no "concealed carry" permits - you just do it if you want to.

I'm fond of guns, but I've never carried a firearm other than on my way to go plinking or target shooting, or on my way home from buying it.

In Vermont, I've never felt the need. (That may change as the drug problem moves up from the cities, and out from the larger Vermont communities to the country. But not up to now.)

When I go "down country" to the larger cities, I feel the need, but I can't carry 'cause I have no license.

There's something here that doesn't make sense. But I do know that the highest crime areas of the US have the strictest gun control laws, and vice versa.

Peter.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: dianavan
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 08:02 PM

1. Most burglars won't enter a home if they think anyone is there.

2. If they do enter your home and you make a noise, they will usually leave.

3. Guns kill more people accidentally than intentionally.

4. If you have a weapon, there is a pretty good chance it will be used against you.

5. The chance of you encountering an armed burglar is far less than being hit by a car.

I think if you watch too much tv you begin to think that crime is all around you. In fact, in the last 57 years, I have never been threatened with a weapon. What about you? When was the last time you had to defend your life?

gnu mentioned home invasions of the elderly and single women. Lets remember that now that the invaders have been caught, that particular crime spree is over.

I can't help but wonder if the 'gun culture' of the U.S. isn't fed by the govt. and the media. If you are in a state of fear, it justifies almost any act of aggression. Its not a very big leap from this state of mind to waging war against a country that is a perceived threat. No wonder Bush got so many votes.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Rapparee
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 02:46 PM

One of the things that saddens me about my time in the military is that I learned so many ways to kill people. Up-close-and-personal ways.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: wysiwyg
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 01:59 PM

I believe the most recommended weapon for women in self defense at home is a hammer kept under the pillow or by the bed. It's the right proportion to take the upper-body strength usual for most women, and multiply it to lethal force. It has a grip such that it's easier to keep a hold on than lots of other things that can be taken away by an attacker and used against them. Also it doesn't matter if you aim perfectly-- the whole head of the hammer, at whatever agle it hits a head, is effective. And it's easy to find, by touch, in the dark.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Amos
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 01:29 PM

If you want to see how a smatchet is used, click here.


A

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: GUEST,Rapaire
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 11:34 AM

A three foot section of closet rod, if you know how to use it, makes a wonderful self-defense or home-defense weapon. Somewhere in moving I've lost my nightstick (pure wood, unweighted).

Back in my undergrad days, the long-flown days of my misspent youth, women were being raped on their way to the dorms at night. They started going in groups, men's clubs provided escorts, and so on. But one woman, a striking blond, would have none of it -- she was older and would work in Chicago as a Kelly Girl, alternating college and work so that she didn't have to borrow money for school.

The inevitable happened. She was grabbed and dragged into an alley. She offered no resistance (a knife was at her throat) as he tore at her clothes. He unzipped, took out his assault weapon -- and she literally tore his balls off. The police had no trouble finding him at the emergency room (they just matched the testicles she handed them to the assailant). My uncle, who was the arresting officer, told me the whole story -- the college merely noted that the rapist had been caught.

On another occassion, a U-shaped women's dorm had the pleasure of an exhibitionist who would stand between the legs of the U take off his coat. He'd then drop his pants and wave his weenie. One cold, cold January night the dormees had had enough and turned the fire hoses on him from both sides of the U. He never returned after they so dampened his ardor.

I really don't recommend killing people, even in defense of yourself or your loved ones. It's sooooooooo depressing to see their bloodstains in the carpet, and it can be sooooooooo much trouble to get them out that it's easier to re-carpet.

k

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: GUEST,~S~
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 05:51 AM

A friend of mine had the presence of mind to shoot her home invader through the foot at an angle to lodge the bullet in her floor. She didn't want to kill him, she just wanted him to leave. (A second shot would have been fired if he had not left but had charged her instead.) Well, after he ran and went to the ER, the ER had to report the gunshot. So then the invader's story was that the lady had shot him just for the hell of it. The bullet in the wood floor proved otherwise!

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Don Firth
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 03:52 AM

Not a burglary, but a few years ago, a friend of mine told me was walking down the street near a low-income retirement home not far from where I live. He observed the following:—

An elderly woman was walking from a nearby bank toward the retirement home. It was the third of the month, and she had been to the bank to cash her Social Security check. My friend saw a rather punkish looking teen-ager walking rapidly toward the woman and immediately grasped what was about to happen. He broke into a run, to attempt to forestall the coming mugging/purse-snatching. He was closing fast, but the punk reached the woman and was about to make a grab for her purse. Suddenly, the woman turned, and swinging her purse by the strap, she caught the punk upside the head. He did a cartwheel and three somersaults and wound up laying inert on the sidewalk with his face in the gutter and his butt in the air.

