BS: They sure breed them young

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 17 Mar 05 - 04:34 AM

And how much of that violence is in 'innocent cartoons'? Did we not all enjoy watching Daffy Duck get blown up many many times during Wabbit Season?

Life is not safe, but surely we don't have to go around making it worse by having loaded weapons lying around?

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: jacqui.c
Date: 17 Mar 05 - 06:45 AM

That comes down to parental carelessness - in the same way as there are parents to leave medication, sharp knives, cleaning fluids and whatever else lying around where young children can get at them.

And human beings being what they are I don't think that will ever change.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Rapparee
Date: 17 Mar 05 - 09:28 AM

I'll point out again that my weapons and ammunition (what there is of it) are as secure as I can make them.

And the only people who live here are two adults -- both of whom are now over 60 (and glad to have made it, let me tell you!).

Like giving blood, I can only speak and act for myself -- I can't ensure that others will do as I do. BUT I can do my bit, and if everyone did....

I think that parents must, absolutely MUST, accept a chunk of the blame. They must teach children responsibility for their actions, and I don't see that happening on a large scale -- not anywhere in the "Western world." Yes, individuals do teach their children, but it's not a society-wide thing.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: jacqui.c
Date: 17 Mar 05 - 06:02 PM

Yes, it always seems to be someone else's responsibility to instill any sense of right and wrong in the kids.

But these days, if a teacher or a policeman attempts to discipline unruly children in any way the parents have a tendency to jump on them.

Definitely a lose/lose situation.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Peace
Date: 17 Mar 05 - 08:26 PM

I asked a parent at a parent/teacher interview how much time per week his child spent watching TV, playing video games, etc. The response was "about two hours a day." When I asked the child as part of a class exercise, the child responded "about thirty hours a week." OOOOOOOOOOOOKAY.

Of course the parents were responsible. The kid was a child. Who the heck do people THINK should bear the responsibility?

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 17 Mar 05 - 08:30 PM

Of course it might be the parents were accurate in what they said there, brucie, but the kids were lousy at mental arithmetic...

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Peace
Date: 17 Mar 05 - 08:37 PM

No. They did it by the shows they watched.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Gurney
Date: 18 Mar 05 - 03:51 AM

Ted beat me to it, they usually do breed them young.

Strange morality we live with these days. Every day on TV we see at least a couple of murders and sundry other violent acts, but in 50 years of watching, I've never seen (on TV I'm talking about) anyone in coitus. So, killing is OK for the kids to watch and play computer games at, but shagging is so immoral that no-one is allowed see it?

I'm not wanting to, you understand. It's a participatory game, after all. I just question the lop-sided morality.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 18 Mar 05 - 06:00 AM

You've never seen shagging on TV?

You're watching the wrong station!! Here in the UK we have a whole station dedicated to it - it was originally Channel 4, which specialised in naughty things, but now Channel 5 has taken the baton and boy, is it running with it!

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Mar 05 - 08:33 AM

I know, Gurney. And I wonder if the parents think that the kids came from the cabbage patch or where.

"Look, Harry! A brand new baby under this leaf!"
"Not now, Myra, I'm a-rubbin' ma gun."

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: GUEST,Jake Turner
Date: 19 Mar 05 - 01:52 AM

Are people missing a salient point here?
Holding a gun makes one feel great.
You get a surge of adrenaline.
You feel powerful.
You ARE powerful.
You can, if desired, kill something.
Better than any drug.
There is intense pleasure involved.
Having a gun does NOT mean you will use it.
People with guns will not easily be persuaded to stop having them.

JT

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Boab
Date: 19 Mar 05 - 04:00 AM

Can any American say this? I lived in southwest Scotland for sixty years, and cannot recall even one instance of murder by fire-arm anywhere near our area. Accident, yes,almost 100% shotgun. Suicide, a very rare occurrence.And I wish this absolutely brainless guff about "guns don't kill people, ---people kill people" would fade from the muddled minds. The real truth is that UNSTABLE PEOPLE with GUNS kill people.
While we're at it, let's not get down [low] to the old chestnut about knives, axes etc.. those crazy kids at Columbine would have been felled by a chair or some other way long before the slaughter reached a fraction of the level it did, had they used such weapons on that awful day. Likewise with the loonie who went berserk in Dunblane Scotland.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 19 Mar 05 - 04:13 AM

Jake, you aren't a 4 year old whose little brother is annoying you...   If it were your child or your head it was being held against, you might feel a little differently.

