BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:50 PM

Yes, and as I agreed, mere posession is no reason to attack those with WMD.

It was the attack on Kuwait and subsequent violation of the cease-fire terms that made the attack both legal and required.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:45 PM

"I fail to see any on that list whom we are at war with."

BB, that is NOT what the list is for. And the 'we' you speak of included MY country under the conditions you have stated--that is, Canada was involved in the Gulf War under the UN flag. The US seems to have decided it was in under the US flag. Not all the allies thought the US decision was such a good one.

The list was posted to give y'all a look at WMDs around the world. Lots, huh?

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:41 PM

Peace,

I fail to see any on that list whom we are at war with. Prior to invading Iraq, ony two countries were at a state of war with the UN or US- Iraq and N. Korea. There were cease-fires in place, which prevented active combat until they were violated.




LH,

"once against Kuwait, but never against the USA. "

Except that our treaty obligations made that an attack on us, as would an attack on a NATO country, such as Canada.





"You don't go attacking people on the basis that they might one day, someday attack you"

Agreed- BUT Iraq was at a state of war against us already, since it attacked Kuwait and then violated the cease-fire terms, repeatedly.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:25 PM

Yes, yes...(grin)

Well, BB, I have always said and will continue to say this: It is NOT, in my opinion, a crime for a nation to possess a weapon. It is a crime for them to USE that weapon in an unprovoked, illegal, aggressive attack on somebody. The USA has done that with its weapons (B-52's, F-18's, tanks, cruise missiles, etc...) over and over again. Those are crimes. Iraq did so once against Iraq and once against Kuwait, but never against the USA. They had no real capability to attack the USA, and in any case, such an attack could only have led to their own destruction. Saddam is not a religious fanatic who wants to die for Allah at the first opportunity, so I highly doubt that he would have contemplated committing such a suicidal act as to attack the USA, even if he had weapons capable of doing so...which he did not.

Iraq probably did not possess more than a few mere scraps of what anyone would normally term WMDs by the time of the recent war, anyway, but what I am saying is that possessing such a thing is not a crime. I don't give diddly what the U.N. or the USA or you say about it, I don't think it's a crime. Using what you have to kill people is a crime.

You don't go attacking people on the basis that they might one day, someday attack you...unless you are just a self-serving, cynical opportunist with the scruples and mentality of Al Capone... or a paranoid lunatic. Then of course, yes, you do.

And that is why the majority of the U.N. was opposed to Mr Bush's war. It was not justified by the circumstances. It was the act of an outlaw government that simply does what it wants to because no is powerful enought to stop them from doing so.

That's exactly how the Romans acted when they were out conquering places. They did what they wanted to, because no one could stop them. I think they may have been less phony about their reasons for so doing than the USA is, but perhaps those were more honest times in some respects.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:25 PM

Other countries with WMDs. Neat site, too.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:22 PM

The cease-fire was violated, repeatedly. The UN stated the IRAQ was in non-compliance, thus hostilities resumed. No further declaration or vote was needed. If Korean armed forces cross the DMZ, there would be no need to go to the UN for a declaration- the war is STILL IN EFFECT, albeit on hold by the cease-fire.

The US does not need to be the UN.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,Geoduck
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:21 PM

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:19 PM

Not at all. I damned well know he was working on WMDs. Fact.

The issue is, however, that the US is NOT the UN.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:15 PM

Peace, I have stated that prohibited materials ( including raw materials and ballistic missiles the UN had forbidden him to have) WERE found. Read 1441- it talks about programs that would lead to WMD, not possesion of completed WMDs.

Hitler did not succeed in killing all the Jews- would you than state that he did not actually attempt genocide since some survived? By demanding MORE than the UN had stated he had in violation of both the ceasefire and resolutions, you are putting yourself in that corner.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:03 PM

I still think it's rational to ask to see one of the WMDs that "WERE found in Iraq!"

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 04:00 PM

Arne,

Try looking at the facts. The UN DID declare hime to be in non-compliance, no matter what you belive they should have done.


ThUS worked with the UN for 14 YEARS, and Iraq still did not comply with the cease-fire terms- therefore hostilities could restart without any further votes. Sorry if you do not understand.


No escaping that.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Amos
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 03:59 PM

The Carnegie Foundation's thorough analysis dramatically disagrees with your conclusions and what the facts justify as conclusions.