My friend congratulated the woman on her effective response to the purse-snatching attempt. She told him that she'd had her purse snatched twice and wasn't about to let it happen again, so she took steps. "This is the second one I've nailed this year," she said with a measure of pride. "I keep my money in my coat pocket," she said. "And I carry a brick in my purse."

They left the trash laying there on the sidewalk and although it was obvious that she could pretty well take care of herself, my friend saw her safely back to her apartment building.

He went back to the scene of the attempted purse-snatching about ten minutes later and the punk was gone. If he'd been dead or seriously injured, there would have been cops all over the place. It was at about 17th and Madison in Seattle, and although it's not like downtown, it's a fairly well-traveled area. In ten minutes' time, someone would have found him and called for help. Chances are he wandered off with a helluva headache, a vivid bruise, and a whole new attitude about little old ladies being easy marks.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: LadyJean
Date: 05 Feb 05 - 12:15 AM

In August of '98, I went out to my kitchen to see if I'd locked the back door, and surprised a burglar. My then housemate, Don Myron, chased him out walloping him with a leather jacket. (Don was stark naked at the time. It was an interesting thing to watch.) If I'd had a gun, I might have been able to deal with him, depending on where the gun was. If it had been in my purse, the burglar would have gotten it. (Instead, he got 75 cents.) If it had been in my bedroom, I couldnt' have gotten it. If I'd gone to sleep with loaded gun in my pocket, I would have been really stupid.
One of the reasons I am now a homeowner is that the manager of my old apartment building liked to let himself in to my apartment when I wasn't there. Someone told me that if he tried that in my house, I could shoot him. I don't know why I would. It would be much more fun to have him arrested. Especially as one of my old neighbors, who doesn't like the SOB any more than I do, is a cop.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Feb 05 - 07:36 PM

Kendall, it's a swing-out cylinder. I can drop the cylinder, insert six rounds via the speed loader, close the cylinder, and get off a pretty accurate shot (single action) in under 3 seconds. I've been timed by the police in doing this. A revolver like mine can be faster to load, aim, and fire than an semiauto (mine is in better shape and has had the grips replaced with "rubber" ones). And I'd hear anyone coming in -- breaking glass, etc. Unlike some of my neighbors, I lock the doors and close my garage door! And while someone COULD come into my bedroom windows, they'd need a ladder 'cause it's a 15 foot drop to the yard.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Flash Company
Date: 04 Feb 05 - 09:56 AM

True Story (Also thread creep!)

Some years ago when the UK unions still insisted on wages as a cash payment, the company I worked for with a 1200 man payroll was drawing a hell of a lot of cash every week. The head of payroll was authorised to carry a gun on the bank run.
However, the Insurance company would not cover him for carrying a LOADED gun, so he had the gun in one pocket and the bullets in another!
Fortunately he never had to find out how quickly he could load the thing!

FC

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: kendall
Date: 04 Feb 05 - 09:32 AM

So, why is your gun not loaded? You might not have time to load it if some scumbag breaks into your house while you are asleep.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Rapparee
Date: 04 Feb 05 - 09:24 AM

Smatchet, not smatcher.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Rapparee
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 10:30 PM

My cartridge guns, and most of the muzzleloaders, are locked up. So is the ammo. I hedge on the muzzleloaders because I have pair of .44 caliber cap and ball revolvers in a box, but there is no powder, ball, or caps with them.

Even if there were -- do you know how LONG it takes to load a cap and ball revolver? Trust me -- you wonder exactly HOW the West was won.

Now that that's said: because of recent home invasions in the neighborhood (and the cops think that they've got the guy), I have been sleeping with an unloaded .38 Special (S&W, 4 inch barrel) and 12 rounds of hand-loaded SJHP ammo in speed loaders in the nightstand. I can load that revolver VERY quickly should I ever need to do so. Now, if the cops have the guy -- and I think that they're right -- the revolver and the ammo will join the other guns in the lockup.

The gun knowledgable will know what sort of rig I've described; for anyone else -- the bullets would mess someone up pretty badly; they definitely would stop a bad guy from doing whatever he's doing.

HOWEVER! I am alone right now, and when my wife is here there are only two adults in the house (and usually the .38 is locked up). She knows guns, even though she doesn't "like" them. Should children come visiting, I stuff ALL firearms in the lockup.

Actually, for REAL home defense (if you must), it's hard to beat a smatcher or bolo knife or a machete. Messy, but it doesn't destroy the walls and furniture.