Sure it gives you all those feelings, but then so does holding a new born baby... much as I hate babies... I know which I'd prefer to hold.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: robomatic
Date: 19 Mar 05 - 04:26 AM

"The right to bear arms is one of the most basic rights of Americans. It keeps the King of England from moving into your house!"

- Krusty The Clown The Simpsons

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: GUEST,Jake Turner
Date: 19 Mar 05 - 09:00 AM

No Liz, I was talking about holding the gun.
If the gun is being held against you, you automatically feel differently.
Unless you also have a gun.


JT

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: GUEST,McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Mar 05 - 10:41 AM

Perhaps it does that for you Jake - the only times I've held a gun was when I was in the cadet corps at school, many years ago.

I seem to remember my typical sensation was of having to waste my time playing these silly games, and knowing I'd be getting into trouble for not cleaning the bloody things, or for handling them the wrong way, or being a rotten shot. Certainly no sense of exhilaration and empowerment and that.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: heric
Date: 19 Mar 05 - 02:39 PM

I used a Colt .45 and some other large pistol another time. While impressed with the craftsmanship, it was not much of a rush for me, either. I can only assume that target shooters get their fun from "just imagine" scenarios going on in their little heads.

I had a handun brandished on me late night in downtown Vancouver by a guy who was very, very short.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Rapparee
Date: 19 Mar 05 - 04:52 PM

If handling a gun gives you a feeling of power and euphoria you shouldn't have one and shouldn't be allowed near them.

As for target shooting, I am a target shooting. When I sight I see a black speck, and I am trying to send a 40-grain peice of lead into the very center of that speck. I try to do this several times -- to send one bullet into the hole made by the previous one. To do this, I need to "shoot between heartbeats" while taking into account the wind's force and direction, changing light conditions, the trajectory of the bullet at the known distance to the target, and compensate for the minute differences in cartridges. The concentration required is total, and I can only compare it to Zen archery (if you're an archer you'll understand). Sorry, but there is no room for fantasy.

Boab, your neighbors never disgraced their weapons. I would that those in my country could say the same -- and I repeat my earlier assertion: there are no accidents with weapons, only carelessness.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: heric
Date: 19 Mar 05 - 05:45 PM

I guess I can understand that accuracy thing, Rapaire, as in the joy of golfing. The fantasy time occurred to me when I was actually thinking about target shooting with rapid fire assault weapons.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Gurney
Date: 20 Mar 05 - 02:17 AM

Liz, I left the UK in 74, and at that time I'd seen no TV sexual activity. Here in NZ I've seen none, not graphic, anyway. We did catch a scene of a squaddie having a knee-trembler with his greatcoat around his partner, and I had to explain to my teenager what they were doing. That was a UK production.

Guest Jake, I'm an ex-serviceman like many on Mudcat, I've fired military weapons up to the Bren, I've hunted as well. I can honestly say that I've never felt the elation that you describe, and I'm glad to report that. I'm totally in rapport with Rapaire here. If you are one of those sick people who like the idea of holding anothers life in your hands, then you should most definately NEVER get access to any kind of weapon.
I wonder how long that sick murderer in Hungerford had been creeping around the woods, wearing Camo, pointing his loaded rifle at picnicers

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 20 Mar 05 - 04:01 AM

I used many weapons during my time in the army, it was seen by most of us as just a bloody nuisance because once fired they had to be bloodywell cleaned again.

On a lighter note, we were once kept back from going on leave because the small arms were not clean enough for the Squadron Leader,
we told him we did not have enough cleaning material, so he ripped off his shirt sleeves and threw them at us and said use that then.

eric

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: ard mhacha
Date: 22 Mar 05 - 12:41 PM

I could be resurrecting this thread again and again, is it not time for the land of the gun to heed the saner members of your society and restrict your gun laws. I refer to the latest shooting in Minnesota, another ten poor souls shot down because of easy access to a gun.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: GUEST,Jake Turner
Date: 22 Mar 05 - 11:44 PM

Red Lake Shooting.

I rest my case.

Subject: RE: BS: They sure breed them young
From: robomatic
Date: 23 Mar 05 - 06:19 AM

"Marge, when I'm holding a gun I know how God feels, when He's holding a gun."

- The Simpsons