A

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,Arne Langsetmo
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 03:49 PM

BB: Just trying to show how stoopid your "prove beyond doubt" is. (OBTW, that little manoeuvre of yours is also called "moving the goalposts"). You see, BB, that the FSM (not the Flying Spaghetti Monster, the other FSM) wasn't under sanctions in no way makes them any the less dangerous for having WoMD. If there's the least possibility that that they have such, then even if they aren't inclined to skin your children alive and infect your wife with pustulent anthrax today, who knows what the morrow may bring, eh? Maybe they'll be bothered by Dubya's inflection in his latest speech of historical revisionism, or just get annoyed at the next seasons episodes of "Desperate Housewives", and suddenly want to kill us all. Or they may get invaded by terra-ists who appropriate all these WoMD. You see, the potential is there, and aren't the consequences of a mistake too horrible to contemplate?

Then there's the equally stoopid notion that the only proper action in response to such hallicinatory paranoia is to go to war. In fact, quite a range of responses do present themselves to those that look rationally ... and in fact, a majority of the U.N. Security Council (so beloved by quote-mining RW apologists) thought that, given the absence of any significant findings on the ground whatsoever (and, hopefully, a growing realisation that the "intelligence" that the U.S. had trumpeted so forcefully and unequivocally was "garbage, garbage, and more garbage"), a more rational course was to let the inspections continue, and then re-evaluate what courses were prudent.

At this point, I see that a majority of the U.S. people (as well as vast majorities around the world) see that the invasion was unjustified, hasty, enormously costly in human lives, and in the end, in fact, quite counter-productive. Summing up, just a damn pi$$-poor idea, the kind that makes you think, "what were those guys smoking?"....

No escaping that, BB. You will maintain your honour and dignity a bit better if you accept that now, rather than later when your intransigence is seen more as stubbornness and obstinate and deliberate ignorance, rather than just a case of getting fooled by those that you thought were honourable men.....

[Arne]: "Saddam was complying."

BB: Not according to the UN, who declared him in NON-compliance with 1441 on the deadline date.

Balderdash. And despite Dubya's promise to actualy seek a UNSC show of hands (even if he wouldn't succeed in getting the approval of the Council), he saw that it would be a political embarrassment for him because he wouldn't even get a majority of the Council, and so he decided to break that promise and go it alone (with ramifications down the line that have been quite untoward....).

Cheers,

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 03:40 PM

Some of us were talking about the chemicals, nuclear materials, and missles that violated the UN resolutions from the begining- but it just was not what the anti-war folks here wanted to hear.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,Jaze
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 03:02 PM

What Kat said, exactly. Considering how low Bush is in current polls and the recent drubbing Blair took, they'd be all over the place with this info. And remember, Bush admitted there was an "Intelligence failure" regarding WMD's. Wouldn't is just be conveninet now to "suddenly" find WMD's? I never say never,but I have doubts about this.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 02:17 PM

Arne,

"I heard rumour that the Federated States of Micronesia also have not been able to prove beyond doubt that they do not possess any WMD or any WMD production capability. Bombing will commence in 30 minutes...."

If there had been 14 years of non-compliance with UN resolutions, and FSM was under the legal constraints ( cease-fire terms) that Iraq was, I would not even give them 30 minutes.




"Saddam was complying."

Not according to the UN, who declared him in NON-compliance with 1441 on the deadline date.



You seem to like to revise history. Why bother even looking at the facts, if you can make up what you want to believe happened?

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,Arne Langsetmo
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 01:36 PM

Teribus: The point has long been forgotten that the aim of the exercise was to prove beyond doubt that Iraq did not possess WMD or retain any WMD production capability.

More revisionist cr**. I heard rumour that the Federated States of Micronesia also have not been able to prove beyond doubt that they do not possess any WMD or any WMD production capability. Bombing will commence in 30 minutes....

As for this proof: Someone wanting to prove this would have let the inspectors finish their jobs. Someone who really didn't care about the truth of the matter (or worse, who knew it was a lie) would start a war against the suspect country (strangely enough, in the process not bothering to take any measures to secure any potentially dangerous materials that were suspected of being there, but oddly enough, rushing to protect the oil ministry) before that actual state of affairs was known. Sadly, everything that the aborted inspections did show indicated that in fact the suspicions about WoMD were (in the words of one of the inspectors) "garbage, garbage, and more garbage". You'd think a sane person would at that point say, "Hey, waiddaminnnit, this stuff isn't checking out, let's re-evalutae before getting thousands of people (including innocents) killed." In fact, that is what same people did. The U.N. Security Council refused to authorise the invasion. Dubya, after promising to seek at least a "show of hands" in the Security Council, decided against even this when it became apparent that he couldn't even manage a majority of the Security Council (despite arm-twisting and bribes) for his invasion. The rest is, sadly, history, and a rather sanguine page therein.