(The Thompson Submachine Gun, or "Tommy Gun," was introduced into the US Army far too late to be used in WW1, as was intended. So it was marketed as a home defense weapon! True! Spray 50 bullets around your living room and see what it does to your furniture! And then...scroll down and see the ad.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Sorcha
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 08:12 PM

In the US states vary, but almost all say only house, and only if you feel your life is endangered. The equal force rule applies. Our guns aren't locked up, but they aren't under the pillow either. If they want to forcibly rape me, go ahead. I'll win in court. Stuff is just stuff.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Barry Finn
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 07:52 PM

When I was a kid an adult picked up my tricycle over his head in order to bring it down smashing in my skull. My mother at the time had been close by talking to other neighorhood women & promply stab him in the gut, she was never even questioned. When someone knocked on our door I always thought my mother must had fixing to feed us because she always had this big kitchen knife in her hand that was hidden behind the door. I prefer having a big dog in the house & I don't have to worry about the kids if I'm not at home. No one wants to enter a dwelling when there's a big dog growling behind a door.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 03:17 PM

Common sense surely is, a gun that is securely locked away, with the ammunition locked away securely as well, just isn't going to be available in a hurry. A loaded gun that is available in a hurry is a serious danger in a home, and has been proved to be so by a whole series of domestic tragedies over the years.

There is no absolute safety in this world. What you can do is work out the relative dangers, and choose the safer option. The safer option seems to be for householders not to rely on guns to protect themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: gnu
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 01:45 PM

We've had the locked up gun and ammo (separately) law here in Canada for about fifteen years and home invasions are becoming all too common because of it. Many of these are violent and most are perpetrated on the elderly or single women. Through this legislation, self defense with deadly force in one's own home has been taken away and criminals have been invited into our homes. The crimes encouraged, even created, by these laws far outweigh the accidents of previous years. Granted, education, training and screening may have been lacking, but legislation and common law was not. What seems to have been lost in all of this is common sense. And it is to the benefit of the criminals and no one else. Talk all you want from your high and mighty horse but, when someone comes into YOUR home and beats the crap out of you and or yours because they CAN, you just might think of the right to deadly force as a reasonable deterrant from this type of crime. Anyway, my guns and ammo are locked up solid at the gun club. However, my super-soaker is filled with bleach.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: robomatic
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 01:17 PM

Sorry about the q marks. They started out as quotes.

Answer: It couldn't. It was manslaughter by maniac. Unfortunately there are plenty of idiots to be found in homes and juries.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 12:46 PM

I imagien for some reason your computer is putting questin marks in place of quote marks.

But how can it be "unintentional homicide" when he pointed a loaded 44 Magnum at them and pull the trigger? What could he be intending to do but kill? I mean he might have been able to argue that it was intended as "justifiable homicide", and therefore that it wasn't murder, but that's another matter.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: robomatic
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 11:30 AM

Actually, all you need is the right jury, but you can still be nailed on civil charges:

Don't forget the incident in Louisiana where a Japanese student went to a costume party:
What I remember about it is that the homeowner's wife answered the door, got hysterical and yelled at her husband to "get the gun". What followed was a tragedy in anyone's lexicon:

What follows is stuff I cobbled together from a question and answer website:
_ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ _
?On October 17, 1992, Yoshihiro Hattori and Webb Haymaker were on
their way to a Halloween party for Japanese exchange students in a
quiet neighborhood in Baton Rouge, Louisiana. Arriving at the home
that they thought was the site of the party, they rang the doorbell
and waited. Because the front lawn of the modest brick ranchstyle home
was festively arrayed with Halloween decorations, they assumed that
they had found the right place. When no one appeared to answer the
door, they started back for the car in disappointment.?A Japanese exchange student, Yoshihiro Hattori, was searching for a
party he had been invited to. Thinking he had found the house in which
the social would take place, Yoshihiro knocked on the door. Not
knowing that they had the wrong house Yoshihiro and his companion
startled the proprietor. After having the front door shut in their
face the two boys began walking back to Yoshihiro's car. Yoshihiro
Hattori and his friend, Webb Haymaker, then turned back towards the
house upon hearing the carport door open behind them. Instead of
seeing the party's host, these two boys were greeted by a " 'Freeze' "
and a .44 Magnum-carrying Rodney Peairs. Yoshihiro, thinking he had
found the party after all, stepped towards Mr. Peairs and said, "
'We're here for the party' ". Webb Haymaker then found himself
standing over his dying friend, Yoshihiro Hattore, a victim of
unintentional homicide.?
?Yoshihiro Hattori, a 16-year-old foreign exchange student, was shot
in the chest in the carport of a Louisiana home, a place he had
mistaken for the site of a Halloween party he was to attend.
The homeowner, a man who had been raised on a part of the American
dream that the missionaries hadn?t mentioned, mistook the foreign
exchange student for an intruder.
When Yoshi Hattori failed to respond to the command "freeze!" - a
word he didn?t understand - Rodney Peairs pointed a .44-caliber Magnum
handgun at the student?s white John Travolta-style disco costume and
pulled the trigger.?