BB: And I am waiting for the examples of how the anti-war folks demanded that Saddam comply with the UN resolutions, and prevent the need for action on the part of the US and allies.

Saddam was complying. Strangely enough, Dubya had two different psychotic moments, and stated an obvious, glaring falsehood when he said: "[Saddam] wouldn't let [the inspectors in] [a]nd, therefore, after a reasonable request, we decided to remove him from power." (Dubya repeated this hallucination on another occasion as well).

Yet you folks continue to defend this moron?

Cheers,

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 01:27 PM

This one?

http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/news/iraq/2002/iraq-020924-usia01.htm


If not, it should be in one of the two threads I referenced earlier...

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: pdq
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 01:16 PM

beardedbruce,

Can you re-post the British intelligence report about chemical, biological and nuclear weapons? It was dated 1999 I believe. Includes items such as "16,000 litres of antharx".

There are so many threads on this and related subjects that I can no longer locate it.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 01:02 PM

Peace,

Ask the age-old question about the Iraqi WMD program, as well....France, Germany, Russia- All of whom wanted to NOT enforce the UN resolutions.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 12:57 PM

I happen--again--to agree with beardedbruce. (This is twice in three months, bb, and it's gotta stop.)

The UN was continuing to get a run-around from Iraq over searches, etc. They kept getting stalled by this or that government official. That is true--and pretty much accepted by all except people who still think the world is flat.

The other issue being discussed is that of the US deciding to invade Iraq without UN sanction.

I do not doubt that the White House was fed some information that was less than accurate--at whose behest I have no idea. The US wanted to get into Iraq. And it did despite most of the allies from the Gulf War declining the offer to participate.

I think that George Bush is too stupid to knowingly carry-off the verisimilitude that was necessary to engage the American Congress/people in the present war. I think differently about Cheney, Rove, Wolfowitz, etc. The advisors to the President are dangerous people. Wars create tremendous opportunities to make money. A few companies have made megabucks on this war. Cui bono? Ask the age-old question and then ya have a place to look. IMO.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 11:46 AM

The biggest WMD I've seen is the human mouth.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 11:29 AM

These WMD wre found and have been reported. That is not the arguement. The knock against Bush is that huge stockpiles of WMD not been found, as had been predicted.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 09:55 AM

TIA,

And I am waiting for the examples of how the anti-war folks demanded that Saddam comply with the UN resolutions, and prevent the need for action on the part of the US and allies.


Still waiting...

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 09:50 AM

Okay fellas. Now why don't you go cut and paste from speeches by Bush, Cheyney, Rice, et al. in the run-up to the war. Please post the quotes that show that they were claiming that he had a "program", but no actual WMD. I'm waiting....

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,Teribus
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 09:47 AM

Not quite correct TIA,

"The (UN/UNSCOM)claim was that he had WMD (Stockpiles or stockpiles of material to produce them), and (the evaluation of the Security Services and advisors to the Governments of those nations who joined the "Coalition of the Willing was that) we (, our national interests, our allies, and the region) were in imminent danger of him using them. Anything else is revising history.

The point has long been forgotten that the aim of the exercise was to prove beyond doubt that Iraq did not possess WMD or retain any WMD production capability.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 09:42 AM

"The claim was that he had WMD, and we were in imminent danger of him using them. Anything else is revising history. "
......................................................................

The Security Council,

          Recalling all its previous relevant resolutions, in particular its resolutions 661 (1990) of 6 August 1990, 678 (1990) of 29 November 1990, 686 (1991) of 2 March 1991, 687 (1991) of 3 April 1991, 688 (1991) of 5 April 1991, 707 (1991) of 15 August 1991, 715 (1991) of 11 October 1991, 986 (1995) of 14 April 1995, and 1284 (1999) of 17 December 1999, and all the relevant statements of its President,

          Recalling also its resolution 1382 (2001) of 29 November 2001 and its intention to implement it fully,

          Recognizing the threat Iraq's non-compliance with Council resolutions and proliferation of weapons of mass destruction and long-range missiles poses to international peace and security,

          Recalling that its resolution 678 (1990) authorized Member States to use all necessary means to uphold and implement its resolution 660 (1990) of 2 August 1990 and all relevant resolutions subsequent to resolution 660 (1990) and to restore international peace and security in the area,

          Further recalling that its resolution 687 (1991) imposed obligations on Iraq as a necessary step for achievement of its stated objective of restoring international peace and security in the area,

          Deploring the fact that Iraq has not provided an accurate, full, final, and complete disclosure, as required by resolution 687 (1991), of all aspects of its programmes to develop weapons of mass destruction and ballistic missiles with a range greater than one hundred and fifty kilometres, and of all holdings of such weapons, their components and production facilities and locations, as well as all other nuclear programmes, including any which it claims are for purposes not related to nuclear-weapons-usable material,

          Deploring further that Iraq repeatedly obstructed immediate, unconditional, and unrestricted access to sites designated by the United Nations Special Commission (UNSCOM) and the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), failed to cooperate fully and unconditionally with UNSCOM and IAEA weapons inspectors, as required by resolution 687 (1991), and ultimately ceased all cooperation with UNSCOM and the IAEA in 1998,

          Deploring the absence, since December 1998, in Iraq of international monitoring, inspection, and verification, as required by relevant resolutions, of weapons of mass destruction and ballistic missiles, in spite of the Council's repeated demands that Iraq provide immediate, unconditional, and unrestricted access to the United Nations Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission (UNMOVIC), established in resolution 1284 (1999) as the successor organization to UNSCOM, and the IAEA, and regretting the consequent prolonging of the crisis in the region and the suffering of the Iraqi people,

          Deploring also that the Government of Iraq has failed to comply with its commitments pursuant to resolution 687 (1991) with regard to terrorism, pursuant to resolution 688 (1991) to end repression of its civilian population and to provide access by international humanitarian organizations to all those in need of assistance in Iraq, and pursuant to resolutions 686 (1991), 687 (1991), and 1284 (1999) to return or cooperate in accounting for Kuwaiti and third country nationals wrongfully detained by Iraq, or to return Kuwaiti property wrongfully seized by Iraq,

          Recalling that in its resolution 687 (1991) the Council declared that a ceasefire would be based on acceptance by Iraq of the provisions of that resolution, including the obligations on Iraq contained therein,

          Determined to ensure full and immediate compliance by Iraq without conditions or restrictions with its obligations under resolution 687 (1991) and other relevant resolutions and recalling that the resolutions of the Council constitute the governing standard of Iraqi compliance,

....

http://www.un.int/usa/sres-iraq.htm

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,Guest Teribus
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 09:37 AM

"....into the real world here in Mudville???"

You are kidding aren't you Bobert.

If this is what represents real life to you pal, you want to get out more.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 09:36 AM

The claim was that he had WMD, and we were in imminent danger of him using them. Anything else is revising history.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 08:32 AM

Peace,

Good site. As wih all reports, each of the documents will only be believed by those who already agree with it...

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 08:15 AM

thread.cfm?threadid=77314&messages=119

thread.cfm?threadid=70594&messages=167

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 07:53 AM

Bobert,

"1/1,000,000th of the WMD that the US brought with 'um to occyupy Iraq..."

Care to tell us WHAT WMD the US took into Iraq?



"So exactly, G-duck, what is yer point here???"

That the anti-war folks who stated there were not any materials are liars...

And there was NO grand jury indictment against Rove, so you might want to admit you were wrong there, too...



Peace,

The claim was that Saddam had materials and a program to produce WMDs, NOT that he had active weapons (though it sounds as if he did)

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Bobert
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 07:30 AM

Yes, GUEST, the right has a full time revisionary staff to clean up behind Bush... Problem is that they apparently have been swamped here lately... And their office manager, Karl Rove, has run into a little bad luck himself...

Ahhhhh, not to mention that there are more folks paying attention now that Bush and Co. are gettin' into the working man's wallet with some degree of regularity...

Can't hide everything behind a flag, MASCAR, country music and Budwieser...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 01:59 AM

Odd how the radical Left was always accused of conspiracy theories and now that the tide has turned, its the radical right that is delving into conspiracy theories and fictional history.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 12:57 AM

That would be BBUC.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 11 Nov 05 - 12:43 AM

B.B.C.
Bullshit, Balderdash and utter Crap?

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: katlaughing
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 11:40 PM

If it were true Bush et al would be shouting it from the rooftops and parading the spoils on every tv program they can commandeer. It is ridiculous to believe anyone has the power to prevent him and his cadre of crowing about such supposed "validation" for his Oil War.

Having some popular noteriety does not make one an authority, either, ala Pat Robertson and his calling for the assisnation of Chavez, blaming a hurricane in Florida on "godlessness," and now his threat of coming armageddon to the folks of Dover, PA.

It's all a dream, time to wake up!