?In Baton Rouge, Rodney Peairs, the homeowner who gunned down Yoshi
Hattori, was indicted by a grand jury. He was charged with
manslaughter and put on trial in May. The jury, apprently convinced
that Peairs was well within his rights to blow away an inquiring
teenager, deliberated for just over three hours before acquitting
him.?

Yoshi's Gift Foundation

?On September 15, 1994, the parents of Yoshihiro Hattori won the civil
case with the amount of $653,000 as the compensation for damage
against Mr. Peairs who killed Yoshihiro by gun and his home owner's
insurance company. Out of $100,000 paid by the insurance company, the
Hattori received about $45,000 after the lawyer's fees and expenses
had been paid. The Hattoris created Yoshi's Gift from this money. The
Hattoris hope that, with the help of Yoshi's Gift, many gun control
groups will grow up and become stronger lobby groups against NRA.
Consulting with the Haymakers, Yoshi's host family in the US, the
Hattoris decided to establish the foundation. Yoshi's Gift was named
by Holley Haymaker, Yoshi's host mother.?

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 11:29 AM

I don't think too many burglars round our way would recognise the sound of a gun being cocked.

Since in the UK any one licensed to keep any kind of gun has to keep it securely locked up, the likelihood of their being able to lay their hands on one in a hurry when they come across a burglar is pretty remote.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 10:53 AM

The reason from having a weapon is to prevent people getting hurt.

As noted above, by Rapaire, if someone in you house hears a gun being cocked, then they will probably run. Neither of you hurt.
If they stay, they're either very stupid, or intent on worse than robbery. Both ways you then want to be armed. It may not be a good solution, but it's better than the alternatives.

Bunnahabhain.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Rapparee
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 09:22 AM

Our house was broken into. The guy kicked in the door, ran in, grabbed my wife's purse, and ran out. We were upstairs and it was over by the time I put on slippers (we thought that the living room ceiling light had fallen) and got downstairs. Even if I had had a gun & ammo at hand (which I did not), it would have been of no use except to annoy the cops.

My friend Mary was in bed; she awoke to find a man in her hallway (she's single). She screamed; he grabbed her and threw her into the bathroom where she locked the door. He left without taking anything. Mary has a pistol; she lettered in pistol in her undergraduate days. It would have done no good as it was over before she could have gotten to the gun.

You cannot shoot anyone unless they are a direct and immediate threat to your life or someone else's life. If your neighbor is stealing your riding lawnmower from your shed, loading it into your motorhome (to which your BMW is attached to the towing package), and smiles & waves to you as he loads the mower, you cannot shoot him -- you can call the cops, you can close the gate in front of the motorhome, you can slash the tires, but you cannot harm your neighbor.

An elderly (80-ish) woman in South Bend, Indiana was stopped at a light. A 20-ish street thug reached into her car and unlocked the door. Without thinking of what she was doing, she put out her cigarette on his hand. He screamed and ran away; she immediately drove to the cop shop and turned herself in for injuring him! The cops, of course, simply checked the emergency room and arrested him; she was given praise for her quick thinking. Again, snubbing out her cig was faster than grabbing a gun and in this case more effective. (Attempted carjacking, attempted kidnapping, guilty, minimum of 10 years inside.)

A gun or any other weapon can be, literally, a lifesaver. But you'd better be both right and good, and above all, know when NOT to take a life or harm another.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Crystal
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 09:11 AM

But is a shed still a shed?

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: GUEST,Laurie Love Bird
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 09:10 AM

No in the UK, you cant kill them in a shed as it is not a house.

Maybe things are diff in Usa where a garden is a yard I think.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Paco Rabanne
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 09:02 AM

If someone breaks into your house they deserve all they get.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Crystal
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 08:56 AM

Is it just your house or is your land included?
For example if your shed is at the bottom of the garden and you catch your neighbor in there stealing your lawnmower are you allowed to kill them (bearing in mind the number of dangerous items most people keep in their sheds)?

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 08:39 AM

McG's right.

Subject: RE: BS: You can kill someone
From: Bert
Date: 03 Feb 05 - 01:33 AM

Trouble is that the only people that I want to kill don't come breaking into my house;-)