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 10:56 PM

Some time ago, the U. S. Army found some long-buried stuff from Saddam's little war with Iran. None of it fits the appelation, WMD. This was well-reported in the press.
Perhaps Guest's tale is from a blown-up version of this story.
I listen regularly to the BBC News, and no WMD report has been carried that I remember, other than a report on these old, long-buried and forgotten weapons.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 10:51 PM

How sad. A small, wretched, devastated, and starving country has a few pathetic remnants of WMDs left (according to the book) and it cannot even manage to use them to any noticeable effect when invaded full scale and occupied by the biggest military power on Earth. My, my, how terribly dangerous Iraq must be! About as dangerous as Denmark was to Nazi Germany...

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 10:31 PM

The sire above is excellent, and so is the SITE!

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 10:31 PM

Read all about it.


The sire above is excellent, BTW. However, I would like to know where the WMDs are. I don't really care what anyone wrote in a book. I've read books about Yeti/Sasquatch, too. Show me one!

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Metchosin
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 10:16 PM

I wonder if Guest, Geoducks sattelite has been hacked lately and he's now predisposed to rapid eye blinking too.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 10:15 PM

No one said that. Produce one of the weapons. That I would believe. Where are the damned weapons, Geoduck?

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,Geoduck
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 10:14 PM

Care to 'splain why the claim GWB lied about WMDs is not Bullshite?

If Joe Wilson has written a book that does not mean he is a liar but if someone else on the right side of the aisle writes a book, everything he says is a lie.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 09:55 PM

GOOD eye, Arne. Great post.

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST,Arne Langsetmo
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 09:43 PM

Richard Miniter:

1. Disinformation : 22 Media Myths That Undermine the War on Terror
2. Shadow War: The Untold Story of How Bush Is Winning the War on Terror
3. Losing Bin Laden : How Bill Clinton's Failures Unleashed Global Terror


Coming from Richard Miniter:

"How I Made Millions Scaring The Pants Of Yokels While Propping Up My RW Pals: A three volume boxed set of RW political screeds."

No thanks.

Say, G-Duck and GUEST,A: Care to explain how Dubya is "winning the war on terror"? Is Amman the new "flypaper"? Oh, yeah, and where's Osama been Forgotten?

Cheers,

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: Peace
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 09:36 PM

It's all good. Uh, has anyone actually GOT one of the WMDs?

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: leftydee
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 09:30 PM

Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to getcha. Being on the Best Seller List means little. Lots of fiction has that honor. Who cares what conservative websites say? Take a look at The Drudge Report and Conservative(Jeff Gannon)Guy.com, just paranoid nonsense. Terrorists don't have to cross the Rio Grande at night. There are lots of other points of entry. I live near Lake St Clair, a short boat ride from Canada at night. 5 minutes tops from Windsor to Detroit. Then a 15 minute drive to the largest Arab community outside the Middle East for cover. OOOOOOH Scarey!!! Be watchful, yes.... but get the knot out of your guts. Relax... life is good

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 09:30 PM

WMDs have been found in Iraq, so reports New York Times best-selling author Richard Miniter in his new book, Disinformation.

Apt title.

� Found: 1.77 metric tons of enriched uranium

Oh, nonsense. Saddam did have uranium (which made the Niger yellow-cake claim even more dubious), but it was under IAEA watch and was not highly enriched.

� Found: 1,500 gallons of chemical weapons

Nonsense. Pure hogwash.

� Found: Roadside bomb loaded with sarin gas

Dubious. But it was in bad shape, and didn't go off. No one says that Saddan never had CW (in fact he used them, after which the Republicas thwarted effort to put export restrictions on him [as requested by groups like HRW]). Sure, someone may have absconded with one or a few shells, but they were in pretty bad condition, and hardly a workable arsenal. Only when you invade the country and put yourself in position to be hit with such bombs, does any danger even arise. But FWIW, all of the 2000+ deaths in Iraq have been due to conventional weapons, accidents, etc., and not a single soldier has died from CW attack.

� Found: 1,000 radioactive materials--ideal for radioactive dirty bombs

Oh, you mean the radionuclides you can find in pretty much any medical facility and teaching hospital? The stuff that the coalition forces made no effort to secure in the invasion???

� Found: 17 chemical warheads--some containing cyclosarin, a nerve agent five times more powerful than sarin

Nonsense. None were filled. These were found (and secured) by the U.N. teams before the invasion, and were probably just misplaced. But, as I noted, none were actually loaded with an actual CW.

This is only a partial list of the deadly weapons Miniter reveals in his new book,...

So the other disinformation is even shoddier?

Cheers,

Subject: RE: BS: WMDs WERE found in Iraq!
From: artbrooks
Date: 10 Nov 05 - 09:29 PM

Well, after carefully reading each of those links, I still see no indication that any chemical or radio-explosive weapons have been found.